A hookup app for the emotionally mature
newyorker.com
newyorker.com
> Thursday. I describe it to my friends as “the grownup hookup app.” By “grownup,” I mean not only that its users are above a certain age but also that they favor a kind of maturity and decorum; by “hookup,” I mean that the app facilitates not romance but sex, broadly defined. It is not the place to find your “down-to-earth, no-drama girlfriend” or your “partner in crime.”
How exactly does this translate into "emotional maturity?" Sounds like the writer is trying to ascribe some kind of moral superiority to enjoying non-vanilla casual sex. I mean, that's cool I guess, and no judgment, but from where I stand, dealing with bills, conflict resolution, changing diapers, attending PTA meetings, having to put kids through college, etc. probably requires way more "emotional maturity" than hooking up on a dating app.
But maybe that's just me.
> Not having a partner and not having kids may mean that you have more sporadic sexual encounters with people you do not know very well.
I get that there's an agenda at play here (the very next sentence gets into abortion), but this is provably false. Young people are having less sex than ever[1]. In fact, many psychologists and sociologists are worried about a potential population bust. The root cause is unknown.
[1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/03/29/share-ame...
Sounds more like contrast to other hookup apps.
Anecdata: My grandpa had 9 kids. When asked for the reason, he would say that in his times there was no TV.
Now we have computers, tablets, phones and thousands of ways of consuming content.
Almost everyone is addicted to their phones.
I wouldn’t be surprised if we are just having a lot less human interaction, because we are preferring our devices.
In fact right now I’m writing this comment while I have family around me to interact with. And they are all on their screens as well. We are not interacting, even though some of us are in the same room.
Edit: removed my uninformed comment about the Uvalde police officer
We're spending most of that attention and time elsewhere now, and so relationships... just don't happen more often.
The one whose wife, a teacher, was injured and dying? That doesn’t seem like a case of phone addiction.
If you’re talking about the one with the Punisher lock screen, I’m pretty sure his wife was contacting him telling him she’d been shot and was dying. AFAIK he wasn’t just “checking his phone” out of boredom.
You realize this is of course a joke? Every country in the world decreases birthrate as their socio-economic stability increases, because in part they no longer have to rely on having lots of kids to take care of them when they are old.
The rest of your comment goes almost exactly against the story that is linked? That is about how technology is making it a lot easier for people to connect in person?
It frustrates me that this thoughtless conservatism goes unchallenged on HN.
I don't think this is some thoughtless conservative belief, but rather one that's bringing up how everything primarily being online nowadays is causing less in-person communication than ever. I mean with fewer people having sex each year, it makes sense to suspect the things that have changed between the generations that didn't have this issue and the ones that now do.
> This was one way to make my unwanted future tolerable, to at least make it interesting for myself: to pretend that there was such a possibility as a new kind of person in a new kind of world.
I gotta say, the self awareness is refreshing.
The Guardian has the nickname Grauniad (coined by Private Eye, a far better publication) because of its frequent spelling errors. I had a girlfriend who became a sub-editor, and she was told not to use a spellchecker because it would lead to negligence and hence, mistakes. I understand their logic but I think it's wrong, just use all the tools at your disposal and be diligent.
I'm on Feeld and wow the headline for article is a weird take.
Compared to Tinder and Bumble there aren't many people (which isn't surprising) and it's very explicitly about non-vanilla sex, and I would never have thought that "emotionally mature" would characterize the people on it.
I'm in my 40s and I have trouble finding people my age. It's ok if you want to find a rope bunny or something like that though.
When I was in a relationship we tried it for threesomes and TBH had more luck with that on Tinder.
Also the "cores" concept is just strange. Why did they choose the cities they did? In Australia you can see who is in Melbourne but not Sydney (And Sydney is kind of an iconic gay city, which has a lot of cross over into kink).
I do think it reflects the author's experience a lot though. It doesn't reflect what I've seen when I use the app.
My response was:
Many more swingers.
I've never tried to use FetLife as a dating app. But in my city I recognize many people across the both (so yes a lot of people into kink, which often doesn't really overlap much with the swinger community).
Never used Feeld, not in the market at the moment, but I never saw anyone on Tinder who put any kinks up front.
That can be a sign of vulnerability, or something more along the lines of defiance. One is more mature, the other is quite the opposite.
There was a golden age a while back using websites such as AMM for hookups and threesomes, and Fetlife was unusually great for kink. I basically just listed myself as a male into needle play (with equipment) and LOTS of girls actually came to me. I would get messages asking if my lab was real and when they could visit. Which is a completely contrast to anything you'd see today.
Fetlife really died. The vast majority of female accounts have some variation of "if you'd like to talk to me more, subscribe to my Onlyfans". I opened my inbox today and clicked on the profiles of girls that messaged me years ago, they've all left the site, and you absolutely can't replicate that experience on Tinder.
I'm a middle age balding white guy and I can find more women who want me to top them on Tinder (let alone Feeld!) than I can handle. If you don't believe me, post a pic of some shibari and see what happens (assuming you have normal Tinder profile with face pics and you don't seem too weird). I'm sure you'd find the same thing.
Fetlife is in trouble because of the combination of Facebook (which you can find groups for if your kink is less challenging that needle play!) and OF which causes so much spamming.
I don't even particularly enjoy shibari. But a pic of a single column on an arm or something is like a shibboleth that unlocks a whole world...
But also ran into some that, having zero real life kink experiences, immediately expressed interests in more....advanced I guess(?)stuff like CNC and TPE, so who knows though. The last few generations have had access to the entire spectrum of kinks, and photo/video examples of them in action, via the internet and they are just waiting for an opportunity to live it out themselves.
Edit -- for anyone reading this that may run into someone like me on Tinder, just be careful. I'm always sure to have long talks about limits and boundaries and expectations before any clothes come off, but there's tons of creeps out there that will take advantage of your youth/inexperience to try and push your boundaries, or make you do things your not comfortable with. No means no, anyone not respecting your limits isn't someone you need to fuck with The second anything like that happens or they try to guilt you for saying no to something, you need to shut things down and leave right then. Don't let them use kink stuff as a cover to abuse or exploit you. Be smart, be safe.
It's just tinder for couples and kinks. The rest is extremely oversold. Glad the author got so much value from it, but what a disappointment!
There's a certain group of people that prefers to define themselves by their sexuality these days. Good for them, I don't care. I don't think this is "emotionally mature" though nor is it ideal for a dating app. Yes sex is important, but no, it is not the first thing I want to know about you, nor is it something we need to be broadcasting to the world. In turn, many professionals on the app don't show their face because they don't want to be seen on Feeld, while others fill their profile with photos of them elaborately tied up in shibari. A weird dichotomy for sure, and I stopped using the app shortly after I started (there are barely any people on the app anyway, and I live in a major US city).
Dimo and Ana were the first paying clients of the last startup I co-founded, Smooch.io, that would go on to be acquired by Zendesk. I even had a chance to meet Dimo on a trip to London.
Unlike many of the hundreds of other brash founders that we sold our platform to, this team was different. The level of maturity, emotionally and otherwise, that the pair demonstrated was astounding. They poured themselves into this product and its very much an artistic creation first and foremost. Using the app, you can sense that real people, with real feelings, expressed thoughtfulness and empathy like few other builders of the era.
They've since moved on from Smooch/Zendesk, and I've moved on from it as well, but seeing their work covered here leaves me feeling really nostalgic for those days gone by. They (and their love for one another) really built one of the few remaining places left in the digital world that are delightfully special.
One of the first places we showed our product was at a support software conference in vegas where we were invited to share a booth with a few other startups as part of an innovation thing.
I had feeld (then called 3nder) running as a demo in the booth to showcase how our platform could create really cool mobile help experiences. One of the people I demo'd too went full fundamentalist Christian on me and asked why I would show him an application based on the devil's work, that it was sick and disgusting that I would be proud of 3nder's patronage of our services, and a bunch of other nonsense...
I wonder sometimes if that man was actually on the app and worried his profile would show up due to the proximity :)
I would like to hear from some ordinary, average guys on the app.
That's the sort of idea where you realize if anyone involved had a sense of self-awareness they'd find the result painful, but instead they'll continue on, oblivious.
I find these articles written by (mostly) women who get such easy access to sex to be a bit... cringey. It's often written in such a way that clearly shows a privilege that is basically completely unknown to them. Akin to being rich and being unaware most people can't just ask their parents for a new Mercedes. There's always some writing about a man or men but it's always about tall white men. This article is no different. It's just... cringey and completely unaware. I expect no different from a New Yorker article, tbh - as its entire employee base is this type of persona. (Blissfully unaware)
Much of the publishing industry is filled with hopeful women backed by family money trying to break into the industry. For most it pays very little, but must confer some sort of status? Find your nitch, be bold, be aggressive, ???, profit?
Have you actually tried this?
It's true that women get a lot more approaches a lot quicker then men. But this whole "oh no I'm a guy the world is against me" is nonsense. You need to seem interesting in some way.
I’m not sure if you live in the US but it’s incredibly competitive here for young men. You’re also in your 40s. So, your time might’ve been different as online dating wasn’t as prolific/normalized in your 20s as it was in my 20s. When I was in my 20s, close to 40% of people met through online dating. On top of this - sex for men in their 20s plummeted in my 20s while in yours - it didn’t suffer at all.
Also - I take “average looking white guy” with a grain of salt. I’ve seen 6’4” models describe themselves as average in person and online.
I was recently in <another major US tech center city> for a bit and didn't have trouble getting dates on Tinder, and picked up a 26yo girl from Seattle in a bar.
I don't think I'm good looking, but I am interesting. I talk well with people both online and in person.
> Also - I take “average looking white guy” with a grain of salt.
Well thanks and I wish that was true. But balding, middle aged, slightly overweight computer programmer here.
I don't have acne I guess and I try to dress well, and like I said above I'm interesting.
I also taught myself how to actively listen. Someone once told me they'd met Bill Clinton, and he had the ability to make people feel like they were the most important person in the whole world when he spoke to them, and they said I'm like that.
I'm not discounting your experience and the stats that say what they do. But I know how bad I was with women when I was in my 20s and when I meet many guys who complain about this I see the same behaviors I had.
If only online dating relied on talking to get a match. Instead it relies on - hmm - your photos to get a match.
Why is this so hard for older men to get? This is a repeated issue on HN. Like you use the app - you realize the photos are the most important thing. Just face it / you’re more physically attractive than you likely realize. Most men in the USA don’t get matches - let alone messages.
On Feeld I had a scenery photo to keep my identity secret. That isn't uncommon.
Quite so. Women on the other hand don't need to seem interesting to get as much casual sex as they can handle. Which was the point.
Analogous to the ubiquitous harassment and "male gaze" encountered by people like the author (because dudes want their bodies), you will experience ubiquitous (and aggressive) harassment and "third world gaze" -- because everybody wants your money. "I'm not just a pair of boobs" becomes "I'm not just a walking ATM", and so on.
You will continue to want to go out in public, but you will also want to find "safe spaces" -- expat hangouts, good hotels... places that keep out the riffraff. At some point you just need to be able to hang out by the pool without somebody trying to rip you off in their tuk-tuk or sell you a suit.
Or, say, go to your yoga class before making your way to the job from which it's too much political hassle to ever fire you.
Whatever. Chronos crushes us all. "I am become time", says Vishnu. She'll learn, eventually.
This is a company that in it's pre-Eternal-September era and might not realize it. I hope they figure out how to retain their magic.
If they are in a pre-Eternal-September situation and they want to avoid Eternal September, that's different. Then, they should work to slow user growth, improve onboarding, and have some moderation. The goal is to integrate new users slowly, so they buy into the culture before they change it. It's difficult.
As with any dating app, local userbase is key, so other locations may be far worse.
Some other commenters have doubts about "emotional maturity;" I think feeld encourages users to be their most authentic selves, and that takes some maturity. If you don't have it, and try to play normal dating games, you won't last there.
AMA for a heavy user, I guess? I'm probably an 8, cis tall white man in his late 20s. Mostly looking for consistent hookups, mostly women.
And just when I thought I was "emotionally mature" at 40, I can't help but giggle at that sentence. Are there really 20 different genders and such nowadays? Are these filters "kinks" or have I lost touch with the current state of identity labels?
What am I supposed to do with "woman" vs "womyn" vs "womon"? How about "differently-gendered" vs "metagender" vs "metamorph"? "Transgenderist" or "Trangenderalist"? Gender outlaw against gender pirate? Do these identities communicate or do they confuse?
These aren't genders, they're portions of GUIDs.
This is a lifestyle ad-piece. And what a bullshit lifestyle! Does she not even know that 1Q84 is Haruki Murakami's worst book?
The ability to "explore" like this and western sexuality in general, I wonder if it is a product of better resource scarcity (due to capitalism or whatever economic force)? Would this be possible under conditions of economic strain or poverty, I don't mean relative to others in a society but at a global scale. Food, health care, employment opportunities, time-saving technologies,etc... to the point where universal basic income is a serious topic. Does all this empower sexual exploration? I think so.
“Finally, a place where I will be appreciated and stand out from those other morons.”