Half Life of a Tech Worker: 15 Years - Slashdot

* Fast-growing companies at large scale do enormous amounts of college recruiting. That's because the quality of the pool is much higher than the pool of out-of-work programmers... not because young people are smarter or better programmers but simply because the candidate pool includes a cross-section of skills, whereas the candidate pool of out-of-work programmers is biased to programmers who can't find work.

See also: http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/FindingGreatDeveloper...

Thus, the average age at Facebook is younger than Google, at Google it's younger than Microsoft, and Microsoft is younger than IBM. It's just a question of when the biggest growth spurt occurred in hiring.

* Nobody was working as a software developer 30 years ago. Well, of course, not nobody, but this field has grown like CRAZY. Everybody knows that, but they don't think of the implications. Even if every software developer who started work in 1980 was still working today as a software developer, they would only constitute a small fraction of the current workforce because the number of software developers in 1980 was miniscule. And you would expect them to be working in relatively mature companies simply because those were the companies that were around when they got their jobs.

Bottom line--this "mystery of the disappearing tech worker" is a good bit more imaginary than real and is probably mostly explained by the kinds of people you're hanging around with, not a real social phenomena.

See also: http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=computer+software+appli... (If anyone can figure out how to get older data than Wolfram Alpha displays, I'd appreciate it)

This should go for everyone, not just tech workers. We only get so many years on this planet, and assuming you make it to 35 and are reasonably healthy, you've likely got a lot more years ahead of you (another 40ish?).

You've had some education about life, work, money, etc. You've got no more excuses by 35. Have a plan. Have a backup plan. Understand what you'll need to do to execute on that plan.

For tech workers, this may be going in to consulting, doing a startup (two of the more popular ones), but it also may be moving around to different companies to keep tech skills cutting edge (or demanding that from current employers). Not everyone will be accommodating to your plan, but you have to execute. If current employers won't support you, find new employers.

There's probably many reasons people leave standard tech/dev work by that age - employers wanting cheaper/younger workers is the most popular reason/excuse, and there's probably some truth to that. But I moved out of that because much of it was boring. Some of the work was still interesting (data sizes, algorithms, etc) but the day to day realities of 'corporate life' grew tiresome. Never saying never - I won't rule out "corporate job" again - in fact, there's always some interesting companies popping up that need my skills/labor, and one day I may join one again. But my mindset is totally different about how I would approach a "job" again, and that mindset probably puts off many would-be employers anyway (making finding one both harder and easier at the same time).

So... what's your plan (those of you 35 or older)?

I had my first job at age 21. A month before my 36th birthday, I left my last job. I have not been able to get a job since.

I have applied for 58 jobs over the past year and have gotten a response 11 times. I got a phone screen for three of these jobs, and got to an in-person interview for one of them. All rejected.

I am not a superstar but I have built solid things including sites from scratch that are still running on the web. I worked on parts of an iPad app that has over 3 million downloads in the app store. I solved the programming challenges on the HR pages of two hot companies. (Didn't hear back from one, was told there weren't any positions for me at the other) I even was on a team that made it to a y-combinator interview. My other HN account has a decent amount of karma.

I just say all this to point out that I'm not the typical square sob story where some guy making crystal reports for 15 years get the boot from IBM and spends his days whining about H1Bs on patriot message boards. However, sometimes I wish I was one of those guys. I can't even get a job doing something like ".NET Sharepoint integrations" because I've never done it before!

I'm mostly zen about the whole situation but at times I catch myself sliding into serious depression. I've been working on iPhone UI programming to learn something new. However, in the back of my mind I know that even if I get a job, something like this will happen again when I'm 42.

I don't know how I would get a management job, but I'm not convinced management is a safe haven. I have two uncles who worked at IBM for decades. They were made redundant in their early 50s and never worked in the industry again. Then again, at least they made it another 15 years and were able to pay off their house.

I could write more but you probably get the point. My only advice is to make a lot of money when you are young so you can coast when you get old (35?). I basically think programming is like pro sports. You can be an amazing rookie in your early 20s, a kobe like superstar in your late 20s and even early 30s. But mid 30s you need to make way for the next generation.

This is why I like being independent. I'm forced to keep up with changes in my industry. I have to always be networking. I have to keep my selling skills sharp. When I have some down time I can plant seeds for alternative streams of income. These are the same things everyone should be doing, but you don't have to do these things when you work in the bubble of traditional employment.

In short don't get too comfortable. Work every day as if it's your last day at the company. I suppose this advice goes well for life in general. ;)

Eventually, developers start saying things like "I want to watch my kids ball game" instead of being at the office and dealing with the latest manager-inflicted crisis. 60 hour weeks are not family-friendly, and the developers that choose family over the office end up getting pushed out the door.

The old ones complain that they're discriminated against because they are... old.

Meanwhile business complain they can't find good people no matter how much they pay and Google & Facebook can't give enough bonuses to stop their people from being pouched.

So, who's right? Bunch of f-ing whiners all of them, if you ask me:

Youngsters should CODE and get the right experience.

Oldies should LEARN continuously, not stop and rely on their old stuff.

Business should PAY and PAY even more, while rewarding on merit, not people skills.

Now get off my lawn!

That said, I love other things in life as well - friends, family, girlfriend. All these loves are first class citizens and I can't tradeoff on one for another. When forced to choose, I always find a way to compromise. For example, when my girlfriend started grad school, I started working with Intridea (an all remote web and mobile consultancy).

I constantly in the process of finding ways to allow me to code what I want to, and still make money. I like to think of it as a daily and incremental refactoring of my life.

One of my uncles retired at 66 still writing COBOL.

At first I felt impatient about that result, until I stopped and looked around and realized how many of my peers were probably never going to be independently wealthy...

The key is to stay flexible, always be willing to learn and set your priorities. Try to put yourself in positions where good things can happen. The path you take will likely vary greatly from what you envisioned, but if you achieve what is most important to you, then you have succeeded. There are many definitions of success, so be sure to measure your accomplishments based on your own definition.

Some folks just get caught up in, well, life. They have kids, a house, and grow a life and hobbies. That means that they are no longer staying current, and their heart just isn't really in it any more. After you've kicked ass and conquered the world with code a dozen or so times, you've gained weight, you're missing out on the rest of life, and there are just a dozen more impossible missions ahead of you. It never ends. I'd throw out some kind of pithy remark like "work at a sustainable pace" but the sad truth is that a "sustainable pace" for a 23-year-old is not the same as it is for a 40-year-old. Not even close.

I like the model I've seen of moving great programmers into lead roles (with PM-type duties) and then "uber lead" roles, which also include some program-management duties. That way you keep your technical talent close. It's easier to teach a programmer business than it is to teach a businessperson programming. This idea that we move good programmers out simply because they start acting much more like middle-aged people than college students is hurting the industry. In my mind, the MBAs are much more expendable than some guy who has just spent 15 years of his life learning our business systems inside-out.

First, technology is a lot less ageist than mainstream business (i.e. BDC-land).

Here's the thing about corporate culture. Anyone or anything (a group, a project) that is judged to be not successful (regardless of reason, regardless of whether it's that person's or group's fault) is avoided like a corpse. What ageism is about is the (often unfair) negativity directed at people judged to have underperformed their age curve. In mainstream business, there's an expectation that a person will be in an informal leadership role no later than 32, be in an official leadership role (i.e. manager or executive) by 35, be a VP by 40, (S|E)VP by 45, and CxO by 50.

Here's where sciences and technology have an edge. There's absolutely nothing wrong with being a non-managerial programmer, scientist, or mathematician at 40, or even at 60. The best tend to peak later (with a few notable exceptions) so most of them are just starting to do their best work at this age. I repeat, there's nothing wrong in technology with being non-managerial at 40. No one looks down on you for that if you're great at what you do.

Contrast: in mainstream business, if you're still at the analyst/associate level doing line work at 40, no one will want to talk to you. Most investment banks have one "adult analyst" (i.e. someone in his late 20s or 30s working alongside college kids who use "steak sauce" as an accolade) and his co-workers mock the hell out of him behind his back.

There is a catch: by 35, you have to be really good, and you should probably have more than one specialty in which you can out-perform 99% of the competition. By that age, it's not enough to just be talented; you need to come with a seriously formidable skill set. The upside of this is that in technology, working hard and working smart means you will be good. The technology career is quite volatile but it's pretty easy to have reliable, steady improvements in one's level of skill. This is a lot better than mainstream business (banking, biglaw) where people can be passed over for no reason at all.

I'm not even 1 year in and I'm already busy executing my plans for freedom (by starting my own business, for instance).

Then again, I guess I don't have a single lick of salaryman in my bones. Others may relish the thought of a holding down a comfy desk job and not having to make your own decisions about what to work on.