Comment by kergonath | Hacker News Reader

Comment by kergonath | Hacker News Reader

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> The reason other OS's don't support that macOS feature is because their open and save dialogue is usable on its own. In my opinion the open and save dialogue is one of the worst designed interfaces on macOS (and easily the worst open and save dialogue across all of the popular desktop environments). The fact that it's "killer feature" is having to use another file navigator to find the target and then drag that file into the first dialogue (ie dialogue that should have been used to find the file to begin with) is more damning than anything.

It is not a browser, or a file manager. It is a file selector. So it allows you to select files, not do some file management. It is not rocket science. I get bitten at least a couple of times a week on Windows when I stupidly drag and drop the file I want to open, and instead of the sensible behaviour it gets just moved to whatever the app thought the default directory should be for its open file dialogs.

> a completely redesigned open and save dialogue that works a little more like Windows and KDE

Hell, no! Let me double that: hell fucking no.

> It is not a browser, or a file manager. It is a file selector.

But you're selecting the file in a file manager and then dragging it into your "file selector". That whole dialogue then becomes completely redundant because you might as well just drag that file into the application window without having to click "open".

> I get bitten at least a couple of times a week on Windows when I stupidly drag and drop the file I want to open

If you drag the file into the text area it will work as you wish. Or you could just drag the file into the application -- a lot of applications will support that and open the file without displaying the file open dialogue.

Sometimes the application doesn't open files you drag onto its windows, and sometimes you want to select a file but not open it.

> But you're selecting the file in a file manager and then dragging it into your "file selector". That whole dialogue then becomes completely redundant because you might as well just drag that file into the application window without having to click "open".

Sometimes. Others the dialog is how you set things like the format of the file or some import options. Or you need a multiple selection and dropping a bunch of files just opens them separately. Sometimes you can input a regex and you just need to quickly go to the right directory. Sometimes you need to select a file to import it into another document and not open it. It is also damn convenient to just drop the folder where you want a new file to be in a “save as” dialog without having to navigate from dog knows where. There are plenty of use cases.

What is redundant is a file manager in an import dialog. There is a full blown file manager that’s always going to be better just a click away.

> If you drag the file into the text area it will work as you wish.

In theory, yes. In practice it’s hit and miss as developers don’t seem to care about using native widgets (that, and the fact that native widgets have vastly different capabilities on Windows thanks to years of cruft they cannot remove).

[edit] sorry if it sounded harsh; I have nothing against you. It’s just that the file selection dialogs are a particular pain point on Windows and Linux.

> Sometimes

None of that prevents Apple from building a more featureful dialogue

> In theory, yes. In practice it’s hit and miss as developers don’t seem to care about using native widgets (that, and the fact that native widgets have vastly different capabilities on Windows thanks to years of cruft they cannot remove).

I agree it sucks when developers roll their own but that’s not really relevant because we are comparing two very specific dialogues and not the wider OS ecosystem. (I’d use macOS over Windows any day of the week. But that doesn’t mean I have to love everything about macOS).

> sorry if it sounded harsh

You didn’t and we are good :) It’s been really interesting hearing another viewpoint.

> It’s just that the file selection dialogs are a particular pain point on Windows and Linux.

For you. :) Personally I think KDE got it just about perfect.

I guess this just goes to show how completely different two peoples preferences can be.

It’s a shortcut that comes in handy when you operate in deep file hierarchies and can’t be bothered to memorize the path.

That said there’s even easier ways to get there:

Just navigate, the sidebar will reflect what’s in your Finder sidebar so you can use that as a shelf if you’re going into one specific directory a lot for your work. It’s a dynamic environment, you don’t have to treat it like it’s static.

Or: hit Command-Shift-G. This will allow you to type the path with tab completion.

Dragging the folder in is for when you’re operating in the Finder and another application and rather than navigating you want to just drag the proxy in to go right there. It’s a shortcut, but depending on the task it’s not necessarily the most efficient way to do it.

> Dragging the folder in is for when you’re operating in the Finder and another application

Not only Finder! You can hover over the filename on the top bar of any application and drag the icon from there as well. It works for any application where you have a file opened.

Is there a pattern to it? I find it an amazing feature, but also find that it doesn't always works. Do I have to do something before I can drag the icon?

In recent versions you might have to hover for the icon to appear, which is infuriating.

Except for that, all proxy icons should be dragable without problem if they are from the native widgets (so no guarantee for misguided developers who reimplemented it to look like the native one without actually implementing its behaviour). There might be a small delay between the moment you click on it and the moment you can drag it, to avoid mistakes (I think that was the case at some point, not really sure now).

Awesome, thank you!

Absolute hard second on this, it works well and doesn't need to be changed.

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