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Comment by Terry_Roll | Hacker News Reader

> I hope we do not forget that it is Russias fault when the food prices in Europe hit new highs in the coming fall

So you dont recognise the deceit with Nato govts as the trigger for Russia?

I dont blame Russia for standing up to Western passive aggression thats played out over decades across popular culture, media and govt policy. Its not like you get the truth from criminals running much of the world directly or indirectly through manipulation, blackmail and other disingenuous means.

There has to be one country which is the Emmanuel Goldstein of the world, its how the simple unthinking masses manage to comprehend world events.

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What deceit did NATO governments that justifies, invading raping and systematically destroying a country?. Russias war of aggression falls firmly on the shoulders of only Russia.

We are lucky that Russia is so terrible at war, if they where any good they would of won by now.

Right. What propagandists often use is the logical fallacy called "Whataboutism". Russia invaded Ukraine but what about US invading Iraq, doesn't that show that Russia is no worse than US?

The fallacy in that argument is that Russia is doing its war-crimes right now at this moment. What US did in Iraq was far less bad, and most importantly whatever US did in Iraq they stopped doing. But Russia has not stopped bombing Ukraine. Therefore, at the current moment, we must condemn Russia for what it is doing now, not US for what it did long ago and stopped doing.

And even if it was true that US was and still is as bad as Russia then so what? That doesn't give Russia the license to do war-crimes. Two bads don't make it right. Hey, I may be bad, but what about Al Capone? He was much worse than I!

very few people blame Iraq for having been invaded by USA, it was a war of aggression and unfinished business

as is the case with ukraine, it is not ukraine or NATOs fault that cities are being leveled, Putin is in control of Russia's artillery, no one else

We did cause 1M deaths.... and our troops are still in Iraq.... you should be protesting Biden for maintaining the troops there still just as hard as Russia, and boycotting products sold by the US.

FROM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Withdrawal_of_United_States_tr.... :

"On 9 December, Iraq and the U.S.-led coalition announced that the coalition's combat mission had concluded, formally transitioning remaining U.S. forces in the country to an advisory, assistance, and training role."

Assuming the "We did cause 1M deaths" is true (do you have a link?) that is exactly the whataboutism I was talking about. If it is true, it still in no way justifies what Russia is doing in Ukraine.

Not him but from 2007: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2007/sep/16/iraq.iraqtimel...

This doesn't justify the mess in Ukraine tho and people really need to stop acting like it.

I think it’s important to draw a distinction here. Whilst America’s war of aggression was in no real way justifiable, Russia is on an entire another level. The Russians rape, loot and pillage with either impunity or active support from their military. We only recently got reports that they executed journalists when they entered certain cities earlier in the war, and have seen a number of cases of Ukrainian children being raped and killed by Russian soldiers.

True. Another logical fallacy propagandists use is "False Equivalency". Just because there might be some similarities between two cases does not mean they would be qualitatively equivalent in any sense. But some people will fall for that trick too, especially if they are so disposed.

You dont think NATO troops have done similar but its been covered up like the Chinese have covered up Tiananmen Square. We have some naive simpletons on HN!

I’m sure troops in every country have done reprehensible things, but as I said before the difference is that the Russian troops do this a lot and with the full support of there military and we have even seen there partners support there raping and looting in the past.

There’s no need to cover it up for the Russians cause it is fully supported.

> We are lucky that Russia is so terrible at war, if they where any good they would of won by now.

I think that's pretty unlucky. The global economy will only get worse the more this war drags on.

Thats true, the world for the sake of the world economy should be doing as much as it possibly can to end this war as soon as possible in Ukraines favour.

Stop standing up for NATO govt' that brainwash their populations and steal their lives. Wake up!

If you wanna see some stolen lives you should really look at all the people from the economically repressed regions of Russia that make up the majority of the soldiers they are throwing in the Ukrainian meat grinder.

Russia cares little about its own people, and have had active intelligence campaigns to influence the Wests opinion on the war, luckily it’s not going very well.

Please stop unreflectively parroting Kremlin’s propaganda. Putin's Russia started a war of aggression against a sovereign nation -- that would be an heinous act EVEN IF there'd have been "Western passive aggression" prior to that. And for the record, there wasn't. Putin's speeches to justify Russia's war of aggression paint a clear picture: Putin is an old man who is dreaming of times that came and went, hoping to turn back the clock -- by any means necessary. NATO is a defensive alliance and Russia has no say in an independent nation's decision to join. Putin says that said defensive alliance threatened Russia but if you look how Russia's armed forces are concentrated in and around Ukraine while thereby leaving ~95% of Russia's territory exposed to possible attacks, you can easily tell that he does not expect NATO to attack -- he almost certainly never has.

Bestiality is not justified.

> I dont blame... for standing up

You have a very peculiar interpretation of 'standing up', which in your use stands for the exercise and expression of bestiality. Just look at facts directly.

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