I wish there was a legal standard whereby if the state stops prosecuting a law, the law automatically can be invalidated by a court. We have lots of things that are illegal that are only used by prosecutors when they want to throw the book at someone.
There are three parts to the law:
1. The legislature must draft the law
2. The executives must enforce the law.
3. The judicial must punish for breaking the law.
If (2) never happens, then it never gets to (3). And courts can "invalidate" a law: jury nullification.
(This is also why federal drug legalization could, in theory, be achieved through executive order, if Dems had the spine for that.)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn
Basically, if they can somehow connect it to interstate commerce - even if it very indirect, like in this case where growing something for personal consumption affected demand - it's "constitutional", supposedly.
This is the case that explicitly extended this reasoning to drugs:
https://news.gallup.com/poll/356939/support-legal-marijuana-...
This doesn’t invalidate the law. It decides one case in a particular way. An invalidated law is unenforceable for everyone.
Technically, there’s nothing illegal about a judge telling the jury about nullification either.
If you want to get kicked right off a jury start talking about nullification. Waiting in my jury pool to be called/dismissed one of the prospective jurors started handing out FIJA (Fully Informed Jury Amendment) flyers to anyone who was interested before we went into the courtroom.
http://www.ibiblio.org/fija/fijaintr.htm
The bailiff called him forcibly into the judges quarters and everyone he had spoken to was sent home.
That's not an accurate explanation of the situation in the US.
Cannabis is illegal at the federal level. Separately, it is illegal in some states too (although fewer and fewer as the years go by). States do not have the power to prosecute people under federal law, so in states where the state has legalized marijuana, prosecutors (DA, AG, etc.) have no basis to file criminal charges.
The federal prohibition means that people can be prosecuted for possession on federal land, or if a federal agency (such as the FBI) takes enough interest to enforce the federal law, but they rarely bother at this point.
> I wish there was a legal standard whereby if the state stops prosecuting a law, the law automatically can be invalidated by a court.
What you are describing is actually closer to the Dutch system. Marijuana is illegal there, but because it's been "tolerated" (best translation of the Dutch word) for long enough, it's not actually legal for them to enforce the law anymore. (Well, sort of).
Our glorious leaders governing style has been to do as little as possible to avoid elections and let future generations solve things.
For anyone else wanting to know more about the Dutch policy on this: https://www.government.nl/topics/drugs/toleration-policy-reg...
I never understood why it is exactly that The Netherlands were kind of against the drug tourism. I mean, I'm sure your average pot head tourist is not that much trouble and leaves quite a bit of money, no?
I studied in The Netherlands and always thought I'd be proud as a country to be that "progressive" in a sense -- especially once it became clear that other countries were following.
I guess there was enough trouble that some people thought it was worth trying to cut back on. Money isn’t everything
Instead Amsterdam wants to court tourists who fly in, spend a week or two, go to many tourist destinations, spend a bit more money at many locations. It spreads it around the city/country, does less wear and tear to a few places, and makes the locals lives much nicer.
In Canada the crossing signs with a countdown display how much time you have left to cross not how long the wait will be.
A lot of the drug tourism isn't the stuff like that, that you're probably thinking about. A lot of it happens in border towns and is essentially trafficking by criminals. They come to the Netherlands, buy quite a bit of weed and go back to their home countries to sell it. In those countries it's illegal, hence the criminal part. These are not the types of people we like to have visiting our country.
aha, they literally only come for weed and prostitutes, let's say it doesn't attract the most well behaved people in the world. Imagine the typical German or English 20 something years old tourist in Mallorca but instead of being drunk they're stoned.
Low travel cost + mass tourism + young adults + drugs = problems. You can travel there for 70 euros back and forth from any major city in Europe
It's limited to very specific streets but these streets are hell on earth, I don't even know why people go there anymore: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/02/world/europe/amsterdam-to...
So they're sitting in cafes eating fried food? What exactly do you think stoned people do lol
I'm not Dutch and I really enjoy going to Amsterdam, have friends living there, etc. From what I gather those are the main complaints, just annoyances and not really major problems.
Financing criminals when these same tourists go searching for other drugs, that's a real issue.
Disclaimer: I don't believe that weed is a gateway drug and I'm very pro decriminalisation of drugs and legalisation of recreational cannabis.
Sounds like you're describing the behavior of people who've had too much to drink. Alcohol is already legal.
> What exactly do you think stoned people do lol
There are many subsets of stoners, just like a guy drinking half a bottle of red wine at every dinner isn't the same type of alcoholic as the guy emptying a vodka bottle everyday by noon.
I used many drugs, with many people, some people are just trash, sober or drugged, drugs don't transform them into well behaved and civilised people
> What exactly do you think stoned people do lol
What kind of people travel hundreds of kilometers for a joint sand some titties behind a window ? ...
It's a subset of the problem of overtourism in general.
I mean, I'm sure your average pot head tourist is not that much trouble and leaves quite a bit of money, no?
Actually they don't, and that's precisely the problem. They come over on EasyJet, check into a shitty hostel, score some weed, buy a shawarma (and maybe some fries), oggle the working professionals in the red light district for a bit, and then leave a few days later.
This is a stereotype of course and not 100 percent true -- but it also probably intersects about 60 percent with the spending profile of the average weed tourist. On average not usually the type to visit anything other than the most obvious tourist destinations, or patronize any of the better restaurants, or avail themselves to any of the amazingly cool stuff that city has to offer.
Since growing weed is purely done by criminals right now, we're also afraid to legalize because legal weed farms might get issues with criminal involvement or threat because the criminals lose a huge income source. If we don't legalize however when Germany does, we'll then get a bunch of trafficking from Germany to the Netherlands.
We're in a bit of a pickle and it'll be interesting to see what our Christian/Liberal/Progressive government will come up with. I expect them to just ignore it and continue by doing pretty much nothing until it's a real problem.
Oregon legalized weed and this hasn't been a huge problem. But if people fear it is, the solution to this is simple. Make it easy to become a legal grower.
> The $2.78 billion in illegal marijuana found in Southern Oregon dwarfs the nearly $1.2 billion in legal marijuana sold at shops in the entire state in 2021.
> Behind the scenes, immigrant workers may face threats of violent retaliation against their relatives in Mexico if they complain about living and working conditions at illegal sites, or the withholding of wages.
> “The cartels will kill their family back in Mexico. They know there is a realistic likelihood that would happen,” Barden said.
https://www.mailtribune.com/top-stories/2022/01/22/pot-busts...
> “We’ve heard of the threat of harm to your family if you don’t go with us”, Daniel said. “And then they are transported up to the location. From what we are understanding, these workers are not paid until the end of the year when the shipment goes out and the money is brought in. There’s not like a weekly payroll going on here.”
> Sixteen other state and federal agencies joined the Josephine County Sheriff’s department in the raid, including the Department of Homeland Security. The operation included more than 1,300 acres of property as well as 200 workers.
> Officials found workers living in squalid conditions, which included sleeping on cardboard mats or inside tends. Workers denying that they had been trafficked, Daniel said. The Department of Homeland Security offered victim services to the workers, but all turned them down, according to Daniel. This could be for several reasons, including fear of their employers or immigration authorities.
https://www.oregonlive.com/marijuana/2021/08/southern-oregon...
> Sergeant Cliff Barden, of the Oregon State Police Basin Interagency Narcotics Enforcement Team (BINET), said illegal grows in Klamath County are clearly linked to drug cartels. He said the cartel’s strategy in the area is to overwhelm local agencies and resources with the sheer volume of production, ensuring that much of the operation will go unnoticed and ultimate generating immense profits.
> “They are intentionally trying to overwhelm the system,” Barden said. “And that is why it is so difficult.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/clear-links-between-illega...
Take coffee for instance, it's widely grown in South America--is most of the production run by cartels?
Or is it just that cannabis is a high-value crop, and it's easier to move the produce around the USA from within, rather than having to smuggle it over the border?
And if cannabis is a high-value crop, is it because not all states have 'legalised' it?
What if the whole world legalised cannabis, would it become like coffee?
As a different example, there are "dry towns" where alcohol sales are illegal. The bordering bars where it is legal do very well.
I remember a few years back, someone in the Dutch police claimed the Netherlands was on its way to becoming a narco-state [1].
I'm ignorant about the domestic issues there, so correct me, but it seems like the legality of drugs is a separate issue to the control of organised crime in the country.
I think the closest analogy for Americans is what happened during prohibition.
Here's a 70 page report only on cocaine trade.
https://border-security-report.com/the-cocaine-pipeline-to-e...
and maybe hit on those narco gangs which looks like are behind de Vries assassination
It is expensive place with miserable weather. Dutch ladies are always a nice sight though. Plus those drunken crowds of mostly young British around Red light district won't be missed by me.