Unresponsive Air France Boeing 777 Aborts Landing in Paris | Hacker News Reader

Unresponsive Air France Boeing 777 Aborts Landing in Paris

simpleflying.com

27 pointsbelter8 comments

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The Aviation Herald's coverage:

https://avherald.com/h?article=4f700fec&opt=0

Unclear if issue was the same, but another issue of control problems with 777 Jan this year:

"Emirates Boeing 777 Faces Control Problems Flying To San Francisco":

https://simpleflying.com/emirates-777-control-problems/

And prior to that the FAA cited Boeing for a previous similar issue with the 777 on Dec 2020:

"...The FAA cited a long litany of concerns, including a serious flight control incident during a test flight on Dec. 8, 2020, when the plane experienced an “uncommanded pitch event” — meaning the nose of the aircraft pitched abruptly up or down without input from the pilots..."

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/citin...

Concern for these type of incidents would be of course 5G interfering with Aircraft Controls.

I know the chances are still tiny but I really don’t feel at ease flying any boeing aircraft anymore.

I have been switching to companies that primarily use airbus when available just for the peace of mind. Yes i know it’s irrational and im more likely to die driving to the airport but my anxiety doesn’t seem to follow logic.

Landing in Paris shouldn't be affected by 5G. They've rotated their antennas, and they're not as close to the frequencies used by radar altimeters.

So, these events may be unrelated.

There are at least 11 5G antennas within the CDG airport.

https://www.cartoradio.fr/#/cartographie/lonlat/2.522295/48....

Understood. But they should be reduced in power, tilted downwards, and still operating on frequencies further from the ones used by radar altimeters.

Even if they are still present, they shouldn't be a significant risk.

I see two points of interest:

1. Why discussing only of 5G antennas? Mobile phones are powerful emitters (~1W) and they are a few meters from the plane equipment. So it is much much likely any 5G interference comes from a traveler mobile phone and not from the operators antennas.

2. Please have you a link to a French operator document, telling that their antennas in CDG "are reduced in power, tilted downwards, and still operating on frequencies further from the ones used by radar altimeters"

At least in France, 5G uses 3490 MHz to 3800 MHz. For people who are not in the trade, there is no strict cut off at the end of an emission band, on contrary there are spillover along a very large band. The higher the frequency, the greater the bandwidth impacted.

And it's not the first time this can of issue arise, for example 10 years ago there was concern about GPS precision when the 5GHz band was opened to WiFi.

1. The potential issue of 5G interference from cell phones is common across all planes and all airports, and therefore isn't special to this particular incident. If we were to enumerate all possible risks that all airplanes and all airports are vulnerable to, then we would never be able to finish this conversation.

2. As shown in the previous conversations regarding the 737 model , and all the outcry in the USA about 5G towers, it has been well established that The standard throughout Europe (which includes France) is that 5G towers are tilted towards the ground, reduced in power, and do not get so close to the frequencies used by radar altimeters. If you have proof of anything else, please provide appropriate links.

In particular, the towers here in the US are now going to 4000 MHz, which is why there is such a concern regarding older radar altimeters -- that cuts the buffer in half for the distance to the radio frequencies used in the altimeters.

All the manufacturers and operators in Europe have said that they are very safe from radio frequency interference for radar altimeters, which cannot be said for manufacturers and operators here in the US. Again, if you have counter evidence showing that radar altimeter interference is a valid risk in Europe in general or France in particular, please let us know.

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