“How I Survived a Chinese ‘Reeducation’ Camp” by Gulbahar Haitiwaji | Hacker News Reader

“How I Survived a Chinese ‘Reeducation’ Camp” by Gulbahar Haitiwaji

thetimes.co.uk

166 pointsjseliger37 comments

> 'Born in 1966 in Ghulja in the Xinjiang region, Gulbahar Haitiwaji was an executive in the Chinese oil industry before leaving for France in 2006 with her husband and children, who obtained the status of political refugees. In 2017 she was summoned in China for an administrative issue. Once there, she was arrested and spent more than two years in a re-education camp. Thanks to the efforts of her family and the French foreign ministry she was freed and was able to return to France where she currently resides.'

This is not 'long long time ago', this is 'yesterday'.

This is shocking to me. Somehow I have heard nothing about this until this article linked in HN. It’s not for complete lack of media attention, when I search for this specifically, I find a lot of related articles.

I’ve read it before, for whatever that’s worth.

https://archive.fo/1la1W

Wtf? As someone who once held refugee status under the Geneva Convention, my only remark is: you don't go back to discuss your pension. If you do, you're stupid.

China is a master of manipulation. They know weakness of people, money, fame, etc. You wouldn’t believe how many people are lured to dig their own graves this way.

In an article in The Guardian (linked in this comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30238350) she explains the nuances of her decision. She already had a resident's permit, renewable every 10 years. She knew she would be questioned, and was even reassured about this by her husband.

Essentially, she still had roots in Xinjiang, and Chinese nationality.

Didn't Saudi Arabia use a similar trick with Jamal Khashoggi?

It was some paperwork for his marriage to his fiancée, yep. But it's even worse because it was just an embassy, he didn't go back to the country, and even though a Chinese "reeducation" camp doesn't sound a fun experience, it's still probably better than getting chopped up.

>it's still probably better than getting chopped up.

It also seems much better than how Iraqi 'extremists' and civilians were treated in Abu Ghraib.

The suspicious shift of the US/UK to all of a sudden 'caring' deeply about specific groups of Muslims may give some objective observers whiplash.

Better to be tortured in a democracy than in an autoritarian state.

"BEN: Now, take my case. They hung me up here five years ago. Every night, they take me down for twenty minutes, then they hang me up again, which I regard as very fair, in view of what I done, and, if nothing else, it's taught me to respect the Romans, and it's taught me... that you'll never get anywhere in this life, unless you're prepared to do a fair day's work for a fair day's pay!

BRIAN: Oh, shut up! "

The difference is, the torture in Abu Ghraib was actually proven to have taken place. My understanding is no proof of torture in Xinjiang exists, only defense industry funded allegations.

What a picture of thin-skinned biopower, of a state utterly unwilling to accept anything but it's own hardliner mode. Xenophobic, extremist, & totalitarian.

You could paste this statement under a headline about the US and be just as correct.

I challenge you to do the following:

1. Go the the United States and publicly speak out against the government and call the president an old geezer who couldn't find a funding bill if they duct taped it to his forehead. Then spend time protesting and handing out pamphlets about imperialist policies, war crimes in Afghanistan, and racism against black Americans.

2. Go to China and publicly call Xi Jinping a Winnie the Pooh looking war criminal and start protesting and handing out pamphlets about free tibet, Tiananmen Square, genocide of muslims, and racism against non-Chinese.

You will quickly see which country more closely matches this statement.

The Guardian published a preview of the book here:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/12/uighur-xinjian...

This book is an English translation of Gulbahar Haitiwaji's French book, Rescapée du Goulag Chinois.

Don't forget the rapes! Systematic, state-sanctioned RAPE.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55794071

There's a hidden half of human history that no one wants to talk about: Our Bodies, Their Battlefields, by Christina Lamb (https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Our-Bodies-Their-Batt...)

One blatantly pro-Beijing journalist who writes for the HK-based South China Morning Post made an interesting point in an article [1] the other day: that the West is either an accomplice of the Uyghur genocide, by calling it a genocide but not doing shit about it, or it's not really genocide, so it's Western propaganda and lies.

So we're either cowards or liars. This point stuck with me. Based on these stories coming out all the time: we're the former.

[1] https://www.scmp.com/comment/opinion/article/3164071/human-r...

What do you suggest the west should do?

War is clearly not an option given China's thin-skinned nature, inexperienced military (yearning for battle as we can see in the border with India) and firebrand government. I think really biting, heavy sanctions that cover more than a dozen assholes in Xinjiang who probably don't even have bank accounts would be a good start. But what do I know, I just feel terrible that these things are happening and the UN seems impotent to do anything about it.

China has veto power in the UN, it's not like they wouldn't veto anything against them ( like the US and Russia do).

Calling China’s military inexperienced seems extremely ignorant to me. Against what yardstick are you measuring their military experience?

Calling me "extremely ignorant" for pointing a very well-known fact that experts inside and outside of China agree upon sounds like you're taking this personally, or maybe you are a Chinese nationalist. In any case, enjoy some assessments by people qualified to speak about the Chinese military's inexperience, haven't seen combat since the 1979. It includes opinions by retired Chinese generals, in case you think you know more than them.

A direct quote:

"I am retiring soon. My one big regret is that I never had a chance to fight in a war," Gen. He said, according to Aaron Connelly, director of the Southeast Asia Project at the Lowy Institute.

Though it's strange to regret peace, He correctly identified what the Academy of Military Science of the Chinese People’s Liberation Army previously told Business Insider was the Chinese military's biggest weakness: inexperience."

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/military/article/3111922/chi...

https://www.rand.org/blog/2018/11/chinas-military-has-no-com...

https://www.businessinsider.com/retiring-chinese-general-rev...

>What can the West do?

Gain the moral authority necessary to actually apply pressure to China - by prosecuting our own war criminals and crimes against humanity.

Until we do that, there is nothing we can do except create more atrocity. We are certainly not prepared to do whats necessary for as long as the criminals responsible for the destruction of Mosul and Raqqa are free to spout their nonsense to the world ..

Divest, we can pay more to make it here. because we are not fat lazy or lacks.

What happened in 1930s? People don’t want wars and delay the inevitable until wars came to them and they can’t escape anymore

I think we should have boycotted the olympics. I'm sure Beijing would have thrown their toys out of the pram and launched economic sanctions against everyone but you know - genocide bad and that.

Article conveniently leaves out PRC allegation - Haitiwaji and husband was involved in US funded World Uyghur Congress and participated in secessionist activities in XJ, including Urumqi riots. Of course article also conveniently uses photo of prisoner transfer that has nothing to do with XJ securitization. After 5 years, the exaggerated atrocity porn tier western narrative is still built on by unreliable actors selling books or shilling for citizenship, without any damning evidence, and of course conveniently timed.

Just read another thread "my seatbelt rule for judgement" https://www.dannyguo.com/blog/my-seatbelt-rule-for-judgment/ ,I can't agree more.

Before you make any judgement about anything, you need to learn about it. In this case, go visit Xinjiang, talk with natives, see with your own eyes, and then you know who's telling lies.

Try flying into China and going to Xinjiang to "talk with the natives" to see what will happen to you.

Edit: language.

Have you done that? How are you so certain?

I live in China.

So what happened when you went to Xinjiang?

Did you see the moon landing? Personal pic or it didnt happen

You get a sanitized tour and multiple (daily) police checks, including police visiting your hotel at 11pm to check your visa number, and many, many areas are off-limits to visitors. There is no "talking with natives" as the natives are scared to talk to any Han or foreign tourists. And if you are seen filming or trying to interview or make a Youtube video where you talk to people, you WILL get arrested.

When the truth comes to light what will you say? Nothing ... you voice is only to provide this temporary stay of injustice.

You take some of blood and place a drop on your hands.

Just happen to read another thread "my seatbelt rule for judgement" https://www.dannyguo.com/blog/my-seatbelt-rule-for-judgment/ ,I can't agree more.

Before you make any judgement about anything, you need to learn about it. In this case, go visit Xinjiang, talk with natives, see with your own eyes, and then you know who's telling lies.

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