The definitive guide that you never wanted: Backpack fabrics (2017)
pangolinswithpacks.com
pangolinswithpacks.com
Also I think it is somewhat confusing to list thread materials like nylon and polyester, along with brand names like Dyneema and Cordura. Most Cordura fabrics are nylon, for example.
Coatings are probably the weak point of durability for many packs. Any of the synthetic fabrics, even light weights, can easily last decades with normal use. But as the article notes, even with the best care, you won’t get much more than 15 years on the coatings. And when polyurethane goes bad, it’s gross. It smells horrible and becomes a sticky goo. It is depressing that despite decades of advancement in outdoor gear, companies are still just spraying PU on and calling it good.
Like is it worth paying much attention to smallish items that last 15 years?
No in the sense of emissions and garbage creation from them are negligible. But ensure you pack out everything you pack in, not washing your dish(es if you're bougie) near the water source, etc are very important principals to maintain hiking and camping conditions for whomever comes next. Because that plastic wrapper will definitely last more than 15 years.
Bonus: they're usually white, which means you stand half a chance of being able to see the stuff in your pack. White is pretty rare except for Dyneema packs (Dyneema apparently doesn't dye).
Edited to add:
The other major failure mode for coated and laminated fabrics is when they tape the coated or laminated side. The seam tape flexes differently from the substrate fabric, which pulls at the coating or laminate. I've had coated and Goretex rain jackets fail in this way, as well as coated stuff sacks. Silnylon fares a little better because the silicone is impregnated into the nylon rather than coated on. Silnylon isn't breathable, so it isn't a mainstream material for rain gear though.
Source: GA->ME 2010 and another thousand or so miles of hiking.
(I discovered https://ripstopbytheroll.com from a comment below)
For me, a rain cover is a hindrance when I need to retrieve things from my pack, I have to remove it entirely, whereas a pack liner, I just need to unfurl the top of it.
Secondly, as there are very few bridges in the New Zealand back country, we frequently have to cross the channels of braided rivers. A rain cover keeps out water from above, not so much from below.
And as I mentioned in a previous comment, pack liners can, in an emergency, function as a flotation device or emergency shelter.
But you don’t need a liner for the whole pack, either. Cookware and stoves can get wet, and the tent is probably wet anyway if it is raining.
Typically only the food, sleeping bag, and clothes really need to stay dry, so you can just seal those each in their own bag. I kept those things dry for a month in the Pacific Northwest using just regular kitchen trash bags.
* Don't need to stop/remember to put the pack cover on.
* Can use them to organise different things. e.g. separate clothes from sleep kit.
* Can use them to roll/squash the air out of clothes/bedding to take up less space.
* If you need to remove things from the pack to look for items lower down they'll stay dry in their separate bags.
It's nice if I'm biking home with the pack on and it starts raining, but I don't bother if it's going to be a short light rain.
I recommend a pack liner made of a more durable plastic, as they have a couple of advantages in emergency situations.
1) They can retain air and thus keep you buoyant if you come to grief crossing a river. 2) Assuming you're using a large pack for multi-day trips, you can use a pack liner (and in my country they're designed for this) as emergency shelter if you don't have a bivvy bag or tent.
It's a classic ultralight hiker move [0] and is commonly the first suggestion in gear shakedowns on /r/ultralight.
[0] https://sectionhiker.com/how-to-keep-your-backpacking-gear-d...
That said, I'm guessing mostly it looks good to people who don't know better.
I am whats called a "Bikepacker", and I've made a lot of my own gear. I ride my bike (a LWB recumbent) instead of hiking; but still do the camping part like backpackers do (with the added nerd-points of using a hammock).
If you are interested in the do-it-yourself side of these hobbies I can't recommend ripstopbytheroll.com enough. There is a lot of great guides, the prices are great; and I even met the guy once (before he started the website) at a hammock get-together.
Uh how do those work?
At the time I was a member of hammockforums.net
It's a forum dedicated to hammocks, hammock camping, associated equipment, and discussions that usually relate to hammocks. There have been several "group camping" gatherings (pre-covid) in various parts of the world. At the gatherings that I attended there was 50-75 individuals all sleeping in hammocks. It was over a weekend in Indiana.
The hammock community has a lot of cottage industry involvement, and a very large portion of the group actively contributes to ideas much like the OSS community does. There was a lot community spirit. Several people (and companies) brought equipment/gear/stuff to give-away. I as one of the few Canadians to show up brought Canadian beer, chocolates, and snacks. I won an under-quilt, some hiking chop-sticks (they screw together and have a belt-attachment), and a few other things all at no cost to me ($400+ worth of gear).
So there we were 50+ hammocks all hung in the surrounding forest enjoying fellowship.
We need a different category than synthetic fibers in English terminology for these altered fibers.
I've been pretty pleased with my Peak Design gear these last few years, I've yet to find a brand that makes bags that feel as well-built. They're not cheap though.
A year isn’t that much I guess, but I’m always blown away by how durable it has been. It really does look a lot like the day I got it.
Apart from being durable I love the way it looks and the overall utility is hard to beat too. While it isn’t cheap, I can’t see myself needing more from a bag or breaking this one soon enough for the cost per year to seem high relative to other bags I’ve had.
Also worth mentioning is that their customer support is second to none.
I’m just a customer for what it’s worth, not getting paid to say anything about them.
The fabric backing on bottom parts of the padding at the back of the pack has started to wear through though. I guess this is where it rubs most on my back, and I was walking maybe 5km a day with it daily for a few years.
Still, very happy with it.
Do you know if the bag has changed much since the kickstarter? I wonder if they’ve addressed potential wear like you’ve experienced.
Regardless, 5 years is not bad for a heavily used bag!
If you really want to make the most of fast fashion etc. the best thing to do would be to immediately stitch in some reinforcement when you get it home. Of course, I never actually do this. The higher price items deserve their cost.
$300 is a doozy, but the quality is noticeable, and it was one of the few backpacks I saw that unzips into one big compartment which is what I want when I'm packing a bunch of clothes.
Too many backpacks seems to maximize compartment count where I don't really understand the utility and it limits what I can stuff in there. My girlfriend's Osprey pack has the same volume but is split into four compartments that can barely fit a pair of jeans.
And it also looks modest but cool. Most packs in the space make you look like you're about to go camping, there's enough of that.
Comes in many grades down to near tissue paper thin which is great for small stuff sacks. Obviously, while impressively strong, the thin grades are weaker than the thicker ones, but still amazing.
It doesn't like abrasion, so don't drag it across rocks, easy enough; just set your bag down instead of throwing and dragging it. "Well there are situations when you need to…" just avoid getting into those situations.
I found my mini first aid kit bag is wearing thin (it's made of the tissue paper thin white color) so for my next mini first aid kit bag I'll go up one level.
Don't use it for something where lack of breathability would cause problems… it's pretty impervious to moisture.
For the thinner grades, the thread holes can be a weak spot. Thin bags need to be handled a bit more gently. Thicker grades are brutishly strong.
The internal coating is failing in spots. But the worst damage was to the foam padding in the back. Gone. Turned to dust.
Unfortunately, because I bought the bag from the outlet, it’s not eligible for warranty repair.
I bought a motorcycle last year to take on trips. Not sure what luggage system I want to use, so I turned to the ol North Face and I took a razor to the backing, removed the padding materials, shoulder straps and hip belt.
Now it’s improvised moto luggage for clothes, tent, sleeping pad, tent pole.
Let’s see how google images hosts for HN:
Would love if there were additional info on pricing (per pound, per metric), any sustainability issues (see Dark Waters for teflon [1]), and lastly ownership (are these patent protected, largest manufacthrers)
For a while now now I’ve just had to have multiple backpacks and rotate through them when one becomes too fragrant.
If anyone has some guidance on how to get human ecology bacteria (i.e. that funky stank) out of synthetic materials that doesn’t result in smelling even worse of the cleaning agent, I’d love to hear it.
I haven’t used it myself but a friend swears by it.
But bags are like old friends. They all have personalities and are unique in their own way. I have an old Chrome messenger bag from college that’s 20 years old. It’s still going strong but I have a different bag now (still a Chrome though) which has an integrated laptop compartment. The bag is still going strong today and whenever I take it out to use it’s like talking to an old friend and retelling stories of the past.
[0]https://www.hyperlitemountaingear.com/collections/packs/prod...
Dyneema bags are light, strong (i.e., hold a heavy load), flexible, can have good water resistance and attractive colors—and will wear a hole through in one drag through an airport.
Good for taking on holiday when you don't want to store a suitcase till the end of time! :D
What's an IKEA bag made from out of interest?
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/41222966/medium-authenti...
http://www.extremtextil.de/naehprojekte/kunden-galerie.html
some of them are quite impressive