Wet/Dry Vacuum Buying Guide (2019)
wet-dry-vac.com
wet-dry-vac.com
URL: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSN7PXwn1yU
Summary: SHOP VACS TESTED: Ridgid, Craftsman, Shop Vac, Bauer, DeWalt, Hart, and Stanley tested for horsepower, air speed, suction and noise level. Testing also included speed of vacuuming 5 gallons of water and 50 pounds of sand. Total water holding capacity also measured for each brand. Finally, each brand participated in a "grudge" match when the suction hoses were joined together.
On the farm part, there's a pretty funny video he has called (iirc) "Does Project Farm actually farm?"
https://socialblade.com/youtube/c/@projectfarm
And I expect that he's near the top of those numbers, because his viewers are probably buying expensive tools based on his recommendations rather than an equivalent number of views watching a cartoon for kids or cute animals or something else difficult to market.
At close to a million views on many of his videos, and something like $0.01 per ad view, he's likely making on the order of $10k per video. Buying and destructively testing some shop vacs, hose clamps, or whatever is just part of that budget.
A useful review would give you an actual choice: what's the difference between a department store brand $100 vacuum, a $500 vacuum, and a $1000 vacuum?
This, to me is the most important metric. And from a person who is allergic to absolutely nothing thank spaghetti, I’ve always noticed this aspect of vacuums
To the point where I make an effort to start my vacuum out the door when first starting it such that the initial blow of the fan blasts the dust captured within to the outside.
Most people don’t realize that many vacuums have a small filter for the escape air and they never clean or change that other filter
EDIT: I also, will never have a carpeted home. The reason is, once you have a fully hardwood home, you realize just how much actual detritus accumulates in even the most lightly traveled areas.
In the 1980s we bought a house in Tahoe, and it had 2" (TWO INCH LONG) shag carpet. and it was RAINBOW COLORED.
I wish I had a pic of it, but it was literally 2" long rainbow shag carpet that was a nightmare.
https://i.imgur.com/u4sFJj2.jpg
But the entire house. 1982 cocaine house.
Carpets were invented to hide dirt. The history of the vacuum is quite amazing.
I HIGHLY recommend Carpet covered by Leather.
I cannot describe it - but thick leather, covering carpet, on bare-feet is amazing.
Trust me until you feel it.
this is not a fetish, its just a reality: Cover a carpeted space in high quality leather. Walk on it.
Seriously. its the best walking experience.
(Source: Leather over carpet in my room.)
Best leather source ever:
https://www.yelp.com/biz/s-h-frank-and-company-san-francisco
>>>Folks, if you find yourself frustrated when you come to SH Frank, you might just be struggling with entitlement, and you may just be intolerant of different types of personalities. Larry is excellent at what he does, but he's super neurotic, and probably on the spectrum
-
Larry is like larry david, but not funny. He is the neurotic jew Larry David wished he was....
Anyway, this guy is amazingly cool - but, and I am not joking, Walk into the shop with a wrinkled $100 bill in your hand. LITERALLY A $100 BILL
And flag it around asking about prices...
I swear this is how I bought all my leather from him and its kind of an art.
For babies to crawl on, there are mats you can lay on the floor such as these: http://en.alzipmat.com/
The mats are easy to clean, and thus may be healthier than carpets which are difficult to deeply clean thoroughly or frequently.
But I would prefer that dirt be trapped in a carpet than floating around my home, kicked up again every time there is a breeze.
Can corroborate: is horrifying.
“PM10, PM2.5, PM1, and PM0.1 resuspension due to human walking”
Strongly disagree. He's reviewing vacuums that someone would actually use in their shop environment. Who the heck is going to risk dropping $1000 on a vacuum for use in a busy shop? I'd be paranoid that something would scratch it. Or never want to use it outside of the basic parameters it's designed for. Whereas with my $50 ShopVac, I have no fear of using it and it gets used all the time, and probably for things it's not meant for.
People who value not dying from silicosis, I guess. Obviously it depends on your use cases. Sawdust for example is not as dangerous, but you can still find various price points and performance of wood dust extractors.
Many woods are moderately to severely toxic. Plywood glues are probably not healthy to breathe. Most finishes are undoubtedly health-hazardous in micro/nano-particle size, when inhaled.
https://www.wood-database.com/wood-articles/wood-allergies-a...
Nothing good comes of breathing micro-/nano-particles, even wood ones.
Also used this beast and a couple chunks of conduit to clear a tricky gutter.
However, there are certainly sites, and perhaps this is one, where there is considerable credibility (actual interest and knowledge), research and effort that I have no problem with the owner being compensated for providing the resource.
Even if just providing a more intuitive and deeper method to narrow down options to fit a narrower use case (which vac has the longest cord!), then there is added value.
One solution is things like Consumer Reports and Wirecutter, where you have an institution that does some quality control. But I wonder if there's something in the middle, like a few good reviewers clubbing together and certifying one another, such that there's a recognizable brand that they share, one with meaningfully high standards.
He is not the "Stereophile" type of reviewer, for example.
Affiliate programs have destroyed this kind of web and Google happily suggests these sites as search results.
It honestly just makes me sad.
The problem is discoverability. Though there are more sites like this than ever before, it's hard to find any of them. Google has been thoroughly conquered by content marketing at this point -- if you search for any product category, the first dozens of pages are 100% long form commercial advertising now. They all have much larger budgets and way better SEO skills than the average aficionado.
I ended up getting everything in a single shade of white, just varying levels of glossy depending on if it’s trim or ceiling. And I am not really that happy with the outcome to be honest.
I had a GF who decided to paint a major wall in her house as pure pitch black. I thought it was a horrid idea, until it was finished.
Grey is the way.
Its neutral to all of your bad interior design decisions.
https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/wet-dry-vac-warranty
> It is our experience that a product that fails prematurely due to a manufacturing defect in materials or workmanship, will generally do so very early in the products life cycle, often the first or second time the product is used. When returned for inspection, these products are generally found to still be in like new condition and show very little signs of use. It is uncommon for a product that was manufactured with a defect, to survive under normal use for any extended period of time. Products that are returned for warranty inspection after months or years of continuous reliable service are rarely found to be defective. The most common demand for service is the result of normal wear and tear issues, which may not be considered a defect in materials or workmanship.
No warranty is fine, but I don't understand how they can put that badge on the box in good conscience. It wasn't that big a deal, but it rubbed me the wrong way and I'll never buy Rigid again.
What I'd really rather do is have a conversation with the person who wrote the "Lifetime Warranty" copy. What "lifetime" are they referring to? I can't think of a defense for it. I can only imagine two ways the warranty could be activated: Either you buy it and it never works to begin with, or you buy it, leave it unopened for your entire lifetime, and then open it on your deathbed to discover it doesn't work.
> Ridgid is owned by Emerson Electric and has licensed the Ridgid brand name to TTI for the manufacture of woodworking stationary and portable power tools. Ridgid (the Ridge Tool company, a subsidiary of Emerson Electric) also makes plumbing and electrical tools that have nothing to do with TTI. These are generally made here in the U.S. Same is true of the Ridgid shop vacs, which I believe are made by Emerson Electric. These are not manufactured or warranted by TTI either.
> Also noted in a post somewhere else on the site recently was a statement that Ridgid was owned by Home Depot. Again, this is NOT true. The fact that both Home Depot and Ridgid use the color "orange" is strictly a coincidence. Home Depot does have an exclusive retail agreement for the Ridgid-brand and Ryobi-brand tools made by TTI. But Ridgid plumbing and electrical tools are not part of this agreement. Also, TTI-owned Milwaukee tools are not part of Home Depot's exclusive retail agreement either.
> The Lifetime warranty lasts for the manufacturer’s defined lifetime of your vac. The vacs are designed to have a run life of 500-700 hours. The warranty coverage ends the shorter of: after such run life or the product becomes unusable for reasons other than defects in workmanship or material.
The shorter of (500-700 hours) or (when the product becomes unusable) for me was (when the product became unusable), or about 6 months.
According to the warranty page you linked, "first or second use" is not a limitation. The language you quoted, however, does discourage warranty claims on products that have been used for a while. I agree that does not inspire confidence in the longevity of their products.
> Modesty permeates Numatic. The campus is more Wernham Hogg than Silicon Valley; the firm never advertises Henry and retains no PR agency. Yet it has a turnover of almost £160m and has now made more than 14m Henry vacuums ... Duncan beams with pride as he tells me almost all of the 75 parts that make up the latest model could be used to repair “Number one”, as he calls the 1981 original; Henrys are made to last – and to be easily repaired – in the landfill age of rapid obsolescence.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32414066
> I'll mention for the benefit of our American readers that Henry is a dry vacuum, Charles is a wet/dry, and George is a wet/dry with a tank and pump for spraying carpet cleaner.
The downside is how expensive and heavy the vacuum is, along with the extra time it takes to set up (add water & later discard water).
"Bagless" vacuums like the popular Dyson are a joke compared to either.
The Dyson weighs considerably less. Turns out there's tradeoffs in different engineering solutions.
Products made before the power and noise limits came into force now sell for a lot of money, because they work better!
My yard is absurd clay. I've used my wet/dry vac, along with an electric pressure washer, to dig holes and remove tree roots (easier to cut what you can see).
A drain would increase my work time, at the expense of thicker sludge when I'd have to empty the vac manually. What I really want is to move the mud slurry, not store it. I suppose I should build an open frame to replace the vacuum body, and just use the pump lid.
This kind of website (filter search list) often looks intimidating at the first glance but they're surprisingly very easy to use, from my experience using Digi-key as a non-EE professional.
I do have a question about shop-vac in general: Under what situation you (as your household) need one comparing to just having a normal "dry" vacuum? I never owned one so don't see its applications.
I'd guess almost all the parts are manufactured in China these days, even if some assembly is done in the USA.
Of course, there's always more to add, and the first items I notice are that there seems to be nothing from Fein (makes great vacs, I've used one in my workshop for years), and that we can't sort by CFM, Lift, or Air Watts.
Please keep up the good work!
> The original, and most iconic manufacturer of wet-dry vacuums, the privately held Shop-Vac Company, imploded and went out of business.
A disappointing sign of the times, but luckily (so far) I've been able to find 3rd party replacement bags and supplies for my 3 Shop-Vacs online.
> The bank indeed sold Shop-Vac’s assets to a Chinese company. But the new owner, through its subsidiary GreatStar Tools USA, decided to keep Shop-Vac’s operations in Williamsport, led by new American managers. More than 200 of the old workers -- about half of the previous Pennsylvania workforce -- were retained or rehired this year ... Shop-Vac will continue to produce motor assemblies for all of its vacuums in Asia, and it will also continue to produce small Shop-Vacs -- under four gallons -- in China or in Vietnam to reduce tariff costs. Those smaller household vacuums sell at a lower profit margin, and they can still be produced in Asia at a lower cost.
Regarding the thin non-HEPA filters that come with the packs of bags, if your Miele is anything like mine, you're supposed to use one of those and the HEPA filter. There is a vertical tray behind the bag compartment that snaps open where you can insert one of these pre-filters. (You may need to cut it to size.) The air exiting the bag goes through the pre-filter first and then the HEPA filter, so the HEPA filter clogs more slowly.
On the cord retrieval system, my vacuum came with instructions to hold the plug while the cord is pulled in, and only let it go when the slack has been all taken up. This prevents the whipping you mentioned.
If you try using an exhaust filter on the motor intake, it will starve the intake, stressing the motor.
I just opened a fresh box of GN bags for my C1, and it came with two flat filters along with the bags.
One is a soft filter with Air Clean printed on it. It has cut lines that match the size of the HEPA filter.
My C1 came without the HEPA filter but had a filter holder designed to hold the soft filter if you don't have the HEPA. I put a HEPA filter in mine, so I don't use that holder or this soft filter.
The other is the wiry scratchy filter which goes in the vertical filter holder. This is the pre-motor filter you're talking about, and it has cut lines that match that filter holder. I use this one along with the HEPA filter.
Are we on the same page now? Want to make sure I didn't get it wrong. :-)
When I buy bags, I get the Air Clean filters with them, but it doesn't come with the premotor filter.
I should have figured that different retailers would package differently. That's my bad.
In case it helps, here are the bag+filter packages I've been getting:
https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B00UTFZAII/
This definitely has both the throwaway Air Clean filter and the scratchy pre-motor filter.
There seem to be no Numatics in this database: http://wet-dry-vac.com/?manu=Numatic%
Can perhaps anyone on HN assist? It's urgent.
Hey, HN type people: How can we build a network of people and sites like this to replace the inferior process of adding "reddit" to the Google searches to actually find useful information?
Wirecutter being a prime example, they tend to exclude products they can't get an affiliate link for. So their incentives are not always aligned with yours.
That whole mattress review scandal with Sleepopolis and HonestMattressReviews shows exactly what happens when sites like this get big.
So they need to stay small and secret. Unfortunate.
I was looking at vacation destinations recently, and considering taking a toddler, and Google searches for things like "Destination A vs Destination B" or "Destination A with toddlers" led to so much SEO junk. Ads for shiny e-books with regurgitated information, text that was clearly robot-generated, etc. Then adding "reddit" to the end of the searches does get you to helpful discussion from everyday people. Sure, you might have to read between the lines ("oh, this person seems unwilling to pay more than Motel 6 rates", "oh, this person seems like they might be afraid of black people", etc). Sure, the info might be out of date, or otherwise in need of verification. But you can quickly accumulate some useful ideas that the shinier SEO-optimized junk sites just don't seem to provide.
Take this one-star review of a wet-dry vac:
"I bought this thing specifically to suck out the ash in my fireplace. It got use with some other projects like small wood chips and sawdust before I tackled the fireplace, and it did fine. Then I put it to task. It sucked up maybe 1/5 capacity of dust and just stopped."
If the top rated one-star review for this consumer-level vacuum is that the filter immediately clogs when you *SUCK UP ASH FROM A FIREPLACE* then I know hey, this one-star reviewer doesn't understand vacuums.
So yeah, as long as you find one guy on Reddit who's really happy with the vacuum and the one-star reviews are stupid, you've got a good product.
And that's assuming you can even amass useful information. For every useful bit of information you will have to filter out ten dolts who just want to hype whatever premium product they bought in order to self-justify the purchase (see for example Reddit's penchant for certain brands in certain product categories).
I’m the meantime before such a site exists, the (imperfect) solution is to do research as well as you can, and only buy products from vendors who offer a good return policy. In the US, Costco comes to mind.
And be brutal about returning stuff that is not great.
Same for buying kitchens, mattresses, cars ...
We focus on keeping track of and removing the special status of sources caught getting paid to write fake reviews. Some categories are more prone to astroturfing than others, and we account for that by restricting the sources. Actively curating the sources is part of our daily work.
> "[A HEPA Filter] is particularly useful for very fine dust that can be harmful, like asbestos or mold spores [...]"
The professional vacuums (such as some manufactured Pullman Holt, Nikro) are tested and certified for these purposes. Please do comprehensive research when dealing with hazardous materials. Consider professional abatement services.
Edit: formatting, disclaimer, typos, precision
Sadly, I know that a number more than zero of building companies will simply bury asbestos when they happen upon it, rather than paying through the nose for specialist disposal companies.
Do all companies follow these steps, no. Can they be held accountable for neglecting safety, yes. Being exposed to hazard materials like asbestos is gross negligence. Knowing that such a company exists doesn't means it's normal or common practice.
I'll mention, though, that a HEPA filter on the vacuum, together with an N95 on your face, is often adequate, even if the vacuum doesn't have a properly sealed full HEPA system. The upside of a HEPA filter on the vacuum which most of the air passes through is that it will catch most (not 99+%) of the fine dust. If you reduce fine, harmful dust by 80% every time (assuming 80% of the air passes through the filter and 20% goes around it), after three cleanings, you'll have removed >99% of the fine dust.
A lot of this depends on the level of hazard. There's a scale from pollen allergies to nuclear/BSL-4 waste.
For the pollen end, I've found that combined half-measures usually do better than the uber-over-engineered stuff.
We have gone from branding that consumers revognise to branding spesifically being used to mislead and confuse customers. Hwat went wrong in the market?
The origins of Stella Artois can be traced to 1366 when the Den Hoorn brewery was established in Leuven, Belgium
I am sure even cavemen traded sharpened rocks and said 'this one is made by steve, he is really good, so I want more meat for it'
So many industries are like this, just out of sight of the average customer, it's hilarious.
Part of the problem is also that knock off manufacturing is now quick and pretty good. Snap-On initially had a huge lead on the market because (a) they invented something new and (b) nobody could quickly replicate what they had. Now if they come out with a new type of wrench within a year others will copy the design at a fraction of the cost and it will be almost as good. In most cases it will be way better value for the money.
Think Crosley record players, or different anti-itch powders, and such.
Some managed to be just-good-enough to crawl back into becoming a real brand with real manufacturing. But some remained just junk, only to disappear again.
Or, in other cases, the manufacturer of cheap Chinese junk will contract with a well-known American brand to put their brand on the junk and offer it as a discount to the American company's existing customers. Readers' Digest clock radios is a good example.
Looking through Goodwill will reveal dozens of these brands, and their junk just before it hits the landfill.
We’re living in a world where nearly everything is low quality. It’s the old Sam Vimes narrative about being poor being expensive, but it is currently challenging for people of any means to find a quality product without loads of research and expertise.
And even then, it’s subject to change as good brands get bought by someone larger or new management comes in and cuts quality to increase margins.
Can you actually list items that, on a price-adjusted level, are lower quality? Nearly everything is of higher quality and cheaper than it ever was.
Meanwhile fridges from the 1960s are still humming along fine.
The crumbly new fridge is more energy efficient by a long shot than that workhorse hold fridge - so it does depend on what you consider quality, but longevity and repairability are definitely major factors in what I consider quality.
Fridges that you see from the 1960s are still humming along fine. All the ones that broke decades ago get none of your attention. This is survivorship bias. Reliability of products like fridges has gone up immensely over the last 50 years.
I've used it for all kinds of things. I tend to reinforce it if it's load-bearing (eg I made a bracket for my router under my desk, but molded the Sugru around a screw that I put in the desk). Each pack is very small, so it'll only be enough for corners or wrapping around wires very close to the end or whatever.
Compare this with the garbage we have in today’s McMansions … and weep.
Because you can buy an newbuilt apartment in London for a million dollars and it will be absolute shit. Recently builders forgot to build balconies, forgot to lay down internet cable for a block of flats, and built and entire block wrong way round. They are worse than an average javascript app!
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/uknews/16419384/persimmon-buil...
Eg, my microwave has a vent cover on the top that tends to crack and fall off after less than 3 years. They company wants >$90 for the lightweight, simple plastic part.
I have a fridge with a long lasting LED light. The proprietary board that its mounted to failed after less than 4 years.
We've somehow managed to replace short lasting components (filament bulbs) with components that last longer (led) but fail in more costly ways. Somehow the manufacturer gets away with blaming laws (incandescent bulbs were banned, we say!) while also profiting from building things too cheaply.
If I had more money to spend I'd get an M-class vac, but the cheapest one is a Festool for 560 euros. It's not often that Festool is the cheapest in a category.
(I think the M/L class system is specific to The Netherlands: https://mastertools.nl/collections/bouwstofzuiger?refinement... basically M class means it's safe to use by professionals who work with stone dust for 8 hours per day).
One very popular product was subcompact cars in the '80s when GM, Ford, etc., needed something to offer in a segment they had no expertise in or manufacturing capacity, so they had third string Japanese and S Korean MFs pump out stuff and rebadge them as their own. Often these rebranded Daihatsus, Ssanyang, etc., sucked... but so did Chevy and GM in many respects anyway.
That said, if a brand is quality conscious and can filter on our behalf, I don't see the problem. A perfect example is Apple. They have someone MFG their designs to spec and we receive a quality product.
I usually use the AK-47 as an example for Dewalt -- they use such sloppy bearings and construction there isnt much to wear out that it doesnt work. Its not well built, just sloppy enough to take a beating
Premium tool brands are like Festool, Mafell, etc. Stuff that weekend warriors freak out about when they see the price tag. Dewalt just has a big marketing budget, recognizable colors, and is in every big box store.
DeWalt has great ergonomics though.
Before Sears imploded, the power tools were mostly made by Black and Decker, which owns DeWalt but also makes a lot of low-end crap that ended up in the Craftsman line. I'm not sure who makes them now.
You trust the brand to outsource manufacturing to high-quality suppliers. They're outsourcing 99% of all components anyway. Apple does this. What is the difference?
Dewalt (Stanley, etc.) is doing none of that, they're just white-labelling. Essentially in this relationship Dewalt is a marketer.
And Apple will even do the reverse, arranging for Apple-designed products to be sold under someone else's brand, if they don't believe that the design is up to usual Apple quality.
Source: Knew an Apple engineer who was involved with said charger.
Here is the likely chinese manufacturer
If you're the CEO of a company, licensing out your brand seems like free money, in the short term.
If you're a well known international brand of backhoes, and somebody offers you $x00k/year to put your logo on their line of disposable batteries? No cost to you, no effort needed on your part, it's pure profit.
It's only in the medium term you run into problems - if they're shitty batteries, that might damage your reputation and harm your backhoe sales. Or even if they're perfectly good batteries, having your name on consumer-grade disposable items might be a poor association if your main business is all about industrial multi-decade-life products.
Oh, some CEOs would resist the siren song of free money. But others will ignore the 'fuzzy marketing mumbo-jumbo' about 'brand reputation' and comfort themselves with the assumption their customers are sophisticated enough to know the batteries don't reflect on the backhoes. Nobody expects Harley-Davidson baseball caps to be made in a Harley-Davidson factory, after all! And if you've moved jobs before the reputation impact shows up on the bottom line, it'll look like you did a great job.
An example of someone currently doing that well is Kirkland house brands at Costco. They are universally known for being an incredible value and just as good or superior to the name brand stuff on the shelf next to them.
An example of someone currently doing it poorly is Pendleton, who is known for making wool blankets that cost $500 and last generations. They have been putting their name all over $20 plastic fleece blankets in the last year or so.
For tools, it’s not only brand licensing but mass consolidation. Brands are used similar to car manufacturers.
https://www.protoolreviews.com/power-tool-manufacturers-who-...
Milwaukee Ryobi Rigid and Hart (found at walmart) are all the same manufacturer. I own mostly Milwaukee tool, bought something from Ryobi and had it break right away.
(the argument is that the plastic gear serves as a "mechanical fuse" and if something's going to break it's better that it be a $2 plastic gear instead of burning up your motor, but, in the big picture, they're also weakening up the motor, etc.)
Having dismantled many, the entry level kitchenaid design hasn’t changed much in the past two decades.
It turns out, and kitchenaid realized, there was a lot of money to be made by casual box cake mixers that want the appearance of a KA.
I live in the USA and I generally consider Makita (which also doesn't have any other brands or lines, it's just Makita) to be a high-quality tool brand that I'm happy to use and happy to own in the garage. I think most people would agree with that assessment as well. But the Makita tools we get here have nothing on the Makita tools that are actually available in Japan. It's like another tier entirely. I sure wish we could get all that good stuff here.
Why do I see SQL at the bottom of the highly-touted wet/dry search page?
> SELECT COUNT(DISTINCT vacid) FROM vac ;