Ask HN: How do you deal with getting old and feeling lost? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: How do you deal with getting old and feeling lost?

1,094 pointstrendingwaifu849 comments

I am turning 35 years soon and I feel like I haven't achieved much, both personally and professionally. I have held jobs in small and big companies for mostly for 1-2 years each, traveled and lived in different countries, had 2 failed startups, and have about $500k in savings. I am single and haven't had a serious relationship for many years now.

As time went on, I started feeling less excited about everything, personal or work related. I used to be excited about new technologies, but not these days. I feel like I've seen most things before, and it's all just different iterations of the same. I increasingly wish I could go back to my 20s. Now I feel too old to go to festivals, bars and clubs and make new friends that way.

This has been a recent change for me. When I was ~30 I still considered myself young and able to do anything I could do when I was in my 20s. But not anymore now. I feel like my time for everything is running out. Have you been through a similar thing? How did you deal with it?

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This is almost exactly my life, shifted by a decade.

The problem is that by 35 you can't get by on novelty anymore because you've seen some version of everything there is to see.

The worst thing you can do is pine for the good old days. They aren't coming back. And they weren't that good anyway. Your best times are ahead if you can successfully adjust.

What worked for me was putting down roots. I resisted it mightily at first because I wanted to stay mentally 25 forever. Now I see that getting married and having a couple of kids was the right thing to do. It forced me to become more flexible, more deliberate, more focused and have more stamina to do hard things

I'm a loner by nature, so I can't imagine where I'd be if I hadn't settled down. I just know it wouldn't be as good.

Once you've got those roots down, life will lead you to what you should do next. Maybe being a full time parent, maybe learning to sail, maybe more successful entrepreneurship. Who knows...

EDIT: I don't mean to imply that everyone needs a family. What's important is to start living for others to some degree. Hedonism has famously bad diminishing returns.

Some people choose to do lots of volunteering or switch careers to social work. There's lots of options.

I second this one

The big difference is that settling down gives you things to care about deeply. Your family, the community your kids will grow up in, the experiences and skills you want your kids to grow up with.

Absent that, my life was one long drawn-out example of “fear of missing out” and I flitted from thing to thing, place to place.

Just make sure you marry above your station, emotionally.

> Just make sure you marry above your station, emotionally.

This is one of the most pithy bits of marital advice I’ve ever read, but easier said than done! Emotional maturity seems to exhibit a very pronounced Dunning-Kruger effect. Also, people continue to mature emotionally in adulthood and this can occur at very different rates.

Just as a vivid example, recovery from addiction/alcoholism can often create rapid changes in emotional maturity.

i second the recovery from addiction as a catalyst for growth in emotional maturity.

This sounds like incredible advice, if you can it would be wonderful to learn more of your thinking about marrying above your station, emotionally?

It’s sort of a know-it-when-you-see-it thing.

On an early date with my now wife she spent an entire subway ride to Queens telling me about Montessori education methods and how it made her the person she is. I recounted that when I was in first grade I was punished for interrupting the class by having a cardboard box put over by desk, so nobody could see me, and that that made me the person I am.

So two passing tests in one convo: she was impressively interested in things that matter (I was already infatuated with her) and she was not put off by my bullshit.

you do know it when you see it, but boy does it almost always look like this....

You won’t know, they age like a fine wine - haven’t you heard? You will see very different facets of their personality- before you’re married, after you’re married, after you’ve had kids, after she stops being able to have kids, after the kids have gone off to college.. they are all the same person underneath it all, but you won’t know, you can’t.

>problem is that by 35 you can't get by on novelty anymore because you've seen some version of everything there is to see

I'm 68 and this is self-limiting B.S.

In the last few years I have seen many things I never saw before, and never imagined.

Ironically, when I was about 30, I was in a similar position and complained to my dad that there was nothing new under the sun, everything is just a rehash of what has come before.

He laughed at me, and threw me out of the house.

You don’t feel the amount of new things you see slows down considerably as you grow older?

It’s not that you can’t find novel things any more if you go looking for them, but most everyday things hold no more (or less) excitement.

I notice this especially much with my 3 year old son, for whom everything is fascinating. He’ll find out that sticking a bowl upside down in the water and turning it face up will make a lot of bubbles and he’s tremendously excited. I’m excited to see him being excited (which is novel’ish), but the fact that bubbles appear is incredibly mundane now.

> You don’t feel the amount of new things you see slows down considerably as you grow older?

Only if you stop exploring. When you think there's nothing new left to learn, nothing novel to experience, well, you stop looking. Start looking again.

> I notice this especially much with my 3 year old son, for whom everything is fascinating.

Spending time with kids is the best way there is to rediscover your sense of wonder.

Just one example: All my life I have been curious about human pre-history and ancient history. Never learned much about it along the way.

Now that I have time, I find an incredible wealth of knowledge and insight about early human history has been developed. I feel like a dim area of my understanding is being illuminated, like exploring a dark attic with a bright flashlight, it is very satisfying, and particularly when pieces fall into place and I have an "aha! so that is what that was all about" moment, it is exciting as well.

I'd add that it's about detail - if you thin slice reality for efficiency, reality becomes more simplistic. But you can also discover infinitely more detail. walking into a library reveals that there is an infinite amount of things to know, and there are all kinds of differences between two similar glasses of wine etc. Perhaps its more about the spare energy of the individual available for learning and discovery

Exactly. The way I think about it is that anything is interesting if studied in enough detail.

A single square inch of lawn could provide material for multiple PhDs.

Indeed. Just studying your last sentence could provide inspiration of finding funny alternative sayings to 'get off my lawn'.

Added as Learc's Lamentation to https://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup

I'm into my sixth decade, and I will agree with you that it's about detail. I find more and more rabbit holes to go down that are just fascinating. I make ice cream, but how can I make really good ice cream? What are the pros and cons of regular switches vs. leaf switches for the retro arcade controller I want to build? Why does putting a bunch of wood mulch around my fruit trees do so much to improve the soil ecology? The list goes on. I am never bored.

I think many people take the availability of information we have at our fingertips today for granted. It wasn't always this way. Dig into it, learn something, rinse and repeat.

You don’t feel the amount of new things you see slows down considerably as you grow older?

Not OP but I don’t feel this way at all.

My oldest son is starting college next year. That alone has been a learning experience! I coach his robotics team, that has been tremendously new experiences.

I’ve gotten three cloud certifications in the past year. I have a huge list of things I want to learn about - assembly language on Linux, FPGAs and about 20 other things.

I could spend 10,000 lifetimes and not scratch the surface of what this world has to offer.

I don't see how this is an adequate counterexample to OP's experience. The novel things you mention have happened to you take are rarer occurrences than a 3 year old experiencing basic physics.

Despite the pleas in responses to continue to explore and experience new things, it seems to me that the experience of being surprised at new things becomes rarer as one ages, with exploration yielding diminishing returns with respect solely to that experience.

I think maybe it’s easier to get stuck in a rut, go on autopilot, rely on what you know and then end up feeling like there’s no novelty in the world any more as you get older and comfortable.

Maybe you can fall so deeply into it that you can’t even tell you’re in a rut any more and just think that that’s how the world is, which is a puzzling perspective to those outside of the rut because the complexity and novelty of the world really is literally everywhere.

Not that endless novelty seeking is the be all end all, but it’s there if you want it.

For me I have found that traveling helps break that "tunnel vision" which I occasionally find myself stuck in. And it's very hard to realize you're stuck in it until you break out of it. Traveling helps me realize that there's an entire world out there where people are not just living, but thriving. That always helps stir up my curiosity to dig deeper into things.

The novel things you mention have happened to you take are rarer occurrences than a 3 year old experiencing basic physics.

I can use the same example though! Seeing each of my children born left an immense imprint on me. Seeing them experience basic physics for the first time was as novel of an experience for me as experiencing it myself many years earlier.

There are infinite novel experiences awaiting you if you want to seek them.

> You don’t feel the amount of new things you see slows down considerably as you grow older?

At 44 I have the opposite problem. The more I learn, the more I realize I don't know. When I was younger I had the ego of a young person and thought I was always on the cusp of knowing it all. As I got older I realized I was simply unaware. It's a bit cliché, but I started approaching everything, even things I 'knew' with a beginners mindset.

One of activities that really helped trigger this shift was finding something brand new to me at ~40 that I also became passionate about. In my case it was jiu-jitsu, but it can be anything where you're drinking from the firehose again. That mindset spread through everything else in my life.

> The more I learn, the more I realize I don't know. When I was younger I had the ego of a young person and thought I was always on the cusp of knowing it all. As I got older I realized I was simply unaware.

This rings truer to me than anything else posted here. I feel exactly the same way right now, (in my late thirties) as if I suddenly realize I spent my life going deep rather than broad and that there’s a whole world of opportunities out there to be a beginner again, with the same enthusiasm as a much younger person (but now with resources!). The struggle of trying new things has completely changed my outlook.

My advice: try things you thought looked interesting but never thought you’d be good at.

It's easy to see familiar patterns even in "new" things, though: especially those things that typically bind social networks (primarily shared recreational experiences). There are only so many story tropes to fill books and movies with, shared exercise experiences all blend, card games, board games, etc.--you name it, and odds are that the chance one has "seen it before" increases with age.

So while something can be new, as one ages even "new" things have elements that are immediately obviously the same as one's past experiences. The older one is, the more of these elements there are. There's a diminishing return, so to speak, in experiencing new things.

Exactly this. Many others are confusing novelty with pursuing specific knowledge or activities.

If you can build a life around mastering Jiu-Jitsu or learning machining techniques, more power to you.

I think that you are describing the coming of Wisdom... Seeing how things in many different domains fit the same patterns. This does not have to be a negative thing. If you see something new that fits a known pattern, then look closer and see how it's different or how it modifies the pattern to fit it's unique state.

An ego of a person on the cusp of knowing it all, what a perfect description. I spent a lot of time living like this. I'm going to borrow your page on beginners mindset, living that way brings so much new life to each day.

I guess I realize that, and then when I consider how much time I spent getting where I am at one topic, it never really seems like it’ll be possible doing it for another.

Same age, similar insights and personal development path (except in my case it's woodworking rather than jiu-jitsu). If I could have one personal "do over", it's wishing that I could have spent my 20s and early 30s a lot more humble. I was really unaware how much I didn't know.

54, this is my life.

There is so much out there to know and experience and it makes me sad to realise that there is no way that I'm going to be able to do everything.

I've a history of every couple of years diving deep into an interest. Woodwork was a thing for a few years, then wood turning. Gardening has come and gone a few times.

We spend a lot of time travelling and seeing new areas, slowly in a caravan, we never get to see it all.

Recently I've started running a Dungeons and Dragons game for a couple of my kids and their friends, there can be a lot more depth to that than you may think.

I've got to agree with you that you start to see a lot more things that you are familiar with. This is not really surprising if you are staying in the same environment.

Cycles of initiatives at work seem to come back every 5 or 6 years and they always ignore the same problems... sigh. There is truth in the idea that history repeats and the more things change the more they stay the same.

My suggestion for dealing with the feeling that nothing is new is much the same as everybody. If your world is getting boring and feels like everything is just on repeat, just change your world. Even if that means you are stepping into the unknown or you are taking risks, you are still going to change your experience.

> At 44 I have the opposite problem. The more I learn, the more I realize I don't know.

I'm 47 and in the same place. I have only recently come to grips with the fact that I am a good programmer and I do know what I'm talking about, but there's also so much that I still don't know. I keep learning, but you've got to pick your focus, because you can't possibly learn everything.

> You don’t feel the amount of new things you see slows down considerably as you grow older?

I don't feel that at all.

I've always felt there was a lot to know. I don't think I ever felt the "ego on the cusp of knowing everything" when I was younger, because I knew I hadn't studied most fields and that there was much more I didn't know about. But I did feel like I was getting that way within a few narrow technical fields.

But as I get older the awareness that there's so much still to see, learn and do in just about every area, including those where I'd become something of an expert, just grows and grows, and it is depressing.

As time passes I feel more and more the limited bandwidth of my capabilities, and that nothing I can do begins to scratch the surface of what there is. Some people seem to find a joy in learning. I enjoy it, indeed I can't help it, but I feel so small and my future life feels so short, it gets me down.

Most things I take an interest in, it feels like it will take 300 years to get to grips with them. If anything, I feel an almighty rush to see what tiny part of what there is I can see, be around, and even better, understand and work with, while it's still possible.

So much to see, so little time.

I'm 64 and retired last year. I spent 4 decades programming, and everything changes all the time, and I always learned new things. I am still learning new things, and still writing code to support my generative art. Admittedly I was finally burned out of the grind of working as a programmer, but it took a whole lifetime. But to truly approach new things you have to be willing to let go of the old, even programming if necessary, but without forgetting what you learned. A lifetime is a long time; you really don't need to just do one thing the whole time.

A quote from a novel has always been an inspiration since I read it in high school - "An artist must leave a body of work" from The Agony And The Ecstasy, about Michelangelo. If your programming no longer excites you, learn something new in programming, or even learn something that isn't programming and do that. It's not easy, and might cost you money, but wasting your life doing something you no longer care about is not worth it.

Of course some people can deal with a terrible job, and just spend the non-working time doing what they love, and that's OK if you can deal with it. I could never do that; I didn't turn to art until the last few years.

> If your programming no longer excites you, learn something new in programming, or even learn something that isn't programming and do that.

This is the key right here. If what you used to do is no longer exciting you, it is time to try something else. This often means getting out of your comfort zone, and there is no guarantee that the new thing you try will excite you. But if that happens, at least you tried. Every discovery of something that doesn't interest you is a step closer to something that does.

I'm just over 50 and I'm finding it harder to stay in programming.

Most companies want to push me upward into management (which I don't want to do) - and I feel like I'm aging out of eligibility for most development jobs.

How did you manage to stick with it? I still love it.

56 and still technical here.

Learn, learn, learn. Find the new hotness (at least one that has staying power).

For me, kubernetes is the latest 'big hill'. It seems to have legs for years ahead, and plenty of technical details that prevent anyone from completely mastering it.

> Learn, learn, learn. Find the new hotness

58 in a few weeks, and seriously considering going the other way: To jump off the treadmill of new fads and concentrate on / return to basics.

"Big Data!" "Data Lake!" Data Vault!" "Apache Spark!" "Kafka!" "Cloud this!" "Cloud that!" "Cloud the other!""Snowflake!" "R!" "Python!" "Pandas!" "This new ETL tool!" "That new ETL process!" "This other new ETL tool!" "That other new ETL process!"...

Sigh.

SQL and bash ain't going anywhere, and they're all you really need for ETL.

I'm thinking of really learning the old cool in stead.

Yes, that's a valid path, too.

When I was just starting out (circa 1990) a good friend of mine had a pal that was making his living servicing punch card machines.

They were completely unsupported by IBM at the time, this guy had been an IBM tech and saw the opening. He embraced the old tech, knowing there were people still using it and willing to pay for some form of support.

So I don't disagree with that idea, it's definitely workable.

SQL isn't quite comparable today to punchcards in 1990, is it?

Depends on who you would ask.

Anecdata: was asked by a client why the same query was running orders slower on our infrastructure (IaaS on Xeons) than on their test server (a regular desktop with i7). I check the load, IO, yada-yada and I don't see anything what could indicate the slowness. After a bit I check the db size and ... I'm pretty speechless, because it is 77MBs. 77 megabytes and the query runs for tens of seconds. I tell the client to give me the query. They are happily oblige and provide a two FullHD screens of SQL with like... 20? More? 'SELECT *' from the same tables on and on.

After speaking nicely with the client about the origins of this query and checking their dev environment, I learned:

1. this query was autogenerated by Lavarel

2. their dev environment is 100 times smaller than the prod

3. until I forced them to copy prod data to dev they didn't believe the problem was with the query

4. between two programmers and one sysadmin on the client side NOBODY was even close to reasons of slowness.

So... for some people SQL in 2022 is pretty equal to punchcards.

My first dev job about 15 years ago I took over this in-house developed intranet. Some queries took quite long (30 to 60 seconds), and according to "the last guy" there wasn't any way to speed it up. At the time I didn't know anything about SQL (literally never used it before), but I figured there really had to be some way to do this faster. I just read some basic documentation, rewrote a few queries, and now I got the exact same results in 1 to 2 seconds. A few months later after I learned a bit more about SQL and optimized it further (just by adding an index IIRC) and now it was fast enough to appear instantaneous.

I'm still far from an SQL expert, and certainly wasn't 15 years ago, but you can get a lot of win by just spending as little as one or two days learning about SQL. It really surprises me how some people don't.

Then again, for a very long time I thought awk was basically useless to learn, until I did last year after which I kicked myself for not learning it sooner as I had spent a ridiculous amount of time cooking up inferior solutions for ~20 years, and spending just an hour or two learning awk would have been a great ROI *shrug*.

I guess the moral of the story is that you can never be quite sure if something is useful or useless until you actually learn it.

With the rise of ORMS, I'm coming across more and more devs in my work that have no idea how to write performant SQL, and don't ever check to see what gets generated and run "behind the scenes"

Pandas is a pretty fantastic tool for ETL.

Only if you've never used dplyr ;)

Awesome, thank you so much for the suggestion. That is one of the reasons why I am active on here.

I was being a little snarky. Dplyr is phenomenal but it's written in R which many people perceive to be a weird language.

64 and still crafting in C and assembly. Occasionally doing hardware design/specification work. I studiously avoided the management path my forty year career. The constant technology change is what has held my interest. A career in telecom: Metallic access -> DS0/DS1 -> SONET -> 56K/DSL -> MPLS -> ROADM -> OFDMA/LTE -> WiFi/BT/Lora/Zigbee. Never look back. I cannot even imagine the page count of standards documents, requirements, and manufacturers user and programmers guides I have read in the last forty years.

Had to come back and add. I am doing a lot more embedded python utilities in the last three years, but it is all interfacing to C based firmware on raw silicon underneath.

I have found python to be a lot of fun.

spent 4 decades programming, and everything changes all the time

A half-aged kid here. This is the source of my anxiety, that all I’ve done and learned will age, slip through fingers and become forgotten. I wish our craft could stabilize on something, but it just doesn’t.

It does if you specialize in something that barely moves (AS/400, COBOL, others), but the experience of that career is almost the exact opposite of why many people get in to programming (lots of paperwork, consensus-based decisions, lots of waiting around trying to look busy, little new growth or exploration).

However, there is some light at the end of the “everything changes” tunnel: as you learn different frameworks and languages you’re gaining new perspectives on the deeper concepts, and for the most part those deeper concepts don’t change. In OOP the “gang of four” is practically as relevant now as it was then, for example.

Technology is rapidly improving, developers like us have this cycle of never ending learning new tech stack to keep up with the times.

Change is the only constant, I guess. This has always been part of anything computer-related. My dad started his career with punch cards, ended doing Java. You keep learning. But you've got to do that to some extent in every career.

If anything, things are stabilizing now more than ever before. Java and Javascript are almost 30 years old, and still as relevant as ever. Computers have been "fast enough" for most purposes and aren't obsolete the moment you've bought them, like they were in the early 1990s. The x86 architecture is surprisingly still with us. And despite all the new languages and frameworks, there's still tons of stuff being done in all of the old ones. They don't get obsolete as fast as they used to.

You can never do everything. Pick what you love, and focus on that.

[ A quote from a novel has always been an inspiration since I read it in high school - "An artist must leave a body of work" from The Agony And The Ecstasy, about Michelangelo. If your programming no longer excites you, learn something new in programming, or even learn something that isn't programming and do that. It's not easy, and might cost you money, but wasting your life doing something you no longer care about is not worth it.

-What about economics, a management role or something else? my advice: Have the habbit to improve your habbits (including your thinking) the medicine = reading btw

]

I agree, a curious mind never runs out of interesting things to see or do. How do we help the original poster becoming more curious and motivated?

When you're burned out, it's hard to simply be curious. And burnout is demotivating.

You don't need to _have_ a family. But it helps to find one.

Can you add a bit more about how this works?

(wishy-washy, unverifiable emotional pseudo-psychology follows)

What I mean is -- you do not need to have a partner and your own kids. There are all sorts of families (macro and micro) out there that can benefit from us.

On the micro side: you can allow yourself to be included in your best friend's family, you can allow friends to become close enough that you know they'd be there if you were sick and vice versa. You can think about lonely older people who you feel kinship for and be brave enough to offer them support. You can sometimes convert former romantic relationships into trusted friendships, and you can widen your romantic ideals to include joining a single-parent family that already exists.

One step up: you can treat your wider friendship circle like a family, believe in them like you would your family.

On the macro side of things: you can join a community and allow yourself to be absorbed into it as someone of significance; you can help people find their people. Introduce people to other people; be the reason other people have people.

All of these things require a kind of bravery that deserts most of us at some time, and obviously a kind of comfort with other people that not all of us find easy at all, but really any step you make to try to build a "family" is better than no step.

When you're young you don't need it and you forget to look for it, because new experiences outweigh family ties. When you're old you need it and it is harder to find.

When you're 35... this is the time to enjoy the thrill of being brave and seeking real connections with a mature mind, and allow yourself to think of it as building family and significance into your life.

I managed some of this -- a real social life, real connections -- for a long time from the age of 33[0], and then the pandemic has undone a lot of that; people have scattered. And if all of the above sounds preachy and patronising it is because it's really all I think about again -- how do I get that back, at the age I am now?

[0] "Lord, to be 33 forever"

This is a beautiful answer, thank you. It puts into words so much of what I’ve had at the back of my mind for awhile now.

Thank you. It sort of spilled out a bit, and I think it's more a message to myself than I realised; it is time to pay more attention to this again.

I started surfing with 40. And then I found out plenty of people do it, now I am starting with rock climbing.

Plenty of things to see and do after 35. New friends, new activities, new music to listen, new places to go. Don't self limit yourself.

Yep, concur with this - having children and a family gave me a sense of fulfillment and purpose that has never really diminished. Won’t say every day is amazing or life is any less difficult. However, there is definitely something to be said for living your life for others instead of your own enjoyment.

I felt exactly the same as OP described. Once I became a dad (not that long ago), I felt that a missing piece of a puzzle finally fell in its place.

This thread suggests that becoming a dad is not unlikely to throw you into a 2-year deep depression: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30240609

"Even with this realization, there were lots of times where I sat on the couch the first year and just felt like I was drowning and life was over. That happened in the second year as well, but less after the child was 18 months. And by ~2.5, it's a lot better!"

That's hardly a good outcome for anyone, let alone someone who misses the joy of life they had in their 20s.

I wouldn’t call 2.5 years the “outcome”. You have kids with a much deeper horizon in mind.

> I'm a loner by nature, so I can't imagine where I'd be if I hadn't settled down. I just know it wouldn't be as good.

I'm the same way, and spent many years of my twenties living a very lonely existence. Getting a family was the best decision I ever made. I'm absolutely certain I'd be in a miserable place otherwise.

If you’re out of novelty in the world by 35 I think that’s more on you than the world. There’s really so much out there - complexity in every direction and at every focal length. If you want to center your life around novelty-seeking you can do it until well past the point where your body will fail you. Travel and education are good ways to find new horizons, but they are everywhere around you all the time. Seriously.

> If you’re out of novelty in the world by 35 I think that’s more on you than the world

It's a good thing I didn't say that then. I said you experience diminishing returns due to having already experienced similar (but not the same!) things. The more you experience, the more you recognize what you've already experienced in new experiences. This seems like a totally unavoidable consequence of living for anyone that doesn't have a long term memory disorder or an interdimensional portal gun.

Even getting diminishing returns on all the variety and everything in the world in your 30s to me seems crazy, but to each his or her own. I am in my 40s and don’t feel like my world is trending towards indistinguishable gray mush at all.

You don’t have to take my word for it though, there are lots of older people who still find and get by on novelty in the world, are inspired by it, and don’t feel that everything is a rehash. There are some even replying in this thread, and more you can meet in your own neighbourhood I’m sure. Let them be an inspiration that it doesn’t have to end up that way.

> The problem is that by 35 you can't get by on novelty anymore because you've seen some version of everything there is to see.

This could not possibly be true. You have only just begun. The mere thimble full fo knowledge and experience that you have accumulated thus far is nothing compared to what lies ahead. But only you can make it happen. Make a decision. Take an action. The comments here are loaded with wonderful and practical advice. Louis Pasteur: "Chance favors the prepared mind".

Also consider this (this is a quote that I cannot give attribution for): "In youth we struggle with illusion of certainty. As we grow older we struggle with the certainty of illusion." We create the worlds that we live in. It is easier to follow a path that mimics and conforms to the structure of your environment. It is much more difficult to break away and define and follow your own journey. The feedback is not avaialble so you have to rely on your own internal compass. The choice is yours.

> This could not possibly be true.

The novelty you experience when doing something new must decrease over time. To say otherwise is to say the world is infinite, which it definitely is not.

At some point the buzz one gets from the novelty of new experiences is not enough to make a satisfying life. That's when it's time to look for source of meaning for your life.

It's different for everyone. For me and the OP it happened rather quickly.

> Make a decision. Take an action

Thanks coach

The world is effectively infinite relative to your ability to experience it.

The worlds is big enough to keep finding new things! Not to mention all the new things that are constantly being invented! Recently I have been playing Flight Simulator in VR… just remembering how was to play Flight Simulator 95 back on the days to how it is now my mind is blown! Or better… with a bunch of friend we started enhancing our DnD sessions with very cool AR glasses that we got as backer of a very nice kickstart! The world is full of wonders! To find something new and amazing you have just to look for it!

> we started enhancing our DnD sessions with very cool AR glasses that we got as backer of a very nice kickstart!

Sounds really cool, what product is it?

https://www.tiltfive.com/

“Thanks coach”

The ego in this response and complete ignoring of the advice given to you is off putting.

And I’m quite younger than you ;)

> The novelty you experience when doing something new must decrease over time.

It goes up and down at different stages in your life.

When you're a child, everything is new, so nothing is. Everything that exists in your childhood is Normal. It might be completely new to your parents, but you've never known otherwise.

As you grow up, you get used to this normality, and new things are novel, but not that novel yet, because they're still close to what you know as Normal from your childhood.

As you get older, new stuff gets increasingly removed from your Normal, and you're amazed by it. At some point, you get used to that feeling of amazement. You get used to getting new stuff all the time. And sometimes it doesn't impact you as much because you're already completely invested in all the old stuff. Although still there sometimes is new stuff that you can't avoid, and it uproots everything. (Think internet banking for old people who have banked on paper for all their lives.)

And then you start to realize that all the Normal stuff from your childhood was probably also completely novel at the time.

There's no question that family is what is missing from your life. A grown man needs a family to take care of. And yes, it's a direct contradiction to what has been discussed on this very forum re:divorce. And no, I cannot suggest any magic solution to the question of finding a sane woman who you'd be madly in love with.

The good new is that 35 is far from the end for a man. I'd say you have five to ten years while you are still at the peak. Make sure to look for a woman a few years younger though.

Best part? When you have raised the your own children, grand and great-grand-children start trickling in! YAY!

I believe 35 is a tough age. You've effectively achieved Journeyman level. No, seriously, you're past the Apprentice level, and you've completed all the 300-400 level life courses. You're ready to become a Master. Unfortunately, you need to go on a journey to discover your masterwork. That may take a while. For me it took another 10 years. But trust me, you will find it, if you're willing to take a step sideways in your career a few times to try and find the problem that you seek. When you find the problem, you will recognize it for what it is: Your Masterwork ... something only you can solve. Solving it may pay off financially, with fame, or just emotionally, but either way it will pay off spiritually. You will know who you are.

Wow brilliant comment. This masterwork concept - I love it. Something only you can solve. Wow. Solving this type of problem it brings a wealth greater than any type of FAANG paycheck, win or lose.

Well said. I have been thinking like you and OP: never wanted to settled down , didn't want to be tied down to anything.

Now, I have married, and planning to get a child. I kind of gave up and let wherever life/fate lead me to.

However, I still feel lost. Just too busy with worries to think about it every hour like before. I feel terrible because I feel like I have surrendered life.

At least I don't have time to think about it as much; whether it is an improvement or not, I don't know.

I'm a month from 71 and I still get excited by stuff. Things I half expected aren't going to happen in my lifetime (fusion for example after working on JET years back) which is disappointing. And flying cars - thankfully seeing how ground based cars are handled. OTOH I came across the Internet in the early 70s and it's been amazing to watch it change. I still work in cyber security and that keeps giving challenges which I enjoy.

I've been married and been not married and had long term relationships. Built a couple of houses, moved from the UK to Australia, then across country. So much new to see there's never time to get bored. A decade ago I started to feel burn-out so I did an MSc (Mobile Biometric Authentication), worked at an ISP and learned about voice.

My current side project is a mix of NLP and semantic graphs, and I read a lot. The biggest change over the years is probably that I listen to less music now. I never really got into podcasts or audio books, but I still have 70s, 80s and 90s mixes on the server, but they're played less. Probably because I know the content too well.

I used to like music. Now I think it muddles the brain. I am 80. Brains are marvelous things but the thing I don't think can handle multiple inputs over a significant period of time. I prefer quiet when I am engaged with any project or activity except those involving the opposite sex.

35 is an interesting age, because it can cut both ways in terms of the OP's concern. Your approach is common, but I think it's not the only way.

Many people commit to being settled etc as you imply. But you don't have to! The "settled" / company-man group skews older, but it's more about attitude and priorities.

Keep a positive attitude, keep working out, don't let the way you dress etc slip, be a "bro" not a "bob" at work, go out and do fun things, and keep raging on the weekends. Don't steer conversations towards work and your kids. Get excited about things. Don't complain. Keep up personal projects and hobbies. Keep learning new skills and challenging yourself. Talk to the newer/younger people at work etc as peers, and not in a condescending/know-it-all way.

Assuming that's what you want!

I'm 58. Everything IS an different iteration of the same thing. Generally, if intelligent adults are involved, there are likely to be some useful new things in the new iteration, small improvements. On rare occasion, there are massive changes that only become apparent later. (Like when transistors first appeared, they wore out, like tubes, but slower... germanium was replaced by silicon, and lifetimes tended towards infinity, and then integrated circuit appeared)

You're not too old to have a social life... that happens once you're in a nursing home, and have worn out the good will of the staff. Up until that point, there are always new friendships and relationships to be had.

Going out to parties and drinking until morning is a lot harder on you than it was, that's a normal part of growing up. There are plenty of other things to do that are far more rewarding if you give yourself time to grow into them (and Covid rules don't prohibit them)

If you need a hobby, I suggest machining. Challenge yourself to make 1000 of some everyday hardware store item, like a 1/4" 10-24 x 2" screw, Flat head. You'll learn a lot of interesting history, and grow to appreciate the supply chain, along the way.

Note: Outside of the US, maybe some M8 Torx screws instead? You'll learn about Rotary Broaching, or cold heading, along the way.

>I suggest machining

That's a great hobby, but instead of screws i made some small steam-engines, it's not too hard and it's absolutely fascinating if they start working ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sp8FMqgc5Io

Not my content...

What if they blow into your face? :/

Then you learn about how the medical system works. Everything present a learning opportunity; it's up to you to embrace it and earn some benefit.

Just to be clear, don't embrace the steam engine.

Not while they're trying to do their job at any rate.

Why, because the engine won't reciprocate?

Epic !

At least you'll have an interesting epitaph.

"Here lies isoprophlex. An insufferable hothead, like his miniature steam engines."

Before that you should have more fear of the lathe.

Yeah and maybe buy the pressure-tank (with over-pressure valve) or just use pressured air.

And if the machine itself blows up...even more fun to repair and improve it.

You hydrostatic test them at a multiple of their working pressure.

This uses water instead of steam. If something lets go, the energy released is relatively small.

Machining is nice. I was in IT for little less than 20 years, programming and sysadmin. Then I started hand engraving and got good at it. Now I am fulltime machinist with my own company and quite a few machines. Currently I'm also in uni studying mechanical engineering. Seems like I learn new things every day - metallurgy, metrology, machining etc etc. A wondrous rabbithole of learning, it is.

I co-founded a makerspace. Maybe 70% of our membership are 30-50 y/o men that work in some form of IT (and other desk jobs).

The opportunity to make something physical brings them life. It's a real bonus if it's something they can carry around and show others. 1-2-3 blocks, welded cubes, wood lathed pen bodies, 3d printed gadgets, etc.

Bless you.

A makerspace let me use a sewing machine for a few bucks to fix a shirt. Began a multi-year foray and let me express myself more truly than my job ever could.

That's so cool that you were part of the founding team for a makerspace! I'm working on building something makerspace-y right now...If you're open to it, I'd love to ask you a couple quick questions about it. If you're busy, no worries, I 100% get it :) my email is in my bio.

Mourning the loss of one’s youth is pretty typical. You lose a step. You didn’t do what you hoped you would do. You wasted your time. So forth and so on.

Don’t worry. It gets better. This is all part of the process of life.

My recommendation is that you read Man’s Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl.

“He who has a why to live for can bear almost any how.”

I’m 52 here. I was a prolific programmer in my 20s. A go-go marketer in my 30s. For the last 10 years, I’ve run a business that I love with two partners who have taken advantage of me at every turn. The last two years neither has worked and yet they get paid.

Do I feel lost or depressed? Absolutely not.

I love life. I have an amazing family to whom I am utterly devoted. I volunteer for stuff. I do cool things every day. If I feel bored, I make things with my hands or engage in other creative pursuits. I focus on the moment and others more than anything else and all the rest just goes away.

How is this possible? I’ve filled my life with reasons to live.

In fact, I have so many now that there is no room for worry about what I have and haven’t done. And in doing so, I realize that none of that matters anyway.

My mom died at 52 after taking a header down a flight of stairs. My grandfather died at 56 after getting stabbed in the belly by my grandmother (she was psychotic).

Our naked existence is laughable. Everything can be lost in an instant.

Dive into the why and you can deal with any how.

Why do you still work with the useless partners?

Because I have a whole bunch of employees who still like to eat and a whole bunch of customers who love what we do. If I stop, all that stops too.

The state of my partnership might be crap, but the worst day I’ve ever had working for myself is still better than the best day I had working for someone else.

Would it be feasible and better to start a new business and let the customers and employees who want to migrate across?

Not unless you like lawsuits.

Precisely and when one party has a business lawyer for a sibling it gets even more expensive.

Not in this case. As Jacques notes, there’s the legal barrier but there are also a few other unique factors.

Can you buy them out?

That would be one way to kill the nuisance and find some more joy in what it looks like your self-respect forces you to do.

Alternatively, find new partners that are interested in funding the buyout. Post in Who is looking to collaborate and just mention that you are looking for deeper than normal pockets, maybe?

I went this way a couple years back, but one partner is intractable.

One yes and the other no. It’s a rather complicated, self-inflicted situation. Cleaning up the mess would definitely raise the joy factor. I’ve been working for awhile to find a mutually acceptable solution but we are at an impasse. So, I can get a bigger bite of the apple but probably never get the whole thing.

Ok, then you should offer them to buy you out at the same valuation at which you would be happy to buy them out. And if they don't want to accept that you have to walk.

Keep in mind that your loyalty to your customers and your employees can and will be used against you if you don't put your foot down and put some kind of ultimatum on the table.

Then they can choose between having money in their pocket or a large chunk of nothing at all.

Best of luck with all this!

Thanks! And yes, that's exactly what is happening.

I second the "Man’s Search for Meaning" recommendation. That book is great for putting one's struggles into perspective, and emphasizing the importance of a "why."

Agreed, great book. Meaning comes from within, it is in you to create it.

Status, material possessions, wealth, family, prestige - all of it can be taken away from you. But not meaning.

This book gets recommended a lot probably because it relates to the Holocaust, but it's worth pointing out that "Man’s Search for Meaning" describes itself as "a story". It's not a philosophical book. If you want, you can learn about the development of human thought over time. There is an entire history of philosophy.

"Siddhartha" or "The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn" might also relate to the meaning of life but they are also not philosophy books. They might be great books but you might be looking for something completely different.

If you get the full edition, there’s a complete discourse on Frankl’s method (designed for the layperson). That said, I found the actual story of his experience far more compelling and much easier to relate to… at least in a way of making any problems I might have seem meaningless by comparison.

Interestingly I found the logotherapy part of the book much more useful and compelling. Using the holocaust as an example of putting it into practice is so extreme it's unrelatable. The daily life type case studies in the second part of the book were much easier for me to learn from. Saying that, hearing a first hand account of the holocaust was powerful in its own way.

The book is a personal reflection, but it’s also a distillation of “logotherapy,” which is both a philosophy and a therapeutic technique. If the book resonates with you, then looking into a more formal application of logotherapy would be a logical next step.

I think of people with whom I have good relationships as buoys, and your description of “whys” inclined me to add them as buoys, too; bulwarks against despair and for inspiration. Thanks as well for the nudge to read Man’s Search for Meaning. Listening to Blindboy talk on his podcast about Frankl is as far as I’ve gotten.

Having a child, especially one with disabilities that require extra daily attention, provided/provides a “why” and inspired me to come up with some others. How whys of you :)

Excellent pun and glad I could be of help. I have kids too and I work with many other children I tend to think of as my kids as well. They are always a joy and a balance. Good luck to you!

What if you don’t have any “why”? How would you go about finding one?

Personally, I find it in service and hard, physical work but I think anything that breaks you out of overthinking and just doing can work. Another good book along this line is Shopclass as Soulcraft. Totally different subject but also about finding a why.

I was in similar spot with around 30. My advice:

1.) Start dating. It might be a drag and maybe embarrassing at times, but obviously not being a loser having saved up half a mil in 10 years, you will probably find someone. Don't buy into that Hollywood "soulmate" crap. More likely than not there is already someone you know or at max someone one graph edge away which will be a perfectly fine partner for the rest of your life. So finding that person will keep you occupied for 2-5 years.

2.) Get kids. Having never imagined to be a father and now having three kids, I have to admit I always feel sorry for people who don't have kids. I have a hard time to see any relevance in a life without children anymore. This might be complete bs but certainly floats my boat. I got my "finding meaning in life" completely covered by getting those three buggers into a good position for their life. That will keep me busy for the next 15 years.

3.) Don't take your job too seriously. There is Jeff Bezos and Bill Gates and Henry Ford but for 99.99% percent of the people here on HN (me and presumably you included) what you do in your work life will not really matter for generations to come. It pays the bills, it should be interesting enough not to bore you to death, you should have colleagues that are in their majority "friend material". That's it.

I always imagine my live as a pizza with three slices: personal (some sport, watching movies with friends, reading books, etc.), family and work. Ideally, each one should be about a third of the pizza, ie. have a third of your attention and time. There are times when this is not possible but it should be the state you are striving towards.

(3) is a very negative way of looking at things. Do you think Bill Gates did it on his own? You don't have to be famous in order to play a small part of something impactful that's larger than yourself and will be respected for generations.

> You don't have to be famous in order to play a small part of something impactful that's larger than yourself and will be respected for generations.

Once someone leaves a company, their work generally fades into oblivion. Almost immediately, too.

Are you around 25? I used to feel as you do. But at 34, I'm with OP.

I'm older than you. The code I write and the production systems I've brought online tend to stick around. It's because I pour my heart and soul into making them as beautiful and poetic as possible. Because I'm not just thinking about my paycheck. I'm thinking about the next guy who's going to be maintaining it, and how good his life is going to be, after I've moved on to a different project, and then the next guy. I think if we all approached our work with the same level of tender loving care that we normally reserve only for our children, then the world would be a more pleasant place.

It sounds like you haven't had the experience of being fired without notice, with one month of rent in savings.

Companies literally don't care whether you die. Why would you pour your heart and soul into something so soulless?

When I felt as you did, it ended up causing interpersonal conflicts when my vision of "good" didn't match my coworkers'. If you pour your heart and soul into something, and then everyone disagrees that it's good, then empirically you were a net negative for the team. Strike two for soulpouring.

I understand you might want to remain anonymous, but it's also telling that you didn't link to any examples of the work that you're proud of.

My point is, try not to judge others for not feeling as you do. Empathy is a difficult art, but it's worthwhile. It wasn't till I was diagnosed with narcolepsy that most of my work history made sense in hindsight -- zero companies were tolerant to missed meetings, with the thankful exception of my current role. (I wrote about my experiences here: https://twitter.com/theshawwn/status/1392213804684038150)

And no matter how much you care about your work, I bet you don't pour your heart and soul into meetings. So it always felt like the world cared about things I didn't, which in turn made me stop caring beyond professionalism.

But professionalism has merit. Once I detached my ego, I was able to take orders well, and to execute someone else's vision well. "Tool" is another name for that sort of person. And although I don't enjoy being a tool, I'm well-compensated for it, and the counterparty and I both walk away happy.

Companies normally don't fire a crackerjack but that happened to me back in the 2000's during one of the more vulnerable parts of my life. The vice president who recruited me took a higher paying gig at a competitor. Then my manager went on a weeklong vacation. I showed up to work one day and found that my computer couldn't access the network. I asked the IT guy what happened and with a bead of sweat rolling down his forehead he was like, uhh talk to the new VP. Turns out first day on the job, he decided to can me. When my manager came back from vacation and learned what they'd done, he immediately tendered his resignation. Really unfortunate. But I checked and they're still using my code.

But it doesn't matter, because one goofball VP doesn't shake my faith in myself and the meaningfulness of the work that myself and my colleagues are doing. You might have lost faith but that doesn't mean other people should too. The GP wasn't just musing about his own life. He very explicitly said you and came across as saying your life doesn't matter if work is the thing that matters to you, because your work will never matter unless you're Gates. I don't accept that and I won't empathize with that conclusion. Because it's demoralizing and insulting to everyone who's working hard. If his truth was accepted as everyone's truth, then could you imagine how unpleasant the world would be? The simple fact is that your family matters and your work matters too. Regardless of whatever misfortune or doom and gloom you may have encountered on your journey.

“Companies don’t fire a crackerjack” implies that you’ve always been seen as an all-star team member.

Consider an alternate universe where you were never allowed to feel like an all-star, because you were never able to show up for meetings on time, and people got progressively madder at you regardless of how much soul or effort you put in.

We’re probably two sides of the same coin. You got lucky at all your jobs, and I got unlucky. But it certainly made me think twice about thinking badly of people who get fired, regardless of official reasons.

(Your manager seemed to actually care about you on a personal level? That ~never happens.)

What you call luck, I'd call magic. The important thing to understand about magic tricks is they're really not all that magical once you learn how to perform them. People are also willing to overlook a great deal when they believe you're a luckbringer. My manager for instance cared about me on a personal level because I was contributing to his success. When the VP took me away, it weakened him.

How do you do that when your manager always considers you an unreliable risk?

I think you're dramatically underestimating how much it matters to be punctual in the vast majority of companies, regardless of whether your code output is reliable.

Then you find a new manager, in a different team maybe, who aligns with your values and respect your strengths. There are many different types of people in any company. It takes 2 to tango, and I'm sure one of these managers will be delighted to find someone just like them!

As for punctuality, there are many people who are punctual but couldn't code their way out of paperback, let alone fight they way out of a soaking wet one :)

Guess who'll be brought in to the rescue when they predictibly fail?

Your perspective matters a lot. It will color your actions. Punctuality or even code reliability ultimately doesn't matter. What matters is if you can bring more money to the company, one way or another. If you are doing sales meetings, it may be punctuality. If you are doing tech work on the core infrastructure, it may be code reliability. Find your own niche, surrounded by people who like you and need the unique strengths you bring to the table.

As someone who is at least reasonably productive and competent, who suffers from a medical condition that forces me to live in the reality you say is trivial, let me assure you that if you could switch places with me for one year, you wouldn’t write this. The inaccuracies are so overwhelming that it’s hard to correct it, and there’s also no point in having that conversation with someone who believes these things so strongly.

By the way, sign up at http://www.hnreplies.com/ and you never have to worry about missing replies, or use karma as a reply indicator.

> suffers from a medical condition that forces me to live in the reality you say is trivial

LOL

You know nothing about me! A meeting before 11a has about 20% chances I will attend, tops. And even if, by chance, I happen to be there, I won't have much to contribute before my 2nd redbull.

Yet, somehow, I've found a way to make it work, by focusing on my strengths and what I can bring to the table, and moving myself to the right environment.

So I'm telling you, your perspectives limit you. Several people also have tried to tell you. But it seems you want to ignore that, maybe in a desire to be in the right because the alternative might be threatening to your self identity/the wisdom of your past decisions?

It may seem harsh for me to tell that, but some people like to double down on their errors, as (re)claiming agency can be frightening at first.

Well, whatever, if you are like that, and it works for you, why not?

> By the way, sign up at http://www.hnreplies.com/ and you never have to worry about missing replies, or use karma as a reply indicator.

I'm way too lazy for that :) It kinda works this way (unless when I forget what the karma was at the day before, oopsies), and HN is not important enough to me to make it worth being distracted by email/push notifications.

Maybe one day dang or someone will add a colored notification, a bit like reddit?

That I could use!

Nah, your perspective doesn’t bother me. Minorities and disabled people are used to ignorance, so it’s no surprise you’re doubling down.

I do feel that the most productive course of action is to end this conversation, though. There are more enjoyable ways to spend one’s birthday.

Suffice to say, I have no identity. But if one day you were to go blind, and then listen to someone telling you with a straight face that it really doesn’t matter, you’ll feel what I felt in this thread.

“Think of me~~ Think of me fond-ly, when we say good-bye~~ Remember me, once in awhile~~ please promise me you’ll try~~” as the song goes.

I've been building systems for years in numerous places. Have you never experienced a political situation where a decision is made in these systems you describe as beautiful and poetic, that is not your own and yet due to organisational structures you must obey? I am curious given your attachment how you handle these. They're standard political issues in organizations larger than a few people.

My attachment? That aside, I think what you're asking is really simple. Relationships and empires are built on compromise. When you work a job you should agree with the stated objectives of your bosses. If you've got those bases covered, and it's a healthy environment too, then nothing should surprise you.

Reading this made me realize I've written code that's no only older than a lot of people reading this, it's still being sold to new customers.

That's really impressive. What's the code? Something like that sounds like it could be a really inspirational success story.

It's not that inspirational in reality. I worked for a company that produced software for banks converting their systems over to Windows in the 90s. The resulting packages are still being sold to new financial institutions by the company that bought the company that bought the company that bought the company I worked for at the time. Heh. One of my old coworkers there still makes some decent money as a consultant supporting it.

I also worked on some ATM software at the same company, but it was pre-windows and I doubt it's running many places, much less being sold still.

I think that's inspirational. What was it, written in something like COBOL? I've had my codebases demolished by things like Express changing its API enough times that you might say I've got a little COBOL envy. Major respect to anything that's stood the test of time and continues to serve a useful purpose after all these years.

The point isn't that you will never be part of something great. The point is to keep your stress level low in regards to work.

> play a small part of something impactful that's larger than yourself and will be respected for generations.

So do you know anyone from MS who played part except Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer? I would attribute the guy who invented C# and TypeScript a significant impact, however I don't even know his name without googleing it.

Well Tim Paterson for starters. He wrote their wildest hacks. Like this program that translated old CP/M binaries into i8086 code dynamically at runtime during the loading process, so that DOS could seamlessly transition people away from the Digital Equipment Corporation platform. Plus he wrote commands like `DEBUG` which like GDB normally require special kind of giftedness in order to create. What would Microsoft have been, if it weren't for unsung heroes like him?

Anders Hejlsberg, also the architect of turbo pascal, delphi, and j++ before c# and then typescript!

And hackerfromthefu isn't the only one who knew that by heart; I was going to supply you with the name when I noticed that someone already had. Not mr Hejlsberg's fault that you don't know his name, is it?

Yes I'm a huge fan!

I've followed his career for 2 decades using his tooling because he has the sense of style and expertise to create development tooling that was generations ahead of the competition, the best I've ever found from trying so many languages. He's also a really personable and humble genius based on the relatively few videos and interviews available. In my opinion he's the Michael Jordan of software, though he's more humble!

I've known of him for a bit longer, but soured on him a bit when he let himself be bought by the Evil Empire. Also, his uglier second take eclipsing the original annoyed me.

But, mellowing with age, I'm slowly getting over that. :-) (Also, Khan should just fucking have paid him better.)

I think the point is that you shouldn't try so hard to "change the world". We are far too often told that you can change the world, you can be anything you want to be, keep looking and don't settle, and it brings a lot of misery to a lot of people who feel they are losers just because they're not changing the world..

We the HN readers are generally some of the luckiest people in the world because we were born smart enough to be able to work in a profession that is generally very well paid. If OP has $500k he is in fact probably among top 1% of the richest people on this planet.. If you're less lucky and work as a truck driver somewhere in poor country, then life is extremely hard...

I would agree with you on one thing: no matter what your conditions are, you can e.g. go out and start picking up trash and cleaning up your neighborhood. I am sure it is meaningful, someone will appreciate it sooner or later, someone might even join and help. And if not, at least you have cleaner neighborhood.

(2) This! Once you have kids your focus is on other people rather than yourself, which makes you a better human being... well that was my experience at least. Don't leave it too late.

Take a look at the current "feminism" movement that aims to empower women to be equal to men in the job market. What has happened in the West is that women are realising by the age of 40 they have a great job, but no kids or long term relationship to speak of. Instead they have surrounded themselves with cats :(

(not saying all Feminism is bad - it's done a lot of good in other aspects)

I wouldn’t say that was the result of a feminist movement as much powerful interests in society being able to exploit women’s work much more systematically.

If a woman has a career the government can tax their earnings and somebody like Jeff Bezos has the value of their stock holdings increase by some multiple of the earnings created. Contrast that to unpaid domestic work which doesn’t contribute to either but does contribute to the welfare of the family.

Manicur Olson points out that large groups (50% of the population) have the most difficult time organizing on their own behalf, whereas small special interest groups that are more concentrated are much more effective at getting what they want. The most effective social movements have both an elite and mass component.

> The most effective social movements have both an elite and mass component.

And guess which of those parts the movement as a whole is usually most useful for.

While I am glad that you are enjoying kids, I do not think it is fair the way you paint the picture of people who choose to not have kids ("feeling sorry for them") as if it was a condition or something. Plus I think having children is not something that should be rushed. Pretty sure there are many parents out there who became a parent because of social pressure.

What if I tell you I find fullfilment in travelling? Should I feel sorry for people who do not want to travel (or can't because they have kids ;) )?

I agree with 3) though that a job should be just a means to the end.

Take that comment with an assumption of good intentions, and you can get to a specific situation like: "oh man, that particular guy really has nothing going for him, if he had kids it would look a whole lot different". BTW, I feel like "that guy" sometimes, and it's probably quite common.

> I do not think it is fair the way you paint the picture of people who choose to not have kids ("feeling sorry for them") as if it was a condition or something.

It's not painting childless folks as having a condition, it's more kindhearted than that. It's saying, "Here's this thing that's incredibly difficult but infinitely rewarding. I care about you so I want you to experience it too".

If you don't have kids you are missing a fundamental understanding of what is driving most people each and every day. You are clueless about most of the world because most people have kids and it profoundly affects them. You can't know this unless you experience it yourself.

It's also difficult to understand what you are getting into by having kids. It brings on a profound level of anxiety about their feelings and ultimate happiness. Your world is not yours anymore. You don't control them and you can rarely fix them. Anything that makes them sad is like a stab to your heart that requires immediate action. Imagine having a kid that does not have any ambitions and struggles to find any happiness and has problems with drug addiction. Get ready to have your soul ripped out.

Not having kids prevents this very possible outcome and allows you to focus on pampering yourself with your millions your whole life...with the side effect of perhaps coming to the conclusion that your own life is meaningless somewhere down the road.

If you reach a certain age and are still childless just know that nearly everyone will feel sorry for you.

The world does not revolve around single people...at all.

Not everybody is created equal. I love my kids, don't get me wrong. But I also know people that live for their art, their skill, their ability to help others and so on.

> If you reach a certain age and are still childless just know that nearly everyone will feel sorry for you.

Nearly everyone is a pretty large assumption, I think you speak mostly for yourself, not for 'nearly everyone'.

> Nearly everyone is a pretty large assumption, I think you speak mostly for yourself, not for 'nearly everyone'.

Exactly this. Additionally, I've known a number of parents that deeply regret having kids, and look on child free friends with envy, not sorrow.

It's not a socially acceptable view for them to have, so they generally keep it secret. And the majority of them still love their children, but have a very complicated relationship with the whole parenting situation. People don't want to talk about it, though, because it can come off like they hate their kids, which usually isn't the case.

We need to teach people from a young age that choosing not to have kids is a perfectly acceptable choice, if that's what they decide they want.

> If you reach a certain age and are still childless just know that nearly everyone will feel sorry for you

I legitimately do not care if people "feel sorry for me". I have good reasons for choosing not to have kids, and I hate the attitude that I'm somehow selfish or missing out on the "true meaning of life". Life is ultimately meaningless with or without kids. That allows you to make your own meaning, and kids are not a requirement for that.

There's this attitude that people who don't have kids are in some way selfish, but in my experience, the act of having kids can be the selfish one, especially if you are not in the position to be a good parent, for whatever reason. Many people have kids in that attempt to find meaning for themselves, not to actually be a good parent.

As a society, we need to be much better at not pushing every single person into being a parent. It just doesn't work for many people. And that's okay.

> The world does not revolve around single people...at all

Plenty of single people have kids, though?

Its in the code. If many people thought like you our species would be extinct. The people that have this software version is the majority and any argument you make will not alter the code. Their code includes convincing others to make kids.

The way I think isn't "people shouldn't don't have kids", it's "don't force yourself to have kids if you don't want them, and don't expect kids to be the path to solving your own problems -- they may, in fact, just magnify every problem you have". I'm fairly certain that even everyone agreeing with that wouldn't lead to the extinction of the species, but it may lead to less children being raised in dire or abusive circumstances, and less parents miserable with their own existence.

I agree that this way of thinking probably runs contrary to the evolutionary code of the species. But we live in a world where that code is outdated, and education should allow us to teach people that marriage and child-rearing, while the right path for many people, is not the only route to self fulfillment and happiness. And those that choose alternate paths should not be treated as, or feel like, outcasts.

I agree

That's ok to feel like that but you are basically arguing that if I don't want children I have a meaningless life and that I am a second class citizen of Earth and the only purpose of life is to have children.

Having a child is a huge responsibility. It's not just something you can try out and see if it works for you or not.

Honestly, I think you are in a parent bubble or something. I don't quite understand your hardcore stance on must-have children.

> He that hath wife and children hath given hostages to fortune, for they are impediments to great enterprises, either of virtue or mischief.

Unless you're Francis Bacon, or some other world changing figure, this does not apply to you.

It's actually not that difficult for childless people to imagine what having kids is like. What I imagined before I had kids was pretty close to what it ended up being once I had them.

I also don't think I've ever experienced my fellow parents feeling sorry for somebody our age without kids. It's more often jealousy than anything else. A lot of people have kids because it's just the next thing you do and then they end up regretting it.

I don't have children but I have a pretty good idea what it's like. I think many childless people (over a certain age) do. Turns out people are really good at this empathy thing; it's something that's strongly hard-wired in our brains.

> Not having kids [..] allows you to focus on pampering yourself with your millions your whole life...with the side effect of perhaps coming to the conclusion that your own life is meaningless somewhere down the road.

That seems an unfair characterisation; I don't have children for the simple reason that there are enough humans on the planet; it's not like there's a shortage. Many childless people I know feel like this.

I'd actually love to have a family; I just chose not to (thus far anyway) because I think it's better for "the greater good", which sounds a bit lame but that's what it is. You can agree or disagree with that take, but it's not pure selfish hedonism like you're describing; quite the opposite in fact.

I also wonder what a child would think that read that.

Which part?

Maybe didn't mean you, but the GP's "I have a hard time to see any relevance in a life without children anymore. This might be complete bs but certainly floats my boat." That sounds like it could make a kid think "So they didn't have me for my sake, just so they could find 'relevance' in their life".

I don't think there is ever someone who decided to make kids only for their own kid's sake because you don't know your child before they are brought to the world. Or least this is very hard to grasp.

Of course, adopting is a different wonderful way to have children where you can meet the child. But also in this situation: are you choosing one for their own sake or for you own sake?

PS: I have a kid and think a lot about the responsibility of parents to their children due to the fact that the parents decided to bring the children into the world.

Unpopular opinion but even if you are a Bill Gates, I don’t think there is anything of substance about his technological innovation.

What is noteworthy is how he has used his wealth in his philanthropic efforts to eradicate disease and suffering. That deserves kudos.

> Unpopular opinion but even if you are a Bill Gates, I don’t think there is anything of substance about his technological innovation.

I don't understand the downvotes here. In 100 years or so, practically no one is going to remember that Bill Gates created a shitty operating system back in the 20th century, but there will probably be statues of him around the world for his philanthropic work.

When you comment anything that goes against the hacker fantasy… that all of a sudden the world discovers a genius amongst his github code and throws money and awards at him out of good will to honor his genius as if he was the next donald knuth or something then prepare to get downvoted.

The most philanthropic thing he could do would be to go back in time and undo everything he's done in his life. Which is basically enrich himself at the expense of everyone else, causing trillions of hours of human lives to be wasted dealing with his broken dogshit product. Donating some money to some stupid organization with his name on it now doesn't make it better.

> What is noteworthy is how he has used his wealth in his philanthropic efforts to eradicate disease and suffering. That deserves kudos.

Well, yeah, kind of... But what is also at least as noteworthy is how he got that wealth. His philanthropy since he retired has only begun to make up for the stifling hand his evil empire laid over computing for decades.

Gates built a close relationship with Epstein over years (and knowing what he was convicted for), while on the other hand Gates Foundation worked to address human trafficking. Philanthropy is a cheap way to launder reputation without engaging with real powers at play.

>Over the years, the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation had poured millions of dollars into anti–sex trafficking groups, among many other causes, including $5 million to the evangelical group International Justice Mission, which is perhaps most known for conducting dramatic brothel raids in Southeast Asia. At the time, international sex workers’ rights groups condemned the grant and IJM, but nearly no one else drew attention to the traumatic arrests and threats of deportations alleged by sex workers whose workplaces were raided.

Gates Foundation targeted workers and clients while Gates used an actual trafficker to help build his own reputation, hoping Epstein would help help himself to the Nobel prize. This is typically neoliberal philanthropy - address the worst effects (through surveillance tech for cops at that) without addressing the structural problem. Let's not get too excited about a billionaire technocrat's repentance.

> I have a hard time to see any relevance in a life without children anymore.

In my view, having kids is a great way to take off the existential pressure of life being meaningless, by just having a default "do it for them" answer to every single question or hardship in life. And what then will give your child's life such a straightforward meaning? Well, just have kids of their own I guess, and their kids the same, all the way down, forever.

It always seems like a bit of a cop out to me. "Life is empty and meaningless, so I'll just have kids, let that fill up all my time, and maybe they can figure it out." I suppose that could be the history of humanity in a nutshell.

> It always seems like a bit of a cop out to me. "Life is empty and meaningless, so I'll just have kids, let that fill up all my time, and maybe they can figure it out." I suppose that could be the history of humanity in a nutshell.

I understand the sentiment here, and prior to having children of my own, I would have agreed with you. But having kids brings tremendous meaning to one's life in a way that is difficult to explain - it has to be experienced. What you see as an infinite recursion, i.e.:

have children and find meaning --> your children find meaning from their children --> etc., etc. etc.

Being part of the ongoing chain of humanity, there's something beautiful about that lack of an endgame, just being a part of something and then passing the torch.

Having children does not bring meaning in itself. Your interpretation of having children brings you meaning.

I am extremely happy that I do not have children and that I do not have to deal with children. I have so many meaningful relationships with adults and wonderful life experiences and every morning I look forward to continuing with the day. I do not desire children and I'm completely fine with not having them at all.

Well said! Life should be what you want to do - many people don't have ambitions or interests, and I guess defaulting to the evolutionary standard of having kids is a valid response.

You say it like parents choose the easy explanation. But what if for some people the meaning of their life is to have kids? For sure parenting gives your life _a_ meaning. But I doubt people choose to have kids for that.

I think the choose of having kissy it’s more a mix of ambition, societal conventions and natural instinct.

I've noticed that everyone with kids tends to do two things: one is that they get along with other people who've had kids and they use that to create instant bonds of mutual understanding. And the other is that they take opportunities to convince those without kids to get kids. While I don't take offense, I do feel that there is usually an implication in there that someone without kids is somehow less trustworthy or less of a 'good' type of person, or inferior even.

It's definitely a cop out. There are probably as many assholes with kids as there are without kids in this world.

Having kids and being a good parent can be really hard. Parents trying to convince others to have kids might be trying to validate their own choices. We do that all the time for trivial choices like iPhone vs Android, so it's expected that we'll do it even more for irreversible choices like having kids. I wouldn't read too much into it.

Oh I don’t - impressions of what others think aren’t worth the trouble of overthinking.

If anything it’s just interesting that this happens.

I have two kids and I’ll be the first to tell people who ask that it’s not for everyone. First, maybe with climate change none of us should. Second, you have to be ready to stick with things even when you don’t think you can, like literally do not see a way through. It will break you.

On the flip side you will learn more about what you are capable of and you will be responsible for this little magical person who will make the world and time freeze just for a moment when they give you a hug and a kiss.

Is it worth it? That’s the wrong question…

Haha there you go - that’s that opportunity that people with kids take that I was just talking about. ;)

But generally yes, everything you’re saying is 100% true and a valuable contribution to this type of conversation.

The thing I think about quite a bit is this: People with children will frequently bring up how much they’ve changed and matured after having kids. And I have seen this happen with many friends. But it’s also very difficult to really imagine the consequences of the lack of that decision. Because you don’t really have a clear view into that alternate timeline in which you don’t have the kids. What’s more we usually view that timeline as static - we don’t imagine ourselves continuing to change and evolve in it. “I was a irresponsible young adult right before kids so I would continue to be that irresponsible today if not for them.” But if you assume that just as much growth occurs in that other timeline, only in a different direction, then not having kids can be just as big and profound a decision as having them.

It definitely does give you a default answer to keep going. And I don't think thats a terrible thing.

I was lucky to have a great childhood. Becoming a parent is one route to giving someone else a great childhood. Lots of humans derive a feeling of meaning from giving good things to other humans, whatever form that might take. Parenthood isn't the only way to do this, of course.

Also, eventually one generation might figure it all out. We can only keep going and find out!

It's not a cop out it's just a way out.

If video games, side projects, promotions, rock climbing, travel, etc. work for you, then go for it.

But I think for most, those fade. Kids are an investment that pays dividends forever.

Having someone who is dependent on you definitely makes you important, whether that's kids or your dying grandmother or something else. But creating that dependency explicitly as a means to feel important is just weird.

"I have a hard time to see any relevance in a life without children anymore."

Consider the fact that Chinese slaves made everything you own, and are wearing. Isn't that worth caring about? Wouldn't it be "relevant" to try improve that situation?

In this person's mind, a person without kids who is trying to solve the problem of human slavery, is living an "irrelevant life". It goes to show you how stupid the average person is, including the average parent.

>Chinese slaves made everything you own

You should actually go visit some factories in China, their working lives aren’t so different from working in a factory in the west.

It’s how we were programmed biologically and evolutionally, that’s it.

I haven't had kids yet, but I think having them is the most important thing I can do with my life. I can't fix society's problems. I can't even be sure I helped a nonzero amount even if I exerted myself to exhaustion for my entire time on Earth. What I can do is raise someone who is exposed to my principles and ideals. I can carry my meme on so that they may exert themselves for a lifetime that yields an infentesimal result. It's the only way we'll ever make it.

> I have a hard time to see any relevance in a life without children anymore

So do I. Unfortunately I don't have any and most likely never will (the wife can't). Combined with an unfulfilling job, this makes most days quite pointless and hard to bear.

Personally I try to distract myself, not think too much about these things and just wait for it all to be over.

Not sure if this will help, but "giving back" or supporting those around you are some of the core ideas of having kids. I know it can feel hard when there are personal limitations, but I hope you can find someone or a group to invest in. I feel it really makes a difference in my life with similar limitations.

Have you discussed adopting a kid?

Yes, we have. Apparently it's close to impossible to adopt a kid for us, considering that we are in our 40's and that demand is much greater than supply, so they pick younger couples. Also, there seems to be a whole industry pretty much stealing children from poor countries and selling them to couples like us. I do not want to be part of that.

Demand is much greater than supply? I’m pretty surprised to hear this actually. Would you be willing to educate me a little bit about this? My understanding is that there are countless children in foster homes waiting to be adopted.

Demand is incredibly high for babies, and drops off with age.

Can you adopt? There are kids out in the world with no one and who bounce from foster home to foster home until they are booted out of the system at 18. Abandoned again.

Focus on really helping people before you slide into depression.

I know this is a weird suggestion, and doesn't cover the missing fulfillment of raising kids. If having progeny is a concern of yours perhaps sperm donation might be something to think about. You can donate with the stipulation that any resultant children will be allowed to look you up if they wish later in life.

> Start dating. It might be a drag and maybe embarrassing at times, but obviously not being a loser having saved up half a mil in 10 years, you will probably find someone.

I wish that was true. For me, dating became incredibly harder after 40 even though my social status has considerably increased.

I have been happily married for decades. We have friends who are dating late in life. No envy here. I feel sorry for anyone on a dating app. What a shit show.

I'm coming into it at 40 now that I'm far enough past divorce that I'm not an absolute wreck.

It is absolutely a shit show and was far far easier in my 20s.

It’s a shit show for most any straight man. Dating is something you’ll have to relegate to the old real world as a straight man. Too many straight men on dating apps. The apps know how to drain men of their money.

Better to try real life methods - even though they are incredibly difficult and resoundingly terrible overall too. The most difficult part could just be getting in front of someone you find attractive - dating apps make it relatively easy to find the attractive ones even if they put them behind a paywall.

A big part of dating is knowing where to look and what for. 99% of single people don't do either of those right. As OP said (paraphrasing on mobile)

> soulmates are hype

Another commenter said:

> marry up emotionally

Emotional hygeine is imo the biggest contributor to a stable relationship. I'm a stupid curmudgeonly weirdo but my wife is a gem of a woman and she keeps me going. Her positivity and our healthy debate about literally everything makes sure everything is going well and we're happy.

Hidden gems are around and I feel that literature/media over romanticizes serendipity among other things in dating and relationships.

Dating apps are terrible. There's a HN post doing BOTE math about dating that will blow your mind. Make friends. Friends and siblings (not parents or uncles/aunts) make the best matchmakers if you are open when you want to date someone.

what does one graph edge away mean?

One degree of separation (socially). The implication being that if OP doesn't know someone who would fit as a partner, someone (s)he knows does.

presumably, friend of friend

Deciding to have children when you are lost and miserable on the off chance that it will solve your problems sounds like a terrible idea.

With this reasoning, you might as well just get as big a mortgage as you can get instead. It will also give you a "meaning in life" - freeing yourself from the debt burden - and keep you busy for the next 30 years. At least you won't be gambling with a newly created life.

I think you have a good actionable advice. I would highlight that it's important to get your own life in order before you decide to get kids. It's a great responsibility after all and it should not be done only because "I'm trying to find my place in life".

Obviously, HN readers are well aware of it, but (mental) health is the best start.

It's true that kids remove a great deal of existential angst. The answer to whether that is due to the kids being rewarding, or just not having time or energy to think like that anymore, doesn't seem too important.

You state child rearing as a solution to the existential problem and I think that is the wrong framing. Children give life meaning _for certain people_. There are many unhappy parents. There's a type of bias in the dichotomy of those who have and don't have kids. No parent will badmouth their child knowing full well that they're committing to that for the life of their child. Complaining about having kids is an admission of a bad commitment that will pay double digit years. There is a (biologically driven) feeling of love you have for your children and it is overwhelming. It is juxtaposed by hardships of raising children. This puts most parents in the middle of the regret/contentment spectrum. These are the reasons why parents aren't straight with others about having kids.

> it's the hardest thing you'll ever do but it's so rewarding

To set it straight:

- It's hard and there is no certain link between hard work and the reward of happy and successful children

- I have seen great parents with the worst children; at 40, they are angry and broken humans drifting directionlessly; since birth they have been angry and a pain in their parents' collective asses; they are the reason for parents divorce and will likely cause their early death as they battle with drug addictions, low self esteem and abusive relationships - all self inflicted. Both parents blame themselves and have had other happy and successful kids.

- God forbid you have a disabled child; this just plain sucks. If you have multiple children they all resent the disabled child. This child will never become independent and their life is your responsibility forever

- It involves a lot of stress and not a lot of thanks. Most kids are not grateful and don't realize the magnitude and sustain of time/money/sacrifice/stress it took to keep them alive and provide for them.

- It strains your relationship with your partner. Some parents I know are divorced primarily because of life stress caused by children.

- It complicates your life in every way. Want to take a walk? Dinner with friends? Travel? All these things are harder with children. You're constantly weighing opportunity cost because your available time is even more bottlenecked.

Know why you're having children and if you can handle it!!! Make sure you will never give up on them - this is a path to broken children. Index on negative experiences about what it's like to have children.

If after all that you still want kids, go forth and procreate!

I’m in my late 40s. Just gone through 15 years of absolute shit with an ex partner and financial chaos.

Decided I’d fix it in 2019. Three important things to concentrate on:

1. Health. If that’s off, fix it first. Everything depends on health. Sort out your diet, physical fitness and health and mental health follows. I’m fitter than all my peers and both fitter and healthier than I was in my 20s. Can run a half marathon now.

2. Social contacts. Get out there and make friends. In my case i signed up to Meetup and just attended random stuff until people stuck. This usually involves hiking, pubs and bars, restaurant nights out.

3. Invest in experiences. Go travelling, do new things and learn new stuff completely away from your usual area of expertise and comfort. So I’m usually desk bound in the middle of the city but a few weeks back I’m standing on a mountain in the middle of nowhere in the middle of the night in the middle of winter doing celestial navigation course. It was amazing.

All positive, fulfilling experiences in life I have found require putting yourself in unusual and uncomfortable positions. Life where there is no normal but it’s not bad abnormal is where the fun is. Doing those things together with other people is where you make meaningful lasting friends and relationships too.

+1 on health. I'm way older than both of you. Clean living and regular, vigorous, exercise has been the #1 key to loving yourself, confidence and mental health. Pays huge dividends later in life. As for relationships. As the old saying goes "If you are looking for a trout, don't fish in a herring barrel". Do what you want to do, travel where you want to go, join and participate in hobbies that you like. Group activities will be best (hiking, exercise, walking, tours, photography), You will meet your peers. good luck

I think I need to realize this simple advice. Thanks.

It’s correct. Also why I have an ex wife. Hmm.

What is your personality type? Are you extroverted? Would points (2) and (3) differ for someone who is introverted?

Nope; social life is important. I find that I get overwhelmed and drained with large groups, but doing things with a group small enough to fit in a car together is fine. I personally have some hobbies I enjoy for their own sake, and meeting people through those has been rewarding. It’s good to have a mix of “close friends” who you can be open and will support you emotionally, and “activity buddies” who you can geek out about your shared interests with.

Humans are not meant to go through the world alone and modern life can be incredibly isolating. It takes effort to build social connection but it is well worth it.

Glad this works for you, but humans are not all the same. Dont assume what makes you happy also makes other people happy. This is akin to telling somebody with depression to 'Cheer Up'.

They were answering a personal question.

Absolutely not. Even introverts need social connections. It's more akin to telling somebody to get fit because it's good for their health.

Introvert does not mean asocial or antisocial. Social connections are a fundamental part of every human's mental health. Maybe some disorders might change this up, but being an introvert is not that.

So why do I feel ike you are specifically telling me that what makes me happy is wrong and bad for me?

Perhaps you are sensitive to people seemingly giving you advice, because you aren’t seeking it, nor do you desire to change? Not trying to put words in your mouth, but I think you might be interpreting the recommendations as directed at you. Do you suspect that their advice may have a kernel of truth, and you are reacting to the person who caused your internal self to recoil against change? Just food for thought, not directed at you personally.

Some things that make people happy are things that are bad for them. Those aren't mutually exclusive categories.

Maybe that says more about you than them. You're on a social website right now, engaging with people voluntarily, but you're insisting you're only happy by not connecting with people?

Being an introvert does not remove your monkey brain’s need for social connection. Sure, it means being deliberate about when/how/who, but most people leading a solitary life are not happy.

Thankyou for confirming my point by using the word 'most'. It is rimportant to remember the group of people (however small) who operates outside of what is percieved as 'normal'.

It's true that people are different. It's worth remembering that a (however small) group of people also tend to justify their own behavior and that they are not "normal" can be an easy escape-latch for avoiding being uncomfortable but healthy.

I've been guilty of this in the past regarding sleep. "I don't need more than 6 hours of sleep per night" I kept telling myself and others, and I ran on that schedule for decades. When I started forcing myself to sleep more, I started to feel even better, and now I'm hovering around 8 hours per night and feel so much better. I didn't even realize I could feel better by doing something I didn't think was necessary, but it did improve me.

I've also done this related to relationships, where I found myself fine with being by myself for long stretches of time. I didn't really see any problems, and when people told me I have to see other people, I also used the "maybe I'm not "normal" and don't need it like others?" argument, which is what I told myself too. I didn't feel bad, but started seeking out more relationships anyways, and got so many benefits and became happier because of it, that I can't go back to being all alone again.

I'm not saying this applies to you, but maybe it applies to others who read. It's easy to get into the trap of lying to yourself (I'm guilty of it multiple times), with all kinds of reasons. If you can see past that, you can become happier, even if you're not miserable right now.

I believe when you read things on the internet, or anywhere, it should be common sense to assume that it does not apply to absolutely everyone/everything in all possible contexts. Use your common sense. It would be unreasonable to force people to preface all words with qualifiers like "most", "usually" and "most likely" - nothing ever applies universally.

That's typical behavior you see on social media Twitter. People say something reasonable, but then someone replies "how wrong!! this does not apply in edge case XYZ!", yeah, obviously. Just ignore it if you believe it doesn't apply to you.

Right but you should also strive to be precise in your words.

> This is akin to telling somebody with depression to 'Cheer Up'.

If you feel this way, please try to see it as "telling somebody with depression to pick the activity that seems less painful to do and go do it".

It is possible for that depressed person to not be able to do it yet. However, unlike your 'cheer up' example, this is actionable advise that is very likely to (slowly) help lead that person out of the depression if they manage to do it.

I'm an introvert and it works like that for me. I hardly ever feel like socializing. It drains me when I do it. Yet I still enjoy it when I'm doing it and it has a positive effect on my mental state (up to a point, of course).

The key is to find the right balance, and to be aware that there's some "training" to it: the less you do it the harder it gets. Don't give up though because then your mental health may suffer.

I don't doubt that social life is important even for introverted people, but this advice[1] in particular would be quite painful for me, even if it's in a small group. The hitrate (micromarriage rate) would be too small. Wouldn't it just be a few hours of small talk 95% of the time?

I am happy with a small handful of friends. If I'm going to add new ones, there has to be a significant overlap in interests that makes the company particularly enjoyable and non-draining. Probably a more interest-specific/targeted approach than Meetup (although maybe Meetup is capable of that, I am not familiar with it)?

Maybe I should try it out and see for myself, though! Could be one of those things that's pleasantly surprising.

[1] "In my case i signed up to Meetup and just attended random stuff until people stuck. This usually involves hiking, pubs and bars, restaurant nights out."

In my experience, you just have to accept the low hit rate. Worst case you’ll have some awkward small talk, best case you’ll meet people that you’ll find a lot in common with, and those relationships will last a while. You just have to accept that it’s going to be awkward a bunch of the time, but you have to put yourself in those situations.

I went from introvert to extrovert over the space of a couple of years. Fear prevented me from making lots of critical connections in life. Turned out this was silly and putting myself in uncomfortable positions led to lots of great experiences which I look back on when I need motivation and to get over the hump that stopped me doing stuff before.

I'm not sure I agree with those ways of thinking about introvert and extrovert. It's not simply if whether you like hanging out with others or prefer being alone. You don't flip from being extrovert to introvert just because you have a time in your life where you prefer to be alone. Extroverts don't become introverts while grieving the death of a loved one.

It has to do with whether hanging out with others drains or fill you with energy, mentally.

I love hanging out with people, it fills me with joy, and I'm great at talking with people, I'm good at cracking jokes that causes a group to laugh, I can hold speeches just fine, or perform in front of a group. But once I'm done, I'm exhausted, it's like holding my breath, I need to come up for air and be alone, even if I enjoy being with other people.

> You don't flip from being extrovert to introvert just because you have a time in your life where you prefer to be alone. Extroverts don't become introverts while grieving the death of a loved one.

These are hypotheses that I wouldn't rely on to give advice. It could discourage someone who is dissatisfied with themselves from trying to change. Who says it's impossible? Your personal experience, or observing people around you, or a study on 1000 people?

I believe GP is talking about the definition of the word, not commenting on human limitations.

They claim that "You don't flip from being extrovert to introvert just because [...]", so their definition implies that people's ability to switch from one to the other is limited. I don't think that's a reasonable thing to claim without evidence.

Plus one on health. Probably the last thing I’ll stop paying for is my trainer / coach. (I am doing gymnastics)

My life has picked up so much momentum after that.

A failed relationship left a hole in my heart and existence. A failed business also sucked—but much less) Health is the first foot forward.

And sports with people is probably the best way to go! (OP you have the cash for a trainer. Do it!)

Plus one in health and physical fitness. Buying a bicycle and using it daily was probably the best investment I ever made in myself. Also, I can't believe that I smoked those filthy cigarretes for so long, but how good is that I stopped this habit.

About material realizations please remind that the average successful enterpreneur age is about 45. I only started being able to save serious, retirement-style money when I've got 40.

Which bike did you buy?

At the risk of sounding like an ass: It doesn't matter, just get one that's the right size.

I understand why you ask, I'm very much the same way (unless you're asking just because you're curious). Some times I decide that it's time to make a change, and I start to look for thing I can buy to facilitate the process, exercise equipment, kitchen aids, clothing, essentially attempting to buy into a lifestyle. The thing that made me notice was when I started getting into minimalism, and I started to look for "minimalist things" I could buy... That sort of highlighted the absurdity of the idea.

The one at the used bike store that feels the best to ride on a quick test ride.

Buy a used road bike off Craigslist. Look for brands like Trek, Cannondale, Specialized. Even their vintage models (80s and 90s) still ride very smooth and can be around $150-250. This way, if your bike gets stolen or you simply don't ride enough, you're not too much out of pocket.

This. I have a Dawes ultra galaxy about a decade old. It has an unhealthy amount of duct tape around it which seems to put people off. I saw someone think about stealing it and choose something less cranky looking.

Buy a bike with matching frame for your height, with good double suspension, e.g. with front and rear RockShox or better, and raise the handlebar to a comfortable height. Your back will thank you.

Install all safety systems: front and rear bike lights, mirror, reflectors, use helmet, reflectors, wear reflective jacket, etc. You must be visible at the road at all times. (I use no helmet, because I'm trained to fall properly, but I recommend to wear helmet until you fall at least 10 times.)

Ensure that your legs are working for the full length, by raising the seat as much as you can, to avoid problems with joints. I'm raising my seat so much, that it feels like running, because I press pedal with toe instead of whole foot. Otherwise, you will have powerful legs, but weak foots, so you can break your heel just by running. (I did).

If you ride in winter conditions, lower the bike seat until you can reach the ground with the tips of your shoes instead, so you can reach the ground quickly when the road is slippery.

Bike will make your legs strong and healthy, but your upper body will require additional training. AFAIK, the best way to keep the whole body in good condition is to combine biking with swimming or sport dancing. (I use biking + ballroom dancing). Ballroom dancing also improves situation awareness a lot: I never had a collision with somebody else after few years of ballroom dancing.

> with front and rear RockShox or better

If you're only biking on the road I wouldn't get that, only slows you down.

>(I use no helmet, because I'm trained to fall properly, but I recommend to wear helmet until you fall at least 10 times.).

Not sure if you're serious...

I used to work with someone who was an avid cyclist, in his mid 50s, and insisted you didn't need a helmet when cycling because 'if you think about it, when you're falling, you will use your hands to stop yourself - so all you really need is a decent pair of gloves'.

He was totally serious, and I assume the previous poster might also be. It's a slightly bizarre viewpoint, but not that dissimilar - this idea that you should wear a helmet to start with, and then stop wearing it once you're confident that you no longer need it because you know how to fall without it.

Has he seen the "I love helmets!" video?

I’ve been biking for over 30 years. I’ve broken a helmet in a fall. I know how to fall.

ALWAYS WEAR A HELMET! It very well may save your life. Many crashes happen much too fast for you to react to.

It’s like a seatbelt or airbag in a car. Useless 99.9999% of the time. But when they’re needed they can dramatically improve your chances of survival.

> If you're only biking on the road I wouldn't get that, only slows you down.

They will make you feel like you are moving slower, but my bicycle computer shows that I move faster. Moreover, wheels follows ground more precisely, which reduces risk of losing contact with ground. I'm crossing road bumps at full speed, while sitting and continuing pedaling.

> Not sure if you're serious...

I'm serious for both recommending to wear helmet for first 10 falls at least (because newbie is like a toddler), and I'm serious that I don't need helmet (because I'm not a toddler anymore).

Bicycle is safer than walking per km traveled. Are you wearing a helmet when walking? It's dangerous!

I hear you, and acknowledge the strong opinions around Helen’ helmets while bicycling. I usually wear a helmet (I’m in the USA), and for slow trips on known routes sometimes I skip it. If I lived in the Netherlands (or anywhere with a robust bike-commute culture) I might never wear a helmet, because I’m not so fast anymore and I’d be doing known routes at moderate speed.

I lean towards wearing helmets, and support wearing them in cars (I don’t do that yet because of social stigma, though maybe I’ll work up the gumption now that I think about it).

Helmets, and other protective equipment, works, so it may help you to survive many kinds of incidents: road incident, train wreck, fall from sky, etc. There is no doubt.

However, cycling to work is the safest mean of transportation per km traveled.

Nobody will force me to do downhill on a bike without full gear on, because I can fall, puncture my artery, and then bleed out in 2 minutes. One of my earliest memories is: I'm laying on the ground on my back and watching as my bike flying over me, like in slo-mo.

However, I see no sense to wear a helmet when doing one of the safest routine on this planet. I had two road accidents (I hit another cyclist, I hit a safety pole with handlebar when a car in front of me suddenly closed the path for me) and a dozen near-misses while biking in about 40 years. I had much more near-misses in the city (dozens) when walking.

I can understand not wearing a helmet when biking, helmets can also only do so much. just don't fool yourself in thinking that your falling technique is going to save yourself in a traffic accident.

Funny how professional competition cyclists probably have even more experience than you... And all wear helmets.

Ensure that your legs are working for the full length, by raising the seat as much as you can, to avoid problems with joints

Raising your seat isn't the first step: first make sure that you're pushing the pedals with the balls of your feet, not close to the heel. I used to get terrible knee pain during prolonged bike rides as a kid, and nobody could tell me why.

It took me many years before I finally figured out what I was doing wrong: if your feet are too far forward on the pedals, you effectively lock your ankles in place, and all propulsion must come from your upper legs through your knees. If you can bend your ankles, you have two joints and three sets of muscles to share the load. This gives you better range of motion and less muscle strain for the same amount of propelling power.

If you ride in winter conditions, lower the bike seat until you can reach the ground with the tips of your shoes instead

This is the correct seat position all year round.

What does trained to fall properly mean? Are you absolutely sure there is such a thing? I doubt that there is, because the human neck is not strong enough to withstand many kinds of flat falls (just watch FailArmy for a while), and assuming you can prevent a flat fall during an accident is a bad assumption. Assuming you can avoid a head-first fall is a bad assumption, and assuming you’re not going to be struck by a car is a bad assumption.

Have been biking many decades, fallen more times than I can count, and am as trained to fall properly as one gets, I think. I’ve had two falls in the last decade that would have put me in the hospital without a helmet, and one that may have killed me - head collided with a rock at high speed, but I had a good helmet and walked away. My belief is the opposite - that my need for a helmet has only grown the more skill I have. As I’ve gained expertise, I ride faster on average, I’m in traffic more, picking more difficult routes, riding in a wider variety of weather and conditions. All reasons to

When I was in school, our trainer was ill, so he was replaced by a craft teacher, which was fresh from the army. He was a soviet paratrooper, so he told us that he knows nothing about training, but he sure that we will fall a lot during our life, so he will train us to fall properly. We did about a hundred of jumps and falls and rolls per lesson, up to 2 meter height, in military style for 2,5 months, up to 1000 falls in total.

When I'm falling, I'm rotating my body to fall flat on the back. I'm wearing a bicycle backpack with thick absorber and protective plate (Wolf Skin, Kite, etc.), so it absorbs energy and protects my back. Bad for backpack and notebook, but good for me.

FWIW, I had a whole skydiving career before I started biking seriously. Drop & roll is not really a viable head injury prevention plan. You’re prepped for a few kinds of accidents with a backpack and trying to roll if/when there’s time, if you’re really lucky, but you’re leaving a mile wide blind spot to many possible accidents that you don’t have control over. Good luck, I hope you don’t have any of those kind of collisions.

Biking to work is not a skydiving.

See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35MHUtvIpP8

Obviously. I’m saying that your soviet paratrooper roll training isn’t going to save your head in a bike crash, I know because I’ve done a whole lot of both. Biking to work is the place where you’re most likely to be hit by a car, and thus not be able to roll and not be protected by a backpack.

Hey I’m not telling you what to do, only pointing out that assuming you have control over physics in an accident is a pretty bad assumption, and that telling new riders that a few falls prepares them for non-helmet riding is dangerous advice because it’s not true.

I don’t know where you live, but we all know the Netherlands is famous for having some of the best bike infrastructure in the world, and also for low helmet use. Still, the chances of TBI in an accident in the Netherlands is 2x higher without a helmet than with. https://www.liebertpub.com/doi/10.1089/neur.2020.0010

In the US, helmet efficacy has been demonstrated repeatedly. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29677686/

You do you, I’m just saying from my perspective, and from actual experience, the single best thing I can do to prevent a serious debilitating bike injury is wear a helmet. It’s by no stretch of the imagination the only thing I can do, and I like some of your other advice you gave. I just think if you care about slippery surfaces enough to lower your seat, or care about cars enough to wear a reflective vest, a helmet sure seems like a good idea.

I'm from Europe (Ukraine). Yes, I'm totally aware about risk of death in a road incident. After each incident, our bicyclist association does protest near to city administration, demanding more and safer bike lanes.

Our plan to fix it is to make the city safer for cyclist. We are heavily inspired by success of Netherlands: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Boi0XEm9-4E . Situation is improved in recent years. Currently, half of my path to work is safe, while the other half is not.

Helmet is a good idea (I recommend to wear helmet after all), but it has some downsides. We can discuss upsides and downsides of helmet a lot, but I recommend using my OKR instead, when you recommend biking to newbies: «use helmet until you will fall 10 times at least». It's simple, easy to understand, easy to remember, actionable, and leaves no room for doubt.

I see no breakdown of incident number by years of experience in your papers.

Newbies are like toddlers, so they will fall more often and will skew the statistic. Nobody says that walking is a dangerous activity, just because toddlers are falling multiple times per day.

Still, cycling is the safest mode of transportation per km, so, if you want to improve safety significantly, convince drivers and pedestrians to wear helmets first. Cyclist will follow.

Falling safely is a motor skill. The way you "learn" it is by doing it, repeatedly, until your body starts to react in the right way. This is a problem for an adult cyclist on a road traveling at speed. There are consequences to falling. Many of us, however, have had enough experience during our youth on "single-track" to have racked up many falls onto soft ground at low speeds. That certainly helps to a certain extent.

Unfortunately, physics sometimes can present challenges that no human can adapt to regardless of practice. If your bike comes to hard stop when traveling fast enough, your body is going to do an "endo" and your face will impact the street in a matter of milliseconds. This happens before you can put your hands in front of your face. It can happen faster than your body can respond to the stimuli telling it that an crash is happening.

> physics sometimes can present challenges that no human ca adapt to regardless of practice.

Exactly, yes. I have a lot of the motor skill you’re talking about (road cycling, mountain biking, dirt moto biking, skydiving, skiing, etc.). And the more I have, the more helmets seem like a good idea.

Do you ever take your bike off any sweet jumps?

Bear in mind there's still a bike shortage right now. Something that fits your body and is comfortable is the most important thing. I'm 58 and an avid cyclist, but realized that my body just doesn't like road style bikes, so I actually dismantled my fancy Trek road bike and built something that was more comfortable to ride.

For me, making it easy to "just get out and ride" is the key thing. Even if it means less exciting rides. I don't have to get into special clothing or put my bike in a car and take it somewhere.

I also enjoy the outdoors in general. I treat it as a way to get away from technology for a while, so I'm into simple things like hiking, walking, cross country skiing, etc.

Yes. Get whatever bike fits you. And I love my Tern [1] foldable bicycle. It folds into a bag which I can take anywhere in my car or on the bus or train and bike when I get there.

[1] https://www.ternbicycles.com/us/bikes

Funny, I have been looking at Tern too (as well as Riese & Müller). Do you use it in the city as well? Which one do you have? How often do you really fold it up?

Alternatively, I've got a Brompton and I love the thing to bits. It folds in 30 seconds or less, small enough to put under a table at a coffee shop. They're incredibly well-built, and parts are easy to find. You can even get electric conversion kits.

I had a Brompton for about two years but did not like how it felt riding it to be honest. The rather weird six gear box thing and lack of disc brakes (especially in rain and winter) was also not that amazing

But yes, the folding mechanism is superb.

A simple one from Oggi, nothing too fancy. disk breaks, 29" wheels, front suspension. but it doesn't matter. The single most important thing is having an adequate bike seat for your anatomy and an aluminum frame which is not too heavy. The expensive stuff gets important if you're a competitive person.

Biking is a pillar of my mental health.

It instantly transports me to feeling 10 years old again, when I lived in a state of joy and acted on intuition.

There should be a shorthand phrase for "I agree with all parent nodes of this". Like a pseudo OOP-type syntax.

Buying a bike and riding it regularly was my single best investment in terms of physical and mental health. A close second would be resistance training equipment, but this depends on what kind of resistance training you decide to do.

I'd also say that part of the OP's issues stem from an expectation that one should always be passionate or excited about their work. Especially in tech, there's this weird idea that every job someone holds is something that resonates with them personally.

I think this expectation is strange and unreasonable. I think it's perfectly ok to view your job as "just a job". But if you truly want to pursue a job that resonates with you, you have a significant financial buffer to facilitate a career-change. As someone who didn't shift into programming until their mid-30s, I think mid-30s career changes are perfectly fine, and almost expected in a turbulent economy.

> There should be a shorthand phrase for "I agree with all parent nodes of this". Like a pseudo OOP-type syntax.

+1 to everything above

Ah cool, good to know

Please don't do this. Vote instead.

Vote-like comments such as "+1," "Disagree," and "This." take up vertical space and reading time. Yet they convey hardly any more meaning than a vote. Let the ranking and shading of comments reflect your opinion.

Check out the thread for context to understand what I was replying to (assuming this isn't an automated comment of some sort).

super() // :)

I disagree that this is bad form, but it’s a little shallow unless you’re contributing something along with your “I agree.” I also strongly disagree that downvotes should be used for disagreement. Downvotes are for discouraging low-value posts, not making things you disagree with disappear from the discussion.

I share your attitude toward voting. I confess it puts me on edge to vote for a constructive comment that I strongly disagree with.

That said, the HN guidelines actually don't specify the proper use of votes (unlike Reddit, whose stated voting philosophy is similar to yours). So my earlier comment doesn't go there. I can't say what HN voting is for, but I can say that vote-like comments are usually better expressed as votes.

Smoking is also terrible for your social life, unless you only prefer the company of smokers. Most of my childhood friends became weed/cigarette addicts. For my own well-being, I had to stop being in contact with them.

This was not my experience when I used to smoke. Stepping out for a cigarette was the easiest way to strike up a chat with a complete stranger. The best conversations I've ever had were probably done while smoking, with other smokers.

People who have never smoked just won't get it. There is no ice breaker in the world like a cigarette. My social life became harder once I quit, but my body thanks me for it.

Depend on what you do. I haven’t met anyone who actually smokes in the last year in the UK apart from a guy who was vaping in the middle of a hike and we all thought he was a dickhead.

You haven't seen anyone smoking in the UK at all? Are you in the north or south east?

No one at social events at all. South East / London.

It’s actually quite pleasant these days. Less nicotine all over stuff.

That's totally fair, but it looks like you commented to say you don't like smoking, and not to weigh in on the social aspects of it.

How is meat eating viewed in your social group?

Probably less popular than average across the UK but a good friend of mine will quite happily blast down a 22oz steak. Most of us are health and fitness conscious and that seems to intersect with vegetarian and vegan diets.

I am a vegetarian for ref.

As a non smoker, I still used to love chilling outside chatting to smokers. It would be quiet, relaxed, and everyone was open to the idea of just chatting whilst enjoying their cigarette.

The idea of standing still for 5 minutes and talking to whoever happens to be around seems farfetched outside of that social norm

But cycling doesn't cut it, right? Especially when you do it daily, you build some kind of immunity.

Can't even sweat from cycling. Of course, it depends on duration and probably weather. I guess winter affected my experience.

Running is way better for me.

Can’t sweat from cycling? Find a hill

And if that doesn't work, try doing it with a single gear heavy steel bike.

Without brakes.

Actually, I've unwillingly cycled without brakes once; My brakes broke mid-journey. Had to bump into something to stop, multiple times.

Not recommended.

If you want to sweat — lower tire pressure.

Running can be hard on the joints though. A mix of different exercize is best, if you can manage it. Both for health and to keep it interesting. I do running, cycling, swimming and kick boxing (less swimming during COVID).

There's really no evidence that running is hard on your joints, as long as you avoid serious injuries. If anything, studies have shown that those who run regularly have better mobility in old age.

I have seen that research too, and I believe it. However running is bad on joints for many people, including me.

I believe the difference that makes the difference is how good your joint alignment is before starting. If your alignment is bad the running can chronically damage the joints, if your alignment is good they will get only slightly damaged and regrow stronger, leading to the results shown in the studies. Survivorship bias means only people with good joint alignment will actually run enough to be included in a study.

The air moving around your body causes the sweat to dissipate, unless you are only going like 10mph, you are definitely sweating.

> But cycling doesn't cut it, right? Especially when you do it daily, you build some kind of immunity.

Yeah, it's called getting in shape.

Good things, but Memento Mori. No matter what you do, your health will fail eventually. Decide what your life is about and get about doing it.

That isn't the point the comenters above are making. They are saying that without good physical health it is extremely difficult, maybe impossible, to decide what your lifr is about and get doing about doing it for most people. Health fails eventually, yes-but being active and health conscious makes the end more bearable. My gym has a dozen or so 80+ year olds that could train circles around your average 20 year old.

I am 60 but very active and fit. Can't overstate the importance of it. It makes me feel young and I am constantly working on new projects, have lots of energy and general positive outlook. Clients do not believe my age when they see me. They think I am 40. Meanwhile at one point (year 2000) I was total physical and mental wreck after working as a lead architect for a company. Went on my own since then.

What I do - My daily exercise routine is - 2 hour cardio (hike, cycle, swim if summer) and every other day 4 sets of 20 chin ups or 4 sets of 20 triceps dips for strength. Cardio takes time, strength does not as I have bars right close to my computer in my office.

Sure, one day it will all go downhill and I'll croak but for now I enjoy the life just as well as when I was 20.

> My daily exercise routine is - 2 hour cardio

Do you have a full-time job? That would take most of my evenings if I decided to do it.

No one starts doing 2 hours of cardio. You can do 20-30 mins and be a lot better off than with 0.

You can do HIIT: 10s warmup and 4 sets of: 30 second high intensity work followed by 30 seconds break. That's 4m10s in total.

It's been clinically proven to help with vascular health (HDL cholesterol level goes up) and increase insulin receptiveness.

After quitting full time job in 2000 I started with 1 hr but very low intensity. After 3 month I've lost all of my pounds and was able to go for however long I want. Like 200km bike ride.

I did 2 - 2.5 hours of exercise for a brief time (around a year), years ago. You can't do it if you have children, but otherwise it can be done. I started work at 7:00 and left at 15:00. Adding transportation I'd normally be home around 18:15 in the evening. I think the key is to not have other obligations (at least not to many) and a minimum of transportation time.

My daughter is adult and being on my own since 2000 relieved me from wasting time on commute except occasional visit to client. The only obligation I have is to my wife and often we ride, hike etc together or with friends.

Bike ride, hike or swim in the evening - I do not even consider it exercise. For me it is fun. Often doing it with my friends.

As for job - I am on my own and develop products for clients and for my own company.

Totally seconded.

I feel that from the biological point of view, the brain evolved to serve the body (mostly for locomotion) and it's level of function is tightly related to fitness in general

While true, it'd be a silly excuse to stop you from working out into old age.

+1 on all of them.

I would add reading. That has helped me a lot to calm down.

Re health: I recently discovered a great blog with in-depth articles about how to lose weight: https://physiqonomics.com

PS: Don't get distracted by the seemingly arrogant profile picture. His content is really good.

Well, he does actually look like that. And he’s only 25, so he’s still a bit arrogant :-)

But, what he’s saying agrees with my experience, at three times his age: train with weights, have a caloric deficit emphasizing low carb, and walk for an hour on the days you aren’t lifting.

https://physiqonomics.com/cardio-or-weights/

You can't have a caloric deficit as a long-term lifestyle choice: eventually you would waste away. But perhaps it's good advice anyway because most people could benefit from it in the short term.

He actually has content on how to stop a low-deficit diet once your happy with your weight.

After few years of training and being lead by a personal trainer and a dietician I'd add one thing:

It's crucial to have a high BMR - basal metabolic rate, when going into a deficit.

Any deficit will cause body to lower the BMR and, if it's going into < 1800kcal/day (for man) it will generally result in problems.

Body is very adaptable and will just shut down any energy hungry "facilities": lower body temperature ("I'm cold all the time", "I always have cold last two fingers"), increase sleep duration, decrease immune responses ("Why I get flu all the time in season, while others don't?") and so on.

It will loose fat, but if BMR is low, then it's also in the shock mode, where it will want to get that back as fast as possible, with some extra. That's how the yoyo effect work on physiological level.

So, start cutting on BMR of 2500-3000. It won't drop into dangerous levels and will be lower impact on the body

Actually there is a big school of thought that low basal rate makes you live longer and a high one makes you live fast and die.

Any source?

Read up on caloric restriction and longevity. This link came up but there are others. Not sure how solid this theory is, I am just mentioning it because OP was very sure it's the other way around.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4262579/#:~:tex...

Good read. I should edit my comment out and replace BMR with metabolic rate

I took up reading during the quarantine and it changed my life

Anything in particular that you would recommend?

Agree on health. It’s important to bear in mind that health can suddenly go bad, which in turn means that you should make the most of the present rather than thinking “I can postpone doing X,Y,Z” until I’m older.

My father died when he was 59 and had lifestyle-limiting illnesses for the last decade of his life. Bearing this in mind, I went down to a three-day working week aged 56 and then fully retired two years later. I’ve looked after my health but six months ago had an unpredicted episode of Ventricular Fibrillation for genetic rather than lifestyle reasons. I was fitted with an ICD and quickly got back to my physical health but under UK law had to surrender my driving license and I’m now stuck waiting for my application for a new one to work through our bureaucracy.

On balance I wish I’d fully retired slightly earlier.

Coming back to other points that are made here, I found in my last few years at work that the technology was ‘same-old same-old’ and that I found working with talented youngsters (sometimes as a formal mentor) the most rewarding part of my job. Perhaps I was just lucky, but I helped four younger people to go past me on the corporate ladder, and in turn they all looked out for me later on. I was also able to work in an environment where I was viewed as a principal customer-facing techie, rather than having to remain totally corporate. This in fact reduced my career-development options (as I was out on site with the customers rather than being highly visible to my bosses) but I viewed this as a positive.

Another +1 for health, which is easy to improve by exercising. I started exercising (simple pushups and pullups) in 2019 and running a year ago. My social life has improved by this as well, it's just easier to do things when you're healthy. People also start making remarks about my physique, which is also nice :)

I was lucky to make new intimate friends as well around that time, which also really helps feeling connected. Exercise you just do, but for friendship you need some luck.

100% on 1&2 but would qualify, ime, travel is a cheap thrill if you overdo it. It's great to shake things up once in awhile, but not something the average person wants to sustain on a regular basis. Personal projects, hobbies, and sociable fun become the long-invested experiences

Yes travel holds zero appeal for me. It seems like a waste of time and money. I would be quite happy never leaving my small town. Doing other productive things is inspiring, however.

+1 on 1. Health!

It might be personal and specific to me exactly, but focusing on health has made the best impact on my general well being and offset my "I feel old and tired" vibe.

I started out with the most general advice reg. sleep, food and exercise. I noticed that most of my peers tend to get better quicker. That made me dig deeper and I actually discovered some interesting cause and the chain of events that ultimately lead to me being sleepy, groggy and not wanting to take an action in most life activities besides top priorities, which I mostly powered through.

I believe that the general feeling is at many times, a signal from the body and strongly influences our thoughts. Like the split brain patients, that are rationalizing actions in an obviously wrong way (the left/right eye experiment, where patient comes up with elaborate explanations about, what the other hemisphere came up with).

We just feel bad - which is low level physiological cue - and translate that to all sorts of high-level frontal cortex artefacts. As the OP mentioned: former fun things aren't cutting it anymore.

I also very strongly recommend learning about mental health. My biggest gem was dr K and his channel HealthyGamer on youtube. Like, this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuZ8G_ERYUw

I've binged a lot of his videos and he advanced my understanding of psychology from "people can be sociopaths, depressed, narcissists [etc.]" into more nuanced and refined level. He also provides some tools, that can actually help in real life

+1 on health, but especially fitness. There is no health without it. In last few years it was all too easy to stop doing sports, but there should be less excuse now. If you are afraid of getting infected, go outdoor!

+ Health + Travel + find something that wakes you up in morning and work on it

This is excellent advice, I couldn't agree more with Health. Everything else will pretty much fall into place once you take care of it. It will be easier to meet people, you will not have mood swings, or lack confidence. Your mind will be sharper and can think better!

One thing that gets missed often is spiritual health. I believe it's as equally important as physical and mental health. I'm not advocating for extremist religious dogma but at a minimum, I think one should figure out their belief structure one way or another. I recommend to give this matter some thought, research various religions, philosophy and history and make your own conclusions.

On the subject of social contacts, the biggest thing to realize is that our world is shaped by our minds. This means that how your perceive yourself and other people will have a huge impact on your ability to connect with others.

If you constantly see strangers as a threat, or as judgmental people, or "label" yourself as antisocial/timid/unattractive, etc then other people will unconsciously pick up on it. Humans have mirror neurons and can read micro expressions, we are social mammals after all. As a side note, women are _really_ good at this, don't be fooled! you can't _fake_ it! The only way is to actually feel good inside and clear your heart and mind..

Best of luck to OP!

One way towards spiritual health is to find wonder in things beyond my control, and for me that is primarily looking at the moon and stars, augmented by walls in the woods and noticing phenology—-what animals are active when, noticing frost on the ground, posting attention to the wind direction by feel, things like this. I don’t ascribe any meaning to any of this, just immerse myself in the observation practice.

Agreed on the spirituality. I have felt similarly unhappy as the original poster & some others on the thread. Stuck in corporate unfulfilling tech job. 2 years ago, I was able to break free (happy to share if folks are curious to hear).

This advice has worked for me, it could work for you:

(1) Health: actively prioritize good sleep, learn to cook some mediterranean dishes (easy, tasty, exotic, healthy, good as leftovers). Make lots, and share with people. Cook the same dishes a bunch of times until its muscle memory, then try something new. If you are into weed - smoking a J, putting on fun music, turning the lights down & doing some cooking / meal prep - seriously, one of the most fun activities, and so helpful.

(2) Fitness: yoga (google "sun salutations" - 10 min & you're good), 1000% embrace #bikeLife (great exercise, dramatically helps unwind the mind, it's a hobby you can do for most of your life, lots of mechanical fiddling), and wear a helmet 100% of the time. Try a social racquet sport (squash when its cold, pickleball when warm). Squash is my #1 favorite, recommended sport. Easy to learn, low impact, tons of cardio (1000+ kcal burned / hr), tons of fun, great community, internationally played, & you can play it until you're old. Pay for 5 lessons. It's worth whatever money it costs.

(3) Spirituality. Check into Buddhism. It's a highly practical way to think about & live your life & purpose. I strongly suggest this book (its a quick read, uses plain speech / low jargon, highly actionable throughout the day). It does a great job of explaining how happiness works (I want to say "mentally mechanically"), wanting/shoulding, being observant & intentional of emotion-thought-word-action chains. It's had a huge positive impact on my own sense of worth, relationships with people around me, the feeling of life purpose - good stuff. This is the book:

Eight Mindful Steps to Happiness: Walking the Buddha's Path (Meditation in Plain English) https://www.amazon.com/dp/0861711769/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apip_Cah...

(4) Music. Learn to play an instrument. Check out piano. It's WAY easier than you think it is. You already know computer keyboard shortcuts & combos. Same thing works in piano. Youtube Search for "4 chord song axis of awesome". You can learn that exact song in an afternoon, and you have that skill - and ability to express- all those songs for life. When there is any decision in your life that involves a music option, lean into it.

Hang out with healthy & interesting old people - do what they do, ask their advice.

I asked my grandmother of 95 years - still healthy of mind - "What get's you up in the morning each day?". Without missing a beat, she said "Music." She plays piano, sings, dances (wiggles these days). It makes her soul alive, and brings joy to the people around her.

To put that Thought into Action, I bought a little MIDI keyboard, plugs into computer or ipad. Garageband makes it so easy. I can't believe I had that app on my Mac for 15+ years and never thought to seriously play around with it. Making fun hilarious synth songs are dead simple, and tons of fun - especially with a friend, partner, etc. I went from "there is no way I can play a musical instrument, I have to just accept this in my life & move on." to being able to sit down at a piano in any bar, and slam out some fun honky tonk / blues. In 3 months. Music can seriously be used as a mental health tool. When I am feeling down, I can now "procrastinate" on the piano for 15 min as a reward. I try to play the most ridiculous epic concert to myself (so many dumbass epic Spinal Tap style solos). After that, I can feel that the "cloudy soul" / clenched chest anxious feeling is replaced with an enlivened soul vibe. All this to say, I'm now convinced that music is the key to this life. Seriously consider checking it out. If you know anyone who plays an instrument, ask them "could you show me how to do the easiest cool thing?" This is never a chore to a musician, and usually makes their whole day. Get lessons with a real person - a true performer, the best you can find. A couple hours of their time would be GOLD.

Finally: Listen to Earl Nightengale, and find a way to play the album on shuffle every morning (you can use an Alexa Routine to shuffle play the Spotify playlist). Earl Nightengale's advice has been the #1 thing that helped me shift from an unfulfilling life to a life I am actually excited to wake up to.

https://open.spotify.com/track/5tTvGc18CCgyDrye65PAGP?si=Z7x...

I can say from experience in my own life, that the advice works. Best of luck on the journey.

I’m curious in the “breaking free from unfulfilling corporate tech job” part

I agree with all of this, and just want to add a note about mental health; take your stress levels seriously and learn to know your triggers.

While most of us working in tech tend to live pretty cushy lives, but, we are surrounded by silly frustrations and limitless distractions that can sum up and become pretty stressful. Learning to spot, "I'm getting stressed" and finding some way of mitigating this is really important. It changes your mood dramatically.

Interestingly, the three things the parent mentions are actually all good ways of mitigating stress.

A second note: you don't have to do "running" or aerobic exercise if it ain't your thing. I see a lot of people think "exercise" means go running or biking, something aerobic. I tend to think, if you need music to get you "in the mood" to work out, it's probably not your thing. Just experiment. I eventually found olympic weightlifting. I'm now significantly fitter than I was in my 20s as well. The best exercise is the one you feel inspired to keep up with naturally.

Finally, learn to experiment without needing to be "amazing". Just do it for the fun. The whole "Get Back" series about the Beatles was eye-opening for a lot of people, mostly because of how mundane it really was. I don't think McCartney or Lennon ever sat down to write a "profound" song, they just scratched an itch, over and over again.

You should do some form of aerobic exercise if you're working out for health reasons. Cardiovascular health is important and will make you feel "fitter" on an every day basis.

I would just add, do something altruistic and social. We're social creatures and we need to belong. Be a contributing member of a community.

I agree on all points but there is another after the ones you've listed.

Join the movement and push for a cure for old age. There's no reason for us to die beyond things that should be correctable through medical science. The sooner we have this breakthrough, the better for everyone. Multiple different organizations and groups currently support various means and methods of achieving this goal. I myself plan to start local advocacy and even throw my hat into a federal primary just to have it listed as my candidate position.

+1 on health as well. I worked at SpaceX earlier in my career. Others wrote about how having just a career for meaning in your life can have downsides and I wholeheartedly agree. Let me tell you that job gave me meaning, novelty everyday, launching rockets into space, non work friends always asking questions.

The downside for me was I absolutely neglected my health because work was more meaningful than basically anything else, relationships, fitness, family. Focusing on fitness, when I left the company I realized how terrible my health situation was. Lots of late nights, lunch at my desk, and lack of physical activity took a huge toll.

Getting to a healthier state fixed all the usual stuff, but also unexpectedly gave me mental happiness and has made me a better data scientist as well. I wrote a blog post detailing out why desk nerds should very much consider taking on healthy habits, and it brings me so much joy to see others here have seen similar results as well.

https://ravinkumar.com/WhyFitness.html

Going to the gym and progressing in any sport made a huge difference for me.

> 2. Social contacts. Get out there and make friends. In my case i signed up to Meetup and just attended random stuff until people stuck. This usually involves hiking, pubs and bars, restaurant nights out.

I think a problem that a lot of people struggled with, especially those in their late 20s/30s that haven't quite settled down yet, is that corona has made this a lot harder (depending on region) in the last few years. Same on point 3 actually.

Fully agree with your points though; after breaking up with my girlfriend (whom I met on meetup btw) a number of years ago doing pretty much exactly these thing really helped me get back on my feet and went from "I feel like shit all the time" to "I have great new friends whom I do fun new stuff with, a girlfriend, and generally feel pretty darn good" in a matter of about two weeks.

Right now it's a lot harder though, and has been for a while, since both are much harder where I live, which has translated in various problems including feeling more or less like the OP is describing.

I do not mean to tear down OP, but you are 35 and have $500k in savings. You lived in other countries, had startups and worked at a big company. You are not lost, you are one of the 1%. It sounds like you did a lot and now "normal" life that the rest of have to go through seems sucky. It is.

I have years of experience, not 1/5th your savings, have not traveled and now I am actually too old for "big company" to hire me. This is not said for you to fell for me, go feel good about yourself. It sounds like you did a lot. Figure out now what makes you _feel_ good inside and pursue that (you know, unless its spending all of your savings on vices). Time is running out? Come back here and say that twenty years from now. I think life was just starting for a lot of people when they hit 35.

Wow I just wanted to say thanks for this comment.

Although life starts for a lot of people at 35, I envy those people who are able to start much earlier. These are the people who have their first relationships in high school and college, find their life partner in early twenties, get the right job, a house, kids, keep their friend circle, invest money as early as possible, god damn. They live perfect fuckin lives and it’s all because they bravely jumped in and embraced life early on and focused on relationships with the people around them rather than mope around being shy, playing too many video games, jacking off into oblivion, wasting time chasing startup ideas that were never gonna go anywhere…

Sometimes they also get lucky. IMHO, to actually find the right partner for you in your early 20s is damn lucky.

My wife and I have been together since we were 16. Damn lucky. Watching all the people we know on Facebook looks like some kind of hellscape.

> They live perfect fuckin lives

Do they though? Everyone has their own demons to contend with and seemingly perfect lives frequently fall apart further down the road due to regrets and pent-up frustrations.

Everyone has demons, even perfect people have perfect little demons. But as a person who has lived a broken life, I guarantee you my demons are far larger and more monstrous than theirs. My demons would eat their demons for protein.

At 28, this describes me exactly. Found my partner in college, bought a nice 4-bedroom house in a nice area close to friends/family. Financially stable with plenty of time to spend on creative hobbies. We both “jumped in” to moderately lucrative careers early and are now in very comfortable positions at companies that more or less contribute to the good. By all appearances a perfect life which truly results in many days of happiness. It still feels empty/pointless. I’m too embarrassed to complain to those around me, but sometimes I wish I could buy into religion or child-rearing so that I would have a pre-manufactured purpose, and wouldn’t have to keep searching for one constantly. I think when the pandemic is over we’ll try traveling more to see if that scratches the itch.

The reason you feel this way is because you’ve never been on the other side. Imagine reaching mid thirties, no more friends, no partner, no real prospects, and getting older is making it harder to attract quality females. Your only source of somewhat human interaction is writing on the internet. It is a life of quiet desperation. There is only one goal, to accumulate money, watch graphs go up and to the right. Money is the only way to have relevance in this society, the only salvation from becoming invisible in the dating pool. And I know money can’t really make you happy, but it’s the only thing that has truly taken care of me over the years. Would you really trade your life for this? You found someone thing good, hold onto it. It will all be over soon enough one day.

> Money is the only way to have relevance in this society, the only salvation from becoming invisible in the dating pool.

This depends on what bubble you are in. It might be true for most of the society, but there are many subcultures that have different values. Think about any job that is not associated with making money, or any hobby that does not require buying expensive stuff; you will probably find such people there.

Money is simply the "common language" of people who have nothing else in common. If you have nothing in common with someone, money is the most reliable way to impress them. But this is like the laziest strategy ever (well, except for the part where you make the money, that part may be pretty difficult). Step one, find a subculture focused on something you enjoy - now you have another way to be socially relevant. Step two... well, if the specific subculture happens to have more women than men (statistically should be true for about half of the subcultures), the step two is just to enjoy life and be nice to people around you.

Picking up hobbies to meet women is miserable. I actually do not want to meet any kind of women while doing my hobbies, I do not want something pure to be distracted with prurient thoughts.

I haven't been on the other side, and I think I mentioned that I feel silly complaining about this life. But my version of life also feels like "a life of quiet desperation." I suppose it's better with a partner than it would be without, just as it's better with money than without, but that feels like splitting hairs in the face of existential meaninglessness.

Do you have an idea of what your ideal life would be?

I think it would start with "not having to work to live" and from there cascade into lots of time spent building personal projects and playing Scrabble with my parents. What would yours be?

I think we find happiness in service to a community. It can be religion or family, or it can be mentoring, community service, activism, etc. It could be as basic as visiting a retirement home or walking dogs at a shelter. It's pretty hard to feel empty ennui while seeing the gratitude in someone's eyes. And the world is chock-full of lonely, needy people.

I would be careful with that line of thinking. We often envy illusion. We don't truly know that 'those people' are living nearly as wonderful a life as we're inclined to think they are. Further, in my experience, the "perfect life" is always one moment away from "disaster" - be it a health complication, sudden loss, or any of the myriad of ways things go awry. Pain and suffering is not something any of us seems likely to avoid in this life, and inflicting misery upon ourselves due to comparison with what is likely projected fantasy is just one of its many shades.

i mean the gist of the post is right most things are better then

> rather than mope around being shy, playing too many video games, jacking off into oblivion,

even if their lives are not perfect there are better ways to spend your time then this

Precisely. The OP is describing himself as a stereotype of Redditor/4Chan user.

You can be unhappy without reducing your daily life to a meme.

I used to think this way, especially after attending weddings of friends who've been together since their early 20s. Recently, one of those 'perfect' couples got divorced. Two attractive, charismatic, financially set individuals who couldn't make it work anymore. Together 10 years, living together for 5, married for 4.

Part of the issue for them is that they both feel they didn't explore their options enough when they were young and attractive (they still are).

It's a different problem than those faced by people who barely enjoyed romantic lives growing up. But for them, it turned out to be a big enough to end their marriage.

> You are not lost, you are one of the 1%.

Please don't dismiss OP so quickly. One person can very well be lost *because* they are in the 1%.

Things like starting a career and putting your abilities to test can be a huge motivator. Once you reach such goals live can suddenly turn meaningless for many people.

What's your age? I know several people between 55-60 that got hired at FAAMG companies

I'm 73. So yes, when I was 35 I more or less thought my life was over. But the best is yet to come. Think about being in the same room for 35 years. No matter what the room is like, it becomes utterly and completely boring. So get out.

Where to go? For me, the answer came about from wondering what I was capable of becoming. You are not a programmer, or painter or duck or politician. You are capable of becoming anything - well almost. Art always made my heart sing, and while I am not a great artist, I now believe almost everyone can be at least a very good artist of some kind in some form. It is who we are - to sing or paint or write or whatever. And how can you find out if you are the Van Gogh of knitting unless you try?

And yes to the physical side of your being. If you have never done the equivalent of running 15 miles, or hiking up a mountain, or hiking a hundred miles then you just are not getting who you are. (Scaled of course to whatever is a "mountain" for you.) Go for it. [edit change year to room]

Thanks! It is good to hear from an optimistic 73 year old. Just a decade shy of that mark, I am working out how I will transition to the next phase. Intellectually I know that step one needs to be more physical activity-inertia can be a killer. Thanks again for the inspiration.

I think I understand what you're feeling. I'm lucky to have found my way through my period of feeling lost, and have come to a pretty good place as I approach 45 (fathered my first child two years ago, have increasingly good relationships with my partner, family, friends, etc, and have new career/startup opportunities taking shape that are exciting to me). But it's been a long road of feeling very lost and doing deep soul searching to get here.

Some places I'd recommend looking for guidance/inspiration/support:

- Writers/speakers on topics relating to "the meaning crisis"; people like John Vervaeke, Iain McGilchrist, Rafia Morgan and Jonathan Pageau. There are some good video interviews with them and others on the Rebel Wisdom YouTube channel.

- Consider a men's group (assuming you're male; equivalent groups exist for women and other identity groups); I've been in a local chapter of Evryman for the past couple of years, and others I've known have been in The Mankind Project. These kinds of groups can be a great way to connect with other men who are seeking meaning and encouragement to achieve better life outcomes. I've seen some amazing transformations in the men I've known to go through these groups.

- Don't think you're "just depressed". While of course it's possible you could have a clinical condition, and it's worth exploring that and seeking treatment if need be, don't let people tell you that feeling lost in this world is merely a sign of depression. It can be a very healthy reaction to notice that the world is pretty messed up and to feel that there must be a way to find a more fulfilling life path.

Also, feel free to contact me (email address in profile). I'm thinking about starting a new kind of community for people who are looking to heal and grow.

All the best to you.

Time for everything IS running out. And no, there's no roadmap that shows you how to stop feeling lost. I'm 52 and that feeling becomes ever more intense. I wonder how I got here so quickly. I'm told THAT feeling intensifies at 70. That said, the way I deal with it is to accept. I accept my age; the feeling of time's fleetingness; that I will cease to be (god/Jesus, Viracocha, Mandaeism, Zoroastrianism... are constructs that do little to overcome this feeling).

And so I live trying to being aware of each passing moment, and thinking about how I might better use the next moment. I have a personal web site on which I wrote down every major event in my life, and when I feel low I read that. I've achieved and done a lot. And I want to do a lot more. Mostly much more loving. In the both carnal and (obviously seperately) paternal senses.

I have hobbies I love - I did not pick one randomly because one should have a hobby, but because I truly love building those things. Creating something I recognise as beautiful is rewarding as f•••.

I also keep fit and healthy and take some pride in having lasted so many years without gaining weight other than muscle mass. I've done a variety of drugs, I've broken the law, and I'm ok with all of that because I think I've loved more people than I've hurt.

All these things... there's no meaning or other weird existential shit that comes of it. Other than being at peace with myself, my place in this fleeting existence, and enjoying as much of it as I can, while I can.

In parting, try sitting in a meeting and if there are women in the meeting, watch how men just talk right over them. And then interrupt those men, turn to the marginalised woman, and tell her you found her perspective interesting, and would she mind terribly repeating her thoughts. This is a probably hugely incoherent ramble about how I have learnt to actively try to get past what you describe. Some days are rough, most days amazing.

Firstly, stop this rubbish about getting old; with current life expectancies I wouldn't even consider someone middle aged until they are their forties. Old is probably late sixties to seventies. You still have a long way to go :-)

Secondly, stop trying to define your life by "achieving". I know this is a difficult one, I'm still (sort of) struggling with this one. Achievements are ephemeral. Only an incredibly tiny minority of people achieve anything really significant, and even then those significant achievements often only touch a small minority of the world. It helps to bear in mind that about 99.9999% of the worlds population have no awareness of your existence.

The problem with trying to achieve something awesome is that either you never manage it; in which case you are left permanently unfulfilled and with a sense of failure; or you do achieve it, in which case: what then? You are suddenly left having to find another goal.

I think it is better to just find small ways to enjoy your life and work as much as you need to support those interests.

I am 51 and I still go to see bands at pubs regularly. I know people in their 30s right through to their 70s who are still going out watching rock bands. Hell, I know a couple guys who play in bands and their mum, who has just turned 90, still goes out to see them play and likes a dance. I also go to little festivals with friends who are all in their 50's and 60's.

If you are feeling too old when you go to bars and stuff you are probably going to venues that have a younger crowd. Look around and you can find plenty of places that are patronised by people that are a similar age to you. Many of those, both male and female will be single and probably feeling some of the same things you do.

Finally, don't feel alone in this. There are vast numbers of people who feel similar to you. I am single and have been for a very long time, but just recently - completely by chance - have sort of stumbled into something promising. I also handed in my notice at work recently and finish at the end of the month. I am taking a year off to just enjoy myself and am very excited about it.

Good luck, and don't beat yourself up about stuff. Just remember, we're all a bit lost and stumbling through life the best we can :-)

This is a great answer, and similar to mine. I feel there are a couple of things which happen around 35.

- As a child, you feel special. At 35, it's as if you have been out so far from receiving presents from Santa that you sort of cross the heliosphere into interstellar space. You're no longer special. You're no longer the future in this society which has drilled into us the idea of (if you're from the US) American exceptionalism. It's now your turn to do meaning making for others.

- 35 is the breaking point for carrying the old structures which defined your identity. The above plays a big part in that tipping point. You were in a cocoon, which was crafted by society to get you to this breaking stage so that you could create your own reality. The entire time, you were changing. 35ish is the point where things start crashing down.

- Along with the above, there's often another event which helps tip you over. Loss of a relationship and a job will usually do the trick.

- Once you emerge from the cocoon, you're like "WTF?" Where am I? Who am I? What do I do now? The answer is, you're now free, do whatever TF you like! Though this isn't an overnight change. It's the start of a learning process to live in this new existence. It's like you have been born and have to figure out how to walk again, except you have to do this while paying rent.

Maybe not everyone goes through this. But I sure did!

Thanks for this, it really resonates.

I'd add therapy/coaching helps in making sense of the journey, as you can't really figure out everything about you from within.

Therapy is a good point, especially if you're in the group where financial position isn't part of a problem. I suspect there's far more people who could benefit from therapy than is currently utilizing it.

Edit: Check out my other comment in this thread as well, I went a bit deeper there.

This is a wonderful post, and really represents my lived experience for the past few years. It's like having to start all over again - a complete dismemberment experience - only with 1/10th the energy and 100x the responsibilities (ie: kids).

Your words inspire me and help me to feel that there's an after, because it's been a very long and grueling few years.

Thank you for this post, it strongly resonates with me. I recently went through the breaking point you were talking about.

I think experiencing both disillusionment in being someone special, and realisation of the freedom to choose what I want to do myself while recognising and deliberately taking responsibilities that define my boundaries were a big step forward in my life.

What helped you to pass through this change? Any books, teachings, meditation, etc?

Good post.

> Secondly, stop trying to define your life by "achieving".

It's easier said than done, but once I started focusing on the journey instead of the destination everything became much more enjoyable.

I used to get angry when something would not go to plan, but now I view it as a good story in the making. Bugs being discovered in code are now fun problems to solve. I power lifted for years and learned to enjoy the grind because I might go months before being able to add weight to a lift. Now I train jiu-jitsu and instead of thinking about some end state, I focus on enjoying the suck when getting smashed. Even something simple like raining outside. I don't run to my car, I purposely walk and enjoy the drops on my face.

It may sound silly, but this focus on the journey and being comfortable being uncomfortable really changed me for the better according to my friends and SO.

<<Firstly, stop this rubbish about getting old; with current life expectancies I wouldn't even consider someone middle aged until they are their forties. Old is probably late sixties to seventies. You still have a long way to go :-)>>

Definitely agree here. When you look at it from a "midlife" angle, let's use some round numbers. Let's say that life is really kicking into high gear as you finish college at ~20yrs old. Make another guess as to the mortality event at ~80yrs. A 60 year diff, so 20+diff = ~50 as the midpoint. You're only halfway there and there is an infinity of experiences and things to learn out there.

As many have surmised, if you are having trouble getting out of bed to face the day, you could be clinically depressed.

The thing to keep in mind is that you will always feel too old for something. When you're 18 you're too old to play, when you're 25 you're too old to party like a teenager, etc. But there's always something fun you can do at your age, and 35 is young. You can definitely go to festivals, you can travel, live in hostels, go surfing, snowboarding whatever.

But it's understandable that you're less excited about things, at 35 you're sort of programmed to have a young family. As you age that gets increasingly important. I still love extreme sports, travelling etc but compared to my kids it's just laughably pointless.

So use your financial freedom and take a year to get in great shape mentally and physically, train, travel, read and socialise. At the end of that you'll have no trouble getting hitched, and to be honest that's what matters, no matter what "voluntary" singles will tell you.

I know I will be downvoted for this but it's just the truth. I sacrifice my score in order to help you...

Feel free to email me btw if you want to talk about it, I've gone through very similar periods and know what it's like.

I remember feeling similar when I was about your age. All of a sudden I looked around and, where I was spending my time, everyone was a lot younger and I felt out of place. I didn’t want to be the old guy in the room.

So I made changes. Big changes. Rearchitected my life, if you will. They were not easy. But I’ve learned a ton over the journey. I miss the old life, and I’m grateful for this life I made, worlds apart from where I was before. And I don’t think about how it could have been, because that’s not how it is.

Now I’m in a similar situation again. I’m evaluating what changes I want to make. I think a lot about where I’ve been and where I want to be in 10 years, which helps me shape my decision making.

But it’s the little voice inside that I have to pay real close attention to before I make any big change. When I feel out of touch with that little voice, I know I need to work on my spiritual connection.

It’s not an easy place to be feeling lost, out of place, not sure what to do. I know that feeling very well. I was feeling it yesterday like a ton of sand weighing on my soul.

But today’s a new day. And I’m feeling alive. Thank you for your post, and this chance to think through my own decision making. Carpe diem!

What kinds of changes did you make, what did you learn from it? How do you go about rearchitecting and decision making?

> All of a sudden I looked around and, where I was spending my time, everyone was a lot younger and I felt out of place.

I have the same feeling, and it's astonishing to me how quickly it happened. I went from feeling in the same age group as 20-somethings to feeling like their uncle in a year. I doubt I changed so much externally, but I'm amazed at how abrupt the change was.

It wasn't just a few things being out of place, then some more, then some more. I went from "I belong here" to "I don't belong here" basically instantly.

Just turned 35. Suffering very similarly, though minus the savings.

I saw a therapist for 2 years which helped a little and got me to the point where I realised I needed to get out of London, as it felt impossible to build deep relationships.

So I recently moved to a much smaller city and am making new friends and connections here and trying to build these relationships much deeper than I have in the past. I think it's helping but when I'm home, alone, the malaise begins to return.

I've also lost pretty much all my enthusiasm for tech lately, so I've gone down to a 4 day week, though I often feel like I'm "wasting" the extra free day off.

However, one of my new friends here is going through a coding bootcamp and talking with them about tech makes me feel enthusiastic again, so I'm considering how to move to some kind of teaching/tutoring role. I've volunteered as a mentor for bootcamp students, to get a taste, but that's not started yet - I shall see!

I can say from experience that teaching / tutoring is extremely rewarding, even when you do it for free. Harkens back to those days when we were starting out and getting super frustrated. Try and be the teacher you wish you'd had back then and watch the lights go on when they finally grok a concept :)

We're not so different in age, and I'd be lying if I said I never feel the way you describe. However, these are some things that helped me, in increasing order of importance:

- Health. Covered already, but I'd add that you don't need to be in marathon shape. Just hit the basics: sleep, exercise (walking is enough!), diet. It's easy to feel things are ok in any of these dimensions but actually be out of whack.

- Do things with your hands. Humans develop insofar was they learn to manipulate the physical environment around them. This is one of the tenets of the Montessori pedagogy, but I found that it doesn't just apply to kids! I feel _great_ when I install a toilet, paint my living room, fix the car. There's just something about physically doing stuff with your hands.

- This one is hard to describe...I took inventory of my 'philosophical operating system' and realized that I was organizing my life around something without legs. In my 20's I was heavily influenced by stuff like '4-hour-workweek' (lol), the gary-vees, the pg essays, etc. It's not jut practical advice...it's a philosophical system and worldview. When I looked under the hood, it was all spaghetti code. It couldn't stand up to more cogent and complete philosophies, which I found literally down the street.

35 with 500k and you feel lost, I'm 47 single with 15k and I feel ok. This post blows my mind, it's not about money it's about mindset. You can do pretty much anything you want. Find a new hobby, Buy a boat learn to sail, climb mountains, do car racing. I don't know, you have everything, and at 35 you're still young. I wish I had 35 with 500k in savings.

For me those feelings are exacerbated by the housing situation, and inflation running hot.

In a high cost of living area, there are two tiers of human being:

1 Those who have purchased a home before the insanity, and have a stability around their housing location and costs.

2 Those who are renting.

A few scenarios. Let's take the 500K figure and the number 2. Number 2 can't quit their jobs to climb mountains and do yoga, because inflation is running hot at 7 percent and in a high cost of living area, that 500K will be depleted rapidly.

The Number 2 can't even take a PAUSE from their tech jobs, because hiring managers see gaps in CV's as red flags. Another red flag is simply being old. So Number 2 MUST continually jump from job to job.

The feeling of excitement about things comes to play in the question of whether one has a choice in the matter; you work in tech because it pays well and you can be house secure. If you can pause and come back, then you can explore yourself and career options. If you can't pause at all, then all you have are therapy or drugs to tolerate the hamster wheel of tech worker life.

500K is a lot on a global scale, it's in the top percentage of the world. But in the HCOL areas (SF, Seattle, NYC), 500K is, unfortunately, not 'enough' to be secure. You can be secure for a couple of years, but unless you put your belongings in storage and spend time in another country (another country that isn't Europe, also expensive), you will deplete your savings AND be an unemployed middle age (35 is too young for that, but 40 is not too young for this risk) person.

One can do all the yoga, clean living, therapy and child-rearing (all the suggestions below), but no one is addressing 'housing security'.

The Number 2 can move to a low cost of living place. Plenty of small towns around the world and even in the US where 500k will set you up with housing security and free time to do yoga, clean living, therapy, and child-rearing.

Why people don’t consider this option seriously is a different consideration entirely.

Not everyone has fully remote. In fact the largest employers of tech in New York are going the opposite way. I.e. financial services.

In January the business leaders met with the Governor and the Mayor to figure out how to encourage people to come back. It's really happening. Even with hybrid, cheap housing means long commute times.

500k USD is enough to not have a 9-5 if you don’t live/work in an urban area and/or are willing to make some sacrifices like unfamiliarity with the local language. The point is to exit the rat race.

42 y.o. Here. I put it in perspective, try to stay reasonably healthy, and live by the mantra "Never lament getting old. It's a privilege denied to many." Giving back to younger generations is also very rewarding.

Hey it's me your younger generations.

Seriously though, I take special pleasure in helping people directly. Giving to charity helps but getting to know people and giving a hand directly is even more rewarding I've found.

I turned 40 recently, and it hit me like a tonne of bricks. My relationship had just ended, my startup had gone on ice thanks to Covid, and the international move I'd just made reversed in the space of days (due to the break-up). The feeling of "what am I doing with my life?" hit hard, I'd already been doing therapy for a while, but the lack of fulfilment and satisfaction is still there.

Technology bores me mostly, even though it's what I'm good at. I feel like time is running out to do something, I just don't know what that something is. It's really tough to figure out what you want to do, and how you go about doing it.

BUT you're not alone! Speaking to friends, and possibly to a therapist, will help you to process the feelings that you're having, and may help to take steps forward. I'm trying to find enjoyment in tech again, but if I don't then I'm going to go find enjoyment in something else - likely something drastic, knowing my history! Ride a bike, go on holiday, join a club, read a book. There's so much out there, it's about being brave enough to go and do something different.

At least that's what it is for me.

If you get bored by technology but want to give it another shot, see if you can find meaning around making it work for and with other people.

Perhaps you have an offline community that could benefit from some kind of automation, like generating tax receipts from a PDF template or organizing their resources and processes in a way (website?) that's useful for members.

Perhaps you're passionate about user freedoms, you explore an open source desktop environment and related apps but you find that it's still lacking in usability, stability or features. You dive in to make it better and in addition to doing good things for society as a whole, you also form bonds with other members of that developer community, first online, later at in-person meetups.

Perhaps you have an interest in mentoring and learning from each other, so you find like-minded people in your town. It could be coding meetups, pair programming sessions, conferences and presentations, helping tech noobs find their way into the industry. You might learn a bit and also pass on some of your own knowledge and experiences.

Either way, people-focused tech provides a different kind of fulfillment than tech for tech's sake. Worth a shot if you hadn't already tried to make it a focus!

pressing a red button all day would still suck even if it cured cancer. Social contact and validation counts for a lot, plus sense of flow.

I am way way older than you are. I went through episodes like that multiple times. There was always a trigger, work related or personal.

This is depression. Seek medical help. Find a good therapist to talk you. Get 10-15 sessions. Find the root of the problems. But the most important thing to do is talk. Don't go to social media, HN, or whatever. Bars, concerts are to be avoided. When you are there you'll get the feeling that you don't belong.

Medication can also help on a temporary basis until you find that you can get back feelings you had in your 20's.

The worst thing you can do is nothing. It will not go away. If it does, it will come back.

I guarantee that after you seek medical help and handle that with a therapist you will gradually feel more excited about life, there are so many wonderful things to do, experience and good people to meet.

Good luck.

No relationships, moved multiple times, and never stayed at a job for long. Sounds like a recipe for having no roots or committed friendships/community as you chased the cornucopia of worldly experiences… that has now dried up and been found wanting.

You’ve got plenty of time. What you need is connections. Who/what/how is up to you, and talking to an understanding person about it (parents, lifelong friend, pastor, therapist) would probably help more than us all here.

Unpopular opinion:

Start getting spiritual. You will notice eventually that all the life long ambitions/hobbies/craving for experiences is like a relay race of sorts where the baton(craving) gets continuously passed around to the next of runner only to be repeated again and again.

The emptiness is not due to lack of experiences in life. It's due to the realisation that every desire, experience, happiness, pain is made of the same underlying thing. So chasing after more is not going to be anymore fulfilling. Like another comment said, start living for others.

I am 46 and I feel the same. I fill in all the advice tick boxes. Excellent physical health. I work out frequently and have no ailments other than slightly autistic personality.

Great job and well compensated for it. Great economy, own my own place.

Have adult child that has moved out and is doing well. On paper, I am doing extremely well.

Inside, I wake up every morning really sorry I am still alive.

This pointless lonely hellhole existence is statistically going to go on for another 30 maybe 40 years until finally it ends.

Another horrible tinder date and I might just off myself.

I am female btw.

Have you tried professional help?

It's possible to be happy and content. If you're serious, it's not right. Please consider asking for help.

Is Tinder the right place for somebody in your frame of mind? It's plainly a meat market, not a great place for somebody who's looking for more than something really short and shallow.

Not that I have an alternative, just... really negative on Tinder.

I am not your age, so perhaps don't have your perapective but if money isn't a big worry, do you plan to make any changes? A friend of mine at about your age took a break from his job and enrolled to the community college for courses to be a mechanic. He doesn't want to be one professionally but just wanted to learn. When I went through my divorce in my early 30s, I wanted to be social and did lot of meetups with people my age then, just trying to create more chances to meet new people, was surprised to see many people that were in a similar place in life and wanted similar things as me.

On the longer timeline, do retirement, grand kids, spending your saved up money on things you find interesting then excite you?

If you want a friend to talk to, ping me. Please do get the professional help others have suggested.

This post is a good counter example to all the people in this thread saying "just have kids, that'll solve your problems". It's such an unbelievably narrow view that ignores the complexity of human existence.

Not that I dont appreciate the nice comments. I have tried therapy. Several times. When they turned virtual the little humane contact they provided evaporated and I stopped paying for that crap. And dont get me started on trying to talk to a therapist that wears a face mask the entire time.

I am not actively trying to end my life. Just trying to correct the naive suggestions that going to a gym or having a child will make you happy or fullfilled.

Loneliness sites bone deep. The older you get, the harder making meaningful human connections get. And add the past the past 2 years of “keeping us safe and healthy” what used to be my natural coping mechanisms were outright banned.

I tread on. Trust me, from the outside you would not think I was this lonely. I have all the things and the hobbies and the travels. Even athletic enough to sport visible abs, which is not all common at 46 in these parts of the hemisphere.

If I am lucky maybe Ill get shot in a failed robbery or something.

I certainly do not have the courage to physically harm myself.

I appreciate the concern though.

Loneliness has several parts - spiritual, sexual, belonging, tactile, conversational, etc. Some take a lot of work to address, but others might have a straightforward fix:

1. Dancing classes might solve the tactile aspect. Dancing requires a lot of face time during the class, and even more practice time between classes to really get the most out of it. If you're physically fit you might enjoy lindy-hop, for example: https://youtu.be/e62p_K4-Cvc?t=24

2. Likewise contact sports, e.g. martial arts. For example judo and greco-roman wrestling both are tactile. https://youtu.be/PVJoN9MCw_E?t=28

3. Groups sports might help with belonging, esp outdoor sports where masks are not an issue. Beach volleyball, for example. Not the professional type, but the casual one where people drink beer after a game. https://youtu.be/Kx7GlMXVZAM?t=163

4. Conversations are hard to enjoy with a mask, so maybe move to a red state. If your situation is dire, it might require dire measures. I heard North Carolina is great like this - a friend recently moved there for this reason (among many). [no video :)]

Do you feel like any of this is helping? Often times I get a seemingly great advice which I can't follow, so how is this for you?

I'm 45, divorced and am not really that keen to meet people on Tinder/FB Dating etc. Recently I've really enjoyed meeting people through a walking group on FB, there is something happening most weekends when I'm not with my children and it's really reassuring that there are a bunch of people I can meet up with if I have nothing else on, friendships are developing there. Not saying I'm done with relationships, but they aren't a priority.

What is it getting you down, do you have hobbies and aspirations, however small? When I got divorced I made a list of small victories and over a about a year I was able to achieve many of them. Do you have friends you can talk to?

The main thing you're describing is not having a future.

You're a bit young for a midlife crisis, but covid has forced it on all of us (I entered mine at 39 and covid just crushed it). And the world has changed a lot; a lot of the future we imagined has really been taken away - that is, it isn't available anymore, not because of something we did wrong, but because the doors have slammed shut. Just for one thing, having $500k in the bank ain't what it used to be. But I get the sense that you aren't really defined by money.

Maybe the "haven't had a serious relationship for many years now" part is what you should work on. Just putting your time and energy into a relationship is good for you. Without a relationship you have no future.

I have no kids. That makes me feel like I may have no future.

Being aware that the thing you're fighting, the dread you're experiencing, is really about your fear of not having a future -- that can at least provide an anchor, to focus you on imagining what you want a future to look like and taking the steps to get to whatever that place is. I think the biggest problem is that we're all constantly obsessed with the present and somewhere along the line we stop trying to evolve into what we want to be, and get mired down in the quotidian. This may be a normal feature of growing older, but it's definitely amplified by the overwhelming flood of bullshit we see every day now, which seems designed from the ground up to prevent us from thinking about our future.

Spend a little time and ask yourself if not having [edit: not being able to visualize] a future is your actual problem, and take it from there.

> Without a relationship you have no future.

Not to take away from your overall point, but I would encourage people to be skeptical of this claim. Relationships are healthy, yes. They can help to provide meaning and purpose. They may end up giving your life the structure that's been missing before.

But firstly, it's not necessary to be in a single romantic relationship for all of these benefits, a tight-knit group of close friends can be just as great of a boon or almost.

And secondly, leaving a legacy does not equate having a future. Kids are a legacy. Memories that other people keep of you, and changes (hopefully improvements) you make in local communities, society, the world as a whole, that's leaving a legacy. But really, chances are that the world as a whole doesn't give much of a damn about whether your DNA or your work survives. Give it three or four generations and you're at best a footnote somewhere.

And that's okay. Having a future means to shape your life in a way that makes sense to you, that ends up being fulfilling, that lets you experience the good things and the bad things about it conscientiously.

Relationships can help with that. But in no way is having "a" relationship or having kids a prerequite for having a future. Thank you for your time, nitpicking over!

Thank you for chiming in; I don't have the energy to compose my own top-level.

The OP is nowhere to be seen from my vantage point in achievements, but rather, I'm a stone's throw away from that one submitter last year whose circumstances and outlook were so crushingly bleak and who had absolutely nothing to their name.

I'm not going to pretend there isn't an ounce of "oh, poor me" here, but I think seeing it is crucial to understanding my outlook. I am the same age as OP, just weeks out from hitting 35. What they have in savings, I have less than a % in net worth. Also single, with no serious relationship for years (save for the fact that I've been talking to someone for the last some-odd months, we'll see where that goes). I have held jobs in small and big warehouses for mostly for 1-2 years each, for minimum wage.

No wife, kids, or residence to call my own.

Back at 30, I felt I had no future. How do I survive and live on?

Bearing in mind that question, something hit me (I don't know what exactly) when I then also asked myself: what if I pass on tomorrow?

I then started volunteering at the local women's center weekly (and have not been lately only because I finally have my first "real" job now as of a few months ago).

I'm reasonably fit, so I rose up the ranks (albeit still a temp in title) and ran the production lines at my warehouse jobs, sharing not only my sharpness through training people as oversee-ees but also all the warmth I have bottled up with each one of them as fellows I worked side-by-side with. Suddenly, it sucked a lot less to be stuck in my dead-end jobs. It wasn't hard to win people over when almost all the bosses and managers were being a bunch o' armchair dicks.

If I pass on tomorrow, I have already touched so many people and in turn enjoyed the blessings of having been touched back by every one of them.

[edit, outside edit window] To wrap it up a little less mystically/spiritually: people already know who I am.

My friend, you are not lost -- you are free. From what I can tell, you have your health, your youth (35 is still young) and you have some savings. If you don't have a mortgage, kids, a spouse, and a job you cannot leave, then you are free. The next step is to see the world. Get a one-way ticket to Chiang Mai and try to stay as long as possible. Learn the language, get a scooter, and talk to people. Live close to the earth, and when you eventually miss home, you will return a different person. Certain places are easier to reboot yourself than others. Pick some place warm and friendly.

I will attest to this being quite poor advice. I think the OP is well aware that a cheap exotic vacation and a scooter are not going to fill the gap he feels.

It is not poor advice. Travel has always rebooted my outlook on life, the way I see things. It is essental.

On the other hand, locales like the one recommended are full of first-world young adults testing the theory that a change of location will fix what ails them with markedly mixed results.

Travel can be great, but travel is at best a sort of emotional palliative care for a person in the OPs situation as I understand it.

Chiang Mai and the rest of Thailand are rather shit at the moment with insane entry requirements. Even if you persevere (and don't get jailed in quarantine hotel) understand that there are no tourists, no expats, no nightlife at the moment and many many failed businesses and ghost town vibes.

"Just learn Thai lol" is not actionable advice either. I say this as someone who has literally done what you suggest in 50+ countries. If he could somehow sneak into New Zealand (not Australia!) I'd strongly recommend that instead at the moment. Buy a van. Hike. So many great treks and places that you usually need to reserve months in advance and far higher likelihood of meaningful interactions.

So long as you're fully vaxed its not so bad.

Heading there next month ;)

You can certainly catch a variant or just test positive even if you are fully vaxed and boosted. And frankly it wouldn't surprise me if this is just a way to shakedown tourists.

They decided last week that on the first and fifth days from arrival you must stay in an approved hotel. They don't tell you the results until you are all tucked in, and so you have a rather high chance of ending up in an expensive covid jail.

Next month is a long time away and they are making up new rules as they go as per usual. I admire your optimism and hope you get lucky and enjoy the place as few people will get to experience the islands so empty :)

Yeah, happy with that risk, 2 years of lockdowns and no travelling you know?

Thailand is not an expensive place ;)

Here're things that I'm entertaining myself with.

1. Discover new things related to IT. For example I never programmed microcontrollers or dealt with electronics in general. I recently started to learn about it and it's exciting. My current aim is to build some fun machines for my home using STM32 and ARM assembly. Something like cat drinking bowl with small fountain and proximity sensor. Or crypto device to store my ssh keys. Or hand-held radio with everything build from scratch using modern crypto and stuff. I also bought 3D-printer and found that 3D-modeling is very exciting.

2. Discover new things not directly related to IT. Like building house, creating or repairing things in house and around, working with wood, welding, etc. That requires some money, for example I bought some land with old house in a remote village and visit it at summer, spending extremely quality time there, near nature. It's one of my retirement plans - to build a house and live there with remote work or investments.

3. I have wife, but if I would be alone, I definitely would think about yachting. It's possible to buy old yacht for $50k, spend another $50k to repair it and travel around the world, including ocean travels. That's my dream which is unlikely to ever come true, but who knows.

I never really cared about achieving anything. I got paid well enough, I build useful things for my country and that's good enough for me. I have $20k in savings right now, LoL, but that's fine, I live in poor country and that's enough for my lifestyle.

Might be wrong but this sounds more like depression to me than aging. I've had a few bad ~6 month bouts of this and always the strongest symptom was a total lack of interest in things that I know I used to enjoy very much. It seems to happen to me once every 5 years or so (I'm 49).

Personally, drugs and CBT never helped me with these. They might help you. I mostly just put my head down and kept coding for work and did nothing after work but lay down. I just had no interest in reading or watching TV or anything. If I hadn't had kids to support, I would not have been able to force myself to go to work either.

Eventually time would pass and it would go away and I would remember how much I liked coding and how much I liked all of my hobbies.

It's very hard to imagine ever returning to normal when you're in some sort of depressive episode. But statistically speaking, you almost certainly will. That knowledge always helped me to get through them. These is a good chance that in 6-12 months, you might again be quite excited by new technologies and the thought of going to festivals/bars/clubs.

> Personally, drugs and CBT never helped me with these.

Can I ask what medication/drugs were you given (or gave to yourself) when you went through these periods?

I had one bout of this (by far the worst) in like 2003. I think I tried every SSRI out there at the time plus lithium plus a bunch of stuff that like 3 different psychiatrists prescribed over a year. I would try something for like 2-6 weeks and then try another. I honestly don't remember the full list. None of it helped me.

SSRIs in particular did not work well for me because they really interfered with my natural sleep cycle and this did not go away after 6 weeks as the doctors hoped. I would just bolt awake sweating after like 3 hours of sleep which made things much, much worse.

I never tried any illegal drugs. I've read good reports about psychadelics in some cases. But I've never tried anything like that.

I did try benzodiazapines during my last bout like 3 years ago. They were wonderful at first. Klonopin made me feel so relaxed somehow that it fixed everything else. I slept great and was interested in everything again. I thought I'd found the fix. But then it stopped working. They recommended increasing my dose. But I read horror stories about what happens there (see Jordan Peterson saga). So I tapered off. It was awful. I would wake up after 2 hours having a panic attack and not be able to get back to sleep. It took like an extra 3 months after tapering off until I was back to just regular depressed :). Would not recommend these! Read the benzo recovery reddit.

I can recommend shrooms. First experience was groundbreaking. It allowed to see how my habits (and thoughts) are pulling me down. Mushrooms are easy to grow and not addictive.

Do you exercise? That might help you get out of those 6 month bouts faster (or prevent them from coming)

I'm in the same boat. I'm procrastinating more and more and I sleep less and less. I've lost interest in doing new things so much that I don't even feel like watching a new show anymore. End up watching Seinfeld again and again. I'm a pink Floyd fan but just few weeks back this finally hit me like it had never before.

"And you run, and you run to catch up with the sun but it's sinking Racing around to come up behind you again The sun is the same in a relative way but you're older Every year is getting shorter, never seem to find the time. Plans that either come to naught or half a page of scribbled lines."

What I'm trying to change now is reset and restart small. Because I now compare myself to all my successful peers, I've forgotten that it takes small steps to build something. So rather than looking at the the final outcome I'm looking to focus more on small and short tasks. There is no going back to my 20's but I can have better and healthier rest of my life.

Wow. Just had to say I'm turning 35 this month and had the exact same epiphany when listening to the "Time" recently. When I was young and in my 20's I would get high and listen to it and just loved the way it sounded. But now the lyrics really ring true. "And then one day you find ten years have got behind you No one told you when to run, you missed the starting gun" really gets me.

Find a hobby or a cause you care about and make it a priority. Learn piano, volunteer, etc. Whatever it is, you have to follow through and show up every day. Learn to cultivate passion rather than chase it.

Stop moving around. Pick a place you like and make it your home. It's impossible to cultivate a mature social circle and a meaningful life if you keep remixing every few years. Feeling connected to where you live is powerful.

Date and make new friends. This will be easier if you're showing up for your new passion everyday and you stopped moving around so often. We're social animals and having friends and family you can count on is critical.

See a therapist. Your feelings are valid, but at some point you've lost context. You have what most people never will, but have forgotten how to appreciate it.

Stop drinking and doing drugs and start exercising. A healthy body and mind are a prerequisite to feeling "well". This gets more and more true the older you get.

Ditch social media. Stop listening to the news. Stop watching TV and movies. All these things have been shown to make people sad and feel the kinds of feelings you're feeling. Read more books and go be in the sun more.

Find a job that isn't always at a desk and involves collaborating with other people. Find a job that involves building things you find meaningful, especially if you can find one that involves working with your hands or involves using your communication skills. Your job is what you spend most of your time doing, and if that's meaningless the rest of your life is going to feel so.

None of these things are going to happen overnight, but a good life is built on small incremental changes happening consistently, one after the other. The best time to plan a tree was 20 years ago, the next best time is right now.

You may feel lost, but what you are not is old. Ask yourself what you want to do with the other half of your life.

You sound professionally successful (you've done different things, so you have learned, you've got savings), but perhaps left without a purpose. It's good that these questions come up, maybe your brain is alerting you to the fact that something is still missing in your life. I encourage you to initiate that search, there is a lot more out there under the sun beyond technology - the other commenters contain many suggestions about activity, however I would like to focus on people.

Your description focuses on yourself (not sure if this is a random effect or systematic, since I don't know you); I wonder if you could benefit from looking around you and helping and caring for others. That would put you in a position to make forming your own family more likely, and make it more likely to remain a stable bond that provides fulfilment and purpose.

I don’t have any real advice for you except to say that you’re not alone and what you’re experiencing is shared by many. I’m turning 34 next week and feel similarly, despite having achieved a lot of “success” in my business life. I too haven’t had a relationship in many, many years and am disillusioned by technology. I miss my 20s and envy the younger generation for many things. My body is getting older and more tired too and my natural optimism is less present these days.

I think there is a natural change that happens around this age as the energy of youth starts to be tempered by the wisdom of age (not meaning to sound lofty, it’s just how it came to my mind). There is an opportunity to start seeking things of more meaning and purpose in life, whether it is through study, career change, creativity/hobbies, mindfulness or spirituality, time in nature, settling down, finding new friends or rekindling old ones, moving on, a different kind of travel, etc - it will be different for everyone. You may also be depressed or burned out, which is a whole other thing (that I could also heavily relate to). But I think it’s not correct for people to offer armchair diagnoses over the internet and you should find out what’s true for you.

People also seem to be recommending travel above all else, but this isn’t always a panacea and is not right for everybody. There can also be real value in staying put and changing on the inside, if that’s what’s true for you.

Good luck out there

In fairness, OP asked for armchair diagnoses. It's hard to stay away from recommending travel or whatever works for you, but that shows that it's a question that a lot of us (a surprising number of us, from this thread) are struggling with, so everyone wants to test their own theory.

Nothin's a panacea, you said that right.

When I was 35, I could have written the OP's post almost verbatim. I'm 42 now and, despite having spent two years working intentionally on the problem, am still in a similar place on the whole.

Several solutions to the OP's predicament are being advanced with a fair amount of force, and I'm finding that I don't really believe any of them. I do believe that the advice is being offered honestly and in good faith. It's also clearly a good idea to cultivate healthy habits, stay active and meet people. However, I have tried many potential solutions myself and have encountered many false summits, and the tone of the most forceful advice here matches things I would have said to myself when I was camping on them. When I imagine myself taking the advice, I can easily see myself living through the familiar progression of triumph, doubt and disillusionment.

Maybe some of us are just wired for shame, loneliness and regret, and are searching for our safe harbor (to mix in another metaphor) where we won't have to struggle or prove ourselves anymore. That thought counterintuitively makes me feel a bit better. It gives me a reason to not feel ashamed and regretful _about_ feeling ashamed and regretful, and it reifies a system that, whether or not it's the work of humans, is clearly oppressive, which creates the opportunity to find meaning in resisting it.

Internet advice is just that, advice. Sometimes given from experience, often repeated with good intentions.

There are no “12 rules for life” because we didn’t come off the conveyor belt in some factory. We’re variable creatures and the solutions to our personal problems require tailored solutions.

See a therapist. They’ll do more good than reading the posts here.

I started my IT career at your age. In my twenties, I worked as a nurse in trauma intensive care. Saw some ugly stuff.

Do the world, which took about 3.5 billion years to spawn you, a favor for a few months:

https://hospicefoundation.org/Volunteer

Gives a whole new perspective.

But if not, gallows humor is more pleasant anyway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRHN5vxnZrI

500k in savings? That is quite the achievement. You should feel good about that.

Yes, even without kids and a relationship, it's a large sum. Large enough that he's probably doing really good professionally.

Perhaps this is naive of me but to have half a million in the bank and being miserable sounds like a pretty poor state of affairs. Time to convert some of that money into time and experiences.

I would guess loneliness is a big part of it. You don't have to be "successful" to find a life partner.

You're more likely to find one before you get rich.

I wouldn't know, but either way I don't think OP is rich enough to hamper their chances.

Image OP being in the same state of mind but with 20K in the bank. Now, that’s miserable.

Don't say stuff like that in a public forum there's bound to be people who fit that criterion reading this

There are people 50 years old with 5K who aren't as miserable as OP.

I know people who are older than that and with less in the bank. They live on a sailing yacht and are more happy than most will ever be. They cross oceans when they want to change scenery. They haven’t seen temps lower than 20C in decades, living between the tropics and SE Asia, sailing along the way.

Besides that, isn't there a figure about the number of people who'd have to borrow money to cover a $1000 emergency? Something like 60% of Americans if I remember correctly.

definitely. I have just under 500k in debt and about 30k in savings. and I'm 47.

Most of that debt is a house (that needs a lot of restoration). I have two awesome kids and a wife though. I'm happy with that part of me.

> I have just under 500k in debt and about 30k in savings ... Most of that debt is a house (that needs a lot of restoration)

I feel like the concept of net worth is crucial to communicate things like these effectively. Reading your comment, I can't even figure out if you are in the red or in the green.

I wish him all the best and am glad again to know my wife is right when she said money does not solve all problems. I should listen to her more.

You might be experiencing a mid-life crisis (assuming you are not undergoing depression). Fortunately, I found what I was experiencing by just openly talking about my feelings to my friends (and not spouse/girlfriend).

For me something snapped one day after age 35. I was relatively successful, married and I suddenly lost interest in my work or any kind of work. Even retired for 6-9 months, only to come out extremely bored - pledging that I would never ever take a retirement. It took me 3 more years to understand what was happening - I felt that at 38 too, and ideally it was still too early to experience a mid life crisis.

Some tips based on my experience:

1. Take very good care of your health. Regularly exercise (including at least some resistance training) and mostly healthy food. Measure health parameters. 2. Rule out any medical illness and/or deficiencies. Get a full body checkup done (including a detailed blood/urine tests). Do not cut corners here, but if not recommended, you could skip tests involving radiation. 3. For a month or two - take less stress (don't overperform or even try to overperform) and find periods of emptiness. After some time fill in those times with some activity that you love to do - doesn't matter how illogical it sounds. Let your intuition guide you. Make notes weekly. 4. On the work side, try to get into a management role. My situation was a little different, I was not an employee.

I do not know whether I am out of the woods(at early 40s), or just got used to the new reality. But I do feel quite better and may have made significant progress - only time will tell.

You can start by forgetting what age you are and hang out with the people of the age you feel like hanging out with. Bars are a waste of time, sure -- they're noisy and pretty mindless. But that's not what you really want. There might be younger people you might get on with but literally all you need to do is be the age you are inside, and make those friends. You're at the age when you have figured out what doesn't make you happy, evidently. But then maybe you know what `would` make you happy, if you could attain it, so go after what you want.

Feeling is the Secret (1944) by Neville Goddard https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffNWoefuwPM

My birthday was yesterday. I have now lived 80 years on this planet. Seen a lot, done a lot. Do I feel old? Absolutely not. Few aches and pains and other physical problems I let my doctors worry about.

My advice, for what it is worth, is to find some things that you enjoy doing. It can literally be anything. If you are an introvert do things by yourself. Do not force yourself to be around others excessively. If you are an extrovert find things to do with others. That is the real key to happiness. I am an introvert and do things that do not require me to interact with others. Makes me perfectly happy. I have friends. Some of whom go places with others and do things constantly with others and that makes them happy. You will see by my list below that I am a card carrying introvert.

I decided to learn programming. Now I am on problem #50 of the Euler Project. I am, by own estimation, a pretty decent Python programmer. I found bread making some time ago after I retired and bake things for myself and lucky friends and neighbors. I travel. Been literally everywhere with a smile on my face and a walking stick in my hand. I now have time for reading now. Just read The Fatal Shores by Robert Hughes. I love history after hating it in high school. Walking: walk 2-3 miles a day. Ukulele: one of the most relaxing instruments in the world. I love sitting down for 30 minutes and working on a song or two. Then there is backgammon. I am a backgammon fiend. Play it daily. Have become a 'feared' player because of how aggressively I play.

Point is: have a variety of interests, some of which can be passions. Try something and if you don't like it find something else. If you are an extrovert, find a group of people to do things with. Forget stimulants like alcohol or drugs. Life is stimulating enough. Wake up every morning with plans for the day.

What a great life story you are still pursuing. 80 years young and still rocking it. You are an inspiration for sure. When did you start learning Python?

Thirties. Married. First kid on the way this year. Consider your opening sentence. Who are you comparing yourself with? Most people don’t achieve much. You also aren’t owed anything. Time isn’t running out. You hold unhealthy expectation that you are owed a certain amount of life. Release that expectation. Read books about real people dealing with real problems. Write real people letters of gratitude and encouragement. Record for yourself your own ledger of gratitude. Learn how to cook and make a few good dishes. Invite people over to talk and enjoy time together. Finally consider the golden rule as diagnostic code. Whatever you love with all your heart will be your god. So don’t love your money, travel, or even time itself. They’re all pitiful gods. You will love other people the way you love yourself. Take an intentional and committed force of action to loving yourself. Be kind to yourself. The most serious relationship you have is the one with yourself. My sincere best to you on your journey. May you be blessed.

We are insignificant and meaningless. Just look at that data. We live on a planet that's billions of years old in a solar system that's probably even older. Currently each one of us is but one of almost 8 billion others currently alive right now. One day you will die with millions of others. Not long after that anyone that has a memory of you will die. You will be completely erased.

You can see that as depressing if you want. I see it a liberating. Accept your current experience for what it is. Not what your silly little mind thinks it _should_ be. When you do that there is no room for discontent, only happiness, peace and contentment. Live life for what it is; a beautiful dream.

I started reading about the universe and everything in it sometime last year. I was in a shit place due to some stuff in our family, but I found it liberating as well, to think about how small we are in the scale of things or against the time scale of things. Besides it being a cool new hobby, it really sobered me up on what's important to me.

You don't deal with it. Here is the thing: the key to happiness is having 0 expectations. When you have 0 expectations everything that comes your way is a bonus.

To put things in perspective: it's really easy to look at other people and thing: gee, by 35 they did X, Y and Z. Doing this means that you reduce those other people to X, Y and Z. You are not X, Y or Z. You are a human being that can grow on multiple dimensions and that more likely than not had unique initial conditions and unique environmental conditions compared to anyone else.

As long as: 1) you're healthy 2) you're enjoying what you are doing 3) you feel like you're growing along one or more dimension I would not fret it.

Time is not running out. Actually, your best years are ahead of you. You maybe no longer have the optimism you had when younger, but the realism you have now means you can actually get shit done and you can attack problems that you ideally can solve. That's enough.

The key of happiness is having 0 expectations and being happy with what you have.

In my unpopular opinion, almost every person yearns for a sense of identity and purpose. Veritasium sums up these yearnings of the soul nicely in his "Our Greatest Delusion" video. However, I disagree with his conclusion. I don't think these yearnings are a delusion nor do I think embracing nihilism or hedonism or drugs or other distractions is the solution. I think ultimately these yearnings are there because God is real and purpose and identity can be discovered by getting closer to the being that created us.

So, my advice would be to explore religion and see if it starts having a positive effect on your sense of purpose in life. Even if you pick a "wrong" religion, I think God can still work with that and help you understand your purpose vs. no religion. IMO, just like software, religious/spiritual belief is an incremental process.

At some point in ones life, it can become more rewarding to mentor the next generation of people to your craft rather than continuing to go on your own.

Mentorship with the young generation couples the energy of the mentee with the experience to avoid pitfalls from the mentor.

One example of this are professors. Many of them you may noticed never want to retire. They are often in an ideal stimulating environment that only improves with time. Every year a young batch of eager students wanting to learn arrive, while profs provide the taste and quality control to direct the energy.

> Mentorship with the young generation couples the energy of the mentee with the experience to avoid pitfalls from the mentor.

I find this interesting - I've sort of had a taste of this with an extreme sport, a very casual mentorship of a friend at a not dissimilar age with a huge quantity of enthusiasm but little previous experience. I noticed the enthusiasm definitely transfers, and what was old can seem new again - not only that but I can take that enthusiasm to explore new aspects of the sport and push myself further. I haven't quite found the same experience in technical work yet, but I feel I could do with some renewed enthusiasm there too.

It may not even necessarily be mentorship, just being in good company with enthusiastic, friendly and interesting people. As a fairly introverted person it's open my eyes a bit to how much the people around me can affect my mood and engagement with the world.

Put things in perspective. There are people in their 50s that still go to bars and continue until their 70s probably, stopping only because of physical inability. Anyway, that shouldn't be used as a measure is what I'm trying to say.

Remember that anything that happens to you has happened to thousands and thousands of men in the past so don't put so much pressure on living.

Also, try to see yourself more as an artist painting a picture rather than someone that is struggling through life. Hope that helps.

Also, WTF is wrong with bars? Bars are great.

I can't remember what book it was, maybe something by Douglas Coupland (?) He talks about how there was probably some guy just like him in 200 AD, in the Roman Empire, going through exactly what he's going through now. Forgotten to history, all his thoughts. And he's just that guy all over again.

Compared to beating the shit out of yourself for not being Mohammed or Ghengis Khan, Bars are just fine.

The meditations by Marcus Aurelius?

Was Marcus Aurelius the first guy to make the observation that he was probably a clone of someone born 2000 years earlier?

The $500k in savings means that you actually have the option to step off the corporate treadmill and consider what else you want to do with your life if you so desire. Even if it won't be enough in San Francisco, it might be enough to live off of in Mexico or in some less central city or state. You could also invest the money, though with market valuations and economic outlooks being what they are, this is admittedly an exceptionally scary time to be investing. Even so, this might be something to consider further down the line.

Economics aside, it seems like part of the problem is that many people your age already have families, and you're now unsure how to make friends who are your age. One thing you could do is seek out people in a similar situation to go to the festivals with, or to go to bars with, or on trips. And if you should happen to meet a bunch of 20-somethings who want to get to know a 35-year-old, then why not?

Either way, you should probably ditch the idea that opportunities are somehow unavailable to you, and instead focus on how you're ready to move on to a new stage of your life. Whether that stage will involve career changes or travelling or moving or anything else will have to be your decision, but it sounds from what you're saying like it may involve building new friendships.

If you look at what's important, you are, in fact, hugely successful. Maybe you're just comparing yourself to others who you probably don't really know. You have achieved quite a lot and for sure more than a great majority of the population.

If you want to feel better and become engaged again, help others. Share your success. Teach. Do hobbies that bring you physically close to a community. There is a lot of research that indicates that volunteering and helping others improves a lot our wellbeing [1].

To me it makes all the sense and I've experienced how it greatly improved my own life. If you like fabrication, the Maker/FabLab movement are awesome (at least here in Portugal).

I'm 46 and some time back, in my early forties, I joined a local CoderDojo club. CoderDojo is a global community of Programming Clubs for Kids. I started there as Mentor, teaching and helping kids having fun with coding and it was a lot of fun. However, the best, was the community itself. I have acquired many new friends and have met a lot of great people between the other mentors, the champions (club leaders/organizers) and also the kids parents. The parents of the younger ones are incentivized to participate.

Good Luck!

[1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/2020/07/29/voluntee... [2] https://www.jstor.org/stable/3090173

Wow I’m the same age and could have written a similar post. The good news for you is you still can experience a relationship, have kids and get to do all of that. Find a hobby or interest that you’re passionate about (this has to come from your soul) and then just apply your passion towards that, try and be good at it so you stand out and then besides being fulfilling, if you’re any decent at it, it will help you find a mate. And then you can get married, have kids, and in five years come back and write another post about how you’re as lost as you were at 35 except holding your son or daughters hand and going out for ice cream every now and then makes things a little more pleasant.

Model frigate building, here I go!

500k?! Wait what? You should work on some gratitude. Volunteer at a homeless shelter or old folks home or church. Scientifically proven to brighten your outlook and I suspect get you some perspective. Quit thinking about yourself so much. Honestly I find your post a little whiney. My personal advice, and what worked for me more than once, is just say "yes" to most everything. It gives you the exposure you need stimulate your brain and get out of a funk. Oh, and if you're a phone/ fakebook/doomscroller type stop that like yesterday. You won the world being born lottery. Don't waste it.

It's great that you asked this question and (my guess is) it's actually a very common one. Being able to start a conversation and discuss it is an achievement in itself. Kudos to you!

As many have mentioned, fitness and keeping calm is extremely important. With $500K in savings, you are in a financially secure position which is very good.

I invested in a spin bike for a while now and use it with a Peloton class or a Netflix watch of late. Some days the exercise is great and other days it is ok. But, scheduling it and getting it done is a very good habit. Regardless of intensity, just do it.

Next, focus on mental health. Journalling is great and meditation is also quite helpful. There is no aha moment, but just keeping at it will reap benefits.

Next, find someone (right one) to emotionally connect with: it could be a spouse, a partner or perhaps a pet too. Get energy drainers (if any) out asap.

Now that, hopefully, your human side is hopefully is in better shape ... get realistic about your career options. With your experience so far, you are likely very well equipped to decide the next steps.

It sounds to me a lot like you've prioritized your professional life over everything else - no wonder you're feeling empty. You need to focus on you, make social connections, join social groups, get out there and make your life more than work. Once you have some fulfilling relationships none of this other stuff will seem important to you.

Given you have 500k, you could also easily take off a year and just do awesome things and meet people. 35 isn't old either. Not even remotely. You must be living a fairly insular life to think so.

My faith in Jesus has helped me to find my purpose and reinvigorate my outlook through my late thirties. My local church has provided me an outlet to help serve others and connect with many new friends. If pursuing everything that life has to offer hasn't made you happy, maybe it's time to look into something more eternal?

I am almost 42 and my net wealth is <$0. I've experienced your anxiety and gloom but these days I am pretty happy and optimistic about how much I'll enjoy my life as time goes on. The trick is to go deep in something narrow and high-skill-cap (for me it happens to be card games, but the what doesn't really matter). The quest for deep expertise is a boundless source of surprise, discovery, and rich, cheap pleasure. You are wonderfully lucky - with $500k in the bank you can afford not to work for a decade as you develop that deep expertise. I guarantee you that after 20,000 hours of [whatever thing] you'll be able to make money from it if you need to. But don't worry about that now - just pick something deep that you can do at a high level well into old age and focus on getting good. I don't mean good enough to get a job or whatever - I mean GOOD

One measure of happiness is being satisfied with what you’ve got.

It’s clear that you are becoming unhappy. At 80, I’m pretty happy and have been getting more so.

Like most people here, I’d recommend taking care of yourself physically. And go for long walks in the woods and parks. Appreciate what an amazing place this universe is!

I could make a number of suggestions beyond that, but I think the best one would be to take up a study of Zen, which is largely about escaping dissatisfaction.

Joko Beck’s books are a good entry.

I quit my job and did something different. Almost 60 now and I'm about to do it again. Don't regret the mistakes you made in the past. Go out and make some new ones while there's still time left.

Oh.. and one of my best job changes was becoming a high school teacher. Think about it.

Try questioning everything you [mostly unconsciously] believe. This is how do you behave in particular age/status - why? This is what happens when you die - why? Stop believing anything (except that you should generally avoid hurting other people) and have fun. Life is just a role playing game with cool gfx, massive lore and unbalanced mechanics - beat the hell of fun out of it and stop believing you know what's there after it ends. Being lost means having wrong beliefs. We don't know the true but we can give up the wrong (even the whole scientific view is wrong as a belief - it's just a practical picture, the foundation of real science is knowing no theory will stand forever) and face the world with curiosity and awe.

By the way, the idea about science I expressed here triggered another one in me - perhaps we should start giving grants to scientists for exploring the theories/papers currently supposed to be true and working on disproving them. This seems an important work to improve overall quality of the entirety of scientific knowledge.

Remember that when you are 40 you will think of 35 as being young and full of potential. And when you are 50 you will look back at 40 and think "everything was possible". Everything is always possible until physical/mental degradation is too far along and that's when options really start to reduce.

What you currently have is experiences and money but on your own with no real anchoring/grounding, no long-lasting "thing" like a relationship, town, daily friends etc. You might even have made your work, money or materials your identity, which ends up not fulfilling.

Besides the health/social/experiences, it's also a matter of simply branching out. Just like this post on HN is essentially reaching/branching out.

> How do you deal with getting old and feeling lost?

> I am turning 35 years soon

35 is not old... this post is almost offensive.

But spoiler, it's going to get worse. At 35, you don't look old yet. At 40-45, ageism really starts to kick in and a lot of things get harder: e.g. dating, holding a technical job ...

What to do? most people have kids and revise their goals. Some put all their energy into work or hobbies. Some start to drink (very common after 40).

I'm at this point now, with almost 10 years more on my ledger. Between 30 and 40 I experienced the time of my life. I had not that much money but I traveled, got in touch with a lot of people, had some sporty hobbies, I was creative and yes I also dated a lot of women, but never was in a serious relationship. Looking back this would be what I call "freedom".

No I got a child, a well payed job and no time for nothing. I'm still kind of excited for new stuff, but I just don't have the time to pursue that. And that makes me feel sad and not needed, too. I became a consumer, am not a creator anymore. And I don't know what to do about it.

So yeah, not helpful, but I just wanna tell you, that you're not alone =)

This makes me think about a book I read a year or so ago called The Happiness Curve by Jonathan Rauch.

The idea is that happiness peaks in your 20s when you have great expectations and infinite possible outcomes for your life. As you age, you make choices, and reality sets in, and it inevitably leads to some amount of disappointment and dissatisfaction with life.

Fortunately, the happiness curve tends to trend back upward starting around age 50. The author's explanation for this is that happiness is based at least partially on your expectations. The idea being that your expectations are finally adjusted downward enough by the time you reach your 50s that you can be satisfied with normal life.

Wait till you go past 40 and they start calling you "sir" at Starbucks :)

There are two sources of meaning in life: being self-focused and trying to achieve your own goals (like going to Mars) OR being others-focused and trying to achieve something good for them (like parenting kids or helping a group who can't help themselves like curing a disease, fostering animals, etc)

The former tends to start feeling hollow after 30 although some people never lose that kind of drive (and nothing wrong with that)

Living for something beyond yourself is a good way to spend a life and brings much joy you can't get or buy any other way.

The two are very similar in the end, they differ by how you define the success criteria.

"But not anymore now. I feel like my time for everything is running out." -> what is this everything you want to have time for? Do you wish to be in a relationship? since you mentioned it at the beginning.

When I don't feel excited about the world, similar to what you describe, you meditate or spend time in nature. Reading about geology or trees has opened my eyes about how little we grasp about the nature of the universe and how focused on our own short lives we are while we are actually not much important. It's a shift in perspective. Usually, it helps me remember the small things that I still can influence rather than those beyond my control.

> what is this everything you want to have time for? Do you wish to be in a relationship? since you mentioned it at the beginning.

I don't know to be honest. Perhaps what's nagging at me is the lack of optionality. There are certain things I am now too old to do, like go to a school as typical student, go crazy at festival or clubs, go backpacking and easily meet new people, and have casual relationships. It's not that I want to do these things. I don't feel any desire for them. But the fact that I don't have the option to do them is depressing to me.

I dont get why you feel kike you dont have those options? I see plenty of people in their 40s and 50s going to festivals or going backpacking. The only one stopping you, is you.

I can resonate with this. What I remind myself when I have these thoughts is:

A) Life is like an evolving game with many rounds. Some doors close in your 20s, other doors open in 30s and so on. See what interests you outside and off the screen, once you find this, connect with other people who like to do it. For eg. in my city a lot of tech workers are into bouldering and hiking. You will see as you make friends in your age group, there is a whole bunch of new doors opening now that you are in your 30s.

B) Actually most of the things you list are totally still doable even _if_ you did want to do them. School as a typical student maybe not, but why be typical? I've met backpackers in their 60s, age truly is just a number.

You have the option to do all of these things.

I went back to school in the evenings when I was your age after being unfulfilled in my career. Turns out part-time education is full of people ranging from 20-somethings who chose the wrong career when they weren't working, to 50-somethings who just want to do something else.

I'm 40, most of my friends are mid 30s. When festival season comes around in the Netherlands, you can be damn sure people my age are going out there. Heck, we're the generation that started that when we were teens. Sure, I can't stay up until 6 in the morning anymore, but that doesn't stop us from going out until 3 am and hopping from bar to bar. I'll take the weekend recovering over not being able to go out anymore :)

You're not that old. The option isn't the problem, it sounds like your lack of desire is it. My best advice is take some time off, maybe a year since you've got the reserves, read some philosophy, slow down, figure out what matters to you.

Sounds a little like either burnout or depression could be at play here mate. I'd suggest three things; A) work on your physical health. You're in your 30s and can absolutely be much fitter and healthier than you were in your 20s. B) consider taking time out of work and using your savings to do some cool things you've wanted to do for a while - maybe travel in Europe, spend your summer surfing and winter snowboarding or something. C) speak to a therepist and check your mental health is in tip top shape. It can have a really good effect to speak this stuff out to someone and reflect on causes.

Whatever you decide, wish you the best. 35 isn't old.

It sounds like early version of typical midlife crisis.

Many of us have been there, done that. It almost doesn't matter how "successful" you are. (after all, look at Bezos, he seems to be hit really hard with it).

35 is nothing. I remember "feeling old" when I turned 17. Then feeling old when I turned 25, wishing I were 17. Then again every couple of years. From some point I now keep telling myself "you are 5 years younger than you will be in 5 years, and 10 years younger than you will be in 10 years" :D

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midlife_crisis

> turning 35 years soon

> Now I feel too old to go to festivals, bars and clubs and make new friends that way.

LOL.

No, you aren't old. You are just tired and forgot how to have fun.

What to do with that is up to you, but you are in a desperate need for a new experiences and feelings.

And with 500k in savings you have a pretty decent opportunity to just drop everything and be whatever you want to be for a day/week/month.

Just make a list of things you did and didn't do for some reason - and if the thing is reasonable try to do it now.

> turning 35 years soon

> Now I feel too old to go to festivals, bars and clubs and make new friends that way.

/me writing this with a light hangover. I befriended a new person yesterday in a bar.

35 is definitely not 'too old'.

Come to a rainbow gathering :-) but seriously,try hitching, sleeping outside in your sleeping bag, traveling in "3rd world" countries.... learning spanish while hitching south America or visiting/helping in communities in NZ... maybe a change of direction, more manual, like gardening, helping, might help... on a cynical level , life is pointless , but like a Hollywood film occasionally there are poignant parts that make you glad you were there...

https://festivalsandretreats.com/rainbow-gatherings-in-europ...

Ic.org

> have about $500k in savings. I am single and haven't had a serious relationship for many years now.

You have wealth, a good set of skills, etc.

My advice is to work on yourself. Some basic rules:

1. Focus on personal growth - fitness, hobbies, health and goals (build self-esteem).

2. Find social groups - church, clubs, w.e. This helps foster relationships and a sense of community.

3. Build something. Could be a house, furniture, what have you.

Some basic, pretty universal truths:

We, as humans, seek a community. Whether people like to admit it or not, we want community, family, mates, and offspring. The majority of us need those things to feel fulfilled. We need support and we want to feel affection.

You mentioned travel - what's the longest stretch of time you have travelled for? I went backpacking for two years at 35 and it was the best thing I ever did for myself; the chance to just 'be' without any pressure on your time, the freedom to go and do whatever you like with whomever you like - it was wonderful therapy for me, and I came back recharged and ready for the next phase of life.

If you haven't ever had a very long travel holiday, consider it.

edit: if you want to make friends, I recommend SCUBA diving - I've never met a more welcoming, inclusive community of people

First, you sound depressed which is common when you reach a point in your life where you realise that you might not actually be living true to yourself (that’s the feeling lost part - something in you is making you feel acutely that you are not doing what you really want to be doing). My gentle advice is to take care of that because it’s probably dragging you down. You should probably talk with a therapist and start working out if you don’t already.

You also sound dangerously in need of self love. You obviously haven’t achieved nothing. You have held jobs in widely different environments. Tried to start a company multiple times and put aside a significant amount of money. Be gentle with yourself and try to cut yourself some slack.

Then I think you should realise you are not getting old. You are getting older like everyone else on this planet. There is no magic cutoff when you can’t do things anymore (I mean technically you might get unable to do them physically but you are still far from that). Do what you want. If you feel like going to festivals, no one is going to stop you. Some judgmental people might find it weird that you do things they consider inappropriate for your age but thankfully you don’t really have to care about judgmental people.

Finally, there is no miracle solution to feeling lost. You will have to ask yourself some hard questions (but a therapist should help you if you want to and need to) and figure out what you actually want to do with your life. Good news for you is that you are both single and somewhat rich. That gives you a lot of freedom.

You sound like a genuinely productive individual.

This might sound like complete bullshit, but have you spent any time to try and gather your thoughts in a constructive manner to identify where your feelings are coming from, and where or how you might find excitement and joy again?

You won't find all the answers this way, but it could help you find some direction. Personally I might guess that you need to explore other opportunities and find new passions in life to truely get out of your current state of mind. That might involve travel, as others have suggested, to open your mind to other possibilities, since we often pigeon-hole our focus towards what's already in front of us.

I've been through something similar twice in my life, and as I say, it took both mindfulness and a bit of exploration to find my way out. Sending yourself off to uncomfortable and unknown situations, to discover what else there is to life, for you. We need goals in life to feel like we're achieving something, striving for something, like we have something to live for. Have you lost sight of your goals? Do you still have any as of this moment that you are passionate about?

One last fortune cookie I might offer: Believe in yourself. We all fall down at some point, it's how we handle that fall that really matters, and if you can pull yourself back up, new horizons await.

Delight.

I enjoy living in the future. It's hilarious to me that my favorite tech - NextStep, Linux, Mac - ate the world. I chuckle when I dream of time-traveling to 1997 - me, to reveal that Apple is the most wealthy company in the world (most days). That huge supercomputers have been built to train multi layer neural networks, just as I tried to explain to humans of 1990 why dot products might be interesting to optimize in hardware.

It does not particularly surprise me that most people use a web browser to do anything on a computer, but it's funny to me that I started front-end JavaScript programming in March 1997.

It's also funny that I managed to avoid getting rich, despite seeing all of this coming.

I have tried to understand microelectronics fabrication tech, but 13 billion transistors on my iPhone CPU is indistinguishable from magic. I could show 1988 me an iPad or tablet-laptop convertible running web apps, and he would be very pleased that the dream design seemed to have been realized.

That's the tech stuff.

I'm delighted by my kids. They do neat stuff. The py are better people than I am, which is about the best I could hope for.

I found out - perhaps the hard way - that living on a very modest budget is far more lucrative and secure than chasing a big payout. That's a choice I made that maybe would not be very satisfying to many HN folks. That's ok.

It's all taken longer, I'm older, and health challenges need improvement. But overall the outcome has been pretty good.

You're not getting old just yet.

Don't go to bars (drinking for the sake of it is a waste of time) ... except to see live music, or live comedy, or something. Go to festivals, though.

Or start a regular event or a festival with friends, or spend some time helping a local music venue. Or if you don't know those people, join some group that helps people put on events you might want to attend.

At 33, I was handed a bit of a social lifeline and the brief self-esteem to grab onto it, and found my way into a local music scene that I worked how I could to help support, which sustained me personally until the pandemic arrived. Now I find my life is lonely and detached, but 33 is a long time ago. That period of life was good; I look back on it fondly.

Do something to build the kind of life that fits you now. Be part of something: 35 is a time when you can still have fun but you also have life experience and maturity that helps you organise, see more different perspectives, value creating fun for other people, look out for them and take care of them.

And right now, post-pandemic, anything you do to help people re-establish the connections that have gone a bit cold and the friendships that have lost their steam in periods of lockdown and restriction will be welcomed by like-minded people, many of whom will be your age.

Feeling like you are taking purposeful action towards things you want is a great way to start feeling better almost immediately.

Think about things you want in the future. Who do you want to become? What material things would you like to have? What experiences do you want? Write them down, these are all goals.

Want a partner? This is a goal which you can (and should) approach intentionally.

Pick your top 3 and start working on them immediately. Like NOW. Take at least one action on all of them TODAY.

I was in a similar spot when i was in your age, 6 years ago. Had a well-payed job an all, but felt like life was escaping away from me. Like the feeling of is this it? I was close to buy an apartment and settle down for good. But something inside me was nagging at me that this was not the right move.

So, a week later I told my boss i would be leaving for 7 months and that i would not take no for an answer. I took all that money, and spent it in a backpacking-trip in latin-america by my self. At 35 years of age. Totally out of my comfort zone.

- It was one of the best decisions of my life.

I made so many new friends around the world, tasted food that I didn't know exists, climbed mountains, dived with hammer sharks in Galapagos. Hiked in landscapes of indescribable beauty. Had a joint under an amazing sky of stars in atacama.. Met beautiful women of totally different cultures. And finally met the girl of my life.

To say the least, it changed my life. I am a much more open-minded person. I look forward to go to places I haven't been in and interact with nature in a much deeper level. I appreciate the differences in all of us much more now than before. The world is a beautiful place, and you should experience it to the fullest.

Say yes to life! Always!

In your situation I would start some kind of psychological therapy. You have a substantial amount of money so find someone competent. I started going to therapy when I was 35 as well, and my therapist said that for the first-time clients this is the most common age group, as defence mechanism that were working when people were young start to break down. Based on what you wrote - sounds exactly what might be happening with you.

Would you elaborate on what you mean by defense mechanisms in this case? I'm guessing it's on a psychological level, but unsure against what exactly.

Against existential dread maybe? Against awareness of lack of meaning?

Defence mechanism defines how a person deals with stress and anxiety [1].

For example one common defence mechanism among younger intellectual types is rationalisation [2]. A person might get asked why they don't have children and respond with something like "I don't have the money, today children are so expensive", or "I enjoy my free time too much to be bothered with children", or "there are already too many humans on the planet, I don't want to make the problem worse", etc. But in their subconscious the fact everyone around them starts having children while they don't might silently be causing anxiety. When a person gets older such rationalisations can break down, i.e. "I enjoy my free time too much" might not work when you are 35 and start to feel lonely, so the stress that was once suppressed by a defence mechanism rises up.

That's just my layman's understanding of it.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_mechanism

[2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationalization_(psychology)

I had a very similar experience around 37. My latest startup had crashed, and I sort of woke up to the realisation that (for the first time) not all paths were open to me anymore.

To some extent I think this is just part of the natural cycle of life: the mid life crisis if you will. Looking back I think some of the feelings of regret and rumination on the "road not taken" was more or less symptoms of depression / acute crisis. That part will pass. Exercise helps.

For me it was also a lot about questioning the value system I had been born into and finding my own. And I don't mean just the high and mighty (political) values that we talk a lot about, but the really low level stuff we're often unaware of. If I had $500k in the bank and was in this situation I'd definitely try to find a good therapist (the freudian type - not KBT), and talk about your attitude to work, self-esteem, relationships and values.

For me this was a period of pretty dramatic and profound change. I have a feeling you could have it easier. If so I'd also consider putting some effort into finding a partner, and perhaps having children. But health comes first!

I'm 33 and I'm in a very similar boat. Actually exactly the same to be completely honest. Several things have helped me cope with those thoughts. First one was force myself not to think about it. Whatever spare time I have, fill it up with something and avoid just sitting/laying down and contemplating. Books, walks, exercising, movies, stupid youtube videos, anything but giving myself the opportunity to think about it. Second one is getting yourself into new hobbies, which is extremely easy. I've never been a car guy or anything but cars generally interest me, so I started following Formula 1 closely. Got myself a 3D printer and started studying 3D modeling. Microcontrollers, sensors and small devices are dirt cheap and making small devices is extremely rewarding. And last but certainly not least, when the pandemic started I got myself a dog to keep me company. A fairly large one and a breed that is notorious for being extremely smart and having an infinite amount of energy. I definitely underestimated both of those things but it has helped me massively.

33 (and 35) is young, please don't think you're over the hill. I'm 38 and I still feel I'm just starting out & there's a lot to look forward to (I'll bet having little kids is a big part of why I feel that way).

Like the above it sounds like a lot of it might be loneliness? I'm not saying it expecting it to be something easy to rectify but if it is the cause it is indeed possible to become less lonely. I dare say it will give you more happiness than a lot of success in your career.

Nah, in all fairness I'm perfectly content in that aspect-no such expectations or desires. I have plenty of bad examples - observations and personal experiences: in a nutshell, my life is similar to an early 2000's hypercar - looks great on the outside and desirable from afar, but in reality impractical, useless in the real world uncomfortable and deadly in most scenarios. My bad qualities include extreme nihilism, cynicism, irony and sarcasm and extremely low tolerance for anything that doesn't suit me. Selling points - financial status and abs. The latter is offered by most people at the next door gym which leaves us with the financial aspect, so... Yeah... Pass.

Relationships are not transactional like that, you don't have to have a USP to get a romantic partner. You are probably selling yourself short and there are a lot of people who could love you (and that you could love).

Perhaps, whether it's been personal experience or simply as an external observer(and as much as friends and family would hate me for saying this), relationships have been nothing but transactional and manifestations of some form of co-dependency.

> You are probably selling yourself short and there are a lot of people who could love you (and that you could love).

Maybe, maybe not, not caring appears to take considerably less effort.

Thanks for posting. My approach as been very similar to yours, especially not sitting around contemplating it.

39. Exactly the same, except 4 years older, half the savings and just 1.5 startups.

I'm looking to see if hobbies can help me meet people, hopefully friends or even a partner. COVID isn't helping.

I try to ignore friends and acquaintances that tell me how boring my life is, ask me why I don't have a partner, why I don't have kids, why do I spend so much time alone, why don't I party more... Frankly, they are not helping. Still keep them as friends though.

Dating feels like work most of the time, so I'm doing it less and less. It used to stress me, now I tell myself a partner is not a requirement for a happy life and date when I feel like it.

I am still living abroad, will probably move back in a couple of years. I am putting some unreasonable expectations on the move, hoping it will make things better when I know it won't. At least the weather will be better.

As time piles your age, irreversibility gains terrain in the land of possibility. You can fight to do all the possible or, like me, watch yourself lose with a bitter glass of wine at your lips. It tastes better after a while.

I don't think I'm sad, just profoundly bored.

There are so many answers here to the effect of “Stop right now, find an acceptable partner, get married, have kids, everything else is meaningless.”

From all the long-term (7+ years) couples I know well enough to know if they are actually happy or not, it’s the minority that are happy. Stats don’t suggest I’ve got an unusual sample.

And I’ve heard time and again from parents of older children (when they leave home, or even they become teenagers) that much of the feelings of uselessness or directionlessness return.

This isn’t to discount any of the joy or happiness anyone here is experiencing. The opposite, really. I’m jealous of you. I want to have what you have and I’m pursuing it the best I can. But I pursue it knowing that marriage is just a shot at happiness, not a guarantee or probably even a likelihood. And I’m pursuing it knowing that raising children is a beautiful source of meaning, but it is a season.

It’s a worthy goal. But I’m having trouble squaring the black and white portrayal here with what I’ve seen and experienced.

I went through feeling like this when I was about 27. I felt like I had settled into a comfortable, but monotonous, way of life. Programming, my favourite thing to do then, had become challenging only because of problems created by things like application complexity, framework churn, software development fads etc.

What helped me was taking up new interests and hobbies, ones completely removed from software development, ones with a long history that would take a long time to 'master'. For me this was things like reading, writing and studying ancient philosophy.

I also found developing a kind of 'spirituality' – a word I would have considered dirty in my early twenties – essential to living contentedly in a reality that seems chaotic and meaningless, and accepting things like ageing and dying. For me, the writings and recordings of Alan Watts helped enormously here, but I find different people fill this hole with different things and people.

Lots of good advice here. I would add this: Actively cultivate a relationship with yourself.

I find daily journaling rewarding - just venting on paper or into a voice recording app. After a few days/weeks/months of this, go back and look at highs and lows, repeated themes, energizing things vs taxing things. Why are you here and what is important to you, where do you get joy and energy, what kills your soul? This is one method for getting those answers.

Another method: as you live through your week, Monday through Sunday, hour by hour, record what you do with each hour. Then, look at that picture. Just the act of observing will be a teacher.

You already likely know this all of this, and just need reminding. Best of luck and happy to talk more over email. I’m turning 50 this year and have the same list of thoughts you mention hm… maybe once every three weeks. They don’t go away, but through the work I’ve done on myself, I know how much energy to give them.

At 35, it's not an uncommon feeling, some call it a mid-life crisis.

The reason imo is it's an age when we start feeling our body is getting old, the feeling of "immortality" of our 20s is gone, we realize the clock is ticking.

Add to that what happens those last 2 years, the isolation, especially if you're single, and so of course it's a hard period for you.

Personally, the way I dealt with it, was through reading everything I could find about philosophy, particularly stoicism and buddhism. It helped me a lot, taught me how those feelings are unavoidable at times, how the mind create that pain and how to make it more easily manageable.

But there's no secret weapon, no magic cure, life is painful at time, and things get better by themselves as long as we don't add to it by feeling guity or thinking "it's not fair". Some realization takes time, so be patient and gentle to yourself, one day at a time.

Good luck friend.

Any particular books you’d recommend to someone uninitiated to buddhism/stoicism?

Here you go:

For stoicism:

- "Enchiridion" of Epictetus. - "Meditations" by Marcus Aurelius (my personal favorite that I keep reading over and over). - "Letters from a stoic" from Seneca.

It's not a lot of authors but they're pretty dense and should keep you busy for a long time.

For buddhism, it's a very vast subject, but I'd start with:

- "Siddhartha", this is a novel but will give you an overview on the buddhist system of thoughts. It's also very well written and inspiring.

- "What the Buddha Taught", also an introductory book on buddhist toughts. - Another introductory book is "Buddhism for Beginners".

From there, and based on your interests that you will discover along the way, go into the "suttas" which are the religious texts. You may even want to go to a time before buddhism with the vedas and the Upanishads that have so much to teach us.

There are many schools of buddhism, some closer to what we'd call a religion in the west while others purely philosophical (without any emphasis on a god). Zen buddhism is yet another category, where the teaching is based almost entirely on mediation alone but it's the exception, even if in the west we often think buddhism = meditation, but it's not so.

So, as you can see, it's more a tree than a line and you'll figure it out as you go if it resonnates with you and how deep you want to go.

Enjoy!

This is great, thank you!

The Daily Stoic by Ryan Holiday is the book that I read daily (it has an entry for each day) for the past 5 years and has helped me immensely. I tend to write one sentence in it after reading it, and then compare to all the previous one's I wrote - useful for uncovering (bad) patterns.

You have half a million in savings at 35, and you feel like you haven’t accomplished anything?

I think you’re describing depression, anyway, and that’s the real reason why you feel this way.

Invest in therapy, to help you cope with the fact that life isn’t about having a purpose. You seem to be let down by this idea of “accomplishment” that is engrained into our brains since childhood by our capitalistic society. I’m sure that you can look back and find out many accomplishments, plus you could try and do things for the sake of it. That helped me ;)

> I am turning 35 years soon and I feel like I haven't achieved much

that's normal

with some rare exceptions, at 35 you are too young to watch at you life with the right perspective and you feel like you haven't achieved much.

It is also because it's true, you haven't achieved much in the grand scheme if things, like virtually everyone of us, but what you have achieved on a personal level will be visible in the future, it's invisible right now.

Look at it this way: you are at the beginning of the journey, things that are gard now get easier with time, things that now are easy get harder with age, but at 35 you have actually "lived" less than 20 years, while many more are in front of you and nobody can actually predict what's going to happen next. Life is full of surprises.

You're more lucky than at least 99% of the people on Earth. You're young, educated, presumably healthy, and skilled. You have enough savings to survive for years if you budget well. I share some of those privileges, and it fills me with a deep sense of gratitude when I reflect on it. This leads to a desire to give back and help others. How you channel that is up to you.

There's so much more to the human experience than tech. I didn't have a liberal arts education, and spending time filling those gaps led to a new appreciation for literature, music, history, and philosophy. This expanded my pool of hobbies, and helps me connect with other people across more topics.

I assume you run or work out or something already so I'll skip the physical activity bit.

You may need some therapy. To contrast: I'm 36, don't have 6-figure savings, no house, am married, but haven't lived in other countries or founded any startups, but I also value time with friends much more than career achievements.

Since my recent move to Minnesota I've been bummed out a bit due to isolation due to Covid, lack of sunlight, and a somewhat insular culture. I've been going to therapy to help out and it's been a big help. I've gone from feeling numb or like nothing matters, to just getting by, to being optimistic about my future now that I'm being tested for anxiety and ADHD.

I see that you're looking for an outside perspective with this post, but I suggest getting much more personalized help with a psychologist.

Finding a partner and starting a family is a boring social norm and has been for millennia. It does provide a sense of purpose. In terms of professional success, what would be enough? Making millions on a startup? Billions?A turing award? Starting the next computing trend?

I think this is just the ennui that's part of life. Even married, social people feel the same at some point.

Just consider yourself blessed to have a half a million on the side and think about all the potential problems and health issues you DONT have. A bit of stoic thinking maybe.

I'm a couple of years older but I felt very directionless around your same age. I don't know if it's similar to what you are feeling but I'll share my experience in case it helps.

One thing that helped me was to schedule regular time to be with my own thoughts. This became mornings at a coffee shop with a book and a journal, sometimes after a hike through a local park. I take the time to read last week's entry every time and reflect on it.

Set small goals and forgive yourself routinely. It's through small goals that get transformed into routines that long term goals are achievable.

For me, giving myself "protected" time to actually think helped me a lot with my feeling of directionlessness.

Get married and have kids already. The developed world population has been well below the replacement level, and you will have a new purpose in life, one that is very hard, but feels biologically correct. Kids are a way to try to "get right" all the mistakes you made or people made with you. Of course they will make their own mistakes, but we're talking about what will be rewarding for you. You sound like you have experienced a lot, and should pass on your skills and learnings. You also need higher day to day priorities than your own mental health in order to "get out of your own head" and finish maturing into an adult, IMHO. (Speaking from experience)

Don’t know why you’re being downvoted. Sounds like there are a lot of resentful childless population here on HN. The OP asked for advices and someone’s giving it. Chill folks

Oh, I fully expected it. And let me be the first to say, a lot of people are having kids at the wrong time and with the wrong people, which is worse than waiting. But IMHO there is a huge cultural malaise with individual psychological consequences in developed nations not promoting childbearing, even in ones with strong social safety nets.

I see more dogs at the parks and beaches these days than kids. People think not having kids is in their own self interest. I think they are terribly mistaken even though it is very counterintuitive.

Dumb question, how do you downvote a post on this site? Not that I have any particular desire to - but I'm curious because I only see an upvote option.

> feeling less excited about everything

This may be a symptom of depression. It's called anhedonia, where people feel reduced motivation or an inability to feel pleasure. Many people feel depressed without feeling the typical symptoms of depression, like sadness.

Thanks, I've thought about this. I don't think I have depression, at least not severe, but I definitely am less able to enjoy pleasure as I was many years ago. Even the definition of pleasure, sex, has kind of lost its flavor as I became older.

Aside from a lot of the other good advice on this thread I just wanted to remind the OP and anyone else feeling similarly right now to not forget about the covid situation. The last two years have not been normal. Social rhythms, relationships, work ... a lot of things have been disrupted. A degree of malaise is an incredibly common response.

Nothing in my post indicates what to do if this is your situation. But I think am accurate problem statement is a starting place to most good solutions in life, and the pandemic has become so much a part of like that it's easy to forget just how disruptive it has been to the normal trajectory of many of our lives.

Reading through the comments, does it feel like they have no idea what you're going through or where you're coming from? If so, let me tell you what worked for me. None of these comments ever works without having someone around you that you can reality test with. You need to find a partner in life. You need to get married. And no, a live-in partner won't do.

That is it. There is no other solutions for you. Meetups, hobbies, social contacts, "experiences", ... They won't work. You will come back to an empty home at the end of it and discover the same old problems you were trying to deal with.

Just get married.

> You need to find a partner in life. You need to get married.

No you don't. This is not a prerequisite for happiness or meaning. It's a narrow view on life to believe that the only way to achieve fulfilment is through marriage. Especially not even considering all the pitfalls involved, and all the risks of it making your life much worse.

Maybe it'll work for OP, maybe it won't. It's way too big of a blanket statement to just say "marriage will fix your problems".

Yes but getting married is not a goal in itself. It’s necessary but not sufficient.

Not to put words in your mouth, but "Just get married" sounds eerily close to "someone else will fix you".

Sure, marriage can bring lots of purpose and meaning to your life. It may even 'fix' you, for a time. However, it can also bring devastation. Being betrayed by who I felt was my partner in life nearly destroyed me, and years later I'm still struggling to find my footing.

Relying on union with another person is not, in my eyes, a viable solution for the long term. At best, you're punting the internal work that's truly called for down the road to another day.

How does one “just get married”?

Dude, you should visit rural Vietnam, Thailand, or Cambodia and meet people who possess almost nothing except unconditional happiness. Maybe then you stop moaning, fcking poor thing sitting on $500K savings and feeling old at 35.

I've too felt this way and one of the reasons for this is you're lacking something on which you can't really put a finger on just yet.

Take this test (1) - it's from a book called your best year ever (no affiliation just found it on gr) and though it feels a little pop-pschy it does give you some insight on where you may be lacking and the cause of such feelings.

(1) https://assessments.michaelhyatt.com/lifescore/ (it will ask you for email so use mailinator)

I crossed that age and I can tell you without much thinking: focus on sleep quality. It's reason number one for your feeling like shit most of the time, and you need better sleep as you get older.

Second, learn how to prioritise what you do in your free time. Too many side projects? Ditch some. You should have got a hint about what you really like by now and it's time to focus on that.

As for the clubs, bars etc: I feel you, but it's normal, you will find equally exciting places where to spend time with people. Your life is over only when you convince yourself that it is.

I'm in a similar position only a bit younger and richer, I've found restricting exposure to information helps a lot. Meditation is basically spending some time not worrying about anything, it's not particularly helpful if you do it for a bit just to browse social media later. What I've done is remove lightbulbs from living spaces, delete social media and timelock any timesink (my browser allows 20 minutes of HN per day), sold my TVs, use candlelights and focus REALLY hard on not even thinking about things you can't change.

This is a lovely way to frame meditation.

Parking time to practice not-thinking has a cumulative effect in my experience, but it accumulates quickly I.e. days of practice. I’m not as disciplined as some, and mostly my diligence comes in waves where I re-establish a sitting routine every few months after life distracts me.

Also +1 on candlelight/hurricane lamps.

It looks you need to find meaningful things in your life. What it is that is meaningful is enterly up to uou. Normally it’s something that happens progressevly, it starts with “this could be interesting” and then evolves from there. Things that directly involve other people, where you feel you are important to them or feeling that you are appreciated have higher probability of feeling meaningful. I would suggest the exact opposite of travel. It’s not about finding the exotic, it’s about looking deeper on the things that are already around you.

Have you gone traveling? I found that spending a few years on the road dramatically changed the way that I saw myself, my place in the world, and my worldview as a whole.

Concepts like "achievement" are not fixed in stone, and are yours to define. Perhaps it is time that you take that challenge on, and define for yourself what success means to you. It doesn't have to be academic, career, or family oriented. It can be anything that you want it to be. But, it does have to come from yourself if you want it to be meaningful.

I agree completely but just thought I'd point out that OP mentioned having traveled and even lived in multiple countries.

I'm 38 and feel the EXACT same way! I try explaining to my wife but unable to. I'm all the sudden unimpressed and not interested in most things. Very bizarre and honestly depressing.

Have you checked your vitamin D, vitamin B12 levels ? I am 25 and used to feel the same way. Not interested in things, giving up repeatedly on my gf/relationship, playing video games became a chore. I used to sleep less because of the stress of a very shitty job. Overall I felt like shit all the time.

I read on the net that it might be because of a vitamin D deficiency. I took a medical test and it showed me that I was vitamin D and vitamin B deficient. I have started taking supplements for these two and I can already feel the difference after almost two months of taking the vitamins.

Get your vitamin levels checked.

> playing video games became a chore

Ouch. This is the one I identify the most with. I am, or was, a huge gamer. I used to play shooters, MMOs, and grindy RPGs and loved it. I could easily spend the whole day playing.

Now I can barely play for more than an hour without feeling some kind of anxiety that I'm wasting my time or need to get to the goal as efficiently as possible. How can I fix this!?

I'm already taking vitamin supplements :)

I'm late 20's and can also kind of relate. Playing games kind of feels like a chore now.

Personally, I just took that as a signal to stop playing games. I still play (and really enjoy) multiplayer games with friends when they're around, but if you have an anxiety saying "you should be doing something else" then I think you should probably try doing something else.

As an alternative to the sibling comment's suggestion, you could try playing some non-grindy games. There's this general expectation that one doesn't get good value out of a game unless there's at least 60 hours of content and probably an ever-challenging multiplayer mode, but dump those AAA expectations and focus on just having a good time.

Pick an indie game or two with a well-defined end point, one that plays in under 20 or even 10 hours. See the sense of finishing and never going back to it makes you feel any differently.

If it doesn't work, you can still leave games by the wayside. I took several years of a break because I just wasn't feeling it, and ended up coming back to video games with a different perspective. It's all good either way, you don't have to force it.

> Now I can barely play for more than an hour without feeling some kind of anxiety that I'm wasting my time or need to get to the goal as efficiently as possible. How can I fix this!?

Listen to that feeling, because it's the truth. Video games should be at the absolute bottom of your priorities. Every minute you're playing video games is a minute you could be improving yourself, meeting new people, travelling or whatever.

35 is not old but time is nonetheless limited, you need to make the most of it. Once you have a family and feel some kind of fulfilment, then you can play video games if you want. I bet that right now it's just a temporary escape from your feeling of emptiness, but as soon as you stop playing the feelings come back, stronger than before, because you just wasted another hour without getting any closer to your goal. It's very analogous to trying to numb your ennui with alcohol, it's not a good idea.

> Ouch. This is the one I identify the most with. I am, or was, a huge gamer. I used to play shooters, MMOs, and grindy RPGs and loved it. I could easily spend the whole day playing.

> the fact that I don't have the option to do them is depressing to me.

> I definitely am less able to enjoy pleasure as I was many years ago

> Once I get back in front of the screen, it's back to the usual self.

I think there might be something here and I think I might have a video quite relevant for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvNCvCKJRBg

If you let that feeling in for a bit, can you figure out why you feel like you're wasting your time? Is it inefficiency or just plain waste?

I felt this way about Diablo 3 for a bit, at some point I thought "I could've learned 3 languages by now instead of this". Turns out I still like gaming, but yeah, I really do also want to do other things with my time. So no more grindy stuff, I'll game, but more the stuff I can play for 30 minutes and stop, or alternatively some RPG/single player game that I can play for 40 hours over a few weeks to get my fill, and then move on.

33 here, exactly the same story. Take care.

You need to read some philosophy. Find new and rewarding ways to reframe your life journey. The Stoics are the experts of moving past troubles and and reframing events in n a practical and/or positive way. Alan Watts was all about viewing everything as a joyful and entertaining whole. “Four Thousand Weeks” is a recent and practical book that aims to get over the idea of achievements and efficiency and get to enjoying moments in life and rediscovering what is meaningful to us.

Just a few getting started ideas here.

A certain degradation of excitement is inevitable but there are countless opportunities you haven't taken yet and challenges that will give you meaning. "Excited about technologies" is an issue that was bound to happen, considering how overpromising every single new innovation is sold. At some point we do learn our lesson and understand the actual difference this new piece of hardware is going to have on our life will be minimal. If you're looking for new things to grab and hold your attention I highly advice to not keep looking in the same place you've been standing at for the longest time.

It does sound like you've worked a lot, and probably also with computers, so you probably should try to find challenges in other fields, mainly sports. Run a marathon, do some climbing, get in the best shape of your life - it is utterly impossible to not feel ecstatic whenever you beat your own records. Also, sounds like starting a family would give you a tremendous benefit. Once you have kids the question about "feeling lost" doesn't even come up (probably because the kids won't let you think enough about that :P)

I'm 32 and I basically did not exist throughout my 20s but now I'm in better shape than I've ever been before, interact with people more than I ever did before and make new experiences on a regular basis.

I'm 42 and in a similar place. I'm in my third year of law school and about to become a patent attorney -- a 4th career. Hopefully this one brings me happiness and fulfillment. /s

For me, (accidentally) having a kid has catapulted my life forward a bit in terms of feeling comfortable in my shoes.

What I came here to add, is something I'm often thinking about these days: you need to figure out what role money has in your life. How much of it do you want, and why?

Yes, I realize this is a gross subject, but I think, at least in the US, we are not sufficiently honest about this.

I think it's OK to want more of it, or lots of it. Or less of it. Or an average amount. But you need to own that decision and reach a place where you're genuinely comfortable with what you have, or want.

Then you can figure out what you're going to do with your time. Are you going to work towards getting lots of money? Then every act needs to be in service of that goal. Do you just want to be rich at retirement? Do the math -- carefully -- and make sure you will be rich at retirement, and figure out exactly what income you need to achieve that. Are you happy with a modest income and wealth? Huzzah, you can relax.

Once you've admitted to yourself what role money has in your life, then you can go about figuring out your hobbies or workout routine or spirituality, or whatever. But I am increasingly of the opinion that savage honesty about how much money we need to be happy has to come first.

I'm 38 w/wife and 2 kids. I like to think that I don't have any time for myself any more. Looking back over the last few years, I've dipped a toe into the following hobbies:

paddleboarding, biking, fixing up a rental property, sewing, electronics, bought an internet business to run as a side hustle, minecraft (family realm), weightlifting/fitness + fixing my sleep (down 30 lbs in 15 mo), sauna (not really a hobby, but ~30 min/day), crypto, knitting, breadmaking, pottery, ukulele, piano, rock climbing, disc golf, pickleball

Find activities that make you happy and double down on those. Pay for classes/coaches. Travel has been pretty much nonexistent the last few years (thanks covid), so we've had to spend a lot of time/money on figuring out how we can stay put and not kill each other.

On the job side, remote work means way more opportunities to find interesting work. Or buy something neat on MicroAcquire and learn how to grow it if you feel like you don't have what it takes to start something. (I don't say that negatively -- I started a lot of things that never went anywhere, but I find that I enjoy the operations/optimization side a lot more and have enjoyed tinkering on a business I bought in 2018).

(edit: forgot lists don't work)

Holistic health and spiritual practices to open your mind and heart.

It sounds like you're drowning, being weighted down, by your own biased judgement.

I'd recommend to fast track to bypass your ego mind's unreasonable, unflattering judgement of yourself, to look into Ayahuasca ceremonies - which are legal in many parts of the world including Canada.

You're blocked from seeing your self-worth, and that's a big problem as like attracts like - and having a low self-worth (or low vibration in woo-woo spiritual communities) is going to only attract more of the same, and not bring you the light (shine or lightness) into your life - if you're not shining or feeling light yourself.

Psilocybin mushrooms are another option that may be more readily available but not legal in as many places.

There's a fairly large community of users of psychedelics/entheogens in San Francisco/Silicone Valley, so if you're a developer from that area, or ever take a trip/journey out there - it shouldn't be hard to stumble into like-minded communities of developers who you could venture with spiritually; Steve Jobs was into psychedelics, likely why his mind was opened exponentially to the possibilities he was able to see with Apple's potential.

The human mind needs goals, you are without a goal (or you are ignoring your goal) so you feel life is empty.

Think hard and deep; are there things on this planet that you would like to achieve? Family, work, travel, home, inventions, helping others?

Write it down, and start to think about how to reach that goal. When you have some steps that would take you closer to your goal take those steps.

My personal take is that you are programed to wanting kids, so that should be a goal for most people.

This is nice advice from Tim Minchin's 9 Life Lessons speech:

> Americans on talent shows always talk about their dreams. Fine, if you have something that you’ve always dreamed of, like, in your heart, go for it! After all, it’s something to do with your time… chasing a dream. And if it’s a big enough one, it’ll take you most of your life to achieve, so by the time you get to it and are staring into the abyss of the meaninglessness of your achievement, you’ll be almost dead so it won’t matter.

> I never really had one of these big dreams. And so I advocate passionate dedication to the pursuit of short-term goals. Be micro-ambitious. Put your head down and work with pride on whatever is in front of you… you never know where you might end up. Just be aware that the next worthy pursuit will probably appear in your periphery. Which is why you should be careful of long-term dreams. If you focus too far in front of you, you won’t see the shiny thing out the corner of your eye.

Full video/transcript: https://www.timminchin.com/2013/09/25/occasional-address/

What I’m reading from this with no other context:

Bored and or depressed because of few to no socially engaging connections in life.

Probably amplified by being stuck inside due to the pandemic.

Did some cool stuff in their 20s but realizing they’ve done “nothing” for the past five.

Sounds like it’s time to get on a plane and enjoy an adventure. Meet some fun people, have fun, and enjoy the life you’ve built.

Then when you land home try to transfer some of that energy towards expanding your social circle, maybe go dating, etc.

I feel like my time for everything is running out. Have you been through a similar thing? How did you deal with it?

Professionally, I have felt that. I have been in academia for a long time, and there are always people who are smarter, more successful, etc. So by my mid-30ies I often felt like I had an ok-ish academic career, I could probably get a permanent position. But I have frequently felt like the point of making a mark has passed (which is probably false) and that I failed. For me it helped to do something really different. First, I consulted for about a year, then I was offered a position in a really nice company and I am enjoying it a lot.

I used to go to a lot of concerts and go to clubs, but by the mid-30s I noticed that my body needs much more regular sleep, etc. and I can't take alcohol as much, etc. Also, that lifestyle becomes much harder with a child. So, we have a far more disciplined life now and I only drink a glass of wine with a nice dinner every few weeks or so. However, we found a lot of enjoyment in other things. E.g. we usually take a 1 week break every few months were we hire a small house near a national park or on an island. We usually cycle a lot, go to restaurants, enjoy nature, etc. It's always a lot of fun and there is always something to look forward to.

I also re-read Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind every few years [1]. The book is about Zen meditation practice, but the idea of finding and approaching things with a beginner's mind is widely applicable.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zen_Mind,_Beginner%27s_Mind

You may have the opportunity to help others (students?) make their mark. That could be very rewarding.

I just turned 35 and my situation is very similar to yours, with the exception being that I am married. Partners and family do give one's life a lot of meaning. That said, I'm glad you asked this question, as these topics have been occupying much of my thinking lately as well. I don't have the solution, but just want to let you know others feel the same as you (as you have probably already seen in the comments!)

You are now looking back at a significant part of your life and that is changing your perspective. Not only are you not going to be younger in the future, but you may not enjoy the agility that you had, good looks, and all other niceties of youth.

Our western civilizations do not value age that much these days, it's not a good fit for the always-on high-throughput life required to not go under.

Some get lucky, married, have children, which yet again gives you a different perspective on life (and you start to see how little things matter that you thought matter). This can be a significant impulse through your 30's and 40's.

A guy I know is forever single, about your age - a cultivated man, who enjoys a few recreational activities, but who also wastes a lot of time (something people with kids cannot afford any more).

Not sure what has been driving you, but with a nice chunk of savings try to cut back on stuff you do not really value for a few years and try to refocus on a thing that captures your spirits, whatever that may be.

You probably need to let life capture you again, in its weird ways and I see some people just not crazy enough to allow themselves to.

As a Non-English speaker, my advice is to try some language exchange services. There are a lot of girls out there in their early 20s who want to have a relationship with English speaker like you. Learn a new language and make new connections with new people. A good travel, or new business opportunities. Who knows the future? Being unmarried also means being free. Take advantage of the privileges you have.

Mixed bag. Meeting girls in another country is fun when you're traveling and you're 18. It can be depressing if they don't understand your culture and you don't communicate well. Sometimes I can't even understand girls from my own country anymore who are ten years younger than me.

Great advice, learning another language gets your brain going and into social situations. He sounds lonely.

Hey OP, I’m a couple years older than you but have gone through this over the last few years. Also haven’t had a serious relationship since I got divorced in my early 30s and was feeling stagnant in my career.

Things changed for me when I stopped giving a shit about work. It’s something I do for money. I enjoy being good at it, but I work my 40 a week, collect a paycheck, treat my direct reports like human beings rather than “resources” and go home.

I found having a creative hobby outside work helps. Putting all your creative energy into a job is frustrating because the job never gives you back as much as you put in. I took up piano at 35 having never had any exposure. I’m by no means good, but I enjoy it and it gives me something to do. I can see my progress, and it helps me not feel stuck in life. I do it for me.

Similarly, I have a competitive / athletic hobby. I’m not good at that either, but I’ve risen from dead last to middle of the pack. I’ve also met a lot of people through it who are great casual friends (not going to say what it is because it’s a really small niche of a niche).

So maybe try doing more things you know you’re bad at but have always wanted to do. Watching yourself grow through them helps prevent you from feeling stagnant. It also helps you be a more interesting person, which will help you in the dating scene.

And on dating, try to put yourself out of your comfort zone there too. Sadly with the pandemic most dating happens through apps. Maybe go out on a date with someone you normally wouldn’t, like a same-sex partner if the idea has ever held any appeal to you. It’s never too late to experiment, and at our age you should have already realized that nobody other than your mom gives enough of a shit about you to care what you do in life.

You've laid out a number of things:

> I feel like I haven't achieved much, both personally and professionally

> I am single and haven't had a serious relationship for many years now.

> As time went on, I started feeling less excited about everything, personal or work related

> I feel like my time for everything is running out.

Nobody is going to be able to untangle all these in a comment, so it wouldn't be fair to try. I'll give one suggestion. Find someone who is qualified and willing to help you untangle all this.

Would that be a friend? A relative? No, or it would've happened by now. So who? A good therapist :)

If you can get past the judgement a lot of people who've never seen a therapist have, I think you'll find it very helpful. You have the money and if a therapist is not helpful after you've tried a few different ones, then at least you can cross it off your potential solutions list.

This isn't an uncommon or unique set of thoughts to have by the way. That cult movie Fight Club is all about it. Its solution was to drop down to being violent apes. A solution I lean towards is moving up to being a conscious human being :)

Good luck on your journey.

This resonates a lot with me. In my case I think the lack of a relationship for a few years exacerbates everything else. A lot of suggestions from small (go for walks) to big (do some travelling) just make me a little sad that I would be doing those things alone.

I always find it particularly funny when someone says "oh, I totally get feeling lonely. Just the other day I was telling my wife that I was..."

Im in that boat too, but I also look at it as a choice Ive made through the years, Ive always valued being independent and having my own space over basically everything else... And Ive grown into this person, for example, Im good professionally, I skateboard, Im a bit of a nights and parties and bars and travelling person, Im heavily tattooed etc. But then with covid and time passing then the "oh shit this being all by myself and all for myself thing, I think Im over it", then its something that starts hitting you with bigger frequency etc.

So anyway, my conclusion is that yeah Im maybe a bit deep into this, but the most important thing is that I now want to chose a different thing and Ive just got to work on realizing this new objetive just as I done before. This 'Im now old and lonely' thing is though, but the hardest part of it I think is just that we end up ruminating that shit and thinking our choices have completely defined us already and we are done. And when we were younger as the thought went over us wed actually think that was the whole fun, having that youthful outlook like "oh I have all this freedom and time to do what I want with my life, how exciting!", we still have so much freedom and time to choose.

Honestly I think as we get into the mid thirties there's probably some stuff that change in our minds, how we perceive time, past, future, etc, and this anxieties start creeping up more, I guess that's part of life. Most definitely, though, being thrown around and being cornered by fear, by your own thoughts, thats not the way to live, I'm sure. To me its no wonder most of all antique philosophy/religion, if you look into it, focus exactly on that, dealing with human existential anxiety.

This got a bit long but I decided to take my social and affective life into my own hands more, and Ill be getting a dog this year too hahah

I turn 50 in 2 months. (I'm as surprised as anyone.)

I just had my first kid, a son, 7 months ago. He is amazing. But also, I'll be 70 when he turns 21 and that is terrifying. I'm hoping he keeps me young :)

A few years ago I ditched Ruby and went into Elixir. It's been amazing. I don't know what kind of self-limiting BS you're telling yourself but you sound like you're just in a rut and need to change your surroundings. Plus, 2 years of COVID is a drag on anyone's psyche.

I love gaming. Gaming's been better than it has ever been.

I also love EDM. Same story, the fact that recommendation engines know my taste SO well means I don't have to lose touch. I'm still listening to songs that came out a week ago on a regular basis.

I too have some money saved, and some early startup work has started to pay off. So I'm currently working on a business plan (very hard as I have some ADHD) to start a business, I think I have enough industry time to pull it off and I'd love mentoring people.

Find your thrill, sleep well, exercise, etc. etc. Make sure you don't have seasonal affective disorder. Good luck

I expect it's a temporary rut. I vaguely remember a lull around your age. But I just kept living life, and it passed.

I started my third career (as a software developer) at age 38 just before getting married for the first time at 40 and moving half way across the country. I still had two failed startups (and a successful side project) ahead of me.

Almost 20 years later I still frequently go to festivals and local live music shows. I'm taking some time off to partake in SXSW next month. I have a stack of books I can't get to. I'm still improving my guitar and singing skills, a lifelong hobby.

I've made a bunch of new friends lately with a group that shares some interests. We have regular get togethers, like karaoke Fridays, gun range trips (a new hobby for me), and just hanging out. They are all coming to my Super Bowl part this Sunday. Most of the group is 30s-40s. I go to discussion meetups once a month or so.

I'm not saying all this to brag about myself but show you that most of your active years lie ahead.

A few concrete suggestions:

1. If you spend a lot of time playing video games, stop. It's the world's greatest time suck.

2. Curtail porn.

3. Find meetups that interest you.

4. If your BMI is above high twenties, get it down. Keto and daily walks/hiking/swimming does it for me.

5. Consider getting a dog. It's great for fighting loneliness and can help attract dates.

6. Study stoicism. It's the OG self help. (I'm just starting this now. I think it will help a lot as I move into old age.)

7. Keep spending less than you make. You're in a pretty good spot savings wise. Keep it up.

This happened to me around 35 as well.

It's important to recognize that you're still young in the grand scheme of things.

A lot of the other comments recommend making friends, having kids, getting married, etc. Those things might help, but can also make things worse. And ultimately, they might not necessarily fix what YOU need.

It sounds like you lack meaning in your life, motivation, and a clear direction.

It's important that you spend some time thinking about what you want your life to look like to create the happiness you desire. What's missing? What do you want to be working on? What will provide you fulfillment? etc.

You might need to go explore some new hobbies or experiences to figure it out, but therein lies the exciting part of life. Try something new and don't be afraid to fail. It's just part of journey.

Once you've got that picture of what you want your life to look out, write it down. Then start making 2-3 year plans to move your life into that direction. This should help get you excited (or scared). Use it motivate yourself to get to your desired end goal.

Does this quote from Alan Watts help? “There’s nothing in your life that is supposed to happen. if you have no fixed view, you remain elastic.” My advice is to explore spiritual philosophies that focus on waking up from our constant thought world, and to realize that all this idea of where one is supposed to be in life at certain stages or ages, is just made-up mental load.

> to festivals, bars and clubs and make new friends that way.

IMHO those aren't always friends. 1 in 100 maybe, but mostly I found they're people I partied with and that's it.

> How do you deal with getting old and feeling lost?

When I turned 42 I found the answer for me, be less of a piece of shit, like in a deeply metaphorical way. For me that meant take on more significant personal responsibility and expect less from the world.

For you?

Have a kid or kids, no joke. And yes, of course, all the other things that go with that, a partner, a steady job, a nice place to live, etc... They and your partner are built in friends.

Or dogs, or a dog. Barring those options maybe a cat. And if none of those appeal then a few plants. Maybe starting with a spider plant, they're pretty robust and were my first foray into the space. And if not a plant than long long walks in nature, everyday.

It sounds like you're very introspective, and not to sound dismissive, but you may be spending too much time thinking about yourself. It might be time to take care of another person or creature.

Find contentment in what you have and not in what you want. What you want is not true, a falsehood, quite often when we actively seek out our fantasies they fail to live up to our expectations, ergo it is the thought of something that appeals to us not the thing itself. Real fulfilment is serendipitous and you are only partly have agency in that. If you go though life stressing about what you have not the possibility for misery is as endless as your imagination. Look for the beauty in what you have, a morning sunrise while out jogging, a house, a quiet morning on your own terms, look for moments of peace in what you experience look for the tao and love it. You have been to festivals in your 20s, there's nothing else for you to learn there, it's made you wiser and to continue to act like you are 20 will just be an empty form of masterbation. Oh and get a dog, possibly a malamute and walk it twice a day, it's all you need really, the rest is details.

Hey no worries. I'm turning 30 in a couple days and have zero fucking dollars left. I hear philanthropy makes ppl feel better :)

I just read a review of this book with seems worth a read for a man of any age. Take solice that you're not alone in the feelings of uncertainty, and good on you for sharing.

Pulled from Rob Henderson's email (which is not linkable sorry) http://us4.forward-to-friend.com/forward?u=412bdf6ca38cdf29c...

For most men, the life structure of the late twenties is fragmented and unstable. They’re unsure if they chose the right career path. The possibility of marriage becomes a more pressing concern. They feel aimless if they don’t already have a solid relationship, home base, and career path.

From here, men enter what Levinson terms the “Age Thirty Transition.” In the late twenties, men realize that if they are going to make a change, they must do it soon, otherwise it will be too late.

This change could be about their careers, what city to live in, whether to fully commit to their romantic relationship or pursue other partners, and so on.

Levinson writes that this transition is often stressful. He calls it an “Age Thirty Crisis.”

This happens when a man’s current life structure is intolerable, but for whatever reason, they are unable to form a better one. A moderate or severe crisis is common during this period.

The Age Thirty Transition often begins with a vague uneasiness, a feeling that something is missing or wrong in your life. At this point, men sense that they must either find a new direction and make new choices or strengthen their commitment to the choices they’ve already made.

For some men, the process is smooth. By 30, they feel their lives are reasonably complete. Still, it’s possible that they are not acknowledging flaws in their lives, which “often surface at a later time, when they exact a heavier cost.”

62 percent of the men interviewed in the book went through a moderate or severe age thirty crisis.

Levinson concludes:

“A stressful Age Thirty Transition was more the rule than the exception in our study...Many young adults as they pass 30 have serious doubts about the value and viability of our society and about the possibility of forming a life structure worth having. Perhaps every generation feels that its life problems are unique in character and severity—and each of them may be right.”

First of all, at 35 you're still a baby. Tap the brakes on your anxiety around running out of time.

Second, most everyone is recommending other self-interested pursuits and I don't think you'll find the best fulfillment there.

For me, the answer to "what's the point?" is: kids. After I pursued all of my self-interested goals (resulting in a mix of failure and success depending on who's keeping score) I had kids and realized none of that stuff I pursued really, truly mattered. In fact I wish I'd had kids sooner, as young children (I've got three) are an especially thorough ass-kicking for a 40+-year-old.

Having kids with a like-minded, selfless partner is literally the very best thing I've ever done. And it's the best thing I suspect you'll ever do if it comes to pass. As a friend of mine (who also had kids later in life) says, you have kids and you realize "oooohhhh, this is the whole point".

First of all, you're 35 and have half a million dollars US? Congratulations, you won "Life on Earth". I'm seriously, that's pretty awesome and you should be pretty stoked about that (privately! Publicly be modest or at least fake it well.)

Also, 35 is not "getting old". Your time is not running out quite yet. If you live to be 70 you have another whole lifetime to work with, eh? If you live to 85 you have a half-century yet!

Secondably, what do you have faith in? I don't mean religion necessarily, but the search for meaning in life is something to attempt sooner rather than later. If you were having the same problem at 50 or 60 it's kinda late in the game.

Last but not least, try helping other people. It's very fulfilling.

- - - -

What you're going through is perfectly normal. I remember the day I woke up and nothing hurt and I was really happy about that, and then I thought, "I'm officially old now."

We are less and less excited with new things as we age, that is natural. We need to find other ways to manage our mental health and motivation than merely seeking novelty. I found Andrew Huberman podcasts very useful resource. https://hubermanlab.com/

My advice for you being the same age:

The first thing is regular exercise, hydration, and meditation. If I fail on these at any point my mind goes to shit.

Second, humans are a pack animal. You are right that your peers won’t be in clubs or bars. You aren’t either so why would they be? If you are looking for a romantic partner to start your pack, you can look online. Talk values first is my advice there. For companions who aren’t romantically involved with you, try going to events near you in your part of the industry or in a hobby.

Third, get a hobby. Humans are not bees or ants. We need more than work and the hive. We need to feel passionate and productive. If your main job does not offer these, it is time for a hobby.

I’ve gone to pretty dark places internally, and have at various points in my life had very bad mental health. My mental health really seemed to stabilize in my late 20s. Now, I’m doing better than I ever have and I owe to these things above.

I’m 31 now and used to be quite fit but developed disability after a hospitally acquired infection and antibiotics and now have chronic severe food intolerances. I don’t know how I am going to cope as I get even older. It doesn’t seem like I can get very fit. There is a mild developing heart condition as well now. What do I even do?

[Meta] I wonder if it's just me but, reading through these comments I can imagine myself being the OP and thinking that every comment here is both very insightful and terribly useless simultaneously.

All I can think of reading through all the different perspectives is: "No one can fix you, only you can find the solution to yourself".

> I feel like I haven't achieved much,

> about $500k in savings.

> I am single and haven't had a serious relationship for many years now.

Sounds like you've focused entirely on your career (and achieved plenty there). Those savings give you freedom to try other things. Make a change, get a hobby, dive into that.

You're still young. There's tons of things you can do.

Find contentment in what you have and not in what you want.

What you want is not true, a falsehood, quite often when we actively seek out our fantasies they fail to live up to our expectations, ergo it is the thought of something that appeals to us not the thing itself.

Real fulfilment is serendipitous and you are only partly have agency in that.

If you go though life stressing about what you have not the possibility for misery is as endless as your imagination.

Look for the beauty in what you have, a morning sunrise while out jogging, a house, a quiet morning on your own terms, look for moments of peace in what you experience look for the tao and love it.

You have been to festivals in your 20s, there's nothing else for you to learn there, it's made you wiser and to continue to act like you are 20 will just be an empty form of masterbation.

Oh and get a dog, possibly a malamute and walk it twice a day, it's all you need really, the rest is details.

There's some great advice in this thread--it probably won't help.

Around your age I found myself saying "everyone has to learn the hard way" and that includes talking about my own nonsense. Therapy helps, a family helps, hobbies help, volunteering helps. But ultimately, everyone has to find their own way. And you will!

Same except the $500k in savings. I have much less, but I own stock options that may compensate.

I came from a very bad background. Because of my "nationality" I can't work for most Tech companies (because US law), and I spent 10 years until I could settle into a country that I may call home but sadly I don't like to live in.

Relationships? Nothing serious and due to me focusing to much to survive (and my average looks) I never had a stable relationship or found a good partner.

Be grateful of what you have. Some people consider me lucky to live in several countries and seeing the world while looking for a place to settle in. So you are in good place. Just take some time off (I mean 3-6 months) and travel the world, learn a new hobby, take cooking lessons, attend more meetups to meet new people who can spice your life. The hub you live in can be dull so change where you live.

I think this is a pretty normal feeling to have. For myself it was a fine line between “accepting reality” and actual depression. Getting older and realizing half of your life is behind you is not the most uplifting topic.

So that would be my first piece of advice, get some counseling or other mental health help.

As for what to do beyond that, you didn’t really say much in your post. You briefly mentioned your relationship status, so it seems that might be a area to start in. The good news for you is that at 35 it is perfectly acceptable to be dating people in their mid to late 20s, so you still have plenty of time to start a relationship and have a family.

From my personal experience being married and having children will completely disabuse you of your current feelings. You may have other problems to deal with, but “what to do with the next 20 years” won’t be one of them.

Edit: also, if you have $500k liquid you could invest it in something like QYLD and draw roughly $5k/mo and try taking a sabbatical for a year.

Better to not let those kinds of ideas trick you. You'd be rich in some parts of the world. You're not yet old. Maybe it's time to get out of wherever you are and find happiness in a place where people will appreciate you. Personally I dream of this but my savings aren't enough yet.

Make peace with who you are today, and the paths you didn't take. It's the hand you've been dealt by your older self.

The more you spend wanting something, the more energy you drain. The people who age well often limit their focus to a few things. You'll also find that there's a lot of things and experiences that money doesn't buy; it's often best to figure out what experiences matter most to you.

One trick is to learn what death means to you and work backwards from there. Do you believe in an afterlife deep down inside? Do you want to die on a battlefield? Do you care about who comes to your funeral? On your death bed, what are the things you would regret not accomplishing?

Anyway, if you want to make new friends, my email is on my profile. I'm about the same age, similar level of ambition.

I'd buy crypto for half of the money and forget about it. Move somewhere cheap but comfy and play computer games and browse the internet and interact with people there for few years till I figure out if there's anything else in this world I'd rather do than enjoy my early retirement from the world of money and relationship chasing.

I'm 43 and doing something similar for last few years, not exactly the same because I had a different starting point than you.

Also try to excercise a bit because this mortal shell is crap.

It might not be for everybody. But once you accept meaninglessness of it all there are huge benefits of having a 100% of your life just to yourself.

I know mentioning crypto will not sit well with many people here but I see it as a retirement plan at the expense of greedy people of this world.

You knew you'd be heavily downvoted for this, right?

I already am. I'm here since 2009. I recently passed 10000 karma. I guess I have few days of "what's karma anyways" since I dared to post such a controversial yet authentic comment.

In my 40s. I feel that way too sometimes. My advice: try new things! I just started motorcycling; signed up for MSF course, got a used bike and it’s awesome. I play beer league hockey and that one night a week playing and being with the boys is precious (and theuropeutic…in a house with only daughters and wife lol). Snowboard in the winter…got my kids into skiing…golf in summer…LeetCode for fun to keep my mind/coding sharp. You get the idea. My day job (Android coding) is kinda mundane and is really just for the paycheck…and so my personal philosophy of life is to keep trying new things, diverse things, not being afraid of new things, and just going for it. I’m never bored and I don’t sweat things like “legacy” and whatnot. Enjoy life!

When I was that age is when I started having babies with my then wife. All the below advice seems fine to do, but maybe it is also worth considering an inquiry into your self, some sort of psychotherapy or meditation (as a verbal sort of person, I really enjoy therapy as a way to understand my situation better; as an anxious person, I find meditation helps me act closer to how I prefer to act).

Is your life somehow ill-fitting for your values, for what you find truly admirable?

Or kids, you will see new things and not have time to worry about boredom. Your time is running out, but that is the normal nature of life. As my meditation teacher would quote from time to time, “Take heed, do not squander your time by day or by night; this very day your life is shorter by one day.”

Yes time is passing fast. I am the same age as you and I feel the same. It’s hard to find new things to get excited about but a older friend of mine told me a perspective that is a bit more positive. He enjoys to get gradually better at the little things. In his opinion the 20s are everything fast and easy. For example of friends, it’s so easy to find friends if you’re 20. But it’s A good thing to enjoy the little steps we go with old friends in our 40s and 50s and becoming gradually better friends. That works with everything . Just getting a little better at little things and trying to enjoy this.

But my reality is like yours.., those feelings that the time is running are closing me in. I try to enjoy the moment and don’t get overrun by the burden if time

Having kids fixes the problem of feeling old and lost. Your life now has purpose and you have lifelong blood buddies to share experiences & stories with.

Having kids also means ideally having a stable relationship with a partner and you'll never reach that point without dating.

Work, at the end of the day, is meaningless if you feel your life is without purpose. Money isn't quite meaningless in that it can help to entertain & distract you and also help to attract & retain a partner. Everyone likes someone who is self sufficient.

Most technologies aren't necessary, most companies aren't necessary, most work isn't necessary. If you approach life from that perspective you'll see that the only thing worth dedicating yourself to is family & friends.

There seems to be a lot of focus on the material in your post. The material aspects of life are not unimportant, but they are secondary.

If this focus on the outer person is not satisfying, then it may be time to explore other aspects of life. The following site can help you investigate this for yourself:

https://www.selfauthoring.com/

What you are experiencing is nothing new. The book of Ecclesiastes was written thousands of years ago, and may be worth a look. Here's the first chapter:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=ecclesiastes%20...

Not sure if it helps, but I can tell you what I would personally do if I was in your exact situation.

I would live cheaply, I would exercise and train and buy the requisite gear, and then at the next opportunity I would go hike the PCT.

I really want to do it, but with “settling down” on the horizon it looks unlikely that I’ll ever be able to do so.

Maybe you wouldn’t say “hike the PCT” but perhaps you can put yourself in my shoes for a moment and think - what would I regret not being able to do assuming I am settling down 5 or 10 years from now?

If I hadn’t already done so, my answer would have been “backpack around the world.”

I’m sure there are lots of big experiences you could devote some time to, that would in themselves give you the opportunity to gain clarity on what you want.

> I am turning 35 years soon and I feel like I haven't achieved much, both personally and professionally.

It's called "midlife crisis". Everyone goes through it.

> I feel like I've seen most things before, and it's all just different iterations of the same.

Yes. I am over 50, I have been programming since I was 10 or so, and I have seen even more iterations than you :-)

You only get excited about these things if you see them for the first or second time.

On the other hand, if you understand the principles that makes things work, instead of just knowing every single detail, that gives you some good guidelines to cut through the crap and do some slick, efficient things.

> But not anymore now. I feel like my time for everything is running out.

Nah. The fun is just starting for you.

I’m 32 and in a similar situation. I lost my mother and both brothers within last 6 months of last year and ended up questioning everything.

Even though I was in this moment of time where I was questioning everything I couldn’t actually move forward with any of the changes I wanted. The big mental changer for me was the gym. Not necessarily for health but because everyday I’m pushing myself to failure and also seeing improvement.

Even though I have hobbies like photography and being a drummer to be honest I would be frustrated at that type of failure and avoid it. Maybe the lack of feeling creative is too personal to face right now. Since the gym I feel like that’s improving and I am slowly reaching out to a social circle again and seeing new opportunity.

It has improved my mental clarity and personality too. I am lucky to have my girlfriend of nearly two years and I was preparing to propose before all this happened. I would question that too but I started to realise I didn’t want to be this person running from my problems in different countries again. I didn’t wait for the perfect time but did the best I could and that went well.

I suppose for me in the area of finding a partner was finding faith in myself again. At around 30 I was about the same and hadn’t been with anyone I could see marrying. I couldn’t seem to attract the type I saw myself settling with. I think that changed with the gym too and applying focus to my new interests at the time like photography.

After I stopped trying with my current fiancé, maybe a year and a half of our first meetup, she started to see who I am and what I could be because I was just applying myself to improve my own life. I think we all like to see that in each other no matter gender or preference. It can just be within your friendship circles after you grow out of drinking buddies.

I think you know it’s not your too old to go out a be that guy again but you don’t want too. Trust me I have old friends your age who are still acting like their 20 and reliving all the same mistakes. Right now you just need a physical parallel to what your mind needs to do. Fail early, learn and adapt, improve and grow

500K in savings, that's nice. I have 1k savings.

You didn’t prioritize relationships. You chased money and now realize that money after a point is just a huge safety net. All you’ve done is check boxes. Go to Europe, check. Buy a toy, check.

When you die, nobody will give a shit about the toys.

Stop looking at what people brag about (money, travel, toys) and concentrate on relationships.

Look at it this way - unless you have some physical impairment, how is it that you’re so successful, yet not ONE person wants to be your partner? The answer of course is you haven’t made yourself interesting and attractive to ANYONE.

Either you don’t go out enough to find her, don’t engage enough, don’t take care of yourself enough, etc.

Make it your priority, work on it like a real problem, and see where it gets you.

Does this "tough love" bullshit work on anyone? This whole comment is just neg after neg. "Yeah dude, you're right, you suck ass! Maybe you should try sucking less, bro!"

I agree. Whenever someone has tried this approach with me the result has always been me shutting down and avoiding to confide in that person. I am already tough in myself, that's why I always feel like a failure, I don't need this kind of stupid anime protagonist motivational speech bullshit.

I think it's all a sign that you look for happiness at a wrong place (for you). I'd suggest to look at other aspects of life, in light of what makes people happy, what makes their time feel worthwhile. For example, you haven't listed your social connections at all, aside from being single. If this reflects your current priorities, I'd suggest to look for people who make you feel like you belong.

Coincidentally this is also how I personally moved my life forward, but it's not just an anecdote, lots of different sources tell me that this is what matter at the end of the day. For a random example, Season 3, Episode 4 of Bojack Horseman (Fish out of water).

That is my favorite Bojack Horseman episode for so many reasons.

Hundreds of good comments on here already, but I'll add another anyway, fwiw. I'm in a similar situation. 36 years old, haven't achieved much, no family, don't even have much savings.

For me, though, what keeps me feeling excited about the future is problem-solving, especially in the machine learning field. There are tons of problems that still exist and need to be tackled, tons of products that I want to exist that don't. If I stay focused on "This solution does not exist yet and I want it to exist", worries about achievement and mortality get out of the way more easily. It's not about me, it's about the problem.

This ought to give you some good pointers:

https://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2011/10/marc_marons_mid-life...

That's a lot of different issues in a single post.

IT is getting boring and a lot of things are just being reinvented badly, that's true. Aside from some very small niches that might be worth exploring if you still care.

That most things in life naturally get harder as you get older, is also evident. You'll just have to try more and build on your experience (regarding friends, relationships, startups).

Don't worry, at 35 you're still very young, it's the best age for many things (relationships...). Many people will envy you for that and for the freedom you have, not being stuck with the burden of responsibility (from family life, having your own company etc.).

I met my wife while at a club watching a local band when I was 35 years old. At that point in my life I had about $50K in my 401K, but only about $5K in savings.

The two of us didn't accrue $500k in savings until I was 55. I'll be working until I am 70, since I started a family late, and I still have the youngest of three kids in college.

You are not too old. Yes, life changes, but life is what you make of it. I am still alpine skiing in my mid 60s. I just joined a startup three years ago.

And now that all the kids are out of the house, my wife and I can walk to the nearest restaurant for happy hour and day we want. No waiting for the weekends. no needing to hire a baby sitter.

I will turn 67 on Valentine's day so I am in the 4th quarter of my life. As I look back on my life I have enjoyed a lot of successes (two retirements) and some significant setbacks(bad marriage). That is the nature of life. There will be ups and downs. You just need to learn how to handle the downs so that you end up in a positive posture when get to your 4th quarter. Don't give up or get disillusioned anywhere along life's journey because you can always make a comeback no matter how far you are down at any given point. Life is a great and rewarding experience. Don't let negative thoughts or feelings spoil it.

I went through it. You need to find yourself a partner. Soon you'll start having fatherly feelings. And then you'll have kids. And then it's a whole new ballgame.

It happened to me in early thirties. I mean, how much beer can a person drink and how much bars can a person visit before it gets old? One day I just started thinking to myself how I would like to have another human being around and take care of it. Pass some of my knowlegde and experience to it. Luckily I had a wonderful wife and we went for it. Two kids later I have never been so exhausted and happy.

That's my experience, maybe you take something from it. Whatever you decide, good luck!

I was really depressed while doing my PhD, and something that helped me a lot was getting seriously involved in a social dance community.

I think this could help you a lot. It really seems to me that what you’re missing is human connection, and social dance is a way to facilitate it.

There are dance communities with plenty of people your age. It’s a totally different scene from bars and clubs. People don’t drink very much because it gets in the way of dancing.

It’s also a good way to find potential relationship partners, although the primary interest should be the dancing, since people can tell if you’re just there to hook up and that will come off as creepy and predatory.

> It’s also a good way to find potential relationship partners, although the primary interest should be the dancing, since people can tell if you’re just there to hook up and that will come off as creepy and predatory.

If anyone reading this is lonely and thinking of going to social outings for the purpose of finding a partner: do it. It's ok! It's not creepy or predatory.

Furthermore, reading peoples' minds is very difficult, so people actually can't tell what motivated you to go to a social outing. It's okay to go to a social outing motivated by the prospect of finding a partner, and it's okay to say that you're out to "learn to dance" or to "have a drink" or any number of things.

For me, my mental/spiritual/emotional health needed to come first. All my problems around life centered around unconscious turmoil that I wasn't facing. Its my believe that health problems start on a emotional/mental level which has a lot to do with the choices I make.

For me, I really needed to work on resolving my early inner trauma that I carried with me throughout my life.

The information that helped me face this aspects of my life and helped me get back on track of living a loving and peaceful life:

Constructive Living - David K. Reynolds. All works of James Allen The Mankind Project (Don't believe everything you read online about MKP)

Reminds me of https://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-shouts/i-thought-i-wou...

My artistic motto is “Always write five hundred words before noon.” My life motto is “Write one best-seller before age thirty-five.” Today I’ve written one word, a text message to Sanjay that just says, “Hey!”—but I didn’t finish it, just like I didn’t finish my Ph.D. in political science or my engagement to Jennifer in my late twenties.

Have you asked your parents yet? They have a lot more experience being old than you.

I'd try talking to old people other than your parents. By now he should know what to expect from them and he should also have found out how he differs from them.

It's not either/or of course, you can do both. But I'll add that even at 35 you probably don't have a full understanding of your parents, even if you think you do. These are real people with ~35 more years of life experience than OP. Don't underestimate them.

I do understand. Do others, notably friends and family feel you haven't achieved much, both personally and professionally? You are young (I'm 60 and young!), single, relatively wealthy and presumably free. Could you work on something that you are excited about, whilst you are? The world has many problems. Can your technology skills and experience help?

Folks here, including me, may think we are helping you. We probably are not:

https://shatterealm.netlify.app/personal/2021_01_02_living_w...

I'm 36 and in a similar boat. Without going into my story, I'll tell you that one thing that has been helpful for me is "giving back."

For instance, like you, I used to enjoy music festivals (still do, but differently now). Remember how cool your first festival was? How can you contribute to the experience that the first-time 20-something festival goers have now? Build a cool piece of LED art? Volunteer? Start on a project. Get involved.

The above is just one example of the many ways I've found to give back in various areas of my life. It is fun, rewarding, and opens doors to new opportunities and people.

This might be helpful. https://alantabor.medium.com/reverse-engineering-my-life-e06...

I did this on retirement around age 55 so I had a bigger database of experience in my starting sample but with a widely varied work experience you should be able to systematically dig what drives engagement.

Note, this isn't great for a 'and now for something completely different' crisis where some excluded aspect of your self wants center stage and is fading the usual things to gray.

https://youtu.be/FgtcajwNid0

Watching this old guy (Chinese with subtitles) talk about his ups and downs really gave me some perspective a while ago

Nice humble brag there guy. I'd kill have that kind of savings and those life experiences.

As hokey as it sounds, practice mindfulness or meditation. You need to learn acceptance and self love.

Also, you should work on getting healthy and start lifting weights if you are not already. I'm not telling you to bulk up, but resistance training is a must for better health.

I warn you, 35 is when the factory warranty comes off and health issues start popping up. Half of health issues are just down to the luck of the genetic lottery, the other half you can actively work on. Might get a checkup and work on any issues you may have.

You found out your old life isn't fulfilling anymore - and that's great! Better to face it than hide from it.

Well, you have money and time so it should be easy to go find what it is that truly moves you! It won't be stuff you already know. Also, it helps to do things differently... don't be trapped in the "old you" persona. That's just something we make up to make reality feel more solid. Define yourself based on what's going on right now, and not based on old notions of you.

Your spirit (if you will) is begging you change the way you live so just go along with it.

But that's true, all modern "new" technologies are bullshit, they are little but attempts to milk the most stupid of consumers using same old shit under new names (Metaverse? we had Second Life for how many years? VR? VFX-1 was working just fine 25 years ago, and was about as useless as today's gear).

That's alright, keep your savings in the stock market and retire happily at 65, and for now just do something taking as little effort as possible to fund your current expenses.

Young people aren't "better", they just don't know how pointless life is, YET.

- $500k may seem not much for you. Guess you would have more if your start-ups took off or if you would just work in fang and save the money.

- The money doesn't really matter. Guess you would feel the same if you had a successful start-up running.

So to your question. I can really understand you. To be honest I don't have a solution for you, but guess money isn't part of it. I think you would feel the same if you had $10m on your bank account. So it's more the social part. There are some obvious steps you could try to improve it, like dating for example.

I turn 42 this year. My feeling is that there’s always something you haven’t tried. Over the years, I’ve changed careers, failed to change careers, went back for a masters degree, tried totally unrelated hobbies, and more. I’ve done community radio, had writing published, played in bands on the radio, started blogs and apps, and more. If it’s getting stale, look for a change of context, maybe even move cities. But often you can just follow your interest into something new. Works for me at least

As someone who will turn 50 this year with a 4 year old and a 1 year old, I can tell you what worked for me.

But fundamentally you need to work out what brings you happiness, and aim for that.

50 is the new 30.

It's all relative. 35 is older than many people, but also younger than many people.

You have way more money than most people. If you move to a place that is not expensive, and if you invest the money well, you may never need to work again. That means, you get extra 8 hours a day (more if you include the commute). That means, if you compare yourself with an average 20 years old, both of you will have the same amount of free time between now and the moment each of you becomes 50.

For most people, the greatest professional achievement will be to pay their bills. Congratulations, you have already completed this game!

So now I would suggest focusing full-time on your personal and social life. Find a hobby that is neither about making money nor about consuming things (that includes travelling). With that hobby, you may find a community. With the community, you may find relationships. (Much better way of meeting people than "festivals, bars and clubs". Bars are for drunks; drunks are sad.)

People in their 20s have the advantage that the school provides a social environment for them. Past that age, you need to actively seek the company of people; it will not happen on its own. There are probably many activities happening all around you; you just don't pay attention to them. If you see something happening in your neighborhood, go there. You may find recommendations on Facebook. Try to visit some social activity at least three times a week. Especially things that you never tried before. Find a list of local non-profit organizations, call them and ask if you can help them in any way; that way you can enter lots of new bubbles.

> I feel like I've seen most things before, and it's all just different iterations of the same.

There is a possibility that although you have experienced many countries and jobs, you were doing similar things everywhere. Specifically, making money and partying; because I don't see much else mentioned in your text. What is conspicuously missing there: hobbies (other than technology), values, spirituality, prosocial behavior, art... You might want to try experimenting a bit with these and see what happens.

> I feel like my time for everything is running out.

This was always the case, you just noticed it now. Hopefully, you still have lots of time left.

You have time. You're 35. Realistically that means you've probably worked about 10 years and still have about 30 to go. Relax. You've got some money saved; I was in a similar situation a few years ago and took a sabbatical year. Maybe that works for you. Just do nothing for a bit but enjoy the outside world, disconnect, read philosophy. That really gave me a lot of peace and led to a career change and a lot of understanding about what I find important in life.

I was in a similar position a few years ago. What helped me was having kids, life becomes much easier when you are around people who still don't know that it is pointless.

that gave me a good chuckle. thanks.

Is there some pet peeve you have about the world, which you wish to change? If there is, and you can put your finger on it, making it happen could be a very fulfilling thing to do.

I just figured out my pet peeve, the design principle I wish to impart to the world... after watching this video recommended in a different thread

Bret Victor Inventing on Principle -- https://youtu.be/8QiPFmIMxFc

I wish you luck if you find yours.

Joing a few different sports clubs and you might find a sport you like. I joined the boxing one and it turned out I really like it (I do not like football that's for sure). The best thing is everyone goes to the pub after so it's a great way to make a few new friends, there will be one or two people there you get on great with. I did try about maybe 10 sports before I settled on boxing, I even tried yoga and spinning, which both were not for me too.

I highly recommend reading, "Nonviolent Communication." Don't let the title throw you off.

I sense the things you're doing (and wanting to do) are not aligned with any important needs. This lack of alignment (or awareness) can create confusion—and it's very common.

These are phases where we get the opportunity to go within and uncover parts of yourself worth exploring. This book can help you be more compassionate with yourself (and others) and help to see your needs.

Not thinking about waifus and watching children's cartoons for a start.

I'd suggest taking up a hobby or at the very least a DIY project that involves outdoors and try to meet people.

Taking about money either serves to distance or brag (going on social norms from across the pond at least) so I'd say it's better to say you consider yourself your comfortable to well off unless you enjoy people trying to get a piece of it or others thinking your some sort of show off...

</2pence>

In all likelihood, you have 70+% of your healthy adult life ahead of you, meaning only a minority amount has passed.

You’ve got skills in a field that pays extraordinarily well (and that I inherently enjoy) and a savings balance that’s around 4x the median household wealth.

You have way more tailwind than headwind I think and your challenge is to go find the fun and enjoyment you’re currently lacking, but moping about how much sand is out of the hourglass isn’t helpful. Best of luck!

Not sure what the answer is, but I feel sort of the same.

Having a child and partner helps. It gives me something to hold on to. Though that obviously doesn’t help you right now.

But the excitement about a lot of other stuff is just gone. I’m fairly certain it comes from just having seen most things before, and it appears 30+ is the magic age at which you start to feel this.

I’m settled in a career, and have no particular desire to switch now (partially golden handcuffs effect).

Not sure where curiosity and motivation comes from, but as others mention, it helps to maintain good health and some social connections/friends.

I hope you regain curiosity and see and wonder about things in new ways.

It’s not that I’m not curious. I learn tons of stuff every day. But I recognize it for the ‘knowledge’ it is. Most of the things I learn now do not fundamentally change my understanding of reality. It’s all within the bounds of expectation.

Like, there’s a difference between seeing an airplane lift off for the first time and knowing why it can.

Maybe early retirement / FIRE would help a bit here.

I am about to hit 30 soon and I came up with the idea of Retire 35 to start planning for the inevitable.

If you haven't figured out what to do, early retirement can at least give you more time to think about it without the stress / burnout / worrying about work or finances.

Shameless plug: https://retire35.com/

What was the HN scrolling topic yesterday?

Create something new, then tell people about it?

At the very least you’ll have a life-long anecdote or, at most, someone will write a Wikipedia bio for you by which you’ll attract job offers, invitations to write book chapters or to parties enthralling potential mates.

If everyone improved the world this way, no matter how small the refinement, the world ends up better, and as a side-effect we get closer to understanding everything.

First and foremost, the constant feeling that time is running out is just the effect of a big marketing machine built to make you vulnerable to their suggestions. Life isn't a race, and certainly not a race for money and things.

At 35 you are not even close to old, and even when you do become 'old' there will still be plenty of time for new things, excitement and fulfillment. It will just look different than when you were 20, and that's a good thing. Most 20 year olds are shallow and certainly not 'fulfilled' in any meaningful way. That's why they spend so much time escaping to festivals, bars and clubs.

Feeling stuck, behind or in the doldrums is normal from time to time. It's a sign that you need a change. If you're single and with half a mil in the bank at 35, you're one of the very very lucky few. You aren't living paycheck-to-paycheck and no-one's dependent so you absolutely have the luxury of time, lots of it!

You can afford to change things up, make some mistakes, and figure it out. Start with a focus on your health: both body and mind. Then you'll naturally get a better perspective on the other aspects of your life, and how to change them for the better.

My life as I currently know it didn't even start until everything I had built fell apart around 40. Since then I've had 2 kids and third on the way, a couple of exciting career changes, built things with my hands, learned entirely new skills, navigated disasters. Just one example - I learned to ski at 40, and over the next few years trying to keep up with my wife I managed to learn enough to be able to do some of the most challenging and beautiful runs in the Rockies.

To be honest I feel younger (at-heart) than when I was 30 and playing by the rules, living for the weekends. There are so many ways you can find fulfillment in life beyond socializing in entertainment venues.

I'm nearing the 50 mark and expect the next decade to be just as full as the last. I probably won't be skiing many double-black diamonds, but you bet I'll be following my kids to the top of the mountain even if it's to wave at them and take the easier way down. I can't even imagine the adventures that face us.

I'm sure you have no idea what's ahead for you, either. Just don't let it be another night on the couch in front of a screen. Look forward.

Yup. All of this except not professionally successful.

The economy is mostly based on people trying to fill a void. I was able to fill that w a person’s “love” but they left me for a younger, higher-earner who is probably better in bed too. I guess you better just accept it, try and be healthy, talk about it with friends and maybe something will come along that really does make you happy if you “get out there” whatever that means

Sorry to hear this OP. Yes I have these feelings too occasionally. Not sure if this will work for you but one thing that gives me perspective when I'm feeling sorry for myself is to read posts on the subreddit /r/cancer. I immediately count my blessings and realize how courageous/kind people can be. Also it is a reminder that yes, life is finite so you might as well make the most of it.

At 35 having stashed $500k in savings. When do we swap?!

You could try yoga. Take some classes, do it everyday. It makes the body fit and the mind healthy. It also teaches acceptance and non -attachment (to achievements, etc), living in the moment and just breathing.

When you feel good about life and yourself, you can attract people and turn your life positively more easily.

It's all a bit abstract and different from the rationality we're used to in tech, but maybe worth a try?

Thanks for the suggestion. I actually do a kind of yoga (though more focused on long poses and stretching) and it indeed does help. So does working out. I do feel calm and content while doing it, but that feeling does not last very long beyond the practice. Once I get back in front of the screen, it's back to the usual self.

Maybe you found the key. Don't sit back down in front of the screen unless you have to. Fill your day with enriching activities, instead of filling your day with screen and breaking it up with the occasional enriching activity.

One more suggestion: try cooking classes, HelloFresh or just YouTube lessons. Preparing and serving a good meal three times a day helps a lot to distract from what’s behind the screen and also offers enjoyable experience, that you can eventually share with someone.

You would think its an existential, psychological issue that you're getting old and feeling lost, but it seems to me that you're just entering Male Menopause / Andropause. Go to a Male Health Clinic, or a doctor who specializes with Testosterone Replacement Therapy, and check your Testosterone levels, not just Total but Free T too, plus SHBG, plus Prolactin and Estrogen. Trust me.

Write down what are your expectations at 35. Maybe they are outdated and you have been imposing them to yourself unconsciously, making yourself feel bad because of it.

Re-asset them to match your current situation and find your new priorities. If you are lacking passion, it's time for a new challenge outside of your comfort zone. If that doesn't work, you can always go back to what you are used to.

For most of my life, I've volunteered at one organization or another. It's been a great way to meet people and find some purpose. It doesn't even have to be some epic world-changing nonprofit. Even a one-shot like a fundraiser walk can be good. Or take classes (cultural center, library, community colleges, Meetup, etc.), even if you're not super interested in the topic.

Do a lot of cardio exercise, every day; at least 30 minutes. Do it for a month (every day!) and then see how you feel. Often I believe our underlying physiology is the real driver of sentiments which we attribute to conceptual things. Being intelligent, it's easy to fall into the trap of thinking that you can think your way out of anything. Sometimes thinking isn't the answer at all.

Just my 2c.

Many people use GPS, but if you are more comfortable using paper maps, you can do that too. You don't have to carry the full map (fold it, unfold it...), you can just photocopy or even cut out the section of the map relevant to where you're traveling. Of course, you can always just stop and ask a local, and they'll give you directions. People are generally very helpful.

Time is always running out. Even when you were 20, there wasn’t enough time to do everything. Even a 100 lifetimes isn’t enough to do everything. But the universe of things doable in seconds, minutes, hours, days, weeks, months, years, decades is still a lot, and if you can pay / persuade others to join your goal, certainly larger than what most 20 year olds can accomplish.

Sorry you are going through this, but at some point most people have that realization. It's a great opportunity to change your life for the better.

If you want to re-discover wonder, spend time with children. I'm 50, I have 5 kids, and honestly, their sense of wonder is infectious and helping them discover the world and discover what they love in life has been the best part of my life.

35? You are still wet behind the ears! I’m almost 59 and I code all the time (Ruby on Rails, mostly). Age truly is just a number. If you feel confused about all the languages and frameworks, you are right to feel that way. It’s confusing as hell. Everyone feels that way. You just have to find your niche and become an expert in it. Let us know how you’re doing when you’re 60!

u are middle aged, biological imperative dictates you are suppose be raising children. seems you are financially positioned for a family, find out if that's something you'll like or not. imagine what kind of life you want to have at 50.

in general its "never too late for anything", but realistically, having a kid takes a lot of effort both mentally and physically.

> I increasingly wish I could go back to my 20s. Now I feel too old to go to festivals, bars and clubs and make new friends that way.

This is all in your head. When was the last time you were somewhere, saw someone and thought "ugh, oh my god look at that old loser"? Probably never if you're a good person. Most people are good. So go out and enjoy your life!

[disclaimer: i agree 100% with your thinking], but... > When was the last time you thought, oh my god look at that old loser

last night

> Now I feel too old to go to festivals, bars and clubs and make new friends that way.

37 here and I don't understand how you could feel this way. At least where I am the bar/festival/music scene is alive and vibrant and full of other thirty-somethings. Hell my whole party crew is getting older, we're all a bunch of cranky bastards now and I love it

For me, I developed strong feelings for my brother, mom, and sister and pursuing a relationship with each one of them has given me purpose. I was the same as you, but I realized I craved human interaction above all. It's really hard to just exist as a single person with acquaintances unless you're one of the rare people that are wired that way.

It sounds like a rut! From the looks of it most people have touched on a lot of possible solutions. I might suggest doing something crazy and uncomfortable. Move to a foreign country, go into a new field of work, etc…

I am in a similar headspace but at 31, but the truth is that life is just beginning in the 30s. You have experience AND money, which can open so many doors.

short answer: it will pass

longer answer: been there, seen that. carry on, find yourself a hobby and a couple of friends who share it (might require some effort, but it’s worth it). kids are also very rewarding (probably not for everyone, but surely for me), albeit very demanding too. anyway, it will pass, just dont try to drink or drug it out - that will only make things worse

good luck

I am curious where you have worked, mostly in the private sector? Maybe try getting a job in academia or a non-profit. The pay will likely be lower (though maybe not as much lower as you think, in academia at least), but the benefits will likely be better (esp. time off). Most of all, you could have work that contributes to a mission you care about.

Reality is very tied to notion of success and regular supply of it (aka you need a few wins to feel better right now). That said with age the intensity of success vanishes, you care less about winning I assume and more about global balance of improvements, it's another kind of happiness (probably tuned to biological need to make a family)

Ended up buying a house and having kids, seems like everyone else my age is doing the same. Don’t have time to feel lost.

Well, the key is to find something new, exciting but not easy to achieve. For me it's PPL (private pilot license). This is very technical (a lot of IT folks love it) and has a steep learning curve. After starting doing this you'll feel much better again, because you'll have an exciting goal to achieve.

Adult life is demarcated by transitions just as childhood. Although a bit dated, you might find this useful: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/205587.The_Seasons_of_a_...

Don't do anything anyone else is saying. Stop living the script. Go build a school and teach idjits something.

I'm 25 and I feel exactly the same way. (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30230127). Not sure if I can call myself burned out, but Im thinking about quitting my job to study again...

Best of luck to you, good sir.

UK, Late 30s, savings $141k(USD) (House equity & Pension roughly 2:1) Feel very much the same. Mostly v.tired.

So...in some ways, you've "arrived" while at the same time recognize your time left to travel is shorter and, probably worse, you are realizing you aren't sure where to go or if traveling itself is even worthwhile.

You mention a relationship but, while a traveling companion might be a good idea and a blessing, it's unlikely to alleviate the things you are experiencing. I'm 41, been married for almost 20 years to a good woman who is a blessing to me, and it's not a cure to the things you are feeling and thinking.

But, thankfully, I learned a long time ago that none of these things would every truly satisfy. It's not kept me from feeling and thinking similar things, putts just help put them in perspective.

I'd encourage you to read the biblical book Ecclesiastes[1] to help verify and understand your current experience. If you are then interested, move to the gospel of Luke, gospel of John, and Romans to help understand what is truly important in life.

1. https://www.esv.org/Ecclesiastes+1/

Man...I wish I had $500k in savings.

Kinda amusing to see someone complaining about not having achieved anything despite this.

We have a lot in common me and you! I am 37 now! the difference is I have married few years ago and a year and a half ago I had a daughter. The last part changed my life completely made me see life in a different way and appreciate life differently. It's totally fine sometimes to feel this feeling you just felt, I personally think it is a calling to do something different! you have a good amount of saving which I personally don't have! maybe try something totally different than your old jobs? open your own small bakery? does not have to be super profitable just something that can get you going? the small things in life are overlooked most of the time but interacting with others, seeing them, being part of their daily lives is super awesome! my advice to you is to explore different things with a new mindset. You are not old man! in my own personal opinion no one who is highly functional on the cognitive level is old! plus once you are REALLY that old then it's new experience all over again :) Best of luck to you.

Find a sport or sports that you enjoy. Focus on getting good at them with a coach and PT. Would recommend tennis and/or badminton. Join a local club.

That’s health and socialising covered. Which is most of happiness.

Oh and deal with any underlying trauma with a talking therapy and some kind of somatic therapy.

Have you tried strength training? It gives you something that you can progressively get better at over a long period of time (decades). It also gives you mental preparedness for what will inevitably come, that is, getting old and dying. I find that it helps a lot emotionally.

Good that you are reflecting and asking this question now. If you waited until 50 to do this, you might have a much darker view of life.

Explore a bit, ideally without concern for what might make money. Try to find one or more real passions, even if they are only short term. Then pursue them.

Despite some advice here, I beg you - don’t get married and don’t get children out of boredom or to fix yourself.

Firstly, this will not fix you. I’ve been there.

Secondly, it will make another human being suffer and bear a part if your sh..t.

It is only your own responsibility to find your own meaning and your own happiness.

Whenever I find myself feeling like you do right now, I watch this video from Bill Hicks: "It's just a ride" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgzQuE1pR1w

> traveled and lived in different countries, had 2 failed startups, and have about $500k in savings

You've had a rich life experience, and you have a very strong personal financial situation. Congratuations. Everyone has ups and downs, you'll find your next goals soon

Go spend some of that 500k on yourself. Go traveling for a year. Visit as many places as you can.

Feeling old is basically a marketing problem. We all been sold either in movies, ads, perceptions that being old means you are down a level from ppl in their 20s, slow, wrinkly, look like “crap”. Just got to say screw the marketing, I’m making my own.

Your situation matches:

https://www.margithenderson.com/the-paradox-of-aging-the-hap...

Which matches my experience, so far, a couple decades after you.

Help people who are doing far worse than you.

This is one potential way to improve your depression.

Make sure you exercise a lot and take your vitamins.

Pick up a hobby that will force you to meet lots of people. When I did photography, I met so many interesting people, including my future wife.

Reading through these comments and reflecting a bit myself.

OP if you think deeply I think you will find the answer and maybe already know it already. Perhaps there is something in your heart of hearts that you want to do but are afraid to take the leap?

- Have friends around you

- Have freedom

- Do meaningful work

- Spend $ on experiences, not things

- Help others with what you’re good at

- Lower your expectations

- Exercise + eat healthily

- Reflect on thoughts

38 here, and I relate to your feeling that time is short. Mid-30s definitely seem to be an inflection point between youth and middle age. Youth is for new experiences and broadening horizons; middle age is for stability and family.

Find a hobby. Something that is not work related and take it seriously. I don’t know - start cooking, invest into obscure LP’s, vintage fashion, start collecting stamps, racing cars. PS! Going to gym and travelling is not a hobby.

Build a stronger "why." If you get the "why" right, everything else gets a lot easier. You're an emotional creature, work directly on the emotion. The founder of KFC started the business at the age of 62.

I see a lot of comments mention getting family will solve some problems. I agree. It is like distractions, to keep you busy and away from those unhealthy thoughts.

Maybe I will have to accept that I will never find the answer for all of this.

Wow, the ageism is strong in this one. Get over it, really. You’ll need to because you are just starting on this journey.

It’s not your age. It’s you. Taking responsibility and not letting age be an excuse is the first step.

If you think you're old at 35 you may have other issues going on. I'm in my 40s. Eat right, exercise, study, and with just a little gene luck you'll be young for decades to come.

LOL. Getting old is 35.

ONLY $500K in savings at 35. Such a sad story. So sorry for you, as most people are lucky to have saved $50K at 35 or even 55! Money has no meaning if you are feeling lost with $500K.

Seriously though, my advice would be stop comparing yourself to others. Older or younger, married or single, successful or not, fit or fat. Know thyself. Go on a meditation retreat. You have nothing to lose and no limitations.

As others have wisely stated, health is paramount. Challenge yourself with a physical activity you’ve never done before. You’ll meet new people on the way.

Rethink work. List causes you truly believe in, then find an organization which aligns with one and apply for a job in your specialty to expand their reach. Work with purpose even if it’s only a year. Consider is a sabbatical if you need to frame it in a non committal way.

I don’t think you need to underplay OP issues. While he may be better off financially than lots of people, feeling lost with little passion for life is still not a good situation, and he deserves to feel the way he does.

He's not underplaying it. He is telling him to have perspective. Life has been pretty good to OP, at least as he portrays it.

OP is not wrong. Time is running out. His best physical years are behind him. On the plus side he has deep experience. He probably has seen quite a bit. Maybe his feeling of having seen everything is justified.

Existential dread is a bit of a thing, but it comes for the successful and the truly unsuccessful alike.

OP is also probably right, it's probably time to find a new passion, in tech or outside of tech. All of the other advice in this thread to really make sure you're focused on your health in all forms from this age forward is spot on.

> His best physical years are behind him.

They could be. Or it could depend on OP. Tom Brady has more Super Bowl Trophies and MVP selections from __after__ he was 37.

There are plenty of athletic sports where being young does not offer easy superiority.

People like Tom Brady are extremely rare exceptions though, at the far, far end of the spectrum. In most competitive sports, player hit their peak relatively young, in most cases before they turn 35. This doesn't mean getting older necessarily makes one worse, but it definitely increases things like recovery times, chance of injury, etc. that tend to have that combined effect.

I mean, Brady's an exception of course but quarterbacks and kickers can trend significantly older than most other positions in football because they're highly protected by both the rules and their teams and play designs because they're essential scoring roles and their value is largely accuracy, not physically beating an opponent one on one. The same is not true for most of the other players on the field.

This. I am 37 now and feel healthier and overall happier than when I was 15, 20 or 25. It really depends.

So, I really did bounce back and forth on putting a qualifying "his best days are likely behind him". In an absolute sense, you will never have as many fitness "opportunity" as you did when you were 16-35. Speaking as an older dude who exercises a lot: Enjoy working out way, way harder than you should at a young age and getting away with it because your body is like a superhero with its recovery rate.

I didn't mean anything beyond pure athleticism. Sport is another matter.

Physically, it's much more tricky to train and become an at an older age. But I'll agree that for some folks, you can be a better version of yourself at earlier ages -- it is just dependent on what type of athlete you were then, and much permanent damage your body has sustained over the years.

I ran sub 17 5k at 18 years old. Will my tendons and knees support the kind of workload that is required to attempt that again?

One day, your body will fail. Even Tom Brady knows father time always, always wins. You have to choose your battles and figure out where you want to spend your time.

Measured in absolute peak performance wise, yeah you're right. He will never be an olympian. However most people don't have the opportunity to "discover" their physical ability at 15 nor at 25. So in other words : For most - if they start a regular exercise regime at 40 they will end up at the best shape of their lives.

I'm not saying this is the case here, but there have been occasions where I got all up in my head about my problems and someone laughing at me and telling me not to take my problems so seriously was the perfect way to stop worrying and focus on better things.

Really? For me it was the perfect way to stop asking this person for advice.

Is deserves the right word? I’d say he is entitled to feel that way - not that he deserves it since that implies causality and almost seems like victim blaming.

It reads like a humblebrag to me.

"had 2 failed startups". "I am single and haven't had a serious relationship for many years now."

I don't see the bragging part, personally.

I thought the parent made an excellent point, and encouraged OP to try new things without hesitation because there wasn't much he was going to lose, and because he was in that condition because he wasn't trying out new things (meaning there no serious psychological issues with him). I would be glad to get his advice.

If you want anyone to take your advice, you should find a better opener than laughing at them and being dismissive.

You make a good point, but I have to admit, as someone in my 50’s, I also chuckled that some thought they were old at 35. I guess time changes all of our perspectives a day at a time.

I think it's because 30s is where a lot of people first feel age with concessions. It's right when you first feel that you heal slower, have to watch your joints more, etc. The stark contrast from your 20s when you feel progressively more bullet proof each year.

Or - that's been my experience atleast.

37 year old, checking in, agree on all points

used to be able to eat what i want, move the way i want, get hurt and bounce back quickly, not so much these days

Yup. I bloomed a little late and had my social explosion throughout my 30s. But every year the next day after a late night out drinking hurt more and more. Aches start piling up, weight is harder to keep off, it feels easier to hurt myself, and slower to heal.

Keeping your health together and your body moving is one of the most important things.

But the rest of it is just in our heads. We can learn new things, meet new people, start new romantic relationships. But we have to want to do that, and put ourselves in positions where there are opportunities for those things to happen, and then take advantage of those opportunities.

Sometimes that type of response can actually be helpful at putting your current situation into perspective.

Yep this. The average rate of return is 10% so this is someone who can make $50k a year just off this money alone. The real median wage in the USA for workers who worked full time in 2020 was $56k. This person has enough money to nearly replicate the financial success of your average American via a do-nothing secondary income. Your average American retires with only $200k saved up by age 65 as well. $500k is a lot of money and its bothersome that its being played up here as being unsuccessful.

This person is doing very, very well and I suspect "I only have half a million dollars sitting idly by" is a humble-brag as that is obviously a lot of money.

Also 35 isn't 65. This is the prime age for most business people, artists, writers, etc. This is typically a professional and creative peak that lasts, at least, another decade or so. A person this age often has the drive and vitality of youth but the wisdom of someone older. Its no wonder so many great works are created by people around this age.

I think this post says a lot about the demographic here who lean towards worshipping money to the point where having half a million is being "unsuccessful" and being merely 35 is being "old." Capitalism does a great job of making people feel bad about themselves because they arent mega millionaires and commercial media sells images of youth because promoting anti aging things like makeup, drugs, surgeries, fitness, etc is so profitable. Hiring managers also discriminate on age because working young and naive people like dogs and leading them to burn out is "good business sense," while dealing with an older person who knows this con and understands class struggle and the dishonesty of management and the perverse incentive profit demands is "bad business."

My advice is that forums are a very, very poor place to get therapy. Go see a professional if you feel depressed. Forums like these are just echo chambers full of people with similar unresolved issues or with coping mechanisms that aren't healthy. And egotists who just want to tell you their life story, knowing full well stories aren't healing because if they were, we could cure all our malaise with just biographies of people who struggle.

So, no "fitness" or "hobbies" or "kids"[1] isn't it, maybe some of those things is part of it, but there's a lot more a human being needs who has lost their way in an ultra capitalist and competitive society. Part of it is seeing the forest for the trees and a professional can help them get the rational self-awareness they seem to lack, as well as address their emotional issues.

[1] If you are not dying to have kids then you shouldn't not have kids. There is a lot of toxic advice here about having children to "fix" things. Children should not be born as a way to fix yourself. It is 100% valid to not want children. I say this as a parent. Its a grueling and hard life compared to not having children, and if you have difficulty in life and don't even want kids, do not have them. They will not magically suddenly fulfill you or make your life easier. In fact, in many ways they will make things much harder for you in literally every avenue in your life. The world does not need more unwanted children or children used a marriage or personal emotional fixers.

Where are you getting 10% guaranteed a year?

The 10% is not guaranteed. But it is average over several years. Although I prefer to go for global index funds which is more like 7% and less risky.

nowhere - there is NO PLACE you get safely get 10% guaranteed per year. Zilch, none.

Better plans is to plan on living off 4% of you nest egg if you don't want to run out when you are too old to start working again.

The number is quoted from being averaged over several years. I think the basic premise is correct though, one can live off that type of money passively and comfortably (depending on where you live of course). If you aren't seeing those kind of returns on average, move your money to a total stock market index fund.

The premise is incorrect because real rate of return is what determines how you can “live”. Even if you received 10% returns every year, it makes a huge difference if the medicine/food/labor you need increased by 5%, or 10%, or even 20%.

Additionally, if you have lost the ability to earn an income, then you cannot afford to be down a few years, hence you need to greatly expand the proportion of assets that are earning less than equities, and quite possibly putting you behind inflation. Especially if you live in a popular area.

Combine this with a nation whose population is aging and therefore competition for buying young people’s labor is going up, and you might want to be more conservative about expectations of the future.

Just average the winning move of betting everything on Greenspan Put over the past couple years and ignore anything that happened before ;)

Just wait until the 10% returners start to see -5-10% for 10 years returns.

Just about any index fund.

Recently. Also, subtract inflation, which has been uncommonly low in recent years.

You must be very young. Just about any index fund would have returned ~0% pa from mid 2000 to mid 2013, i.e. not very long ago.

> Where are you getting 10% guaranteed a year?

If anyone gets the answer to this question, PM me the details.

As of right now, dividend-paying mortgage REITs pay around 9-10%. The US government will never let its housing market fail, and low interest rates let these trusts borrow inexpensively.

> The US government will never let its housing market fail,...

Maybe I'm totally missing your point, but didn't exactly this happen in 2008?

The US government came out and said that it would guarantee Freddie's/Fannie's debt which caused a sharp downtick as the government effectively admitted there was a possibility they could go to zero. Short (on the scale we're looking at) downturns, even if large in % terms, aren't a failure of a market. So, to answer your question, no.

While I agree that ever-increasing housing prices are almost the only platform both parties agree on, when there are already low interest rates and inflation occurring, the government is out of moves.

Never say never. Markets revert to the mean eventually.

My 401k lost 6% last year... and after factoring in inflation and the account maintenance fees I might have been better off playing the lottery.

> If you are not dying to have kids then you shouldn't not have kids. There is a lot of toxic advice here about having children to "fix" things. Children should not be born as a way to fix yourself. It is 100% valid to not want children. I say this as a parent. Its a grueling and hard life compared to not having children, and if you have difficulty in life and don't even want kids, do not have them. They will not magically suddenly fulfill you or make your life easier. In fact, in many ways they will make things much harder for you in literally every avenue in your life. The world does not need more unwanted children or children used a marriage or personal emotional fixers.

So much this. I’m horrified at the number of replies here touting kids as some magical fix for all problems. I became a dad in December after being in the fence for a few years preceded by several years of “no way I’m going to have kids”.

It’s pretty darn tough. My quality of life has declined very substantially, we’re mostly at home and go for a walk in the morning and another afternoon in a very small radius and in constant fear the baby might get fussy. We don’t go to watch a movie, or restaurant or to a bar. I’ve stopped drinking alcohol (not that I was getting drunk before, just tipsy) as I have a baby to hold and move around the house. Even taking a shit requires some planning. I work remotely and switched to part time (4 hours per day) as I can’t fathom placing all the burden on the mother (on top of breastfeeding which only she can do and it’s also very tough) and hiring a nanny in covid times is not an option, but it’s still hard.

And the constant worry if the baby is ok, are those noises during sleep normal? Is she regurgitating too much? What are those twitches, is she having spasms? Is she developing well physically and neurologically?

And I think I’m blessed with a “good” baby that sleeps quite well at night, waking only 2-3 times for feeding and falling asleep again shortly after.

I recognize some of these issues are probably due to being a first time dad and/or my personality, and also that hopefully it gets easier over time. By the way none of this means I regret it, but still: OP is in no way in the right mindset to have kids right now.

Same boat, congratulations! I think the biggest thing about having a baby is that we change for the better and mature. Getting to a new level of wisdom and grit that sticks around even after they get easier when they’re older!

My take is that you're still in the easy period because babies are just still, well, babies. As they age into children and go to school, academics, socializing, etc matter and their own existential dread of the universe, etc come into play it gets much much harder. My son and I talk about death a lot because he's shocked by it. I try to explain to him what money means. Also you're building both a loving parental but also a peer relationship -- not a parent to baby one, past ages 4 or 5, with someone with their own interests, strong personality, mental health issues, hangups, habits, etc. This is a relationship that cant fail and you can't ever walk away from. This relationship only ends on your death which will badly hurt your children just like the loss of your own parents hurt you.

Especially not only as their parent guiding them through this universe, but also knowing the economic and political system they are inheriting is terrible, unjust, unequal, racist, and dishonest and how they'll have to come to terms with that just like we did, if we ever did. And finding ways for them to avoid getting crushed by this unjust wheel we called capitalism by doing your best to get them into good schools, tutors, pulling strings on their behalf, guiding their interests, etc.

>Also 35 isn't 65. This is the prime age for most business people, artists, writers, etc. This is typically a professional and creative peak that lasts, at least, another decade or so. A person this age often has the drive and vitality of youth but the wisdom of someone older. Its no wonder so many great works are created by people around this age.

The age of 35 does represents an important milestone for many artists; it is the age when their creativity fades in both intensity and volume. What used to arrive almost spontaneously now requires hard and conscious works. This is the age where even Mozart needed to increasingly rely on sketches, and some of those who relied on their youthful facility, such as Rossini, simply quit composition altogether. On the other hand, someone like Beethoven who always struggled with composition from the beginning of his career probably did not notice this creative slump (Beethoven's crisis came later in his mid-40s).

This barrier to creativity that arrives in the mid-30s is especially evident in the Romantic artists, not just Wordsworth and Coleridge, but also Holderlin, Schlegel, Chateaubriand and Senancour. Charles Rosen speculates that is is because the inspiration for the Romantics was "drawn directly from memories of adolescence, and as these memories receded into the past their evocation became more and more artificial, or else the writer found himself with a fully developed manner and no content."[1] In this sense I do believe 35 is in some ways "old" as it represents a paradigm shift in one's approach to the creative arts, and maybe life itself.

[1] Romantic poets, Critics and Other Madmen, 1998

Those are all pre-modern people before the invention of vaccines and antibiotics and who had terrible health and suffered by now preventable childhood diseases. Their 35 is not our 35. Shakespeare, I believe, wrote about joint pain, aging, and losing his memory and mind at 35, which is not typical of a modern 35 year old. Substance abuse and artistry go hand in hand and a lot of these artists were addicts and drunks who badly damaged their brains. Many of them had mercury poisoning from medical treatments of their day and other edge cases not common today.

Not to mention these people were elite global competitors, so if they felt less sharp at 35, that means they were merely just the top 1% instead of being the top .1%. They still were amazing thinkers and producers after 35.

Just off the top of my head, Stanley Kubrick's career peaked with his decade plus long Lolita, Strangelove, 2001, and Clockwork Orange period in the 1960-70s, which was around his 30-40s. Then nearly 20 years after Lolita, well into his 50's he made The Shining, which is considered an important American film, perhaps not as groundbreaking as the others, but something miles ahead of his younger competitors. So even as these people supposedly age out of their peak years, these super high performers are still amazing. The Oscar winner that year? Kramer vs Kramer, a largely forgotten piece of art and "safe pick" that played to social issues of the time. The best screenplay? Breaking Away, a completely forgotten movie. The Shining is still a beloved classic, cultural icon, horror master-class, an iconic actor's defining role, and a movie studied in film school religiously today and for the foreseeable future.

Then almost a decade later in 1987 at age 59, he directed Full Metal Jacket, a lesser work, but considered one of the best anti-war films, arguably stealing or matching the crown from beloved critic favorites like Apocalypse Now and The Deer Hunter, long after the 60s and 70s fad of anti-war movies faded away and Vietnam a now faded memory and during the right-wing, pro-military, pro-interventionist foreign policy Reagan administration. This was a bold and provocative move you'd associate with a younger director trying to get attention and not a man close to retirement. So even "old" Kubrick was competing on a world class level and doing interesting and challenging things.

A genre horror film from a famous director who hasn't delivered a great film in a decade? An anti-war film in the late 80s on the tail of Top Gun? Both of these genres were fads once and decidedly uncool at the time of their release. This on paper sounds almost foolish, but in practice, an artist of his calibre pulled off something very special in both cases.

For modern people, career peaks are mid-30s. The "wisdom" of two hundred old plus composers and poets is a nice toilet read but isn't scientific at all. Science has its own ideas about aging:

The journals Psychological Science, Science Direct, and Harvard claims various mental peaks come later in life. New vocabulary peaks at 67, learning new information at 50, concentrating at 43, learning new faces 32, etc.

https://nextluxury.com/mens-lifestyle-advice/what-age-do-men...

So yes 35 is not only a good age, its the start of a peak, and a 35 year old modern worker has still another two decades of high performance waiting for them.

There should be a 20-year Academy Awards, for movies people still care about 20 years later. Stanley Kubrick's films would do very well in such a competition.

I do not deny the existence of creative peaks after 35, which is of course not a rarity (just look up Elliott Carter for a truly awe-inspiring example). What I mean to say is that there seems to be a certain (mental? physiognomical? spiritual?) obstacle at 35 which affects all artists but especially those who relied on their precocity or talent which was more abundant in their early years. Those who cruised through their youth using the gifts they were born with are faced with a difficult decision in their 30s: they can either accept the decline in the rate and quality of their works or shift to methods which requires much more effort. Of course, not all artists were prodigies and they are not equally affected by this obstacle.

I don't know how sickness affects creativity, although quality of health has never seemed to be a disqualifying factor for the production of great works. Thomas Mann of course utilised this as his central idea in The Magic Mountain. The sickness of Schubert, Chopin and Beethoven does not see to have negatively impacted their creativity; Schubert seems even more sublime when he realised death was near, and Beethoven's deafness hasn't affected the quality of his late works.

The case of Shakespeare is peculiar in itself. If you read all his plays in sequence of composition, you would notice a certain weariness that becomes gradually apparent. Coriolanus, Timon of Athens and Troilus and Cressida contain an undisguised bitterness which is largely absent in the earlier tragedies (although you can glimpse a hint of it in Anthony and Cleopatra). The late romances, Winter's Tale and The Tempest, are of course unusually heavy in their subject matter. Harold Bloom interprets this as a certain melancholy in Shakespeare which made him weary of the theatre business altogether, which certain explains his early retirement. The health complaints in his 30s doesn't square with the fact that most of his greatest works were still to come at that stage.

10%?! On what planet? Where are you investing to get that kind of return now?

> my advice would be stop comparing yourself to others. Older or younger, married or single, successful or not, fit or fat

100% agreed.

Unfortunately we live in bodies that were hardwired to live in a hierarchical tribe; our early life is also a lot of rat racing. Just step aside from that, and know this: you are special in your own way. There’s nobody that’s just like you.

Also to be clear, if you had accomplished more you would probably feel like that wasn’t good enough either. Accomplishments just don’t satisfy inner needs unless they’re something you genuinely deeply care about (and not just to measure up in society’s totem pole).

Where did OP ever compare themselves to any but their younger self..?

> Money has no meaning if you are feeling lost with $500K.

Perhaps it would start to have meaning if the money was taken away.

Your broader post shows that you actually care to someone soliciting feedback and I know you didn't solicit any yourself but I hope I could add some value. You're trying to give the gift of perspective but the tone is just awful to receive, their feelings are valid whether they has $5, $500k or $5M in the bank, it's just a feeling based on their own goals and perspective. You can build much better relationships and people will listen and respect you more if you lead with empathy. You can deliver a much more powerful message by saying "I know you feel inadequate today, I've felt that way too and it's really tough, but if you put things in perspective you are way ahead of your peers on things that really matter (money, life experiences, etc.)" That's what you were really saying anyway in the first 2 paragraphs.

> That's what you were really saying anyway in the first 2 paragraphs.

Maybe it would be more effective but OP was not really saying the "I've felt that way too and it's really tough" part.

I have a problem with this 'lead with (fake) empathy' approach that at broader scale it makes it seem like EVERYONE has depression, imposter syndrome, etc.

There are many of us who are genuinely happy with where they are at life and it feels almost improper to share that publicly.

I could totally understand how you would read it that way, it's true that I don't know exactly what he would empathize with, but the point isn't to be fake, it's to be genuine. It's not that you are feeling imposter syndrome as some true false thing, I don't think I ever have, but usually people don't feel 100% good about everything in their lives 100% of the time. If you can't empathize with that, which honestly I have to question, you should be able to empathize with something and you lead with that. What's right for you in your words.

This stuff isn't intuitive, strong communication is hard work, leading isn't easy. A younger me would take your post personally, "he twisted my words and called me fake!", but assigning bad intention is rarely right and never helpful. I could instead reread my post and understand clearly how someone could read it that way and that's the empathy that was true to me so that's what I led with.

Nowhere does this person say that they feel poor. If anything they are acknowledging they are well off, but wondering why they feel lost and unfulfilled in spite of their material prosperity. It's not exactly an unknown notion, that people can feel unhappy despite being financially and materially well-off.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man's_Search_for_Meaning

>> I feel like I haven't achieved much

What type of achievement would be meaningful to you, in the sense that you could stop, if you wanted, after the achievement and move on to something else?

> Have you been through a similar thing?

More than once, as I guess is true of most people over 40

> How did you deal with it?

Figure out what is important to me and find ways to spend more time doing that. Neither was easy.

Focus on your health of course, find some hobbies u can get immersed in (away from the computer), spend time thinking about your spiritual well-being. Spend more time outside.

Have kids. Find someone who wants to and start a family together.

I think try sticking to something for more then 1-2 years… no wonder you feel lost… can’t really accomplish much in so little time. Spend the next decade on one thing

Find at least one hobby that can give you a decade of challenge - whether that challenge is mental, physical, or both - and completely unrelated to you day job.

Nice byproduct of a small handful of hobbies - provides fodder for small talk.

Mid 50s here. It's not what you've done, it's what you've done with it. Keep your chin up and remember you're in it for the long haul.

> I am single and haven't had a serious relationship for many years now.

Get married, start a family. Stop trying to find meaning in tech or alcohol or money. Good luck.

Get married? I dunno bout that. Kiss half your wealth goodbye. Children? You can be jailed for not paying child support on imputed income. That's imaginary money you don't have.

> Get married? I dunno bout that. Kiss half your wealth goodbye.

jeez man,you sound like an incel.

getting married is about having a life partner to share the best and worse of life together with. money is just something that happens.

Children dont have to happen but if they do, you'd have to understand that children change your perspective on what is important in life.

I don't agree with the person you're replying to, but I think it's fair to point out that you don't need to get married to have a life partner. With marriage rates declining, younger generations are not seeing it as a necessary step in a relationship.

Riding out the wave from the last tech boom, one day I'll look at my savings + day to day work and decide it's time to retire and that will be that.

Always keep a diamond in your mind. Always keep a diamond in your mind. Wherever you may wander, wherever you roam, You got to always keep a diamond in your mind.

-- Tom Waits

You reflect on what’s really important and use all those problem solving skills to focus on that instead.

I’m a big believer that loneliness is there to motivate us to change.

I’m 30, in sort of a similar position.

How terrible of an idea is grad school? Honestly any… but recommendations would be cool. MBA, law, cs, psychology/sociology…

Stay alive and keep pushing. You have 500k, come on. :)

Donating and contributing to various causes that will hopefully make the world a better place for everyone is what adds a lot of meaning to my life

35 is still quite young. Travel is harder now than it used to be but if you’re in the US, a long road trip around the country can do wonders.

35? Old?

I'm 59. I guess that makes me a fossil (geekasaur?).

I really didn't start feeling my technical oats, until I hit 45, or so. I've been an above-average geek, since I was about 21, but I lacked the experience, and the basic habits, that have made me into a much better developer. I started a system (backend tech), at 47, that has become the de facto world standard for a particular demographic, and is now being supported and extended by a highly-skilled and energetic team of younger developers. They probably could not have done the work to get the platform in place, but they have taken my work, and are running with it. They are taking it places that I couldn't go, on my own.

I worked on that system for a decade. Most of that time, it was in production, and I was applying course corrections to it, documenting it, evangelizing it, training people, and being abused.

sniff ... They grow up so fast ...

These days, I'm writing Apple apps (mostly iOS), and loving it. I really enjoy all the learning I'm doing, and finding out that I don't know squat.

I don't bother trying to surf the Jargon Wave. There's some cool stuff, coming out, but I've learned (the hard way) to give it a couple of years (at least) to shake off the fleas. It's very difficult to ship stuff, at the Quality level I prefer, using brand-new tools.

What really gets me excited, is shipping software. That's giving it a pat on the butt, and pushing it out into the world.

That involves a lot of "boring" work. On the project that I'm currently shepherding, We're in the final stages. The release is probably still a couple of months away (at least), but we can see the exit sign, from here. It's been a couple of years.

The work, from here on out, is pretty bland. Lots of work, setting up glossaries, production servers, localizations, accessibility tests, color themes, brand consistency, etc.

And, of course, lots of testing; with the very real possibility of having to put the car up on blocks, and break out the monkey wrench.

It's been my experience that my younger self was less-than-enthused by this part of the project, but I was fortunate to have older peers and bosses, that forced me to walk through this stuff.

It feels great to ship. As I've gotten older, I've come to enjoy this, a lot more.

I wish you luck. I know that one thing that helped me, was to find nonprofits and volunteer Service orgs, and lend my skills to them.

Not sure if this is some weird flex but having 500k in savings i puts you far ahead than where most people are. Maybe relax a bit.

I have learned the hard way it is only appropriate to describe yourself as old in the company of exclusively younger people.

35 was the start of a great run which is continuing for me. That was the point where long-held islands of understanding about the world began making connections. A whole growing in power as it formed from the evolving mesh. I felt as though this time marked an explosion in curiosity which further propelled this lifelong investigation.

Around this time, I also experienced a number of existential questions. There were financial problems. There was a break of a relationship which had already gone cold and another which I had started at the tail end of the first which was built on lies. I felt alone and vulnerable, as if I had been abandoned. I felt as if I were floating in a void.

I realized that I had left behind rigid structures which defined my identity. It's not that I walked away from them, so much as they crumbled and I was left with emptiness. I had a choice of clinging on to the ruins, or further exploring this odd new space I found myself in. I decided that I would embrace the void. I found that without the old structures, I could instead create and and discard new ones. The creations would be like the fantasy worlds I created from my imagination as a child. I entered into a phase of play. I was Don Quixote fighting windmills.

Embracing this void is sort of also embracing the art of being lost. I imagine that my identity could be anything and that I should jump from one to another as a continuation of wandering. Lately I have had an interest in doing performance as a street performing clown as an exploration of different paths of comedy. The clown suits me as taking on a character to remind myself and others not to take things too seriously. But there's also a seriousness to the place of comedy in our world. That's another critical point, that even though I have changed my relationship with structures which once carried great meaning, those structures are still important as a bridge for younger people to get to where I'm at. We need these structures, we need Santa or something like it when we're children. Also realize that part of the reason you feel lost may be that society necessarily treats younger people differently. At some point, like in Judge Dredd, you get exiled from this special place. But you'll find the life in exile is much richer in experience. I wouldn't go back.

One piece of advice that I always give, is to look into taking improv classes. The most basic idea of improv is the "yes, and" approach of interacting with others, which you can apply to everything. Whatever the universe throws at me, I'll respond back with a "yes... and" - and we'll all laugh at the result.

This is a special moment. Congrats. And welcome to the other side.

> How do you deal with getting old

I don't know...

> I am turning 35 years soon

...kiddo, but I do know one thing: You're jumping the gun by decades here.

I know it's not the point of your post but you should be very very happy to have saved up $500k. Way ahead, my friend!

Maybe you should start working to live instead of living to work. Start a family or reconnect with your existing family.

I totally felt the same. But, picking up some math books and start learning again gave me something to look forward to.

Right here with you OP. I dont have cash quite like that yet, but this experience is all too real for me right now.

Do you have space/opportunity to garden, even if it's just something on a window sill, or pot plants?

Ernie Zelinski's "Joy of Not Working" book was useful and eye-opening for me at about that age.

you're not wrong that time is running out, i'm 35 too

It's your choice to think about your age, personally I just do whatever I want

35 is not too old to go to bars, there are tons of bars and clubs that specifically cater to people in their 30s

but really in my opinion you are good to go out as long as your health permits you to

Maybe try journaling to help put things in perspective. You have to find what works for you. Good luck!

You're not old, you're young, and by any reasonable measure fabulously wealthy. Kudos! If you spend the rest of your life telling yourself "I should have done this 10 years ago" as an excuse not to do it now then yes, you will never live your life. But you have infinite opportunities and nothing is stopping you pursuing them except you.

Having ascended Maslow's hierarchy to a certain level, you now have the luxury of ennui.

Find a partner and start a family.

Lmao this is one of the most out of touch posts I’ve ever seen. This has to be a troll.

I feel the same. Will be looking at this thread to look at suggestions at a later date.

hmm.. Indeed as homo sapiens, we no longer have to forage on the Savannah and are far safer than our ancestors within in our nations, states, cities with our PS5s, 401Ks, I sometimes do wonder.. WTF is the point of my existence

oh you are spot on with your feelings. And you can do nothing about it. You will figure out however something that will work for you and move on with life. I could've told this and that. But I just want to be honest.

Man go check your t levels. Had similar symptoms, Innosupps t-drive made wonders

Reality is time is running out. Try to push yourself to do more impactful work.

Mate, don't worry this is normal. I turned 39 last month, I have one failed marriage behind me (no kids), I don't have 500k USD in savings (so I think this is great for you), but I know what you are talking about.

Let me help you with one simple solution - testosterone. I was in mma most of my adult life, with some fights, sparings etc... I didn't use any susptances and supplements that are illegal. Now I am doing som mountain bike races (mostly XC marathones).

Speaking with lot of doctors that I know, the problem is that over 30, sometimes over 35, male is starting to lose testosterone. And testosterone is an essence for mail - physically and psychologically. Like women that over 45 starts to take estrogen, we should also start using testosterone.

So, try to see with your doctor, to start using just enough to keep your testosterone like you are in your 30-ties.

From my experience, it helps a lot, and soon when I will be over 40, it will really help.

Other than that, sport is always good for clearing your head, and hobbies.

And if you feel old, always look at Joe Biden, he is POTUS now. :)

Nothing has any meaaning so nothing really matters, embrace the absurd.

You are never lost if you've found yourself. Rejoice.

Look up mindfullness. Learn to enjoy the present moment

Start with Man’s Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankyl

Isn't this something called as mid life crisis?

midlife crisis I guess, I am in mid 40s and I often think on similar lines. Does anyone have some hack or solution to deal with it?

Psychedelics and Traveling.

Never thought I’d think people would consider themselves a failure despite having $500k savings lol.

A reminder:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30179483

In what way this is a flamebait?

I really don’t understand.

Edit: ok I get it, my comments aren’t substantive enough.

I won’t post anymore.

How did your startups fail?

Give away all that money.

isn't this something called as mid life crisis?

35 isnt old homie.

find something or someone to love

Welcome to your first existential life crisis! Mid-life (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midlife_crisis), quarter-life (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarter-life_crisis), it's the same concept.

You are staring down the barrel of mortality. Your life is slowly ending, time does pass without your control, you will gradually stop being able to do the things you once did. Things that used to excite you don't as much, you haven't accomplished as much as you'd hope, you don't feel satisfied. You want to go back to the past, to feel those old feelings again, to have another chance to "get things right".

Good news! This is all normal, and you can deal with it.

First, accept reality. There is no "winning" at life. Whatever goals you thought you had, whatever accomplishments make up your self-identity, don't really matter. You are going to die. You are going to miss out on relationships, career opportunities, money. You are going to feel dissatisfied and like you've missed out on things (because you have!). But that is all OK.

As long as you provide for the 7 basic needs (air, water, sleep, safety, food, clothing, shelter), you have everything you need to be a successful human. So, whenever you feel like you're not living up to your potential, or promises, or something else, just review the 7 basic needs. Are those met? Then you're OK. Everything else is gravy.

Next, take stock of your life. What do you have? Money in the bank? A successful career? An expansive education? Shit, man, you've got the golden ticket. You can do pretty much anything you want in life. All you have to do is decide what you want. That's a pretty nice problem to have.

As you decide what to do, ask yourself why you want to do it. Sure, you could chase your youth. But why? If all that excites and interests you is the things you did in your 20s, then it makes sense. But you could also find new things and expand your life; find new music, new activities, new people. You could branch out and expand the scope of your life, enriching it with new things, or maybe just improving on existing things. But, if not, that's fine too!

When you know what you want to do, make a plan for the future. Account for the fact that how you do things now will be different than how you did them in the past. We constantly change, whether we want to or not. Grow into the change. Like new skin grows around you, let your plan and action fit into your life changes and vice versa.

Above all, do not measure yourself based on the past. The past is the past! You are a new man in every moment. Measure your current self against your plan for the future. Adapt the plan as you go. "No battle plan survives first contact with the enemy;" your life plans will also not work out exactly as planned. Adapt, regroup, continue.

> I increasingly wish I could go back to my 20s. Now I feel too old to go to festivals, bars and clubs and make new friends that way.

I'm 40, and I guarantee you are not too old for things. If you used to meet new people in bars, you still can. No, you shouldn't go to bars that are predominately people in their early 20s. Find bars (and other venues) that tend to attract a crowd closer to your age. As much as I dislike meetup.com, resources like that can help you find people who like to do the things you like to do, and can introduce you to new things if you're willing to take a leap.

I will admit that the pool of people is probably smaller. People pair off and start families as they get older. Even if they only pair off, couples probably "go out" less often than single people. But also consider that people are getting married later and starting families later these days. So there are still likely plenty of people out and about who share your values and likes.

> I feel like I've seen most things before, and it's all just different iterations of the same.

To some extent that's true, probably. But maybe that means you need some new hobbies. I assume by your "excited about new technologies" line that you're a software developer or similar. I, too, play around with tech as a hobby in addition to my job, but make sure you're branching out and doing other things that have nothing to do with tech.

> I am single and haven't had a serious relationship for many years now.

Don't put too much pressure on yourself, or attach too many expectations to this, as that will have the opposite effect. If you're having trouble meeting people, try dating apps. They're far from perfect, but they help you get out there, and help you meet new people without having the stress of (for example) making a cold approach in a bar or something. Even if you don't find a long-term relationship on the apps, you may find it builds your confidence and helps you get back into the groove of meeting people.

> When I was ~30 I still considered myself young and able to do anything I could do when I was in my 20s. But not anymore now. I feel like my time for everything is running out. Have you been through a similar thing? How did you deal with it?

When I turned 30, I remember the 6 months or so leading up to it were a little stressful for me. The idea of leaving my 20s made me feel like I was "getting old", and I started cataloging what I'd done, and worried that it wasn't enough. But then I turned 30, and realized nothing special happened during that transition. I was still the same person, and I could still do what I wanted to do. Turning 40 last summer was similar. Sure, I'm realizing some things have changed: my body is aging, and I get injured (and take longer to heal) than I used to. I can't drink like I used to without consequences the next day. But I'm still me. I can still hang out with my friends, even those who have kids now. I can still invite people over for dinner. I can still go to bars with friends to catch up over beer or cocktails. I can still go out to restaurants. I can still go out to my favorite karaoke bar and have a wild night, as long as I don't do it too often (well, ok, haven't done that since the lull before COVID delta, and between delta and omicron).

You're turning 35, and even if you die somewhat on the young side, you're only a little more than a quarter of the way through your adult life. You have plenty of time to learn new things, develop new hobbies, further your career, meet new people, find a significant other, etc. While you need to try not to put crushing pressure on yourself to achieve these things, you also need to just get out and keep doing stuff that gives you the opportunity to accomplish these things.

You're still a decade or more away from your career peak, and your physical potential is not far past its peak and declining pretty slowly for now. Feeling "old" at your age is more a matter of experience than biological fact. There are a lot of things that just aren't as exciting now because they relied heavily on novelty or just on the wonder that you could do them at all.

It's true that you've changed in a way that ruins some of the fun you used to have. None of it is new to you. You can't get hyped up for it the same way, because the sense of infinite possibility isn't there any more. Being able to do exactly what you want is no longer new and thrilling, either. And you're no longer as thrilled by inclusion and universality, reveling in those generic activities that "everybody" likes. You might not realize it yet, but you've started to choose experiences for your own sake rather than because everybody else does them.

You're hung up on this being a bad thing, but it's not really bad. I remember how excited I was as a college freshman to hike through the snow for twenty minutes to go to a house party, get wasted on beer that tasted terrible to me, and try to talk to girls that I had nothing in common with. I felt like the world was opening up to me. A year or two later, I still did it, but it wasn't an ecstatic experience anymore, because by then I knew that there was beer that actually tasted good and that the girls I really wanted to talk to were not at those parties. I could no longer feel that sense of infinite possibility. Today, I still understand why I was excited then, but I wouldn't be excited to do it now, even if I could magically pilot my younger body for a while, like Tom Hanks in Big. I remember it as a high point in my life, but what made it a high point was how excited and optimistic I felt, which only made sense in the context of my inexperience and my wonder at flexing a developing sense of autonomy.

Think of inexperience and the transition into adulthood as ingredients that made those young adult experiences delicious but which are no longer available to cook with. Doing the same things you used to enjoy in your twenties, without the inexperience and the excitement of discovering your adult autonomy, is like eating french fries without salt, or salad without dressing, a joyless chore. Don't try to force it.

Would you order curry at a restaurant that only had tomatoes, basil, oregano, and olive oil in the kitchen? If you went to a bakery for chocolate-chip cookies, and they said sorry, we're all out of chocolate and sugar, would you insist on them baking a batch for you with what they had? Don't get hung up on the stuff you used to enjoy.

You have new ingredients to work with, ingredients that are particular to you and your experience. They aren't so universal that "everybody" your age will enjoy the same things, but not so unique that you'll be alone. You need to start to figure out the flavor profile for this time in your life. If you don't know where to start, start anywhere. Look around, try whatever looks good, and if nothing looks good yet, try things at random while you're looking. It won't all taste good. That's life.

Turning 30 was a lot harder than turning 40 or 50. While what I experienced wasn't how I understand a typical midlife crisis manifests, but I usually refer to it as my early onset midlife crisis.

Both turning 40 and turning 50 was much easier. In fact, turning 50 hardly registered beyond "whoa, was that my 40s done with already? Okay".

I got out of my 30 year crisis by starting to challenge myself in other fields. I've always been eager to learn, but around 30 I realized that I should make an effort to understand things that are outside my chosen field and try to do them well. And I sometimes did. The failures I didn't obsess over. Let it go, move on. And it became somewhat addictive. I try new things every year. Some things stick, others are just interesting experiences.

I also noticed the importance of changing fields regularly. On average I tend to stay in a field for 5-6 years before going off to do something I usually don't know much about when I start. In fact, approaching a new field is in itself a skill that has great value.

I've had roles from developer in a startup to VP in a large company. Having experience from many fields, and from very different roles builds a kind of general, broad expertise that is very useful. It can also make you comfortable with situations that most people would find extremely challenging.

You have to build some form of psychological resilience. Learn to accept the things you can't do anything about, and focus on what you CAN do and what you have to do. Complain if you must, but make sure that it isn't your inner focus. Don't let feelings of hopelessness take root. You have the capacity for doing a lot more than you think, but hopelessness and self-pity can block your view of that.

Along the way I had kidney failure, 2 years of dialysis and eventually a kidney transplant in my early to mid 40s. This is where the psychological resilience I had developed since my 30s paid off. Sure, I was physically in such bad shape and one point I couldn't walk half a mile to the store without having to sit down and rest for 15 minutes twice along the way. I slept 14 hours per day and I nearly died a couple of times.

Years later, most of my memories from that period are about the things I did. Not my medical hardships. And I did accomplish a lot in those years.

(Observation: a lot of people who were just acquaintances stopped by and spent time with me when it looked like there was a good chance I was going to die. This taught me something important: you may not fully understand to whom you are important and how many people appreciate you. You have the chance to show them appreciation. No kidney failure needed :-)).

As for the social aspects, having been with my wife for 27 years now I know nothing about dating. Not that I ever did. Sorry. Can't help you there.

I'm dubious about the advice to get kids. It feels a bit immoral and self-serving to tell someone to create a life just to solve some problem you are having. I think one should treat human life with a bit more respect than that. It's not a pet and you should have kids for the right reasons.

If you try out new things (work, hobbies, interests) those are generally how you meet new people when you are an adult.

You need a Miata

make kids

TL;DR: I don't have a solution, I'm still searching for one on my own. The story may resonate, and others that 'made it', please feel free to provide your thoughts...

I'm turning 37 this year, and had this feeling for the past 2 years, which was only amplified in the past few months. So, really, your post (and all the comments) came in really timely (when the student is ready... ). If for nothing else, then to see that I'm not alone.

Unlike you, I am married (IMHO, happily) and have two kids under the age of ten. But, contrary to most of the posts, I can't say that it instilled peace in me. If anything, it made me realize that I need to make even more money to secure their good education and set them up well on that path (don't plan to finance their life past the education part, as I think one should earn for his own luxuries, as it's the only way they could appreciate and learn the value of 'things', and the value of paying for your own stuff).

In my case, in my 20s I was in a way better shape than now. Even though I tried to get back in the game at the start of 30s and ran half marathons (10 of them in 2019) and did supersprint triathlons, I stopped dead cold in 2020 due to a not very serious injury. I'm still exercising, but my main problem for not 'being' fit as fuck is the love-hate relationship with food (and sweets in particular). It's like I'm self-sabotaging in a way. I know, weird

My problem, I think, was always setting some goal (probably not all were BHAGs, but certainly they weren't totally easy), and then working like crazy to achieve it. Most of them, if not all, I achieved. The problem? Once I attain them, I lose all interest. I think that the money part is tricky because on one hand I'm working (hi, my name is X, and I'm a workaholic) a lot to secure the $$ for my kids, and then in turn I don't spend as much time with them as I think they'd need (mind you, I grew up with financially supportive dad, but one that worked abroad and whom I saw only over the weekend - heh, Freud could probably say a thing or two on that..). Crazy twisted logic, I know. Maybe I'm just a workaholic who uses the kids part as an excuse. Maybe I too could make use of professional help (even though I can surely afford it, in my environment, that's frowned upon - maybe I need to get myself in a new environment).

Since my 30s I got into this whole 'self-help' book genre, and can't shake the feeling that most of the new ones are rehashing the ideas from before, but tailor them to the new generations. If you're into reading, Id' suggest re-reading the ones that spoke to you before. I'm a voracious reader, and I can wholeheartedly recommend The Daily Stoic by Ryan Holiday.

I would love to tell you that I have a solution. I don't. BUT, I'm trying - and I suggest you do the same. If money is any measure, then I'd suspect you have the discipline to not give up. Remember, comments confirm, you're not alone in this. And, to use the popular crypto abbreviation these days: WAGMI.

Take care, and I would really like to hear from you 5 years from now.

Also, sorry not sorry, for hijacking your post to also share my 'problems' - truthfully, I overshared because based on the comments I think some folks may give me another perspective as well.

Take care

Civilization is a machine, and you are just a part in that machine that wears out after about 20-30 years, then you either go into management or some other role that isn't physically productive.

Capitalism loves consumption, and the young consume/can be sold to, so civilization is broadly structured around that.

Sort of like the "hot young girl" who loses her appeal rapidly after age 30, this gradual rug-pulling is unnerving. The ground rules shift under your feet. Things you thought were fact, actually were circumstances of the time and place.

All of a sudden, you start understanding your parents, older people, and life situations that were once abstract and far away, and now are more concrete. The progressive commercials are great little parodies of this.

At the same time, you have lived a few pop culture cycles. You start to see the treadmill for what it is rather than all these amazing experiences and things you didn't know about when you were young.

Observations:

1) 35 is not too late to get in good shape. Not the "I walk a couple miles" activity that puts you in the upper quartile of our population. I mean in ACTUAL good shape like being able to run a marathon and bench press your weight. If you do this, your "functional age" will be vastly suppressed throughout the next 25-40 years and the range of options available to you is a lot greater. Be careful though of overtraining in your 30s. Don't listen to dumb 20 year olds whose muscle and ligaments are at the height of their plasticity and durability.

2) you're probably a dude. You can start a family in the next 15 years, your situation is not as dire as a 35 year old woman. But you should get on it.

3) basically you're probably done with the gambling phase of your career. Sure you can keep chasing startups, but really you should have skills and just settle into more regular and predictable income.

4) 500k is a decent chunk, but it ain't retirement-grade. You should start concentrating on growing that rather than moonshooting for another million. I would disagree with "go traveling". That's expensive in cost, time, and missed income. Plus, you are ancient in terms of silicon valley, and getting old in IT in other markets. If you don't want to go into management, you'll need to maximize your sweet spot of your career in terms of reliable income.

Or... you don't? Maybe you need to chuck the entire career thing, put 400k into funds that you don't touch for 20 years and go live an entirely different life and lifestyle? Chuck all the financial shit I mentioned.

But get in good shape. Seriously, that makes SUCH a huge difference now that I'm in the late 40s-50s phase of my life. What is the fountain of youth? Exercise. Exercise often has built-in socializing as well, and makes you better looking, which has built-in social effects as well.

Badly according to the FBI profilers

Man, this is the WORST place to ask for advice. A quick scan of the suggestions:

* Have you tried medicating these feelings away?

* Have you tried drugs?

* Get on a plane! Travel and "find yourself!"

* You have money, why aren't you happy?

* How about you do everything again that brought you to this place... But in a different career field?

About the only real suggestion here is to exercise, find a hobby, or start a family -- but even those posters have an absurdist take that it is a meaningless pursuit. The Mr. Peanutbutter take: "Life is about occupying yourself with pleasant nonsense until you die."

What an indictment of this culture. Their solution is either to therapy this feeling out of existence, distract yourself from it, or ignore it. (Or alternatively, utterly fail to comprehend why you could possibly feel this way when you have money.)

I'm of the opinion that these feelings must be confronted directly. When I was in a similar position, I read the book of Ecclesiastes. I'd start there.

I'm not sure what your background with therapy is, but, it's certainly not an opiate. In fact a good therapist will help out and encourage one to confront one's problems directly.

Oh, absolutely! A GOOD therapist will encourage you to confront your problems.

The problem is finding a good one. My experience is that the vast majority are on the wrong side of the couch, or assist you in suppressing the problem instead of confronting it.

Absolutely this is a great comment. And good marketing for Ecclesiastes, now I want to read it. Definitely go at these feelings head on, meditate on them.

Can you say a bit more about what happened when you confronted these feelings?

Absolutely!

Primarily I was disillusioned with my college education, but that feeling spread to encompass many areas of my life. Everything seemed arbitrary and pointless -- and reading the first few chapters it really was comforting to hear someone else from a completely different time saying the same things. It was like -- I'm not alone here. Many people seemed to feel this way with Bojack Horseman as well... Though I find Ecclesiastes much more satisfying at the end.

In fact, knowingly or not, many people are echoing the same sentiments here: everything is the same, nothing is new, history repeats itself -- things are bent, and there's no straightening it.

But where the rubber meets the road is this: all the suggestions people told me didn't seem to be of any help. "Just do a hobby, exercise, or travel!" is a hollow suggestion when you think everything is meaningless, "a chasing after the wind."

The author talks about the futility of work, wisdom, pleasure, relationships, even gardening! But then he even talks about miscarriage of justice, and government corruption. "Why do bad things happen to good people?" It's like he's tugging on this weed on human existence, and the more he pulls, the deeper the roots of the problem go.

I'll leave with just two verses that stick out to me:

Better to spend your time at funerals than at parties. After all, everyone dies— so the living should take this to heart. Sorrow is better than laughter, for sadness has a refining influence on us. A wise person thinks a lot about death, while a fool thinks only about having a good time. Ecclesiastes 7:2‭-‬4 NLT

Especially as a young man, that impacted me. Much of life seems to be an effort to avoid suffering -- to the extent that suicide is seen as a viable option. But I look at Joni Eareckson Tada, and the impact her life has had on so many people, in spite of her terrible suffering.

But the jewel on top is the final chapter. It's a direct rebuttal to nihilism and absurdism. There is a meaning and purpose in life to be found in your creator. This feeling of meaninglessness was hole that only Jesus could fill. Once he was there, I found the meaningless imbued with meaning and purpose.

This is my Twitter handle as well, feel free to reach out if you'd like to chat!

Completely agree. I'd like to also recommend another book in the spirit of Ecclesiastes: Tolstoy's Confession. A Confession was published shortly after Anna Karenina and at a time when Tolstoy (in his fifties) was widely considered to be one of the world's preeminent writers. He had vast wealth, fame, and a large family. Nevertheless, he was so overwhelmed by the vanity of existence that he was convinced suicide was the bravest, most reasonable course of action.

Apart from pure cowardice, he writes that what stopped him from taking his life was a vague intuition that his own logical reasoning about life's purpose was sound but somehow incomplete. His eventual insight is as follows: life is not meaningless because logically it must be so. Logic cannot 'negate' life because it is itself a byproduct of life. If one reduces life to a form conducive to logic, one reduces it to a cold, dead simulacra that may indeed not be worth living. Instead, Tolstoy argues, the life that is worth living, and the one that so many of the peasants around him lived, was one guided by (potentially unconscious) faith. He concludes that this faith in the transcendent must be the source of life ("God is life") and that life is a logically impossibility save for this faith.

His post-Confession writings are all dedicated to his interpretation of the Christian scriptures. I'll also note that his advocacy and envagelism of Christian pacifism was a direct influence on Gandhi and MLK Jr.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Confession [2] http://www.arvindguptatoys.com/arvindgupta/confessions-tolst...

I'm turning 35 at the end of this year and reading through your post I feel like you need human connection. You're really not in a bad spot, though. A lot of people would kill to have the amount of savings you have, at that age.

I haven't achieved much professionally. I have about 500k in savings as well and have just worked corporate jobs. However, I met my wife when I was 23, we got married when I was 30, and I have two young children. To me, it makes it all worth it. And, it's not too late at 35. There are so many people that have put off personal life at the gain of their professional life, that you're bound to find someone in a very similar situation.

That said, you might need to be less picky at this point and realize that you're looking for someone for life. Keep that in mind as you start dating.

> Now I feel too old to go to festivals, bars and clubs and make new friends that way.

I couldn't imagine doing this. It sounds absolutely terrible. I don't try to make friends anymore because I have enough going on just having a family. I also have zero desire to ever enter a club. Bar? Sure, I'll go with my wife sometimes and it's fun, as long as it's quiet. Staying out until 4am partying? That part of my life is in the past and I'm grateful for it. I look back at it and feel like I was probably searching for purpose and drowning it out with alcohol and drugs when I couldn't find it.

> I have held jobs in small and big companies for mostly for 1-2 years each, traveled and lived in different countries, had 2 failed startups, and have about $500k in savings

Just think about this for a sec. You've got a good career, travelled and have $500k US in savings. You're in the top 5% in the US and definitely top 1% worldwide. I think your problem is your expectations... Worry less about 'success' and live your life.

I am 43 and share a lot of your struggles. I find that avoiding alcohol and drugs improves my outlook a lot, but it takes a while, same for getting physically fit. Then the trick is finding some fulfilling thing to do, finish a triathlon, write a book, travel, join local government, teach, make a game or side project. Some creative goal to work towards.

Good luck

I'm just going to comment in this aspect:

Now I feel too old to go to festivals, bars and clubs and make new friends that way.

Don't know where you live, but in NYC and certain other cities the the bars and clubs (depending which ones you go to) are packed with geezers. Really, it seems like like you've bought into some image of "youth" which holds that only under-30 types get to do "fun" things. But which just isn't ... grounded in reality.

If you genuinely enjoy music and the vibe at these places (again, depends which ones you go to) -- then there is absolutely no age limit, expressed or implied. And anything who thinks there is, is well... square beyond square.

Lock up your savings. Live “lean” for a few years. Read. Keep a garden. Eat healthy, get plenty of physical exercise. Dream of creating a legacy in your life that is not a waste of your humanity.

Love this answer

One thing that’s better than being young is being a parent. Caring for your child as they grow takes the sting off of getting older yourself.

Turning 40 this year.

So you sound a little depressed. Not dating may be a mistake. It may be that your unconscious mind is suggesting you start a family and plays down other activities.

To your last point; You don’t’feel’ that time is running out. Time is running out and you need to be highly aware of that fact.

Wishing you could go back in time and do things differently is everyone’s story

I am in similar position, but 45, negative net worth and alimony. I had two problems: environment (it should motivate better), and health (not 20 anymore, but still have shitty habits).

If you have $500, I would suggest to take 6 months sabbatical and just unplug from tech.

What does it say about society that you can make $500K and feel like you haven't achieved much? A lot of the "work" people do probably isn't very helpful to most people, except maybe some rich person who owns (a part of) the company.

Get married. That will ensure an endless stream of adrenaline

I'll give you a proposal. For $30k, I'll share you real good ideas and optimistic project I've been thinking about for a while. With that amount, I'll be able to quit my job and you can become a partner in building the product. It'll give you a purpose for some time.

This is how great business partnerships are formed.

This is a total long shot, but what you’re describing sounds like gender dyphoria.

I’m not saying you have it. But, you should be on the lookout for fundamental ways that you’re not being true to yourself. You may be living your life to meet the expectations of others instead of optimizing for your own happiness.

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