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Comment by scrlk | Hacker News Reader

The SOS and location tracking via satellite is a pretty neat feature. Free for the first 2 years - no details on pricing after that.

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I really hope they still allow you to use it even if you haven't paid the subscription. It's a tool for emergencies so by definition you need it only when you don't expect to need it. It would be a shame to lock people out from something that could have saved their life just because they haven't paid the $x.99 per year service. In theory they could always back-charge users who are not subscribed but even then that could discourage people from using it in a dangerous situation.

Yes. Charge $20 per use instead of a subscription. $50 or whatever they want. Just don’t make people sign up for a subscription.

I get what you mean but I really hope it doesn’t make the Apple Pay chime in that case, heh.

I think the amount you'd have to charge to not have a massive decrease in revenue would make Apple look like monsters. Human brains really aren't good at valuing rare events.

Here's a possible scenario. I'm sure it's wildly off from reality, but maybe reality has the same properties. Each month, 1 in 10,000 users call in [1]. For the same revenue you can charge:

$1 per user per month

$10,000 per use

One of those, people will hate you for. Charging $100 per use would slash your revenue by 99%. May as well make it free. I actually think that would be the way to go and maybe they'll do it some day.

[1] If that seems wildly low, remember it's per month and getting lost in the wilderness is pretty rare for the average person.

would be nice, but garmin inReach is very specific in their wording to make sure you know that if you don't have an active subscription, your SOS call will NOT work. Subscription is the standard now so doubt apple would do differently. I was genuinely surprised by the 2 years free though. Garmin inReach mini is a $350 device with 0 free function out of the box without the subscription

I think it's more justifiable to require a prepaid subscription for a dedicated safety device. The difference with a phone is that you're much more likely to have it on you even when you haven't paid for the satellite feature. On the other hand, if you haven't paid your Garmin subscription, you wouldn't take your beacon with you. The iPhone would be great for situations that you don't anticipate such as a breakdown. It seems cruel not to help people in those types of situations just because of a small fee.

There are devices however that offer free satellite help signals. No data or anything, just press the button and it will send your coordinates to a (government funded) emergency dispatch who will automatically send rescue.

Neat but the phone isn’t super robust. I’d hate to have to rely on it in extreme emergencies. A dedicated tracker is better as it can survive in cold and other serious conditions. That being said you are more likely to have the phone on you which is a big deal

They definitely marketed it as a tool for situations when you're not expecting to need it. Like, they were pretty clear about how it would be slower and very limited compared to dedicated satellite telephony devices.

I’ve found it to be pretty robust. I’ve taken the same phone on winter climbs in interior Alaska and summer floats, one of which I had to unstick a raft from a rock while water poured over me for about 30 minutes while it was in a pocket in my PFD. It’s held up just fine.

The only thing is battery life. Especially in the cold, but that’s not an Apple thing, that’s an electronics thing. But you keep it in an internal pocket where body heat can keep it warm and turn off all the radios, or even the phone itself while not in use, and it can last a long time. I can now trade out my garmin inreach for a portable battery (which I already carry every trip yet never needed so far).

It's like the camera. The best emergency GPS tracker is the one you have with you.

Not to mention this is a nice backup for if I accidentally break my InReach or the battery fails or something.

For the three-odd backpacking trips I take a year, it's perfect.

I don’t know, modern phones have zero moving parts, are adequately water resistant so I don’t see that. The most likely problem it might have is the battery, which doesn’t happen overnight.

Battery works really poorly in the cold. Also screen cracking

My guess is that they'll do this ongoing. So, you buy an iPhone 15 and you'll get 2 years complimentary, and so on.

And sadly North America only.

For now. I’m sure it’s on the roadmap everywhere it’s allowed.

I wonder what will be the rollout order. I guess I would most like to have this in the countries that are usually the last to receive Apple feature support.

It's not a pure software feature and seems like it needs tons of "boots on the ground" support in terms of cooperation from local emergency services. So I'm guessing it will be first/only in developed countries with high state capacity.

There’s a handful of countries where you’ll be arrested if caught with a satellite communications device so keeping it NA only is probably just as much apple trying to not present this as trying to force the feature on the world (yet)

Wow. I didn't know this. Makes (tragic) sense from a censorship perspective, obviously.

https://blog.telestial.com/2017/11/countries-where-satellite...

I believe T-mobile and SpaceX is free for all Tmobile customers.

Yup, same year as tesla FSD ships and can actually avoid small kids and stationary objects, I hear.

Right after the Cybertruck :P

You do know that over 100K people have the beta?

If people want it now in the US, they can just sign up for the beta. I know several people who did that and got it. It isn't a high bar.

In heavily tested locations (West Coast), it has gotten to the point that it seems to pretty much work.

How do I sign up? Their website gives the impression it's not available until next year.

From your Tesla.

I don't have one. If there's 100k people in the beta, do you have a link to reviews or anything? I'm curious how well it works, compared to Apple's version where you apparently have to wave your phone in the air a certain way. Maybe with LEO receivers that isn't necessary?

Tesla does avoid small kids and stationary objects, which you can see with as simple as a search on youtube.

Also SpaceX is not Tesla in the first place anyway.

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