Gen Z question saving money for a future that looks so bleak
denverpost.com
denverpost.com
I genuinely think the economic system will need a complete rethink in the next 20 years or so, because right now it’s completely failing to deliver for my generation. No matter how well we do, the basic life goals of home ownership and starting a family are out of reach for us.
I don't think this is a desirable outcome, but I can also see it being an option. Essentially people just checking out from conventional work hard, pay high taxes, have less. Not sure if people will stick with that for too long.
I looked up Australian house prices and they're so ridiculous it's hard to even fathom. It's a great place but really, wow?
Gen Z people will enforce it. No group ever acts as a monolith. For a dumb fictional example, IIRC, all the enforcers in Hunger Games were members of one of the subjugated districts given a better quality of life due to their service. For a real-life example, I believe in Russian and Chinese prisons, the lowest level of enforcement and supervision are actually consists of inmates who've been given privileges by the guards.
I think that's actually more or less the same system that I was referring to, I just couldn't remember the term.
Nah, we'll just adopt something like the Logan's Run solution: replace the pension with carrousel and otherwise stay the course.
Something i've been thinking about for a while. Gen Z and Millenials are not having children at replenishment. The older folks are living a lot longer, so our population is still going up today, but the 30 year olds who will have children are alive today, we can count them. There's less of them. As older generations start to dwindle, and are forced to move to long term care situations (which to be fair, I think a lot of boomers will resist as hard as possible), the housing supply crunch will probably go down. The real drain on society will be a raising retired population, and a dwindling working population. The older generations outnumbering the younger isn't going to help the younger generations politically either.
I think it's far more likely that there's a general reduction in standard of living for everyone below the 90/95/99th percentile.
There's not really any pressure to prevent it, people just keep waking up every morning and going to work regardless of how bad it gets.
10-15 years ago when I graduated we had basically the same situation - the bar to win has just been raised. You either aim to be in the top 10/5/1% (adjust as necessary), or you have a life of struggling to pay the bills forever.
We need social democracy, expanded government roles and investment in certain fields, stronger environmental protections, and other policies that are either known to work or very likely to work.
Indeterminate pessimism also means they aren't taking economic risks, whereas many Gen-Z are becoming content creators or starting businesses with their savings, so it could be more determinate optimism. Possibly naive, but time will tell.
While millennials are old enough now to appreciate compounding wealth, gen Z still has a few more years until that happens on average. Most people start actively investing in their 30s.
Instead of helplessness, there is the idea of "learned hopefulness" to take a more proactive approach to one's future, even in the bleakest of times.
A good way to visualize that is by looking at the S&P 500 all-time graph and getting into the habit of regularly investing a modest amount as you skill up and expand your earning potential with age.
Start investing the day you get your first job and let the exponential function do what it does best.
Property? Demographic collapses incoming in multiple developed countries, there will be a surplus of land in a decade or two? Climate change, where do you buy that's safe?
Shares? Going backwards, lots of uncertainty, potential war /conflict about to break out in the pacific.High inflation, interest rates.
I sold all my shares a few months back, not looking like the best of times to get back in, not the worst either.
Gold?
A mix of high quality long term bonds and stocks, depending on the desired risk profile, the same boring answer you'll get from anybody else.
> Demographic collapses incoming in multiple developed countries, there will be a surplus of land in a decade or two?
Very much a fantasy.
> Shares? Going backwards, lots of uncertainty, potential war /conflict about to break out in the pacific.High inflation, interest rates.
The idea is to buy low and sell high, not buy high and sell low. I have 40+ years of work ahead of me. We had recessions before.
Why? Look at Japan, there is places where land is being given away, some of this land was absolutely prime real estate in the early 90's, you couldn't even buy it.
Even in those places, if you buy something, you risk being asked to move due to now crumbling or unsustainable infrastructure. So explain why this doesn't happen in other countries who are facing population decline also ?
> I have 40+ years of work ahead of me. We had recessions before.
The point of the article is that young people don't feel like they want to work and save for forty years due to bleak outlook though?
It's true what people say, we don't have an economic model for what the future looks like here. I'm not saying it's a catastrophe, I'm just saying that you might be expecting a return to normality which might be strange given the changes we're seeing in the climate, demographics etc. Likely I'll just "buy back in" because what else do you do?
My strategy at the moment is not to worry too much about paying stupid money for land, and put my money into yes, bonds or other boring crap.
You could simplify that idea to simply just "buy". Not enough people even contribute to their retirement accounts to begin with.
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/01061...
https://www.census.gov/content/dam/Census/library/publicatio...
Everyone knows "buy low, sell high", but few people know how to actually do it.
The one thing I've learned - Don't buy an asset because it's going up. That's FOMO. Don't sell an asset because it's going down. If you buy something going up and sell going down, that's the recipe for buying high and selling low.
Also, in the long term, the market is always up. Just keep buying shares of index funds. If the market is in a dip, that's the time to double-down and buy extra, not sell.
EDIT: I also wanted to add that in general the idea of compounding wealth is totally correct, but the biggest vehicle for this has been the family home for generations, and it seems that for all intents and purposes, my generation and most of the one before me have been locked out of this. Personally, I’m very regularly investing any spare money into a range of index and diversified funds to try and keep myself ahead but without the 10-1 leverage property here offers its not enough.
Australia has a pretty low birth rate, there is immigration, but not everyone moving to Australia is rich, it's limited. There is climate change which IMO makes Sydney less desirable (becoming crazy hot in summers). Why would it double again? Even if it did, why do you think it will stay at all time highs?
The only way I can see the high prices being sustainable is if developing countries populations were growing, more people with money to come compete for properties. Ultimately, that's not what's happening, so won't there be more properties on offer in the future? I've spent time in Australia and in the area I lived in Sydney, many of my neighbors were 50+, this was some while ago but still...
40 years of successive governments have set the city up to make decentralisation basically impossible. We have next to no fast transit options, our roads in and out are all privately owned toll roads, and once you leave the ‘greater sydney area’, which is fairly massive anyway, there’s basically nothing there to support you.
Also, remote work is now becoming more of a thing than ever, so people have much less of a need to live in Sydney itself and pay crazy high rent. I can see this happening in many other major cities.
I actually left a major city recently where I was paying 5x the rent I was paying pre-pandemic. Things just aren't what they used to be in this regard. I also now have way more money to save and invest in property myself, or other things such as shares. I feel like before I was a slave, now I'm somewhat liberated.
I’m not in tech but it really doesn’t matter where I have a place to live so I’m in the process of buying a house in Iowa which is literally less expensive than the storage unit I rent in Phoenix — relatively speaking, over time, if you aren’t that good at math, maybe?
Sure, after closing I have to deal with the squatters (or maybe renters, dunno?) and probably have to do some repairs (again, dunno?) but the price is basically for a shell of a house which, after a bit of research, is how these things are priced if you’re willing to take on some risk and don’t mind doing some work before you can move in.
At the risk of just rambling…the flowers in the front yard are what really sold me, what kind of person is going to stay in a bank-owned house and still maintain the yard?
Because of what's around it.
Funny enough you mention Iowa. My brother got a job that allows him to work remote and considered moving to a small town in Iowa because he could buy a decent house for under $100K, which would give him a mortgage that's half of what he pays for rent right now. But then he looked at the neighborhood in street view and saw an alarming number of Confederate and Trump flags and decided against it.
I luckily bought my house when I did, because home values in my area have nearly doubled in the last 7 years (Paid $338K, currently estimated worth $650K now). For me to move to a cheaper place means living in the middle of nowhere, and I prefer to live somewhere that gives me lots of options for fine dining within a 30 minute drive. I also like living in a nicer neighborhood where I don't have to worry about some crackhead trying to steal my wife's catalytic converter.
Quad-Cities seems like a good area to me, that was my original plan but this about 45 minutes away in Clinton. Probably won’t be able to get away without a car like I did in Phoenix because I can’t really see me riding a bicycle in the real cold but everything I need is within easy biking distance. Hell, the Mississippi River is a leisurely seven minute bike ride away.
I’m actually totally randomly headed out there on my next load, will have to be on the look out for confederate flags.
In Canada, up until a couple years ago, house prices appreciated 7% per annum on average. That is a doubling every ten years.
In the US, prices have appreciated by 3-4%. That’s a double every twenty years.
Sydney prices will be on the same trend.
But, yah, even then it eventually doubles. Look up “Rule of 77” for an explanation.
Want to talk about an age group? Say what it is. How dumb can people be? Here, let's walk though it:
"Today, 20-30 year-olds face a variety of economic challenges."
OMG, that was soooo easy! I didn't have to make up or look up a bullshit label! YAY!