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Comment by bradlys | Hacker News Reader

It is lying. It is deceit. We just dupe people new to the industry about these tactics. It's only the veterans who know that every person and company is completely full of shit.

Startups have "aspirational" speaking where they say they're using revolutionary "AI" and yadda-yadda to do such and such - even if they don't have any of that and there's nothing actually on the roadmap for it. It's a lie. You may want it but you don't.

If I say I have a billion dollars and fly to the moon on weekends - am I lying if I don't actually? In your words - no. I'm being "aspirational".

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So...Coinbase should keep the offer even if it makes bad financial sense?

It was true when they made the offer, time passes and things changed, now it's not true.

It's a lie if it's false when you say it - not if it becomes false in the unpredictable future.

So...Job seekers should commit to an acceptance even if it makes bad financial/personal sense?

It was true when they accepted the offer, time passes and things changed (e.g., got a better offer), now it's not true.

Maybe the job seeker could offer to work for free for the number of hours they'd be contractually entitled to in severance payments if they were fired their first week on the job. Usually that's zero.

> So...Coinbase should keep the offer even if it makes bad financial sense?

How about Coinbase withdraws the offer AND gives the former-future-employee some money to reflect the fact that Coinbase really did want to hire them but now genuinely can't AND that this change has a real and negative impact on the former-future-employee?

Like, a payment on the order of a month or two of living costs (not just "Sorry, and here's $100")

Sure that's expensive, but it's still cheaper than hiring the person for months of time, what with salary, benefits, office and equipment costs, etc.

Isn't that literally what they are doing?

> This decision is not a reflection on the highly talented people we had extended job offers to. We will apply our generous severance philosophy to offset the financial impact of this decision.

payment on the order of a month or two of living costs

Just one or two months? Banks insist on 6 months of expenses these days when you apply for a mortgage with an offer letter in hand because they know that shit happens all the time.

Here's the kicker: companies have a very good idea of the financial shape they are in. It's just not possible that there was a sudden downturn in fortunes between the offer letter and start date. Except if a round of funding fell through, but an honest man doesn't hire on promises.

The corollary is that these days everyone is a crook.

The problem is that a month or two of severance wasn’t a reasonable expectation considering what they were offering.

Look at this from the angle of an insurance company pricing in risk. For example, I might consider a job paying 500k TC for a 1/3 risk that the company goes bust in 2 months. I might also accept an offer for 300k at a company that has a 1/10 risk of going bust in 2 months. And there are a lot of people who would accept working at a company that pays 150k for a 1/100 chance of going bust in the same timeframe.

The thing is, the overall compensation for all of the above scenarios is exactly the same, but the risk is priced differently. Unfortunately some companies are deceptive, and don’t fairly articulate the risk to candidates, which can wildly swing the market value of their compensation. When expectations doesn’t match reality, people feel like they were taken advantage of.

> So...Coinbase should keep the offer even if it makes bad financial sense?

Yes, absolutely. It’s called integrity. I just bought a house, probably at a loss, at the top of the market, and could have backed out because the economic situation is no longer looking as great. I could have easily used a BS contingency to get out of the contract. However, I made a handshake agreement and asked someone to upend their life for me.

My own code of ethics is to do what I say I will. Maybe it’s not the most game theory thing to do but at least I can sleep at night knowing I was an honest person. There are things in life more important than money.

> There are things in life more important than money.

Not only this, but I think even in purely self-interested financial terms your ethical approach is superior over the long term.

Over time, truth and honesty offer a compounding positive spiral.

You make better decisions because a) the inputs are free of lies and b) you make them carefully knowing you will own the consequences.

Reputationally you garner trust which makes possibilities available to you (collaboration, quid pro quo, and low-friction litigation-fee business relationships) that are not open to unethical people.

> It's a lie if it's false when you say it - not if it becomes false in the unpredictable future

Isn't this exactly what's happening if you accept an exploding offer and then later rescind your acceptance if you get a better one? The job offer was the best you had at the time, so you accepted it. Somewhat unexpectedly you later receive a better offer, so you have to rescind the first.

I'm not necessarily saying I agree with this practice, but I do agree it's pretty close to what Coinbase is doing with the roles reversed.

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