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Comment by jacooper | Hacker News Reader

> Privacy

The company that wants to force CSAM, doesn't encrypt iCloud backups so it can remain as a backdoor to WhatsApp, cares about your privacy?.

I can't even install and app without an apple account.

Apple doesn't care about your privacy, its just marketing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r38Epj6ldKU

On android I can use it without a google account, with newpipe for zero ads on YouTube, infinity for zero ads on reddit, glider as a client for HN.

I use CalyxOS for better privacy with usability, and you can switch to GrapheneOS which is one of the most secure mobile OSes. (Only on Pixel).

While on iOS, there is nothing even close to it, and the FOSS scene is totally dead.

However I only like stock android, Samsung, or the million other IOS clones from Chinese companies almost all suck.

> Security

IOS has more vulnerabilities than Android

https://www.theregister.com/2020/05/14/zerodium_ios_flaws/

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>However I only like stock android, Samsung, or the million other IOS clones from Chinese companies almost all suck.

I used to like stock android but since 12 it's been going down the drain in terms of looks and feel. Now I prefer the Samsung UI since they're at least consistent with previous versions and don't make huge changes for the sake of changes like Google does.

So this is one of the main advantages of android: vendors can rejected Google's ästhetisc choices and just keep the under the hood improvements.

Samsung is better than the rest, but still I prefer stock android, especially with zero bloat and ads.

Even a stock Pixel is more private, because there is no third parties or bloat to track you other than Google services(which are on every phone anyway).

> The company that wants to force CSAM

Every big company forces it, Apple tried to make it better but it was PR failure. Nobody bothered to understand their papers properly.

> doesn't encrypt iCloud backups

CSAM scanning on device feature would have allowed that, now they need to keep scanning in cloud.

> I can't even install and app without an apple account.

How easily average users can install app safely without Google account on Android? Underlining the word safely.

You are talking from the perspective of 0.01% users.

> How easily average users can install app safely without Google account on Android? Underlining the word safely.

What do you mean by "safely" here? What is unsafe about going to a trusted APK source and downloading it and running it?

EPIC literally offers fortnite this way and users seem to manage fine: https://www.epicgames.com/fortnite/en-US/mobile/android/new-...

Before the walled gardens of the Mobile app stores it wasn't only 0.01% of users able to install software on their computers without screwing it up.

> trusted APK source and downloading it and running it?

99% of the users do not know what is actually trusted or not. If third party sources gets popular, it gets even more difficult over time.

Epic one very big well known company and on that case you might trust their APK, but it is not the case for other thousand companies.

When the habit of downloading APK:s gets more popular again, as it used to, then malware spreadingg and phishing gets more popular as it used.

It is easier to get people install software from random sources since it is not uncommon. At the moment, it is uncommon and phishing is harder.

You didn't ask my main question which was: What do you mean by "safely" here?

> 99% of the users do not know what is actually trusted or not.

Before it was only 0.01% of users know what they're doing and now it's 99% of the users do not know if it's actually trusted or not, that's a 100x difference, I don't suppose you have a source on any of these numbers?

Your arguments are all hypothetical, yet we don't have to be as people literally download much of their software on PCs today outside of the Microsoft store and most users manage fine. Other mechanisms have been put in place at multiple levels (the search engine, the browser, and the OS) to make it safer for users, and the majority of those users don't get confused about trusted sources.

> You didn't ask my main question which was: What do you mean by "safely" here?

I thought I made it clear at least on the last phrase. ”Safely” simply means that software is what it is supposed to be.

My arguments are no hypothetical. Android used to be like that in early days, if you followed infosec in that time. It was common to downlod .apks from third parties and phones were full of malwares.

Android does not have same mechanisms like PC. It does not make signature checks for trusted sources or have Windows Defender build-in. Two primary reasons why it is safer to download arbitrary files in these days. MacOS has similar checks.

> CSAM scanning on device feature would have allowed that, now they need to keep scanning in cloud.

What does CSAM have to do with encrypting backups?

Its my device, you dont have the right to control what I do with it.

> How easily average users can install app safely without Google account on Android? Underlining the word safely.

> You are talking from the perspective of 0.01% users.

This doesn't matter, it should be an option regardless.

And I download apps from the play store safely just without using account.

Using Aurora store, an interface for the play store.

What phone do you use, that allows that many choices of android variants, sorry?

A Pixel.

Thank you very much!

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