Comment by tsujp | Hacker News Reader

Comment by tsujp | Hacker News Reader

This is disgusting. Allow me to explain:

The "Federal Air Transport Agency" in question here isn't a military agency, it's a civilian one[1]. For the Americans here it'd be like destroying the infrastructure for the FAA.

Why is a NON-MILITARY BODY the target here? Yes, Russia is committing war crimes in Ukraine and shelling, shooting, and (maybe) kidnapping Ukrainian citizens BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN that you stoop to their level and also target Russian civilians via these types of attacks.

We saw this retaliatory revenge-driven behavior after Germany invaded Russia in WW2. Germany committed unspeakable acts against the Russian population on their march to Moscow and when the tide turned and Russia reached German territory the Russians did the same thing. Both were disgusting and the result of both was the bloodiest theatre of the war for both the military AND civilians: German and Russian both. Civilians being arbitrarily killed, women raped, and overall people massacred.

What does a random Russian citizen who needs to fly between A and B have to do with Putin's war in Ukraine? Russia is a "democracy" in name-only; it's common knowledge people get disappeared for speaking up in Russia. It's not like they have a choice; so why attack people trapped by the circumstances of the country they were born in?

I should note -- and it annoys me I have to say this because it means the substance of my opinion here is only valid by how "woke" my view on the war is, and not other merits my opinion may or may not have -- I don't support Vladimir Putin's war in Ukraine. I do not supporting the Russian military's killing of Ukrainian civilians and targeting non-military infrastructure, but I also do not support Ukraine's retaliatory attacks on Russian CITIZENS.

I'm not Russian. I'm not Ukrainian. I'm from England, I'm European.

[1] -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Air_Transport_Agency (matched based on the name Rosaviatsiya which is mentioned in the article of this thread).

This is total war. Anything which damages the Russian economy is justified because that reduces the funding available to the Russian military. If that means Russian civilians are harmed then that's unfortunate, but it's an acceptable outcome.

It’s not like Ukrainian civilians aren’t being harmed after all.

> Why is a NON-MILITARY BODY the target here? Yes, Russia is committing war crimes in Ukraine and shelling, shooting, and (maybe) kidnapping Ukrainian citizens BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN that you stoop to their level and also target Russian civilians via these types of attacks

That ship has long sailed. By design, many of the sanctions imposed on Russia are intended to hurt the average Russian citizen. The point is to affect Russia's economy to the point that they are no longer able to wage an effective war.

> What does a random Russian citizen who needs to fly between A and B have to do with Putin's war in Ukraine?

They pay taxes and contribute to the Russian economy. However indirectly, they are funding the war effort against Ukraine.

> It's not like they have a choice; so why attack people trapped by the circumstances of the country they were born in?

No, they still have a choice, just not a good one. But ultimately, the Russian people are responsible for their government. If not them, then who?

> We saw this retaliatory revenge-driven behavior after Germany invaded Russia in WW2. Germany committed unspeakable acts against the Russian population on their march to Moscow and when the tide turned and Russia reached German territory the Russians did the same thing. Both were disgusting and the result of both was the bloodiest theatre of the war for both the military AND civilians: German and Russian both. Civilians being arbitrarily killed, women raped, and overall people massacred.

Equating economic sanctions against Russia to the mass rape and pillaging that occurred during WW2 is a little bit disingenuous isn't it? Plus, consider the actions that the Russian armed forces are carrying out against Ukrainian civilian population.

Ultimately, it doesn't much matter why Russia's population supports the war -- be it thru fear, or through faith in their cause. Until the war ends, Russia will be a target, and the Russian people along with it because they are Russia.

> This is disgusting

I think invading another country and killing thousands of their citizens is disgusting. Where is your outrage over that?

> They pay taxes and contribute to the Russian economy. However indirectly, they are funding the war effort against Ukraine.

So, considering the all the wars, regime change and bombardment that the US engaged in, every American company deserves to get hacked? And considering America is far more democratic than Russia, American citizens should be held more responsible for the actions of their government?

> I think invading another country and killing thousands of their citizens is disgusting. Where is your outrage over that?

The parent already said:

> I should note -- and it annoys me I have to say this because it means the substance of my opinion here is only valid by how "woke" my view on the war is, and not other merits my opinion may or may not have -- I don't support Vladimir Putin's war in Ukraine. I do not supporting the Russian military's killing of Ukrainian civilians and targeting non-military infrastructure

But I guess it doesn't meet your standards for the necessary intensity of outrage.

> So, considering the all the wars, regime change and bombardment that the US engaged in, every American company deserves to get hacked? And considering America is far more democratic than Russia, American citizens should be held more responsible for the actions of their government?

Is the US engaged in an UN-unsanctioned invasion of Ukraine at the moment? Yes, the US might have engaged in similar behaviour in the past. That was wrong, and I don't disagree. Yes, we American citizens should be held more responsible for the atrocities our government has committed.

NONE of that justifies the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

> The parent already said:

And yet, they never called the invasion of Ukraine disgusting. Nor the bombing of civilian targets. Nor the forced relocation of thousands of refugees into Russia. Nor the 'double-tap' artillery strikes.

So damned straight it doesn't meet my standards for intensity of outrage. My outrage is that this war has claimed the lives of multiple family members of mine, on both sides. Don't you fucking DARE tell me what level of outrage is acceptable.

> NONE of that justifies the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

If you think anyone on this thread is justifying Russia, you really need to improve your reading comprehension.

> Don't you fucking DARE tell me what level of outrage is acceptable.

Who is policing your outrage level? You're the one cribbing about other people not expressing enough outrage!

Your personal losses don't give you the right to straw man and misrepresent other people's arguments.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com