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wahnfrieden

One of capitalism’s exploited externalities (no economic value placed on the labor of raising children)

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I know. Why should anyone have kids!

The ROI of children is vastly lower than most other endeavors in life. Start a company, not a family.

A lot of people judge their life with metrics other than their bank account.

I think the comment you're replying to is sarcastic.

I wouldn’t bet my family on it, but I hope it’s sarcastic.

>The ROI of children

Seriously go outside, get some sunlight and touch grass.

I think the comment you are replying to is indented as sarcastic considering the over the top quality of the part you are quoting.

Some are replying that this sarcasm. I think not entirely. I think rather it is sarcasms cousin “satire.”

It states in a blunt shocking way a truth that exists manifestly in many of our actions, but is never said in that way.

Except it reflects no truth at all. It's mocking a "startuper" way of thinking.

Who is going to push your wheelchair?

The lowest bidder among many, all vying for some dust from the bottom of my enormous Scrooge McDuck vault of gold?

Really we should allow parents to sell their children into slavery, that would be a means of maximizing short-term return on investment for parents who can't afford to provide food, education and clothing to their children. Remember, the free market is the ultimate selector for maximum efficiency, and to quote Milton Friedman, 'corruption is government interference into market efficiencies in the form of regulation'. Friedman got a Nobel (*swedish bank) Prize in Economics, so he must be right.

Now, I wonder if I have to add the /sarcasm tag or not... source:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yhAOs94n8k

Economists working from first principles can reach horrendous conclusions[1].

1. https://mises.org/library/children-and-rights

After reading the article, I don't see what's horrendous about it. Yes, having children has a market effect and is even a market unto itself. There's rarely any controversy to think in terms of the financial costs and legal obligations (or lack thereof) when discussing abortions, adoptions, disinheritance, estrangement, etc. All of these actions are connected by a single thread: Generally speaking, no person is owed anything for merely existing.

It could be a fun exercise to consider why someone might find it horrendous. You know, just to put yourself in someone else's shoes for a bit.

Instead of my supposing or assuming, I'd rather you speak for your own position. Pretending to be a different person may be a fun exercise, but it doesn't get me any closer to understanding that person's motives or thoughts as they are.

The point behind the exercise is specifically to avoid an oppositional dialogue. It is a way to flex the muscles of empathy and authentically arguing an opposing position is one way to get there. Supposing and assuming is 100% the point. It's a shortcut to the frontiers of one's knowledge.

Yet society pours HUGE amounts of money on it, because obviously it has huge value and the government pays boatloads for it.

Do you really mean "no value"?

there's no living wage (or any wage) provided for it. sorry for imprecise words in my OP but I think you understand anyway

Ok. But you think the government should pay a living wage for the personal choice of having a child, and just be home?

Even though people do it anyway, and think the trade is worth it?

Yes

I think you are right. The fact is, social democratic societies deeply need children. Who will take care of you and run businesses when we are old? Tech cannot solve everything ; we need actual humans deal with the future! No, the Ipad IOS.32 with AI will not do that.

I live in an aging society with 'free' healthcare, where most of the resources are consumed by unhealthy people with chronic conditions (read : boomers with diabetes). A lot of large scale social programs (which I like) are built on the assumption that most of the people inside it are healthy and will not need serious care for a long time (read: full of young people).

I think that raising children produces a lot of social benefits, that unfair social expectations puts a lot of pressure on women, and we should put a LOT of value on the labor required to raise healthy and stable children.

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