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Comment by Grazester | Hacker News Reader

Isn't that what the media has been extensively reporting on for the last month!

There’s a surprising number of people around who seem to think there’s no actual war happening and it’s all just visual effects. It’s all oriented around how a shadowy elite is using it to bring in some great reset, and reveal themselves as lizard people or something.

I’ve thought about offering to show them personal evidence of dead family and friends in Ukraine, but I don’t think that will really change anything. There’s always some excuse or way for them to deny it.

There are a surprising number of conspiracy theorists out there, but also lots of people desensitized or overwhelmed in the Information Age.

The rubble and ruins of war across the Middle East, state brutality of all scales from China to the U.S., unprecedented destruction by weather events... all delivered to your screen in near real-time then 24/7 pundit-ized until the next event... non stop for over a decade.

If you grew up in this cesspool of information, you tune out. If you yearn for the ignorance of yesteryear, conspiracies are easier to digest than critically analyzing the deluge of info... and that doesn't take into account all of the people who are just out there mostly concerned everyday with food and shelter for themselves and family.

To your point... As I started to write this, a nearby group of senior citizens meeting for morning coffee (in East Bay, CA) started fawning over this "refrigerator magnet set that helps you construct your own conspiracy".

I’m not sure what *specific* weapons have been used on cities. Usually we see cruise missiles going into buildings, for example. Lots of video of tanks too.

I think of artillery as less precise, with the idea of using it to indiscriminately level a large area. It’s fired from 10-20 miles away, with a few rounds a minute.

Howitzers, for instance, will be important in eastern Ukrainian

https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/30...

> I think of artillery as less precise, with the idea of using it to indiscriminately level a large area.

Even conventional unguided howitzer artillery is more than accurate enough to be effective against things as small as vehicles.

Artillery has become very precise. The mechanics and effects are well defined and calculated. Artillery also isn't just big guns, it includes those trucks you see shooting huge volleys of (dumb) missiles off their bed.

Russia uses a lot of unguided rockets as artillery

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BM-21_Grad

The reporting that I've seen claims that Russia doesn't have enough guided ordinance, so they're using lots of unguided ordinance.

Modern artillery pieces are incredibly accurate. And if self-propelled and equiped with an auto-loader capable of rapid fire.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzerhaubitze_2000

Up to 3 roubds in 9 seconds, 10 - 13 roubds per minute continously. Depeding on the shells accuracy can be around 1 m per 48 km. Arguably, that's among the most advanced, and expensive systems. The accuracy comes from the shells, so in theory a lot of manually loaded artillery pieces should be able to achieve the accuracy.

What type of shell achieves that level of accuracy?

That would be this:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/M982_Excalibur

At 70k USD per round not nrcessarily cheap so.

That's what I suspected. The impressive accuracy is mostly determined by the round.

That's not terribly expensive either when the accuracy can save civilian lives or the lives of soldiers using it.

Reducing colleteral damage is a stated goal of that round. Personally, I think it's just a nice side effect and nobody really cares.

It's a win win. You more reliably kill threats which saves the lives of your own guys but also spares civilians.

I doubt they waste cruise missiles on their general city terror campaigns. It's mostly MLRS, artilery, bombing with unguided bombs from airplanes, and tank shelling, what Russia uses to terrorize cities. They don't need precision for this.

Cruise missiles are used for higher value targets.

I wish one could believe the media.

Not saying that this particular report is not believable, just that "the media already said so" is not an argument in 2022.

Do you think that these videos or photos are faked? Do you think there is a real war in the Ukraine?

Well, there clearly is a conflict going on in Ukraine. But I don’t think the media is on my side. They are with the powerful, which have every incentive to lie to me to justify the inflation, escalation of the conflict, etc.

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