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Comment by Zimahl | Hacker News Reader

Of course top students get screwed. It's a fundamental problem with schools in general, a flaw in design.

The main problem is that we set grades by age and not skill. This causes a couple problems. Kids might be better serviced by staying behind a grade, due to something as simple as maturity. The flip side is that the 'smarter' kids for their age, those who are able and ready to move up can. Right now, educators are hesitant to do either, especially given how it is frowned on to hold a kid back by parents. So they just move them on, put them into remedial classes that move slower. How are you supposed to catch up when you are moving slower? The more able are just stunted into sitting their while the teachers help the slower kids.

The system is designed as a lose-lose scenario.

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School is a social experience as well. Children get along best with children of their own age, and sticking precocious six-year-olds and dumb-as-dishwater thirteen-year-olds in the same classroom is just asking for trouble.

We should arrange by age and then by ability. Split each year into three streams: 10% "smart", 70% "normal" and 20% "dumb". The smart kids get whatever they need. The normal kids get a good solid education. The dumb kids get ponderously taught the basics of life, to make sure they can read, do basic mathematics, and avoid vastly stupid life decisions.

Is it still possible to be held back a grade in the US? I've heard stories of it happening in the distant past but I've never seen it happen. Usually they get promoted to the next grade and placed in special ed or remedial classes.

I think it happens more frequently at lower grade levels, especially Kindergarten through 3rd. Usually, by the time they reach higher grade levels, they will have been placed at a class with which they can keep pace.

It's generally largely frowned upon nowadays -- largely for social reasons. I recall talking to some folks in Texas about this, and they said, if you could hold kids back for academics, a lot of parents of football playing boys would push to do that. You'd probably see a lot of 18 year old freshman QBs in high school.

At least in Ohio, where I live, one must be under 19 years old to be eligible for high school sports.

I think 19 is the most common cut-off. I think some 20 still exist. So this 18 y/o QB may only get 3 years of eligibility. :-)

I knew a guy who transferred schools halfway through his senior year because it put him far enough back that he could play another year of high school football.

There are some really strange motivations out there.

Yeah. There's a term called kindergarten redshirts, where parents hold their child back to be older for athletic reasons. You end up with these weird kindergartens with some boys just about to turn 7 and all the girls are 5.

I don't understand. Remedial classes are exactly the solution to the problem you posed. The only difference is the number attached to the "grade level".

Remedial classes? We don't have those any more: Putting a child into one of those might damage his self-esteem.

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