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Comment by philliphaydon | Hacker News Reader

I don’t think I’ll ever use ubuntu again. The continued forcing of snap is killing it for me.

I installed Ubuntu a few weeks ago at work because most people use it and there is some existing infrastructure around it (mostly for the target platforms, but could also be for dev machines).

I have to say that coming from Arch, it's a very Windowsy experience: lots of software has to be installed by searching for "install XYZ on Ubuntu", and following some instructions that involve scary-looking command lines that mess with cryptographic keys and add repos to my configuration, or, for a real Windows experience, install from a deb and hope you remember where you got it from when it needs an update.

I know the AUR is no more secure than that, but at least if someone makes a bogus package full of evil, it'll be flagged on that platform. If I install whatever from some random third-party repo, how will I ever know if it's gone bad?

Also, PKGBUILDs are just so easy.

> lots of software has to be installed by searching for "install XYZ on Ubuntu", and following some instructions that involve scary-looking command lines that mess with cryptographic keys and add repos to my configuration, or, for a real Windows experience, install from a deb and hope you remember where you got it from when it needs an update.

Ironically this is exactly the problem that snaps solve; what you describe is exactly why others complain about it.

Snap wouldn't be facing such a big backlash if it solved those problems without adding a whole lot of others. Even worse, they completely ignore better alternatives that exist.

I also come from Archlinux. A few months ago I discovered the mpr repository [1]. It is essentially the same as the AUR bit for Ubuntu. The syntax is also the same as the AUR packages, so it is super easy to port a package to Ubuntu. I highly recommend it.

[1] http://mpr.hunterwittenborn.com/

>very Windowsy experience

>scary-looking command lines that mess with cryptographic keys

>for a real Windows experience, install from a deb and hope you remember where you got it from when it needs an update

Yeah I guess you didn't use Windows recently cause that never happens there

Googling for an exe or msi installer is fundamentally the same thing. Unless it's in the Windows Store, which it probably isn't.

Once installed, unless it has it's own phone-home for updates, you won't know if it's out of date.

To be fair googling for an exe is even worse. At least the weird apt incantations can be easily audited and understood by a proficient user, whereas on Windows you're running a binary downloaded from the Internet that you know is going to ask for superadmin permission to do its thing.

A third-party repo is the same: it's also an "Internet binary".

The AUR is slightly different in that (usually, there are some binary packages) you could in principle check the sources and build process before building it right there and then installing to the system with elevated privileges.

Same here.

Strongly eyeing NixOS and patiently awaiting real work experience from a co-worker who already did the plunge.

Time ago, when OpenSolaris dead I've switched to Ubuntu, until Unity (WM) was there it was good enough, after they took "the enterprise path", I'm on NixOS, there are a bit of annoyances to run unpackaged binaries but the rest work like a charm AND it's fully reproducible AND creating a custom iso is just the config + a oneliner, so deploy a personal desktop/homeserver is as easy as deploy in an enterprise automated infra without the burden of it.

The nix language is indigestible for me, so I eye Guix System but so far Guix does not have things I like/need so still on NixOS in a calm state: systems updated, automated, reproducible without thinking and babysitting them continuously.

I got interested in NixOS after watching https://youtu.be/LA8KF9Fs2sk and https://youtu.be/ubDMLoWz76U

I use fedora since long time and so far is quite stable without any non-sense

I jumped in several months ago and haven't really regretted it. The caveat being that you have to be okay with learning Nix (the language), debugging with only arcane error messages to go off of, and reading a lot of the config source because documentation is vast but shallow. If you feel like you're willing to make the tradeoff, then it is a blast and you'll be surprised you ever lived without Nix.

In case you want some inspiration or to take an existing config and run, feel free to take a peek at or use mine: https://github.com/jakehamilton/config

It is to operating systems what automatic memory management was to programming. Irrefutably needed.

The analogy is even more apt due to nix basically having a garbage collector (packages no longer available from any installed package, profile)

I moved to PopOS for exactly this reason and have no regrets. Essentially Ubuntu with Flatpak.

I ran into weird issues with pop. I don’t think it’s a pop issue. I forget the exact issue but I was trying to install a couple of applications and I couldn’t because it said it was only for Ubuntu. I ended up hacking some file changing the name of the OS from Pop to Ubuntu and it installed and worked fine.

Honestly after that I never tried it again.

Currently running manjaro but really wanna give fedora a try cos seems people who use it swear by it.

Mint is probably a good alternative. It's based on Ubuntu but they don't even allow snap to be installed by default.

It has been a great alternative. And Firefox ESR (it's not in the repo anyway) also works great in 20.3 (and no doubt in LMDE).

I hope Neon (a non Ubu-family derivative of Ubuntu) is going to make a stance against snap. They can become a place of refuge for snap haters.

In the same vein I installed openSuse Thumbleweed and Fedora; as I'm looking for a way out. I hope Fedora allows me to install all opensource packages without Flatpack or I also ditch them. BTW Fedora's F35 installer has a horrible partition configurator, worst experience in two decades of installing Linux.

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