Transparent stairs: what happens when no-one on the design team wears skirts | Hacker News Reader

Transparent stairs: what happens when no-one on the design team wears skirts

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122 pointsmellosouls85 comments

This tweet pointed out that a woman designer popularized the glass stair.

https://twitter.com/kaeae/status/1535445162872033280?s=21&t=...

I don't think you can see through these stairs, seems however like it is possible to build glass stairs without them being fully transparent.

I wouldn't say "you can't see through these stairs". It looks like the glass itself is transparent (ie. it's not frosted or anything), but there's some sort of reinforcing mesh that partially obscures it.

I think the Apple Store on Fifth Avenue has a similar type of design.

All of these glass stairs near me are so scuffed up you can only just tell a human is above it

You know what would be REALLY cool - using the electronically frosting glass which turns opaque, and have it activated anytime anyone steps on the stairs.

We installed these in a hospital's ER department for all the ER and ICU bays. So it was clear - but if there was a Code being called (i.e. someone crashing/going into arrest) they can flip all the glass opaque.

This worked REALLY well in a hospital in LA which had very small ER bays - and getting an entire crash team with intubation etc packed the tiny space with like 10 people. Having a curtain in there consumes people space...

One way is to have 2 or 3 stair treads ahead and behind of the foot placement (weight) turn opaque.

Another thing would also be good for LEDs to light up the frosted treads as they are walked on with a soft glow, but very strong edge defenition (such as a colored-glowing edge of a contrasting light.

Have the stairs light in a running sequence when an emergency/fire alarm is sounded. (but not so fast as to cause vertigo on fleeing tenants.

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With that said, I dislike glass stairwells in general.

Take SalesForce's 50 Fremont building in San francisco.

Up between like levels 39/40 - there used to be a lawfirm in that space prior to Salesforce buying the build which contained a completely 80's-Cocaine-Infused interior design with a spiral stair going between the floors.

They replaced the gaudy railings of the large spiral stair with curved glass panels. They weigh like 500 pounds each, are extremely expensive (due to the helix nature of the curve) -- but they proved to be really difficult to install without breaking.

I know we went through at least two of the very top panels breaking, but it may have been as many as three breaking during install)

The point is, I know how fragile they were during install - so I do not trust their seismic ratings.

I would say though that the glass stairs in the flagship SF Apple store are made with like ~7-poly-layered glass with the same tech used un windscreens... but these treads and rails in apple are thicker than anthing I had seen prior...

But still - the last place I want to be standing upon during any seismic event is made of glass.

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Seismic torsion/twisting on the panels will still statter/crack them -- but into smal little square diamonds that can still fuck you up quite easily if youre body is also being violently thrown against them whilst walking up/down in a skirt during an earthquake.

Please no, if you need to add so much complexity just to work around problems with glass stairs, it's better to just go with boring normal stairs.

In a way, GP's post perfectly captures what's going wrong in much of modern software "engineering". Piling on and on more complexity to work around follow-up issues, instead of having the courage to go back and reverse a bad decision.

What I am illustrating is that MILLIONS and MILLIONS$$ of dollars go into the design of these "environments" -- every major Architect on the planet will continue to do such, while claiming to be LEED/GREEN/etc...

Gensler is famous for such.

My job was to ensure proper installation and implementation of said designs in conjunction with all trades (Not the stairs per se...)

But - these types of designs are not going away.

(Glass' primary material is effectively "free" from the earth (not in energy or manpower etc))

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So we can call out all we want, but this stuff is here to stay.

To be clear, see my other reply below -- I agree with you, its just that I know a LOT of architects. (worked with the infomous Frank Gheary on MPKW, designers of billionaires homes and yachts)

The design ideas are going full video game. Forever.

Have you played any level on Hitman 3? The level design on this video game surpasses a lot (or more) of architectual designs I have worked on building IRL...

So, the idea is that "smarter materials" "LEED/SMART buildings" "tech permeating every aspect of a building" -- so that basically any future building ~20 years from now is going to be a toxic supersite once it peaks its lilfetime.)

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What I personally just dont have experience with in this space ; Building Lifecycle Management ;; We put in all this tech, that relies on plastics, heavy-metals and carcinogens embedded in the building, in a less-harvastable way, when EoL -- and we have a shit ton of recycling problems to solve... else, just throw it all in the ocean like we have been doing for eons.

The sf Union Square Apple store stairs are also cracked. Or we'll last time I was there years ago.

That’s a beautiful staircase, but it would be just a special with any other tread. The beauty of it is the lightweight construction and exposed engineering of the delicate support structure. I think a black marble tread would be rather lovely and an interesting contrast of old and new materials.

Poster seems to have protected tweets

Here's the architect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eva_Ji%C5%99i%C4%8Dn%C3%A1

> She is known for her attention to detail and work of a distinctly modern style, and for her glass staircases.

To be fair, based on a quick google, Jiřičná mostly seems to wear trousers.

While this is a male/female issue, I want to point out that men can wear skirts too, and women can wear trousers as well. It's not the 40s any more. The tweet mentioned gender nowhere.

According to the statistics, about half kilt wearers aren't wearing anyting under the kilts

The difference between a kilt and a skirt is whether or not you're wearing underwear.

I mean, not technically, but it usually shuts up anybody who wants to give you a hard time about wearing a skirt.

in the USA at least, men who wear skirts are frequently treated worse by their colleagues, for example. So there's complexity here.

Though not explicitly mentioned, this sort of thing is "gendered" in the sense that crossdressing still carries social and professional consequences (even for women, to some extent). Which is a shame, because crossdressing is awesome.

(i'm not the one who's downvoting you)

The issue is that men wearing skirts is referred to as "crossdressing". When really it should just be men wearing what they like. If a man wears a skirt, then it's a man wearing a skirt.

That's the real way forward. "crossdressing" has a stigma because the very meaning of that word comes from gendering clothing. So you need to stop using that term.

I've worn a kilt. That's not cross-dressing.

But that was at SCA events, not a work environment. I don't think you'll find glass staircases at SCA events.

TBH, I'm not a fan of glass treads on staircases, I'm not a fan of glass rails on staircases, in fact I'm not really a fan of anything glass in any part of a stairway or staircase construction. Windows next to a stairway are okay, but I think that's about as far as I'd go.

OTOH, glass does wear better than marble, and marble is frequently pretty slippery.

So, maybe no marble treads, either. Some other types of stone would be okay (e.g., granite), but only if they were properly prepared so that they wouldn't be slippery, and would have rounded edges in case you fall.

I don't think they were making an anti-trans comment, you're right though, people should be allowed to wear what they want and others mustn't abuse them for it.

Is that tweet protected from everyone now or did I just end up on some list?

I don't have a Twitter and I only saw a wall of "protected tweets". I have no idea why tweets are allowed here, there's no comprehensible content beyond the title.

Skirts aren't the only reason to avoid transparent stairs. I always wear trousers, and I also get freaked out when I have to climb transparent stairs or even stairs with holes in them. Why? I can see through them and below, and it makes me worry that the stairs could break and I could plummet to my death at any moment. I cope by not looking down and holding onto the handrail.

Fear of heights is a thing. Architecture should be still bound to human needs (at least, too a lesser extent. /s)

As a little kid I used to be terrified of stairs made of metal grating like the ones used for fire escapes. Something about being able to see what felt like 100s of feet below through the thing that's supposed to hold you up just did not compute in my little brain.

Yeah, floating staircases and balconies with grates caused nightmares for me when I was a kid. When you're small and everything is big, the gaps induce severe fear of height; at 6, you see nothing where adults see guardrails. What's worse, some Soviet architectural genius built floating stairs in my school. I got used to it over time, but in the first year I felt a bit lightheaded every time I had to use them.

Architects don't design for users they design for other architects.

Similar to software,resume driven development.

The worst are the UI design systems that are user hostile but oh so impressive to other designers and to pad out that portfolio.

IMO, it’s kind of like the ‘longest most ornate nails’ competition that happens with some folks.

The whole point is it’s obnoxious and actively interferes with getting things done - it’s a flex showing that they are so highly valued and supported with such luxury that they can get away with it.

Like peacock feathers, but professional.

Encountered a similar problem back in the 90s when my employer converted an alleyway between two of our buildings into a social space. To make full use of the space, a loft was built but the stairs and the loft were both build with a metal mesh, making the view from below often embarrassing for those above. I don't know who was the architect but I know the design, including stair prototype, was signed off by our president and the head of my department, both of whom were women.

In our case, an opaque layer in a contrasting color was added below, which made for a visually interesting design that proved difficult to keep clean.

It’s a similar problem with metal grating typically used on outdoor staircases. There are practical benefits in places where it snows for these designs. Sometimes clothing is simply impractical for certain environments.

It still find the idea of glass stairs to be a poor choice with no practical benefits.

Although not really my job, I often helped people with their computers at the office. I learned the hard way to not just dive under a desk to fix the cables if women were working there. After startling one co-worker with a skirt, I learned to announce I was “going under” before doing so. I was young and nerdy and without any bad intentions, so they laughed about it after a couple of seconds, but I recall the embarrassment to this day. Maybe this helps anyone ;)

I once saw a similar thing, but not stairs - it was a hall with the whole floor made with mirror, and I went in a summer.

I'm wholly capable of climbing stairs, but this idiotic design fad is why I wait for the elevator at the Apple Store.

I think these are the stairs:

https://www.kenyon.edu/files/tour/wide-xlrg-wide-xlrg-atrium...

via https://www.kenyon.edu/kenyon-on-a-tour/chalmers-library/

We can't have cool, fairy-tale like stairs because some creeps will misuse it.

I've been to at least 2-3 restaurants with winding staircases and tables reasonably close to the stairs. It's not just transparency that's an issue

Similar issue with reflective floors. See this /r/CrappyDesign thread:

https://old.reddit.com/r/CrappyDesign/comments/l7h9sb/ballro...

Edit: sorry, I misremembered the link. Still, another example of the same problem, not involving stairs, with a lot of comments, so I’ll leave it for that reason.

But your link describes a transparent floor? How else would someone downstairs be able to see up your skirt?

If the room below is not illuminated, the floor can act like a mirror. Like windows when it's dark outside.

Real change will happen when kilts become trendy.

I’m so ready for this.

I have a “modern” kilt that I wear sometimes to special occasions with my daughters. It’s amazing to me how the same garment can be both warm in the winter and cool in the summer.

I don’t much care what people think about it, but people constantly coming up to talk about it is what makes it impractical for daily wear.

Due to the same transparency, I suspect it would be fairly obvious if someone is trying to take advantage of this.

Not necessarily, there's some examples in that thread where the stairs are in such plain view that you'd feel exposed to the whole room. But even then, you'd need to confront people playing dumb hanging out below such stairs, which is not easy for most people, particularly women being preyed on like that.

Are the stairs that transparent? Between the steel support and the blue of the glass, can one really see anything of interest?

Specifically is it the material of the stair step that’s the problem or the open stairwell? If the steps were made of marble would there be as much concern? For example if there are no opaque risers in the stair one could see well through the gaps. The same is true of there are no opaque sides to the stairs under the railing.

I would imagine the woman walking on the stairs will be uncomfortable regardless of the image quality.

Nah. This is the glass and steal aesthetic that routinely creates buildings hard to navigate by people who are impaired (even just buzzed), older, or in any way out of shape. Not because no one on the team likes to have a drink but because form took precedence over function.

Same with super thin phones and half a day of battery life. We like pretty things even if they're not as functional.

I actually quite agree with these choices. The ultimate function over form aesthetic is an athleisure-clad American on a mobility scooter. Not good either.

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