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Comment by zasdffaa | Hacker News Reader

I'm one of those misfits/troublemakers/etc. I've done my life mostly on my terms, and I've had it really tough. Conformists generally get it much easier. I'm all for more independent thought and fuck-you-ness but never forget that for most people that comes at a high price, so take off the rose-tinted specs.

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That was a direct quote from Steve Jobs, except the last bit at the bottom. The whole point of the comment, I think, is how this goes against the old Apple ethos of encouraging non-conformity (to an extent).

Is that a quote from Jobs, or ad copy, or both?

It's ad copy, AFAIK.

By the Chubb ad agency, I believe. There’s an old video of Jobs introducing the ad where he briefly mentions it.

It was ad copy, written by Rob Siltanen for that campaign[1].

[1] https://www.forbes.com/sites/onmarketing/2011/12/14/the-real...

My mistake. I should've been more diligent. I knew it was associated with Apple and the first result on DDG associated it with Jobs.

here's to you, good luck in your journey. make it worth it

"If you're going to try, go all the way. Otherwise, don't even start. This could mean losing girlfriends, wives, relatives and maybe even your mind. It could mean not eating for three or four days. It could mean freezing on a park bench. It could mean jail. It could mean derision. It could mean mockery--isolation. Isolation is the gift. All the others are a test of your endurance, of how much you really want to do it. And, you'll do it, despite rejection and the worst odds. And it will be better than anything else you can imagine. If you're going to try, go all the way. There is no other feeling like that. You will be alone with the gods, and the nights will flame with fire. You will ride life straight to perfect laughter. It's the only good fight there is."

- Charles Bukowski

I don't know if it's worth it. It's the way I am and I seem to have as much choice over it as ivy chooses growing up a wall.

I've never been hungry by choice and I've always had a roof over my head, and I'm grateful for both of those things, but let's look at something I do know: "..could mean losing ... maybe even your mind"

Yeah, BTDT. A lifetime of mental health problems culminating in a complete ... I dunno, breakdown? ... where I was barely able to function for 2 years and became a risk to others (should have been hospitalised but wasn't), and another 2 years recovering. 4 years of my life wasted. Any projected glamour of mental illness is purely done by those who've never had it. Mental illness is fucking shit and has no redeeming value.

Edit: oh yes, and "Isolation is the gift" - Never is loneliness a gift, ever.

> and has no redeeming value

Hmm, the one redeeming value of my anxiety (and the accompanying fear of imminent death) is that it makes it much easier to contemplate things I wouldn’t otherwise contemplate.

I’d still rather do without that, but I guess it’s interesting enough I can call it redeeming?

I suppose it depends. A redeeming feature of death is you never again wake up with a stinking hangover. You can find a positive everywhere I suppose. I don't know.

I am curious at the number of downvotes to this which I take as disagreement, but with what? Have others had years of mental health crashes and found it a great positive in the end, or what? Genuinely would like to know.

TIA

"Elegant, inspiring, soaring prose often makes for incredibly shitty real-world advice."

- hn_throwaway_99

Yeah seriously, that comment is like the ultimate anti-advice.

Well, if you don't want your life to turn out Bukowski, don't take advice from Bukowski.

As Modest Mouse said, "God, who'd want to be / Such an asshole?"

Indeed, but it’s a little funny coming from Isaac Brock.

Well, he would know better than most, right?

Fair enough!

I think of that song every time I see Bukowski quoted.

Asshole he might be but he was right about Disney.

Who said anything about advice?

nobody cares about your opinion because no one knows who you are

Glorious, glorious loneliness...good one. Even introverts know that being alone sucks. Medical studies show a correlation between poorer health and loneliness.

I’d only take life advice from Bukowski if I wanted to end up like Bukowski. Doesn’t really sound like a great life tbh.

I do not think that Charles Bukowski is a good role model. I love his writing, some of it is very disturbing, and some I only read once - will not repeat the experience.

But to live like him? No thank you

Yeah. What are we trying that we should expect to lose the most important relationships in our lives? Unsaid but heavily implied is this person would be an atrocious parent, and a very real price is paid for that.

Yep, I was just about to comment that this kind of decision is a lot easier to make when you have the fuck-you money that Goodfellow doubtless has.

I wouldn’t say he has FYM yet. Enough to maybe FIRE but more than cash, he’s in a position where almost any tech or related company would hire him, pay him a ton, and let him work on what he wants to do. Essentially, tenure at a university but paid 10X as much.

I certainly don't have "fuck you money", but these days I think most competent tech workers can easily get jobs elsewhere, so I don't think it's a big, risky move to quit your job.

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