Senators Draft Bill to Ban Use of Digital Yuan in US-Based Mobile Apps
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I think it would be reasonable to restrict usage of digital yuan by US businesses, but complete deplatforming seems annoying
I get that “China bad” is a popular position, but all you’re doing is punishing Americans who might want to travel to China or interact with Chinese friends (or worse: force those Americans to buy Chinese phones to avoid the deplatforming)
America needs a new bogeyman now that Muslims are not scary anymore.
Earnestly, can you see how that's different from being taken away from your home in the middle of the night because your provincial government decided they don't like the way you practice your religion?
Does it make sense to you, Hung, that those two situations are very different?
Even with all the anti-government rhetoric in the US when it comes to political discussions and the dysfunctional state of congress it's pretty clear that the US has a much more pleasant form of government to live under.
There is plenty to despise here.
And think about the bright side. We can bitch here all we want about the US Government and I feel zero.... ZERO concern that they're going to track me down and punish me. Cannot say the same in China about the CCP.
> We can bitch here all we want about the US Government and I feel zero.... ZERO concern that they're going to track me down and punish me.
Tell that to Julian Assange.
> Tell that to Julian Assange.
Okay, sure. Has he ever been in the custody of the US govt? Was he accused of criticizing the government, or helping someone else divulge classified info? Whether you think that's what he was doing or not, you're stretching a looooong ways here to try and make the US govt as bad as the CCP. You've got a long ways to go.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/exclusive-ukraine-inves...
Not that I admire Russia or anything. It is a crime to invade another nation except in response to violent military action. However, that isn't genocide. Even if it were, we'd decide that after international experts had thoroughly investigated. That hasn't happened yet.
You seem kind of emotional. Perhaps deeply-felt emotion might cause someone to believe everything the TV says?
ps. wrong sockpuppet
And you aren't fooling anyone.
Yes you did. You just don't have the courage to say "because Iraq was wrong, Ukraine doesn't matter." Because that is what you are implying, but it's so nonsensical you must hide behind platitudes.
> Supporting the enemies of one's enemy is fairly common..
As the kids say, "lol".
> although again that's not something I've done here
My word you don't have to courage to stand behind any of your beliefs, do you?
> My enemy, and that of all ethical Americans, is the USA military-industrial complex. No one in Russia or China or wherever is their enemy.
Was the Russian invasion of Ukraine wrong, yes or no. Is the massive amount of evidence for a targeted killings of civilians proof of genocide, yes or no. And if your answer is "no one can know because they got Iraq WMDs wrong", don't bother.
"Civilian casualties of war" -> This is some NK-level mental gymnastics. "It's ok when the US murders people, but not cool when the Russians do it". People die either way.
how many millions of civilians are dead or displaced directly or indirectly because of China's actions?
The actions on the western frontier were explicitly intended and contemporaneously described as genocide. After we ran out of Native Americans to kill, we hopped the Pacific to Philippines where more than 10% of the population perished in five years. CIA managed the Indonesian massacres of well over a million innocent people. The answer must be at least... three genocides? Historians might discover more! For instance, are we sure there are no American fingerprints on Cambodia? I think rather we feel lucky not to have found any undeniable links yet...
I sincerely attempted to answer your question. It wasn't obvious that you meant "how many in the last two weeks?"
I think the last big weapons deal the US signed before agreeing to help Ukraine was subsidizing Saudi Arabia killing Yemenese in a bid to extract value from their civil war.
Seems really odd to call a deal where Saudi Arabia was paying us for weapons in Yemen a "subsidy". You can argue that we shouldn't have allowed the sale, but it was a net profit for America.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/22/middleeast/arms-exports-saudi...
But that doesn't fit the narrative, now does it?
Ukraine does not get a check for N billion dollars, it gets N billion dollars worth of outdated equipment at MSRP
"Fake news" has become a flag phrase, like "whataboutism". The first comment in the thread to include it, either to praise or to damn, was made by the biggest moron.
[0] https://www.opensecrets.org/news/reports/capitalizing-on-con...
[1] - https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/eisenhower001.asp
Two party political systems are the worst.
WePay/AliPay merchant fees are around 0.6%, competing against that could dull some shine.
I’m not claiming it’s the only or main reason, but I expect a lot of lobbying dollars will be backing it.
Define “accept”? If I, an American with an American phone, travel to China and can’t buy lunch because the American government mandated deplatforming of the payment app, that’s really annoying to me.
I agree that nobody in the US should be using the e-CNY in place of the USD, but a more targeted law could accomplish this without trying to police the applications I can install on my iPhone
I frankly doubt e-CNY even has a chance to take off here, in my local Chinatown everyone pays by credit card not by Alipay or Wepay.
Politicians only like hammers so all problems are nails, maybe you are right that the enforcement mechanism is overly broad but I also think the situation you paint is inaccurate/made to seem more difficult than it actually would be. My parents went to China and did fine paying for things 13 years before Digital Yuan was created, my (naive) assumption is that, like all places tourists are herded in any country, the place you go will accept both native currency and USD, watches, nice shoes, jewelry…
With the pandemic US has caught up a lot though
The digital yuan is basically a bank with a nice API and should be treated similarly.
The real solution is to fix our financial system so that transferring USD is cheap, fast and easily done through an API.
The bill is probably needed but this is a bad look for the US whichever way you view it. I could go into long details but in short the situation we have now with increasing trade restrictions, stock delistings and so forth is the culmination of catastrophically failed policy towards the Chinese regime. The US and other developed countries were completely wrong and naive in the way they dealt with China. In fairness, in the 80s and 90s no one could have foreseen the current development and it was a reasonable assumption that with economic growth the country would liberalize. Even under Hu/Wen, I can see how people could convince themselves into believing increasing economic ties would make things better. Although already back in the late 2000s it was clear that the promise to open up the markets was a lie that never happened. Foreign ownership continued to be restricted, companies were forced into joint ventures (aka "thanks for the blueprints, suckers"), the Yuan control actually got tighter...
Western countries plus Japan, Korea and Taiwan made the Communist Party rich and powerful. Without all that foreign investment and technology transfer Mainland China would still be a broken backwater. Corporations in the developed world had gold glittering in their eyes when they looked at China and it's massive population. The Chinese regime found that one fatal flaw in free market capitalist systems: While economically they work, there is no incentive for the corporate leadership to do what's best for the country. Those who spearheaded the outsourcing of jobs and factories profited massively. As did the shareholders initially. It only came at the cost of the future of all the less wealthy people in the respective countries. Plus now they have a nuclear power pouring more and more billions into their military, preparing for war, while running concentration camps and allying with Russia and Iran.
The digital yuan is a form of Chinese soft power projection (as the US dollar is similarly), and it's not entirely unreasonable to dissuade its use (depending on your geopolitical views).
"You invaded someone else therefore you should allow yourself to be invaded."
Akin to saying, "it's bad when you do things that make you powerful, but good when we do them" which is unquestionably true from the perspective of any individual great power.
(One reason I could never be a politician is that I can’t empathise with nationalism like that; I recognise it, but it feels a bit dirty to me).
They can shut a country financial system down at any moment.
I bet they are afraid of being victims of what they know it's possible with such powers.
I’m curious to learn what the realpolitik behind this really is.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/26/business/russia-rates-rub...
Temporarily true in certain jurisdictions, but OTOH one may with RUB purchase oil, natural gas, palladium, nickel, copper, steel, aluminum, wheat, fertilizer, etc. So, those who need e.g. catalytic converters, especially if they live on the 70% of the planet where there are no limits on RUB whatsoever, will probably continue to use it.
It is a specific CCP initiative to project power and track both its citizens and foreigners and undermine the power of western democracies and the power of the Euro and Dollar.
We were fools to not resist the offer to give away strategic manufacturing technologies and capabilities to China in exchange for cheap labor and a few quarters of profit. We'd be even greater fools to allow this next camel's nose under the tent (Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me...).
Even if the senators are typically Luddites, this is a very good move and cannot happen soon enough.
For example, some of my colleagues used to work at US solar companies before they all collapsed due to the market being flooded by below cost Chinese panels.
If a country‘s government is willing to back technology below cost (or by blocking their market only for competitors), that is an appropriate place for tariffs or banning.
Rather, the U.S. failure to do so is bad.
You can thank this 'inefficient capital' to almost all modern innovations. In reality, the US System has evolved to be no different than China, only slightly more people have their hand in the pot in the US.
We also heavily subsidize electric energy production, manufacturing and all other manners of industry. We just don't allow sweat shops in manufacturing anymore, only tech.
"The American System was an economic plan that played an important role in American policy during the first half of the 19th century. Rooted in the "American School" ideas of Alexander Hamilton, the plan "consisted of three mutually reinforcing parts: a tariff to protect and promote American industry; a national bank to foster commerce; and federal subsidies for roads, canals, and other 'internal improvements' to develop profitable markets for agriculture".
The establishment of a protective tariff, a 20%–25% tax on imported goods, would protect a nation's business from foreign competition. Congress passed a tariff in 1816 which made European goods more expensive and encouraged consumers to buy relatively cheap American-made goods."
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_System_(economic_plan...
This prevents competition from forming… yes the US government should do more, but it is slower in a democracy to respond…
When the ruling class interests align, the US acts swiftly.
Innovation is not antithetical to taking heavy-handed policy targeting adversaries, whether through trade or monetary/financial policy.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_System_(economic_plan...
The only reason why it's popular is because our traditional banking system is so anti innovation and refuses to offer decent APIs.
It sure seems a lot harder to trust that a CBDC wouldn’t be abused than a cash-based system, which at least has a paper trail (literally).
However as we start to see fragmentation in the payment space between Russia, China and the EU/US along with an explicit writing in the transactions to disallow crosstalk, there start to be some kind of 'use' for crypto again.
The need for a verifiable, self-soverign, uncontrollable medium of exchange starts to become useful again.
Problems with the above:
Low liquidity, uncontrollable is a loose term here. If the US forces publicly traded companies to dump crypto it will cause a huge crypto winter and a huge amount of money to be 'eaten up' by the bulls.
That would show the true colors of how much of America's liberalism (e.g. free markets) is conditional on free markets being favorable for American hegemony.
Prepare to see Made in Japan in everything you buy.
Oh, and every item will also cost 5x more. But it's just a detail...
Cheers!
oh noes!