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Comment by lnxg33k1 | Hacker News Reader

I kinda love it, you take some people working for these big corps doing customers service, that are exploited and paid like shit, and give them money to f*ck their exploiters, that's awesome

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These are very bad people:

>"... prior to launching LAPSUS$, WhiteDoxbin was a founding member of a cybercriminal group... specialized in SIM swapping targets of interest and participating in “swatting” attacks, wherein fake bomb threats, hostage situations and other violent scenarios are phoned in to police as part of a scheme to trick them into visiting potentially deadly force on a target’s address."

People live such incredibly dark lives. I really can’t even comprehend wanting that. I’d rather kill myself.

I'm not a communist, but this is a modern democratic capitalist disease.

I don't have the answer, but grinding subsections of society into the dust is not the answer.

I said I like the concept of people paying exploited unfairly paid people, to knee their exploiters, then that was it, like just avoid traveling with the brain and go to unexplored lands where I said oh I like bomb threats and hostage situations

To be clear, WhiteDoxBin is bribing individuals to commit crimes, for which they may later go to prison. Also, WhiteDoxBin is a horrible person in other ways. I don't see anything to like or love.

The world is full of horrible people who are worshipped just because they poison the society either corrupting politicians or by operating in the grey areas of the law. I am by vocation against companies and corporations, whatever people do to make them suffer, I like.

So he’s paying some individuals to commit crimes doesn’t make him a horrible person by default, in my opinion, the law is just there to protect the wealthy, is not something that defines what is just, correct or fair. There is nothing intrinsically noble in respecting the law and there is nothing intrinsically horrible in not respecting it

...what is your vocation...? That's by default against corporations and companies?

So, you're ok with exploiting already exploited people even more? Just this time for purely criminal endeavors? If you do things like that you are horrible person, period.

The "customer service" role itself is an invention for companies to absolve themselves of core responsibilities.

Company screws up, the only option available is "contact customer service." And actually getting in touch with customer service is made as difficult as possible by design.

If you do have the patience and persist, it turns out the customer service agent doesn't have the power to do anything either. In a lot of cases (as it was for the Okta incident) they don't even work for the company in question!

First, let me acknowledge that some companies do truly have terrible customer service. But some have great customer service. Both types of companies exist.

However...

> The "customer service" role itself is an invention for companies to absolve themselves of core responsibilities.

This seems like a pretty extreme take. Are you saying that customer service shouldn't exist?

I could easily reframe this to say "Companies employ customer service departments to fulfill their responsibilities which they otherwise could not scale without a department dedicated to it".

Even if software is perfect and has no bugs, most software that has a customer service department behind it is also sufficiently complex that at some point, support is going to need to get involved. This is especially true in the enterprise software space where Okta plays.

What is the alternative?

I don't mean the job title itself, but the fact that companies employ (or mostly outsource) a team of people who it treats as second class citizens and does not give the necessary tools to fulfill these responsibilities you mention. These agents are paid mostly to be a sounding board for customer abuse.

That is a very broad generalization of customer service/support organizations. That is certainly not the case for organizations I've personally worked for, and that includes time I spent as a phone tech early in my career.

> the fact that companies employ ... a team of people who it treats as second class citizens and does not give the necessary tools to fulfill these responsibilities

Again, I acknowledge that there are orgs that do exactly what you describe, and sure, call out the bad where it exists, but it's also not fair to generalize this to "companies".

Most of customer service I've ever interacted with were not much more than whipping boys for disgruntled customers to unload on.

And while you are at it, you are also f*cking innocent bystanders, like their employees and customers. That's awesome.

The people who provide the funding and the labor which perpetuate the existence of employers who exploit workers aren't innocent -- simply complicit. Or, at best, negligent.

> that are exploited and paid like s__t

I wouldn't say that they are badly paid compared to local wages.

One of the FAANG's outsourced customer support accounts here start at $11,000 yearly.

It may not seem that much compared to U.S. wages, but that would easily place you in the highest 10% wages here.

11k puts you in the top 10% el salvadorian wages?

Hi! I'm updating my parent post with more accurate data:

* $11K/year would place you in the top 16% wages

* $14K/year would place you in the top 10% wages.

This stats don't include commissions (like the ones sales teams get), people who are self employed, informal sector or business owners that don't receive a wage.

did you read this bit?- "first surfaced....extortion demand on Brazil’s Ministry of Health" If you are still of the same opinion... Just saying that providing primary care by getting down there and using you skills to improve the situation would be preferable to simply extorting money because the bureaucracy running the care givers is flawed.

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