Nationalists plotting chemical attacks in Ukraine when Russian troops approach | Hacker News Reader

Nationalists plotting chemical attacks in Ukraine when Russian troops approach

tass.com

13 pointsmm3218 comments

They have that item in English: https://tass.com/defense/1424641

TASS, the Russian state news agency reports that the Russian "ministry of defense is reporting preparations by Ukrainian nationalists to use chemical weapons" https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/14125007

I think that they might be fabricating a pretext to justify the use of tactical nukes, as a nuclear response to a claimed chemical attack. Yesterdays they declared the use of hypersonic Kinzhal missiles, so that is also a kind of lowering of the nuclear threshold. News on Kinzhal missile: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60806151

I mean a lot of people prior to the 24th of February thought that it won't come to a war (me included) now just about everything is possible...

in hindsight the issue was that the kinetic possibilities (hey here are all these tanks on the Russian side of the border) were not given as much weight as the speech (just some war exercises). in hindsight a variety of approaches could have been done, for example if NATO sent a "just an exercise bro" series of tanks to Ukrainian side of the border, exactly matching the number of Russian tanks, not exceeding them, then, obviously, the kinetics of the Russian invasion would have been different (impossible).

That's the game theory anyway, I thought that it's better just to go for peace.

So with this hindsight knowledge (tanks = invasion) isn't the real question now, where are the tactical nukes? Should they be matched (insanity for insanity)?

If before 24th of February NATO tanks had matched Russian tanks, under the guise of a war exercise, Russia wouldn't have crossed the border with tanks: they couldn't have - there would have been tanks across the border.

What is the tactical nuclear missile equivalent? What physically mirrors or counters or makes it impossible?

I guess there need to be tactical nukes aimed at all of the command centers that could order a tactical nuke, and then this needs to be publicized.

It would surprise nobody to learn "Hey Russia just nuked Ukraine". Not a surprise to anyone, because it metaphorically just happened days ago. We need to learn from what happened days ago. Time to dust off the old nuclear playbooks.

Its naive to think US didnt fully expect the war. They were the first ones to move diplomatic staff and special assets. If anything sudden withdrawal might of secured a comfortable crisis just in time for 2024 elections.

The idea a pretext is needed is silly. Of course every government at war does it, but the decision to use doesn't vest on the false premise, it's simply what they want to do.

The decision to use tactical nukes has irrevocable consequences which Russian government and military forces would be insane to bring on. It speaks volumes that we've returned to a state of affairs where it has to be said.

Chemical warfare is abhorrent, but has been partially normalised by Russian backed forces in Syria. To believe an accusation of impending use by Ukraine justifies tactical nuclear response is to pile delusional logic on a false premise.

Also normal.

A pretext is needed since Russia needs to dupe people into feeling okay enough to press the button. They can't say: "We will do this as an unprovoked unilateral act of aggression because we feel powerful enough to and the other side is weak and defenseless and we want their territory. Just do it." That doesn't get the soldiers to press the button. These nuclear buttons don't press themselves, you know.

all this is in "how to be evil" 101 level courses, all dictators know this stuff.

Button pressers don't have to be duped, they're selected and trained to do this on command. The problem is the higher command and distribution of the weapons, not firing them.

> These nuclear buttons don’t press themselves

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Hand

Wow that's straight up unrepentant propaganda.

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