Masks clearly have a measurable impact on mental health. Given what he know about aerosolization and cloth masks, masks are near useless in public spaces.
If we are talking about reducing the populations' micromorts[1] by reducing common freedom, then there are far better things to do. Enforcing helmets for drivers, breathalyzers ($70) as default in cars, banning right-turns on red are all significantly more effective at reducing total deaths than mask enforcement, with much lower costs to a civilization. Similarly, banning certain foods and mandating exercise would massively improve American health outcomes.
I find that 'masks for everyone and everything' have become more of a political rallying call driven by hysteria, than a principled outcome focused measure. It reeks of the same blind faith as those who shout 'trust science' while healthy discourse makes up a fundamental pillar of the process of science.
[1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micromort#:~:text=A%20micromor....
Bullshit. Citation?
Anecdotally, I have yet to meet a single person IRL over 2 years of the pandemic who enjoys wearing masks. It varies from minor inconvenience to a thorn in your side.
For one, uncontrolled observational studies show that there is pretty strong correlation between the pandemic and depression. [1] In narrow studies, masks are shown to reduce interpersonal trust [2] , ability to evaluate emotions. [3] and might accelerate cognitive decline in older populations [4]
There is an alarming lack of studies directly targeting the mental health impact of masks. I couldn't even find a survey. On one hand, I understand that getting any good self-reported data from the hysterically polarized population is probably futile. I tried to find peer reviewed studies, but I am not a public health / psychiatry professional. On the other hand, silence can be deafening.
Tangentially, my trust in peer reviewed medical research has declined sharply over the pandemic. These folks need statistics, a sophisticated understanding of causality, experiment design and variable control. I can see why many of the best healthcare writers exclusively stick to meta-studies instead of individual studies.
[1] https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle...
[2] https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-96500-7
[3] https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2020.5668...
In direct contradiction to what you say, there are many businesses in red state US who will stop you from wearing a mask if you try to enter.
I live in a red state and have not seen this anywhere.
In fact my state encourages you to do what you want, including wearing a mask or refusing to do so. Nobody will bother you if you are masked.
Or "stop you if you try to enter while wearing a mask"?
Or are you talking about wearing a ski mask inside Idaho Regional Credit Union in July?
Jerks are everywhere. And they exist in blue states too my friend.
> Given what he know about aerosolization and cloth masks, masks are near useless in public spaces.
Both of these claims are false.
Masks have had no proven impact on mental health.[2] Masks have proven to be one of the most effective tools we have for preventing the spread of COVID-19 in public places.[2]
Mask use is science-based, as countless studies have proven. Anti-mask rhetoric is politically- and emotionally-driven hysteria.
[1] "The evidence that we have does not point us to any concern that masks affect mental health negatively." — Jeremy Kendrick, MD, assistant professor of psychiatry, Huntsman Mental Health Institute https://healthcare.utah.edu/healthfeed/postings/2021/08/_mas...
[2] "In settings of very high mask use, in-school transmission of the coronavirus is less than 1%. The best way to protect health and safety—particularly of those that are not vaccinated—is to wear a mask." — Adam Hersh, MD, a pediatric infectious disease specialist at University of Utah Health and Intermountain Primary Children’s Hospital https://healthcare.utah.edu/healthfeed/postings/2021/08/_mas...
I will concede that there has been no peer reviewed study that explicitly tries to identity an association between mask wearing and mental health. Thus, no impact has been measured. It was not for lack of trying to find a study though. There are literally no good studies (from my cursory google scholar peek) that opined one way or the other.
> There is no evidence that a child wearing a mask causes depression or anxiety
But, saying this is not correct either. [1]
> transmission of the coronavirus is less than 1%.
These studies are strongly confounded with city policy, distancing measures, individual measures and odds of being vaccinated. It is really difficult to get exclusive numbers for mask efficacy using observational or questionnaire based studies of any kind.
As for my second claim, please evaluate it in context. Public spaces is usually taken to mean outdoor spaces or high ventilation large indoor spaces. My comments are also in time where covid's fatality has collapsed and hospitals aren't overwhelmed.
Almost every mask study I read makes assumptions of ideal wearing patterns that do not seem to be match real world observations. Even then, they project modest gains when using the most common forms of cloth masks in perfectly covid-favored situations. Vaccines can't ensure zero-covid. Masks can't ensure zero-covid. The end game is that it can become endemic or we wear masks forever.
Masks are 'useless' in the same way that seat-belts in school buses are useless. The risks for the concerned demographic are orders of magnitude lower. The ideal testing scenario is impossible to recreate in practice. It is impossible to enforce compliance. It has knock-on effects that no one seems keen to study. And lastly, if draconian measure are to be used, there are alternatives with greater effectiveness and lower social cost can should be tried first.
[1] https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/the-phrase-no-evidence...
If we're not going to mandate an effective mask, I honestly don't see what the point of mandates are. It makes as much sense to me as mandating seatbelts and accepting a knitted scarf as an acceptable form of seatbelt.
It's also possible there is more than one mechanism, and that an n95 or equivalent mask with fine enough particulate filter can additionally reduce exposure significantly (initial exposure level also being accepted as having some effect for viruses in general).
So you can look down on people with those fabric masks, but possibly not be completely correct. Honestly though... the whole mask wearing thing is more about trends of what is "socially acceptable" than science. I'm not saying there is no value, but that the forces dictating when most people do or do not wear a mask have very little to do with how well informed they are or on the current accepted understanding having changed, and far more to do with what is considered socially acceptable at the present time... so it's hardly surprising no one particularly cares about the type of mask.
And strapping yourself to your car seat with a knitted scarf might reduce injury risk/severity relative to a person with no seatbelt. That doesn’t mean we should expand the seatbelt mandate to include scarves.
I'm glad you don't run things here. We have a constitutional republic that makes it impossible for the federal government to unilaterally mandate such things as masks and vaccines. Biden tried to mandate vaccines through OSHA but the Supreme Court determined that was an overreach.
What kind of masks? Cloth masks are proven to be worthless and only well fitting N95 masks may help prevent infection.
I think what's going to happen is COVID will be less and less damaging as time goes on (like all novel diseases) and we will go on to live our lives as free people.
This isn't the only way the Fed can get things done. For example, the drinking restriction for 21+ is a state level issue strongly encouraged by the Fed. Louisiana tried to hold to 18+ for the longest, but the Fed finally won by threatening to withhold federal funding for highways.
Links would be appreciated. By all accounts I've heard, for vaccinated people, Omicron (the dominant variant) is like a mild cold.
Omicron appears mild in the statistics because by the time it hit western countries like the US and UK, there was almost nobody left who hasn’t either been vaccinated or exposed to a prior variant, or both.
Countries with low vaccination rates and low prior exposure rates are seeing severity of outcome with Omicron that is comparable to prior variants.
https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1503420660869214213?...
How is that relevant when the complaint is specifically about how "masks aren't mandatory in public in the US"? Vaccines have been freely available in the US for a year, yet the US should mandate masks because other countries have low vaccination rates?
People who have specific concerns about COVID and want to protect themselves (or others) should be encouraged to wear an N95 mask. Cloth and surgical masks should no longer be treated as a valid medical choice.
Yet because 'some guy we know' had it easy, there are a bunch of people hanging around internet forums willing to refute all talk of covid being serious.
Sorry to hear that. Hope you end up finding a way to recover.
> Yet because 'some guy we know' had it easy
I have no idea where you're pulling this from. I wasn't citing you an anecdote I gathered from "some guy I know". I was citing facts that have been circulating all over the news for a while now, along with the relevant hospitalization statistics. And I hadn't heard anything to the contrary. Here's [1] one link:
> In fully vaccinated and/or boosted people, omicron symptoms tend to be mild. In unvaccinated people, symptoms may be quite severe, possibly leading to hospitalization or even death.
[1] https://health.ucdavis.edu/coronavirus/covid-19-information/...
Mild in comparison to other strains of Covid, yes. Tends not to require hospitalisation and has a lower risk of death. It doesn't say 'mild compared to a cold' though. I think it its too early for a study too be able to suggest that Omicron changed the possibility of developing long Covid either.
In regards to identifying yourself as one of the people I was targeting in my comment about 'some guy', I will put that down to a guilty concience.
"Mild compared to a cold" is not what I wrote either. I said it's "like a mild cold" for vaccinated people. "Mild cold" being, you know, what people get all the time: some sore throat/cough/congestion. No high fevers, not bedridden, etc.
If you read the news beyond that one link I pasted above, you'll see what I said is pretty consistent with what has been reported. Here's [1] another one:
> For many people, especially those who are vaccinated and otherwise healthy, Omicron does appear to have relatively mild symptoms, including upper respiratory or cold like symptoms like a runny nose congestion, sneezing, and sore throat—which is relatively common—and headaches. Fever is less common than we’ve seen with other variants, especially in vaccinated people.
[1] https://healthblog.uofmhealth.org/wellness-prevention/omicro...
4 people in my company, my sister and their spouses (so 10 all together) just had Covid in the last 3 weeks. 2 reported mild flu like symptoms, the others range between that and full blown flu. The least affected said it was like a cold but went on for longer. The ones at my company all tried to work through it and all failed to keep a full schedule, despite being the kind of people who might work through a cold.
That's massively understating the effects of vaccination or acquired immunity on hospitalizations for omicron. 3 doses of MRNA are 99% effective, and where it doesn't work there are often other health issues at play.
VE against hospitalization with Delta or Omicron infection after three doses was greater than 99% across the study population. Of the four patients hospitalized with Omicron infections who had received three COVID-19 vaccine doses, all were older than 60 years and had chronic diseases; one had a compromised immune system.
https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2022/02/3-covid-...
All the data I’ve seen suggests GP’s claim is accurate. https://www.healio.com/news/infectious-disease/20220201/hosp...
a) demanded hard proof b) presented an anecdote as contradictory evidence
I think you should probably hold yourself to the same standards that you hold others
That said even if they were shown to be effective I would still oppose them on basis human rights ground. I do not believe it is the proper role of government in general, and certainly not the US Federal government to mandate what I wear when I leave my home. At most that should be a local matter, but even though I would advocate against it in my local government. However is certainly has no constitutional basis under our system of government for the federal government to impose such a mandate
I hear this as an argument against left and right, but when I ask why it is different from the vaccine requirements for public schools I typically get a "it just is" response. Here's hoping someone might have a better response to why this vaccine is different in that aspect.
There are many things that I think are a good idea, but that I oppose the Federal government taking the power to do. I don't object to my state or city taking that same power.
I doubt that. I couldn't STOP hearing the arguments last year. Not trying to be 'smart', but just believe a minimal effort to understand an opposing view gets you there.
> hoping someone might have a better response
Regarding required vaccines for grade-school kids at public schools in the U.S.:
1. Aren't actually forced. You can opt out in several ways.
2. The diseases they treat have a much higher death/hospitalization and/or transmissibility rate among children.
3. We better understand the diseases they treat.
4. Approvals for vaccines were not given under emergency order.
5. Meet the CDC's pre-2019 definition of 'vaccine'.
6. Side affects are published, well known, and readily available.
That's just off the top of my head. And I assume you and I agree on most things.