TSMC to manufacture 2nm chips in 2025. Apple and Intel first to adopt | Hacker News Reader

TSMC to manufacture 2nm chips in 2025. Apple and Intel first to adopt

digitimes.com

39 pointsgalogon20 comments

Please avoid arguments that refer to the impossibility of manufacturing a planar transistor this small. These manufacturing processes no longer use planar transistors, they just use density numbers to work backwards to what the size of the planar transistors would have to be to reach an equivalent density. The fact that those theoretical planar transistors are different for each manufacturer adds even more confusion.

It's like how tank protection is rated with rolled homogenous armor. When a tank has a 900mm RHA rating, there isn't actually a 900mm thick steel plate, it means the armor is equally effective as a steel plate with that thickness.

This is true - for "reasons", the same scheme is used back-calculating from total transistor density back to "if only it were planar, the effective dimension would be".

Even more impressive is Intel's decision to outsource their own processors to TSMC.

AFAIK Intel is splitting its fab business into an owned but functionally more separate unit. The chip design unit will fab where it is best to do so and the fab unit will take whatever business is best to take. This could theoretically mean Intel making chips for AMD if it really does go this way.

Intel previously stated that they were ramping their similar level of tech (20A) in 2024. So outsourcing to TSMC at a later date seems like they aren't expecting their internal fabs to be able to supply enough for what they need.

...while at the same time asking congress for more handouts to build its own fabs.

And how they secured allocation and AMD didn't? Why would that be the case?

Sigh, when are we going to get rid of this meaningless figure??

Million of transistors per mm2 is a much more interesting metric.

I can't get past the paywall. I'm curious about where TSMC's fabs will be located, given the increased potential of a Chinese invasion of Taiwan, and the desire of the United States to retain control of advanced chip fabrication technology.

Taiwan

Has something changed between China and Taiwan? Why do you think an invasion has become more likely?

It is just that Anglo media has been itching for a new enemy, so there has been more speculative articles and reporting on that topic these last couple years and Angloworld public opinion has shifted alongside it

Sad state of affairs, but not much that can be done about it

Read the SCMP, it’s not Anglo media…

Do you think it’s related to Hong Kong or Xinjiang? Or even that Xi himself is ramping up tensions?

>No one should underestimate the Chinese people's staunch determination, firm will, and strong ability to defend national sovereignty and territorial integrity," Xi said. "The historical task of the complete reunification of the motherland must be fulfilled, and will definitely be fulfilled."

>He struck a slightly softer tone than in July, his last major speech mentioning Taiwan, in which he vowed to "smash" any attempts at formal independence. In 2019, he directly threatened to use force to bring the island under Beijing's control.

>China's air force mounted four straight days of incursions into Taiwan's air defence identification zone from Oct. 1, involving close to 150 aircraft, though those missions have since ended. Xi made no mention of those flights.

https://www.reuters.com/world/china/chinas-xi-says-reunifica...

Isn't that all pretty much inline with China/Taiwan relations since the end of the civil war?

China is engaging in a massive military buildup, especially in terms of its naval and amphibious forces.

War is quite unlikely now, given how Russia screwed up in Ukraine.

I don’t see how the two are in any way related to one another. The fact remains that China is building up not only the size of their navy but also their shipbuilding capacity.

Ukraine is very different from Taiwan. One is larger than the size of texas and landlocked and the other is an island the size of rhode island. I agree with you in that china is less likely to invade but due to economic reasons.

Texas is actually slightly larger than Ukraine. Ukraine isn’t landlocked, either; even if you don’t count the Crimea, Ukraine still has a coast on the Black Sea and the major port city of Odessa. Mariupol is another port city that Russia has been trying to fully capture for most of the war now.

China is also very different from Russia. China’s economy is around the size of the US economy while Russia’s economy is closer to the size of Italy. They have more domestic industrial capacity than any country in the world, a billion people, and a remarkable level of state capacity. The main similarity between the two countries—that they each have an aging dictator who has spent the past years consolidating power and who is prone to commanding some ill-advised course of action due to the inability of anyone to push back—only makes it more likely for an invasion to occur.

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