The Polite Form ます (Masu) in Japanese
gokugoku.app
gokugoku.app
This is a low effort attempt at SEO for a learning app. While I’m sure the app is fine, I hope it won’t kick out Tao Kim’s guide on google as that is much higher quality.
Thanks for the tip, and here’s a link to save people the google.
In southern Indian languages, a similar differentiation of formal/informal exists. In northern/eastern languages things are even more nuanced because three levels of politeness exist. This sometimes results in some very awkward scenarios when someone from south is erroneously interpreted as being impolite even when they themselves think they are being polite (I am from a place in north which is frequented by many pilgrims from south).
In the north, esp. in business contexts a dialect of Hindi is getting popular which eschews these levels of formalisms and blends idioms to be closer to English.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/why-did-we-sto...
The pronoun that had previously been restricted to addressing more than one person (ye or you) started to see service as a singular pronoun. Initially you was used to refer to a person of high social standing (such as royalty, who would be addressed as “your majesty”) but soon came to be used as well when speaking with a social equal.
As a result, poor thou was downgraded, and was used primarily when referring to a person of lower social standing, such as a servant. However, this pronoun did not disappear, as it also functioned as an indicator of familiarity or intimacy, and retained its function as a singular form of address for God in many cases in ecclesiastical writings.
what do you mean i messed up the context?
English had a similar distinction in the past, with distinct singular/plural pronouns "thou"/"you", and the plural "you" being used for polite speech, but of course "thou" has disappeared over time.
Even more formal is of using proxy objects, as in to not refer to a person directly, but some quality of him, “your highness” is the most obvious example.
I was thinking of something like "would he like a cup of tea?" when you said third person, and that didn't seem to match anything I'd heard/read, so I was feeling very confused.
England had an outbreak of religious fanaticism, there was a regicide, dictatorship, a bunch of the losers got kicked out of the country and ended up in the colonies. The Dissenters, also known as the Ranters and Levelers, refused to use the formal pronoun, and insisted of calling everyone 'thou'.
The pendulum swung pretty hard and English dropped thou entirely in response.
https://www.quieroaprenderidiomas.com/idioma-castellano/uste...
Interestingly, there are a bunch of other polite pronouns that have fallen out of use in most of the country, and have now taken on a sarcastic/mocking connotation (dânsul/dânsa/dânșii/dânsele for third person, and dumneata for second person).
Funny! I only know Romanian from my grandparents, and I haven't lived in Romania, so I thought these were fairly normal still :)
Other analyses more so analyse these forms as creating distance between oneself and the statement, lending them a more impersonal tone. A similar effect to how “would” can be used in English to say, say, “That would be the case.” instead of “That is the case.” which also sounds less direct and more polite, because it creates distance.
Japanese native speakers have been known to use the “plain” form even in communication with superiors when such distance is not appropriate, such as when expressing genuine concern.
https://www.tofugu.com/japanese/da-vs-desu-in-real-life/
Japanese grammarians have analysed many forms in across many lines which do not really reflect how Japanese native speakers descriptively use them. “gendered speech” is another one that is commonly criticized.
Another similar case is Dutch, where textbooks will tell there is one way to say “you” to superiors and one way to peers and inferiors. In reality the “superior” “you” simply creates distance and sounds as though one is speaking to someone one is not on personal terms with. It's really not much different from “Mr. Johnson” vs. “John” and while the former is more commonly used against a superior, it can also feel inappropriate for a superior to use the latter even when talking to an inferior.