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Comment by kennywinker | Hacker News Reader

> that one part of the transaction does not like the deal that they entered voluntarily

The choice between homelessness, starvation, and working an underpaid job is not a choice made voluntarily.

And equating the “exploitation” of slightly higher taxi rates compared with a coercive job… that’s way off the mark. An extra $20 to get from the airport or home from the bar once and a while (talk about transactions entered voluntarily), vs a grueling work environment that pays terrible that you have to do EVERY day to not starve.

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> The choice between homelessness, starvation, and working an underpaid job is not a choice made voluntarily.

Homelessness and starvation (even if we accept this argument at face value for drivers in first-world countries) are natural human condition, and Uber, or any other employer, does not become magically responsible for it just because they enter the picture with their job offer.

> An extra $20 to get from the airport or home from the bar once and a while (talk about transactions entered voluntarily), vs a grueling work environment that pays terrible that you have to do EVERY day to not starve.

I believe that everyone should feel sympathy for the poor and contribute to charity. However, this moral choice should be a free choice made by the person herself and not through coercion by government or similar entities.

> Homelessness and starvation (even if we accept this argument at face value for drivers in first-world countries) are natural human condition

WTF?

The natural human condition is subsistence hunting and gathering. The natural human condition is family unit based farming. The natural human condition is feudal serfdom. The natural human condition doesn’t exist because when and where in history do you point your finger and say this is natural.

The majority of human history we would not have considered ourselves homeless, and we would only starve if there was no food. The idea of one person in the group having more than they need and another dying for lack of food was unthinkable.

Don’t look to history to justify your social-darwinian beliefs. It doesn’t have your back.

Not to mention shifting a discussion about commerce to one of charity. Forcing companies to allocate more of their funds to labour vs profit to owners is not charity, that’s worker power operating as a market force.

>The choice between homelessness, starvation, and working an underpaid job is not a choice made voluntarily.

and removing the underpaid job from the equation leaves someone with just homelessness or starvation - clearly a better position, right?

feel free to tip $20 for your uber rides if you feel that helps

False dichotomy. The choice isn’t between an underpaid job, and no job. It’s between an underpaid job, and a well paid job with less profits for shareholders and owners.

If your particular business can’t exist and pay people well, it needs to die to make room for one that can.

And I don’t tip $20 - I ride transit or my bike. And yes it does make me feel better supporting non-exploitive systems and avoiding exploitive ones.

> It’s between an underpaid job, and a well paid job with less profits for shareholders and owners

what reason you have to believe that is in fact the option? there are really quite few businesses with profit margins so high you could meaningfully raise pay purely by reducing profits.

> If your particular business can’t exist and pay people well, it needs to die to make room for one that can.

and how does that unspecified higher-margin business (if one even exists) achieve it? presumably the main way would be to be much smaller, charge higher fees & target more exclusive customers, so that only the rich get the benefits of the business, and vastly fewer people even get the opportunity for a job. sounds great.

trade-offs exist and your inability to acknowledge them is not constructive

> what reason you have to believe that is in fact the option? there are really quite few businesses with profit margins so high you could meaningfully raise pay purely by reducing profits.

What reason do you have to believe that profit margins are so slim?

My evidence for business being able to pay more is the existence of massive inequality. The superyacht seems to argue that there is more to go around than the financial statements indicate.

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