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Comment by TeMPOraL | Hacker News Reader

Seems so familiar. I just started to face this problem and I already hate the idea of spending the rest of my life like this. There must be some way out of here...

As a little side-point: on HN we often discuss the values of startup life, or various different alternatives to 'day job'. I can understand why many hate the idea of spending most of one's life as a nine-to-five worker doing things one doesn't exactly care about. I hate this idea too. But, if we applied this attitude on the scale of the whole society, would it not collapse? If every shop clerk, Starbucks barista, bus driver, electrician or other professional realized that there must be a better way of working, what would happen? Do we need to force people to have jobs (so that they can eat) for modern civilization to work?

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If every shop clerk, Starbucks barista, bus driver, electrician or other professional realized that there must be a better way of working, what would happen?

The first three you listed are well on their way to being automated within a few decades. The last one seems out of place, since electricians are relatively well-paid and often self-employed. I think that we're seeing a gradual shift away from a service economy, mirroring earlier shifts from industrial and agricultural economies, as service jobs are automated or taken over by people in poorer countries. I'm not sure what to call the economy that's coming, though. A creative economy? A reputation economy? An economy where people work on the things they find interesting, and if other people find them interesting, too, they get paid. Many of the menial or boring jobs will be automated.

I call it the "Star Trek" economy, but I think something more like "The Matrix" is coming. Most people will have cookie-cutter lives where basic needs are supplied for them. Others will rebel against that life and do something they think has meaning (the red pill poppers). I'm willing to listen to alternatives, because my prediction depresses me. I just can't see us shifting back to a less automated world where skilled labor and basic labor is more valued than they are now.

Vonnegut explores this in "The Player Piano." His take isn't terribly positive.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Player_Piano

I used to think of it in terms of Star Trek until I (recently, thanks to HN :)) read Cory Doctorow's "Down and Out in the Magic Kingdom" story about Bitchun Society, in which death and energy are not a problem, economy is based on reputation and today's luxuries are theirs basic rights. Interesting book, BTW :).

"If every shop clerk, Starbucks barista, bus driver, electrician or other professional realized that there must be a better way of working, what would happen?"

That point comes up often, and personally, I think it works itself out. There will always be people that seek the stars and there will always be people that are content with a different lifestyle, including those you mentioned.

I think a robot/automation revolution would allow us one day to not have to work, but I think that hope faces more political and socioeconomic obstacles than practical ones.

Or in other words, someone will try to profit from such a revolution, and probably to the detriment of the rest of society. In some ways, this is already happening.

Who would want a life without some work? I think it's more that we don't get to work on the things that are meaningful to us. Work can be one of life's adventures too!

BTW: I've met Baristas that are exactly where they want to be ... you can tell from their great smiles, and their propensity to call you by name and remember your regular order after only a couple visits.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm thinking about - 'working on the things meaningful to us' as opposed to 'working on whatever someone will feed us for doing'.

AD your BTW: I also know some Baristas who are like the ones you mentioned :).

The key might be variety. I'd hate "spending the rest of my life programming in front of a screen" as much as "spending the rest of my life making coffee" or "spending the rest of my life on a potato field". But trying your hands at various jobs for a few months or years? Sounds much more refreshing, doesn't it!

As an extension to this, simply experiencing as many facets of life as you can is an incredibly enriching experience :)

That would be great.

However, I'm afraid in this age we're condemned to our specific specialization for life. For every job, to get a job at all, years of experience ('XX years of YY specific recent buzzword experience') is generally required. Even for things a flexible, intelligent person could easily learn on the job given some time and hard work.

You could probably switch career once with a lot of hassle, but 'trying your hands at various jobs for a few months or years' sounds very optimistic...

For every job? Doubt it. There are always demand/supply imbalances somewhere in the caleidoscope of "all possible jobs" at any given moment and place. In a demand/supply imbalance you may not be the "perfect choice" but the second-best and totally-acceptable if you demonstrate that "I'll learn on the job and I have the basic core soft skills of enthusiasm sane-humility big-picture-view hands-on-brain" in your interview.

Well you just tell them "pay me 80-90% instead of 100% of your usual salaries for 1-2 months, then decide whether to keep me for another year or not. I always learn on the job and I always get good at it, fast."

Only if it's the truth of course.

(Of course, that's for "simpleton" jobs, not for programming. You better had been building stuff privately or at uni for at least a year, obviously.)

Can-do or can't? "It's your attitude, not your aptitude, that determines your altitude!" ;))

Right, that might have been true ten years ago, and was even more true if you go back further. These days it's hard to get a job even for people that have a lot of experience in some area (at least if it isn't computer-related... we're the lucky ones for now, but that's another story).

I mean, if you aim for the simpleton jobs, you'll be competing with more experienced people that'd happily take the 80%/90% offer just to get a job at all (if it isn't below subsistence level).

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