Why You Should Bootstrap in Montreal or Join Startup Chile | Hacker News Reader

Why You Should Bootstrap in Montreal or Join Startup Chile

nextmontreal.com

63 pointsvolandovengo36 comments

There are several reasons why you generally have a huge disadvantage when doing a startup in Canada, and it's not just about taxes and laws.

Want to use that cool new service (e.g., Stripe)? Sorry, not available in Canada.

Want to start a service that ships anything in the mail? Prohibitively expensive.

Want funds? Banks won't lend you anything and investors are very few and risk averse. $20-50K investments in web startups are rare and big news when they happen.

I love Canada and I'm not moving from it. But Canadian entrepreneurs have much lower chances of succeeding than American ones.

Can you make millions in Canada? Sure, but it's a much less likely occurrence. And if you do, it will generally be still less than what American startups can make.

This is why it makes no sense to start a company like Twitter in Canada. You can't sustain it. The best approach for Canadian startups is to bootstrap by charging money from day one.

So you can get a lot of nice "Italian restaurants on the web" doing SaaS and making good money, but don't expect groundbreaking innovation a la Google from Canada.

With that said, those who are already in Canada, like me, have no free pass. If you don't succeed, you can only blame yourself.

"In Silicon Valley they hand out money like candy" is not a good excuse for never achieving your dreams in Canada.

I agree with a lot of what you're saying but I think if your focus is to create an italien restaurent on the net, which you entirely own, I think your chances for success are actually better in Canada than the us.

I sorta agree with you about the hurdles but there has a been a bunch of very sucessful startups in Canada. I can't name you a google but Softimage, Ubisoft, Bioware, RIM, ATI, Desire2Learn... and on the non tech side Cirque Du Soleil(Founder just went to space last year) All pretty big successes. For 1/10 the population as the US you can't expect the same level of output.

On the talent side, Montreal and the Toronto area are pretty big recruiting grounds for Microsoft Google and other tech companies. Tons of Game companies have established themselves in Montreal to draw on that pool. There is a lot of talent here and a lot of people would want to stay here instead of working in the US.Montreal's 2 english universities and a lot of French ones around help keep replenishing the supplies. Toronto has some very good schools too (Waterloo being one of the best Comp Sci program in the world).

There are a bunch of ways to get government money but it does involve some major red tape. It be cool to find someone who's gone through it and could make a writeup on it.

EDIT: I should also mention that there are other good cities in Cananda ;p I did not mention Vancouver

For the record, though, Ubisoft is a French company, not a Canadian start-up.

Ah man you are right, sorry for the error (they've had offices here forever but I should have know that).

No problem - a lot of Montrealers have this impression, probably because the Montreal offices are by far the largest.

"In Silicon Valley they hand out money like candy"

I beg to disagree with you. It's still really hard to raise money. On average, it takes 6 to 9 months to raise a decent round.

Pretty cool, but Chile is hardly in the tropics. South America isn't automatically warm just because it's "south" :).

That said, it looks like a killer opportunity. I've looked at this before and it's really going to be interesting to see the different experiences that these startups have come through over the coming months.

The weather in Santiago and Central Chile is Mediterranean (wine, fruit), arid in the north and temperate in the south, plus mountainous regions (and polar climate if you count their claimed Antarctica territories) so basically they have all the climates except for tropical.

Easter Island has tropical climate. So yeah, we got 'em all.

I stand corrected.

Weather in Chile is pretty much the same as in California, and varies the same as you travel away from the Equator. Santiago, the capital, has about the same weather as San Jose.

Other recent HN posts and discussions about Start-Up Chile:

154 Startups Selected in Start-Up Chile's 2nd Round of 2011 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3031349

Start-Up Chile is a Great Experience But Be Careful Too http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3055534

As someone who lived in Montreal for 4 years, it gets old pretty quick. I now live in Brooklyn for comparable prices to what I paid in Montreal (rent is a bit more, but food is dirt cheap in NY) and like it much more.

I can't see how doing a startup in Canada in general is a good idea. Policies there are a lot more restrictive than the states. It's a great place to visit, though.

Health coverage.

I have to say this is a big one for me. It gives a lot more freedom and it's one less thing to stress about.

I agree. Consider these two things:

1) Verizon has twice as many subscribers as Canada's population. The US is a way bigger market.

2) Generally people aren't as excited about your ideas as they are in SF or NYC. People here seem to be way more receptive to innovation.

That being said, Canada has a great education system and there are a lot of smart motherfuckers. Too bad the immigration situation kind of sucks for founders.

Disclosure: I am Canadian

This sounds like a fantastic opportunity. I like the Startup Chile project because they offer a great combination of non-equity funds, lots of government support for networking and an opportunity to explore a new place in the world. Congratulations and best of luck with this.

Not much information about other requirements for Startup Chile in the article.

Through Startup Chile's website: Teams must also give workshops, attend events etc., which hopefully won't be too big of a hassle. Not sure if you have to keep your business in Chile for a certain amount of time afterwards.

Government support and involvement: Possibly good or bad.

I've been talking with a number of directors at length about the program, and we've been promoting it at Hackers & Founders.

There is no requirement after the 6 months. And, the government support is all about walking you through the legal loop holes, and then generally getting out of the way.

Thanks for the additional information. It sounds like really interesting opportunity, particularly for those wanting to learn about a new culture.

And on second thought, the workshops and events are probably a good thing in that you're forced to step outside your intense startup focus to meet new people and maybe find prospective friends/users/employees/investors.

I really liked Santiago when there for study abroad - nice people and very modern city. Only complaint would be the air pollution because of the "containment" effect of the surrounding Andes mountains.

My pleasure. As far as I'm concerned, Startup Chile is one of the best sources of early money around for startups.

Does anyone have any more info on these government grants available in Canada that are mentioned ?

Actually, won't it be summer in both?

Yes it would and if you know anything about winter in Canada you'll know that it would be awesome to be in Chile instead of the cold north.

Depending on where you live and work in Montréal, though, venturing outdoors in winter can be almost completely optional. That can be both a blessing and a curse. I lived a workaholic life there for a while and I hear the city's very nice -- but since both my apartment and my office (and the grocery store, restaurants, etc.) were connected to the Metro, I've never actually seen it.

Yeah the underground city is pretty awesome and useful. There are days when you might have to carry a shovel with you(don't think I'm kidding it's not an uncommon sight) when walking outside in the winter but last few winters have been pretty mild (ok last year had a good amount of snow). Global warming's helping ;p

I don't know anything about it but doesn't sound like much fun, winter in Canada.

No need to bash if you don't know anything about it. Winter in Canada is better than most places. Instead of getting lots of rain you get lots of snow. It's nice to have more than 2 or 3 seasons.

> Winter in Canada is better than most places. Instead of getting lots of rain you get lots of snow.

You obviously don't live in Vancouver, where it rains virtually every day for the 6 months of winter (and I say this as someone who lived there for 5 years). Very SAD.

And in Toronto that snow very quickly turns to dirty slush. Gets old real fast.

There's a reason Canadians who move to California tend to stay there. (Well, assuming they can get a green card. I didn't, which is why I'm now in Melbourne.)

The post mentions Montreal. Where it does snow, it rains seldom during winter and sunny, but cold, days are the norm from December to March. You can't generalize on the weather in a 10 million square kilometer country.

wow - 40k of free money to go enjoy Santiago and build a company. Sounds like a dream!

Probably is

I pretty much agree with the "location, location, location" idea.

I am sure there are advantages to doing a startup in Chile and in Montreal. But I still think that to make it big, you have to do it in Silicon Valley.

The concentration of talented and smart people is greater in Silicon Valley than in any other place.

This sounds pretty cool. I'd go to Chile if not for a little travel and to escape the Bay Area bubble in lieu of a broader life experience. Wonder once you finish the 'program' what the terms are. I suspect they'd want you to stay wherever they're funding you. I also suspect developing countries (PIGS) are going to be a hot bed of innovative startups. Tangible problems beget real solutions, e.g. - successful companies?

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