Hacker News Reader

Comment by jahlove | Hacker News Reader

> Are these chicken selfies?

> Yes. The chickens are using an input device (the motion sensor) to invoke a computer function (the capture method on the Pi), which invokes a series of events that results in the photo being taken, uploaded, and shared.

> This is identical to a human using an input device (tapping a button) to invoke a computer function (the post method on Instagram), which invokes a series of events that results in the photo being taken, uploaded, and shared.

Is it really "identical" though? A human knows they're taking the selfie and sees the result. The chickens do not.

View on HN

Yeah, probably not the same at all.

When I was kid I used to work summers on a family-owned free-range chicken farm. I remember being fascinated by the behavior of chickens. I also spent a lot of time figuring out if they could remember me, and some did remembered and where more keen on approaching, they were totally conditioned by the fact that I used to give them some different kind of grain food. They even made the trip to the house about 30 meters away, just these few ones. Of course they probably remembered the food but I was still happy with my accomplishments in the field of human/chicken colaboration.

After my wife convinced me to get chickens, I went from being ignorant and dismissive of chickens to loving having them in our backyard. It's impressive how distinctive their personalities are given the approx. 50 neurons they're working with in life.

It's like having toddler dinosaurs bumbling around and having little adventures for your entertainment.

Befriending one of the more intelligent birds (jays, or crows) is also very entertaining, though they are still wild of course.

Just don't betray their friendship, as they will not forget it.

And they will tell their friends and children too, apparently

Related: Am I Liable for Murder if my Murder Attempts to Commit Murder[1]

[1] https://old.reddit.com/r/bestoflegaladvice/comments/ki9gb1/i...

I know you are probably kidding about the 50 neurons, but Red Junglefowl (what chickens are derived from) are working with 221 million neurons. Which isn't that much in the grand scheme of things, but more than double the amount compared to a quail and about the same as a parrotlet or a brown rat.

Yes, they do have very clear personalities. We had one who was very curious about people, just very interested in following you and seeing what you do. It's probably food related motivation, but more than simply seeking a handout as most of them do. You could really see the gears turning in there.

And they love it when you do digging projects and come over next to you to see if there's anything good to eat.

This humorous children's short story comes to mind: Squabbling in the Vegatable Patch (it was an audiobook cassette tape). Contains lots of chicken antics revolving around exactly that.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=4YCQY4GwlBM&list=PLU8JDCV_35GGWW...

I still have the original cassette tape from when I was a child and still occasionally play it in my car radio (the only tape player I own).

you dont need bazillions of neurons to showcase complex behavior. also in humans a large part of our brain is to help us move on 2 legs and keep us balanced.

>50 neurons they're working with in life.

so approximtely 10x more than me on mondays before caffeine

The about page seems pretty tongue-in-cheek. Later they talk about the work ethic of the chickens, and offer eggs for $20/ea.

I'm assuming the whole thing is a joke, but if we want to play along with the pedantry, I would object on similar grounds:

A motion sensor is not an "input device," it is a sensory monitor with thresholds and triggers controlled by the architect of the system, not the thing being monitored. This is evidenced by the fact that several of the photos were triggered by something other than the chickens, such as a lawn mower.

If I create a system that drops paint on a canvas when the temperature reaches 80 degrees F, it would be nonsense to assert that the sun had painted a picture. I painted a picture, and the sun was one of the tools I used in place of a brush.

Well. While we're here...

> A motion sensor is not an "input device," it is a sensory monitor with thresholds and triggers controlled by the architect of the system, not the thing being monitored.

Is a microphone an input device? Does it depend on whose voice is captured? Or whether the speaker knows their voice is being captured?

> it would be nonsense to assert that the sun had painted a picture.

The action of the Sun is the proximate cause of the dropping paint. It is not under your control (unlike a brush), and it is not deterministic (though perhaps it is somewhat predictable). The Sun has more control over the result than you do, but the Sun is predictable enough that you feel like you have control.

All this is aside from the argument that the Sun is the ultimate author of all creative works on Earth. Which of course it is!

I take selfies every time I pass by a CCTV camera apparently.

exactly, because "take" is the operative word, being a positive action done by a subject.

better to take a selfie than having your image taken. otherwise, you need liam neeson and his special skills or you'll never get your image back

Greetings, guys. You have quite an interesting experience in this. I think it's fun. To be honest, I haven't taken selfies at all in a long time, and no one really takes pictures of me. I'm probably so unattractive that it's time for me to install surveillance cameras at home so my great-grandchildren can see my photos or they won't know what I look like. But no kidding, besides the ajax security system I installed recently I should think about surveillance cameras not only for selfies but also for their own good and safety.

I guess it's more of a philosophical query. Who took the photo, the chicken or the human ;)

And a legal one. If it's the human then the picture has copyright, if it's the chicken then this are copyright free pictures.

Edit. Link to relevant Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monkey_selfie_copyright_disput...

> I guess it's more of a philosophical query. Who took the photo, the chicken or the human ;)

and do I take the picture when I push the button on my camera or do we really take the pictures when we start looking at them?

But which came first, and does this tell us why it crossed the road?

There's no evidence the chickens know they're taking a selfie, but that shouldn't stop you from imagining for fun that they might. After all, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence: perhaps chickens are not so vain as we are, and their reaction when taking the picture is cool nonchalance.

By that logic, I am taking a selfie every time I speed in front of a speed camera, or I drive in front of an average speed zone camera.

Make a novelty website dedicated to speed zone selfies.

It's more akin to butt dialing.

Most of human selfie SNS photography could be argued to be as automatic and undeliberate as these chicken photos.

Some of those chickens are better photographers than some humans I know.

Accidental selfies, but still technically selfies.

Is a traffic camera photo a selfie?

More like a chicken speed/red light cam.

Correct. He created a trail cam with a Canon 70D.

I'm not sure why this is supposed to be interesting.

Because we're all boring nerds and seeing something other than code all day amuses us. Happy to hear you're okay though

Yeah, you wouldn't put out a trail camera and say "look at the selfie this deer took!". I'm willing to grant the author a little slack though considering this seems pretty tongue in cheek

Reply on news.ycombinator.com