Hacker News Reader

Comment by csomar | Hacker News Reader

So customers have less than 2 months to find new banking partners, migrate their data, inform their partners about banking changes, etc...

This is one reason why I'm avoiding all fintech/startup/neo banks in the future. My most solid experience was with a top 5 US bank. They have a shitty customer service and a plethora of offers; but my direct deposits go faster, I don't get pestered over 5 figures amount going in/out because AML and they were able to accommodate some particular needs (that no neo fintech will do, since they lump all customers into one basket).

If anyone wants to bank in the future (both for personal/business), here are the banks I'd suggest: Citi, Chase, BoA and WellsFargo.

View on HN

When I moved across state lines Wells Fargo required me to go back and close my account in my previous state and open a new one in my new state. Left and never went bank. When BoA moved from San Fran to the South and started doing questionable practices it was time to move. US Bank has been amazing, and my immigrant friends all say US Bank has overcome hurdles/issues that Chase, BoA, and WellsFargo refused to help with (often just refusing to take them as customers). When my mother died, US Bank was amazing with protecting her estate from legal BS, to the point that they ended up going to court and paying out of their pocket to do what was right (and this was not a large estate to profit them). Seriously never seen a bank (or large corporation) so willing to see/accommodate individuals and their situations instead of just providing cookie cutter services that if you didn't fit you were excluded. At this cynical point in society I didn't think a bank could impress me, but they have.

I’ve used us bank for an auto loan and they were super helpful when I sold it. I honestly get anxiety and social lock up when dealing with financial stuff (it’s all so much bullshit after the basic accounting is done) and they were really chill about the whole thing

US Bank is the 8th largest bank. I'm surprised with your experience with Wells Fargo since they didn't require that for my sister. Maybe they changed rules or it was a particular state?

How good is the online/mobile app access for US Bank?

It was because of the state we moved to, but we only had to do it for our Wells Fargo account. Not a mobile app power user but it does everything expected (deposit checks from phone, balance info), and I get large transfers in (trust and business) through Zelle and send to my son through Zelle instantly in the app.

I have never ever heard of a bank requiring you to close your account and reopen at another branch. Are there additional details?

That definitely used to be a thing. I'm 35 and I've done that twice in the past and it was a huge pain.

I wonder if it depends on which states you're moving between.

It was state dependant, but also only had to be done with our Wells Fargo accounts, meaning it was do to Wells Fargo's choices not specifically state requirements.

if it's not to personal, what kind of legal BS might someone throw at an estate and how would the bank protect against that?

Seeing as I have been dumb and posted things under this account I would rather keep anonymous, and court records are public, I can't really elaborate.

Chase is superior to WF and BoA both in tech and wait times in branch. I’ve lived in a handful of cities and used them all concurrently for years.

If you’re doing any kind of business you want to be at US Bank, Farmers & Merchants, East West Bank, etc. They are better about loan products.

Not exactly the same but I did taxes one year on Credit Karma. A few years pass and I'm buying a house, lenders need tax returns. Credit Karma tax was sold off, support gets back to me after two days saying they can't help me at all getting the old return filed with them. Fuck this, never again.

Turns out it was easy to get the return from the IRS directly, but this turned me off from introducing "hip" tech into my financial life ever again.

Odd. I was able to download my old returns from the cash.app taxes website. It wasn’t super simple but it was easy enough.

I had disabled my account, which I conveniently forgot to mention before (I actually forgot, wasn't trying to be dramatic).

It is good practice to save PDF copies of your tax returns so this way you don’t need to request them. I would recommend making a habit of this moving forward in general.

Oh you best believe I have copies of everything now, on my own server hah. Lesson learned :)

Any typical user choosing a big corporate bank over a credit union for a personal account is insane.

1. Zelle: all of the big banks have it. Credit unions are slower to adopt. 2. Mobile apps: big bank mobile apps are pretty great these days. 3. Credit cards: Bank of America rebates 2.625% for top customers. 4. Bill pay: the big bank bill pay integrations with vendors and ebills is better

Zelle should be avoided for almost every transaction. There is no fraud protection.

Not really, there is as much fraud protection as ACH. If you’re will to make use of direct deposits and ACH transfers, you can use Zelle. Just don’t expect to be handled with kid gloves.

No, there really isn't. And the banks themselves say so.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/06/business/payments-fraud-z...

> Zelle’s immediacy has also made it a favorite of fraudsters. Other types of bank transfers or transactions involving payment cards typically take at least a day to clear. But once crooks scare or trick victims into handing over money via Zelle, they can siphon away thousands of dollars in seconds. There’s no way for customers — and in many cases, the banks themselves — to retrieve the money.

> The banks are aware of the widespread fraud on Zelle. When Mr. Faunce called Wells Fargo to report the crime, the customer service representative told him, “A lot of people are getting scammed on Zelle this way.”

Even Zelle says so:

> Zelle® does not offer a protection program for any authorized payments made with Zelle® - for example, if you make a purchase using Zelle®, but you do not receive the item or the item is not as described or as you expected.

Source: https://www.zellepay.com/faq/im-unsure-about-using-zelle-pay...

How is this any different from ACH or wire? What protection is there if you wire your money to a Nigerian prince vs. if you Zelle it to a Nigerian prince?

None with Zelle and Wires. But there is a tiny window of protection/reversal offered by ACH.

Can't reply to the child comment https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31773886 from @proxyon but banks can reverse ACH payments. There are still rules for what can be reversed. Zelle intentionally has no reversal mechanism.

In case you weren't aware, you can always(?) click on the relative timestamp associated with a comment to bring up a reply box, even if on a deeply nested comment the reply link isn't available.

So it's as good as cash?

If I sell my old TV in the parking lot of a Walmart, I don't want somebody to charge back the transaction.

Don't use Zelle to pay someone you either 1) don't know or 2) isn't handing you what you purchased at the same time.

My credit union supports Zelle and has for a bunch of years.

My credit union's app does everything I need it to. Mobile check cash, check balances/see activity, lock or limit my debit card ($ amount, transaction type, location, etc.)

The 2.625% is capped at X spend, right? If not please please let me know

No, but it is contingent on maintaining a minimum balance at BofA/Merrill.

FWIW, Schwab doesn't have Zelle

Schwab has Zelle in the phone app.

As someone who has used both, I whole-heartedly believe that anyone who would put some marginal financial benefits of a CU over the ease of use, consistency and convenience of a big corporate bank is insane. So it appears we’re at an impasse.

See, whenever I’ve had any sort of issue, the CU has been way more helpful and responsive. It ain’t about the rates.

The first credit union I belonged to, my balance was rarely four digits, more commonly 2-3. The branch assistant manager was absolutely amazing. She'd do me all sorts of favors, like insta-clearing parts of checks I was cashing.

Any major bank is full of pencil-necks who have the corporate rule book memorized and won't dare speak a word outside of the script they were handed.

I desperately want to use a credit union for all of the presumptions you're making, however:

- I've moved to 12 in 15 years across 3 countries and 8 states. Credit unions are terrible for this.

- The non-profit credit union I used for my car loan was quite possibly the worst and most painful technology interfacing experience I've ever encountered.

- There are all sorts of out of state and international benefits by using a national provider - for example, I regularly send international wires for an international STR property I own.

- You simply can't beat big banks for their CC rewards.

FYI - I've used BoA, WF and Chase blows them all out of the water.

So, no, it's totally not insane.

I've had several Credit Union accounts across different states. They vary in quality and services.

One has great internet banking, remote check deposit, Zelle, and I can always talk to a real human on the phone when I need to. (Bonus: hearing my hometown accent). Nearly every financial product I need is there. And, I trust them, with cause.

My other CUs have fewer services and would not function as primary banks.

Fully agree about the neo bank stuff. When I picked a bank for my current company people were recommending me Tinkoff (local neo-bank that's entirely online, but has fancy apps etc.). It was tempting due to how shiny all their stuff is, but I ended up going with Alfabank (traditional "brick&mortar" bank).

A couple months down the line I had a bureaucratic hiccup with some tax office documents and it was SO MUCH nicer to be able to walk into a bank office and speak to a person and get it all sorted out on the spot, instead of arguing with some online live chat agent to be escalated to the right place.

When I lived in the UK I used Monzo there (another online-only, app-only (!) neo bank). This seemed like a good idea at the time - until I started needing to do things that traditional banks are much better at (such as international transfers). What really hit me here is that I at some point considered doing a smartphone detox, and realised that my smartphone was the only way to fully access my personal account there. Bad idea, never again ...

(There's some symmetry between this and ordering products online for me, btw. If I can go to a physical store and look at a thing before buying I will prefer this over ordering online and potentially dealing with returns, delivery issues etc. almost 100% of the time)

Does any of those traditional banks support remotely opening accounts for U.S. companies with non-U.S. owners (so without an SSN, only with EIN)?

You'll want to open a business bank account with them if you have an EIN. You might need trust or estate services depending upon the nature of your financial service needs.

Some (or all) may have branches in your country. But they may not be free but they can probably get it setup.

I had one remote experience but here is are the caveats: 1. Needed a valid US visa (a B1/B2 will do), 2. Needed a US phone number and 3. Needed a real US-address (not necessarily yours but not a PO box).

Reply on news.ycombinator.com