A First Look at BankSimple | Hacker News Reader

A First Look at BankSimple

banksimple.com

477 pointsahhrrr189 comments

As someone who have worked a lot for banks and actually already done some of this work let me offer a viewpoint.

Last year my company managed to get a large Danish bank to implement tracking into their netbank. This is no small accomplishment, which anyone knowing just a little bit about how the IT departments in the banking industry normally works, the systems they work on are arcane.

It took us 18 months from getting the bank to like the idea into actually getting it launched.

The results have been nothing but extraordinary everyone loves it.

The reason they love it is because it's automatic. They get insights into their economy that they could not previously get. There is something quite amazing about seeing your spendings categorized for the first time without you having to do anything.

The banks have a unique identifier on each transaction that can be measured up against a category list. This is something Mint and Wesabe can't do because you can't export that unique identifer from the banks.

The big advantage of BankSimple and why I think it's going to be huge is because they don't have a legacy system to deal with.

In other words BankSimple can potentially be anything you could ever dream of a bank being, because BankSimple will be able to cross reference the data in order to provide not just cost reduction but service improvement.

The banking industry are just waiting to be disrupted by someone like BS. There are thousands of ways to create a better banking experience. BS is a good first stab at it IMHO.

I've said this here before, but when I worked at a big bank all the visionaries weren't worried about other banks, they were worried about Google and Ebay. The core business of a bank is built on hardware and software. They knew that a bank built on distributed systems instead of mainframes could beat the big banks on features and cost. It'll be interesting to see if BankSimple can scale up fast enough to compete or if it'll attract the attention of someone with even deeper pockets who can catch up by simply outspending them.

There are lots of banks that could easily outspend BankSimple, what they lack is vision, which is far more scarce than money these days.

Banks are in a rough spot, actually. The big ones have a HUGE installed base which makes any changes very, very difficult. My division of the bank had tens of thousands of cobol jobs that ran daily or weekly. (We also had thousands of ETL jobs, web apps, etc. that depended on those cobol jobs.) Trying to shift the core functionality away the mainframe would have been a decade-long boondoggle.

As somebody else mentioned, it's not just about money.

Here in Australia, we have four massive banks. They're some of the most profitable in the world and three of them are currently in the process of major technology renewal programmes.

The problem is that the systems are so complex, inter-linked and old (the last upgrade was apparently in the 80s) that making changes is a nightmare. Indeed, one particular bank, NAB, has had huge problems leaving people unable to access their money for several days, caused by upgrades. Downtime is completely out of the question and making radical changes (could render some obscure system inoperable) is impossible. While there is a lack of vision, I think it goes far deeper than that.

I believe there will be a big shift coming, but not that it will come from established tech companies in the developed world. Rather, I believe it is banks from third world countries that will push the envelope. This for a few reasons:

They already have a large customer base.

Their economies are growing very fast, which creates a steadily increasing pressure on old systems. Also, this creates shifting marketplaces where new players in the area can pop up a lot more easy than in old settled markets.

Less preconceptions on what can or cannot be done.

Considering that BankSimple is "just" a distributed interface to a mainframe system... that's an amusing statement.

One of the reasons I'm so eagerly waiting for SEPA (Single European Payment Area) to really come into force. Now banks compete mostly on country level, but when you can easily switch banks inside EU, there is bound to be some competition and innovation.

In Finland we're kind of suffering from being pioneers. Finnish banks deployed nice (for the time) web banking interfaces more than a decade ago. But then, having made the big investments in them and seeing little competition, innovation stopped.

Nordea rolled out a slightly improved web interface a couple of years ago, and ever since then their login page has had the message "the new banking interface is coming to our business customers soon"...

Even without SEPA in full swing, your banking situation is still miles ahead of anyone in North America. A nice web interface is one thing, a $25 wire transfer or relying on external, often slow payment processors like Paypal or Certapay/e-Transfer quite another.

Banks can give these interfaces easily, like generalized ACH interfaces, like some merchants have already, but then it would expose to the general public how badly secured the entire design of the system is.

Does anybody actually think this way? As in, do people actually go to their bank's website because they'd like to spend money and want to find out how much they have to spend?

Described this way, this just seems like a tool to facilitate a fundamentally unhealthy way to think about your money. If you're thinking in terms of "How much can I spend today", you've already lost. (Unless, of course, you're 23, in which case your entire goal in life should be to sock away enough money that you never need to ask that question again in relation to food/rent/etc.)

I like the transaction searching capabilities shown in the demo, but I was hoping to see more info on how to do actual "banking" tasks. Can I initiate a wire transfer from an internet cafe in Laos? Can people send a check to an address in the US that automatically gets deposited in my account? That sort of thing. When these guys came on the scene, I got the impression that that was the kind of thing they'd be doing better than other banks. Frankly, sorting my past transactions just isn't a problem I desperately need to have solved.

This is the myopia of the affluent. Many people, not just 23 year olds, do live paycheck to paycheck, and need to know on any given day how much they can spend without overdrawing. The answer to this question is hard to find from most banks, who make money from fees and have an interest in their poorer customers overdrawing their accounts by a few bucks so they can charge an overdraft fee. This is a problem that, for instance, Elizabeth Warren has talked about a lot.

Banksimple is trying to build a bank that doesn't suck, and banks suck for a lot of reasons. These features will be helpful to anyone who is living on a low income, either due to misfortune or choice.

That's a reasonable response and I'm very sympathetic to Elizabeth Warren's mission. I hold the greatest innovation the financial industry could come up with, over the long run, is a better educated consumer.

But is this a product that is aimed at low income customers? I struggle to see, from what's presented here, how that particular demographic will benefit from on online bank, iphone mobile banking app, or whatever else BankSimple has to offer.

Has BankSimple cast away deceptive or exploitative fees and the diabolical legalese of the small print? Have consumer advocates endorsed BankSimple as an example of a new more consumer-friendly bank? That would be great, if so, for that strikes me as a core part of Warren's crusade.

I think a bank aimed at providing a good service to consumers, with a great user interface and features that are beneficial to low income customers, has the potential to be truly useful to that demographic.

The two things that could get in the way are marketing and access. I agree that, so far at least, it does appear to be marketing to... well, a hacker news croud. This may change as they open to the general public. Certainly, HNers probably make better beta customers for just about any business. Let's hope they start making themselves known outside the tech field, for their sake and ours.

As far as access, obviously the poorest of the poor probably don't have access to an online bank, and if you make the bank unusable to people without a smart phone, you're limiting it even further. On top of that, it's not clear yet whether they will have stringent credit rating requirements that could shut a lot of people out who need a service like this.

My hope is that BankSimple will keep in mind how important they could be to people who really do need a less malevolent bank. They certainly could end up appealing only to an affluent crowd, but I get the feeling that they have a certain amount of zealous righteousness that could translate good user experience into a truly new type of bank. I do think they are that ambitious, and I think they have the opportunity to fulfill that ambition. But it's still up to them to prove that their heart is in the right place.

> Has BankSimple cast away deceptive or exploitative fees

According everything they yes, they charge any fees or having any penalties for things like overdrafting your account.

To add to your point - This feature is very much required not only for people living paycheck to paycheck but also for people holding multiple accounts. I've had many instances in which my BOFA account was overdrawn simply because I didn't know how much money was there when I swiped the debit card. Banks thrive on these overdraft fees. I even talked to the BOFA branch manager telling them not to honor a transaction if I don't have the required balance and they simply wouldn't agree to that.

They're not building a bank that doesn't suck. They're building a nice web interface.

They don't appear to be addressing any other service-related issues at all. Rather, they're just outsourcing that.

>Can I initiate a wire transfer from an internet cafe in Laos?

This reminds me of the time in 2000, when I left the US for a 6-month backpacking trip in SE Asia. While in Thailand, I "lost" my wallet sleeping in a hammock at this bar...

I had maybe $20 USD in Baht in my wallet - but I had my cards as well.

I got hold of Washington Mutual and after some time got to some executive explaining my issue. My family had been banking with Washington Mutual since ~1940. My home branch, which was the branch I was talking to was the same physical branch my family had been visiting since 1959. They new my family name and I had ~$25K in the account at the time.

They REFUSED to help me in any way shape or form. When I stated that I only had $10 left their exact words were "Well, I suggest you use your $10 for something more productive than calling me"

I emailed every newspaper I could think of - after some time the San Jose Mercury News picked up the story and they went and interviewed the manager who had said that to me on the phone.

I had to get my mother to wire me money and it was a hassle - but it was infuriating that they refused to help me in any way.

I immediately closed my account the day I was back in the states.

(Aside: I left in October of 2000 with a three jobs "waiting" for my return - the market tanked while I was away and I was then out of work for 18 months. We had a BBQ one day and 45 people attended, all tech, of the 45 - 3 had jobs. Fun times.)

There are plenty of explanations that don't involve living paycheck-to-paycheck.

1. You keep money in several accounts (checking, savings, money market, paypal, etc.)

2. You are a contract worker being paid in large installments and you need to know whether your deposit has cleared before paying bills.

3. You have difficulty with fiscal discipline and only leave money for essentials in your account to prevent over-spending.

and so forth.

My general plan is to put everything I'm not going to spend in the current month in my savings and then gradually draw my checking account down to 0. (I have ING Direct and a credit line attached to my checking account in case of overdraft, so overshooting isn't a problem.) I usually keep track of my balance less my bills for the month and divide it by the number of days left in the pay period. Once that balance goes above a certain level I save more. I've been doing this since college, where I would stash away my student loans into savings and transfer monthly installments into my checking.

The video wasn't working for me when I went to the page, but if that's how the feature works, it might be neat to have that kind of thing better automated.

4. You barely make enough to live on and have no choice but to live paycheck to paycheck.

Presumably not true of most people here, and questionably true of the likely customer demographic of BankSimple, but this is the fact of life for many people.

(I'm a co-founder of BankSimple.)

Once you tell our service about your savings goals, we're able to tell you what you can _safely_ spend. That means not dipping into the savings that you should be building, or putting yourself in a situation where you can't pay rent.

We've done a lot of early customer development. Our features and approach are built from feedback from thousands of conversations. So, yes, a bunch of people do want to know how much money they can spend right now, but we want to let them know that in a way that won't harm them financially.

Payments (wire transfers, etc.) are coming soon. If there's a banking feature you think could be done better, we're probably going to try to do it better :)

Could I get an option to opt out of seeing how much money is safe to spend? I'd rather not have a visual indicator that, in my eyes, is encouraging me that I can safely blow money.

This goes without saying that I would've liked to see the video focus on more of the capabilities of Savings Goals. Let's say, for instance, that I don't have any savings goals setup. Does this mean that you're going to tell me all of my money is safe to spend?

I'd really be interested in seeing how much extra $$ I can contribute to savings/401k/ROTH as opposed to how much extra I can spend. I'd like to be able to adjust numbers with sliders to see various outputs. Also, does this take into account having third party accounts? I have a higher yield savings account, so I would likely not use BankSimple unless it was comparable.

Hi ale3x, I think BankSimple is looking awesome.

Have you ever tried the Payday iOS app? It works just the same (without the power of having a live bank behind it with searchable transactions): what you can safely spend (in our case daily), bills & savings (goals). It's a design I've personally wanted for years and ended up creating because no-one else did. If I'd waited 18 months I'd needn't have bothered! :)

You should take a look as it might amuse you.

http://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/payday/id351013628

p.s. will you ever launch in the UK?

> Frankly, sorting my past transactions just isn't a problem I desperately need to have solved.

That's also not a problem you need to be a bank to solve. Mint and others are already doing a lot of innovation by pulling existing transaction data and offering powerful tools/visualizations for it.

Banks are never the best place to get powerful analytics, because they are limited to the accounts you have with that bank. No one wants to be limited to one financial institution, or have to change accounting systems just because you switched banks.

Bank of America seems to have some Mint-like thing that integrates your non-Bank accounts in their web interface. Theoretically it's some piece of packaged software that banks buy.

It's http://www.yodlee.com/

> That's also not a problem you need to be a bank to solve. Mint and others are already doing a lot of innovation by pulling existing transaction data

Allowing 3rd parties access to your transaction history is a good idea?

> I like the transaction searching capabilities shown in the demo, but I was hoping to see more info on how to do actual "banking" tasks. Can I initiate a wire transfer from an internet cafe in Laos? Can people send a check to an address in the US that automatically gets deposited in my account? That sort of thing. When these guys came on the scene, I got the impression that that was the kind of thing they'd be doing better than other banks. Frankly, sorting my past transactions just isn't a problem I desperately need to have solved.

Did you watch the whole thing? They showed sending money through the website. You can deposit checks by mail or with your phone (take a picture).

https://banksimple.com/faq/

I believe that figure of how much you can spend today takes into account savings goals as well as payment commitments.

Also there is no reason you can't look and see you have some money that is available and toss it in a savings account. Basically the user gets to choose where that money goes, but either way they have a better idea of "what's left over."

Indeed, the presentation felt like the demo of a poverty-management tool.

Then again, I don't expect much from a banking website, although I don't get it today: seamless authentication, easy transfers, easy listing and canceling of pending authorizations... I don't think I need more services, I just need the usual ones to be usable. It's unfortunate that the usability concept seems beyond the reach of most bankers.

Here is where I hope/pray/etc BankSimple is going:

I want a personal financial API for myself. If you want to bill me for something, you don't write down a bunch of text on a piece of paper, stick that inside of another piece of paper, and then pay somebody to put it through a slot in my door (along with all of the coupon mailers, prepaid credit card offers, and VOTE FOR ME! envelopes that I get), you call up blhack's financial API and request a payment from it.

When this happens, I get an email, or an SMS, or whatever else telling me:

"USBank has requested a payment of $347 from you. They have requested payment by October 20th, 2011 -- Note: Car Payment"

"City of Tempe has requested a payment of $60 from you. They have requested payment by October 8th, 2011 -- Note: Water Bill"

etc. etc.

I can log into BankSimple and approve these payment requests (just like paypal, except [hopefully] BankSimple makes it affordable for my city, or my auto loan provider to do use).

It's an accountant for me. Except it's in one place, and it doesn't cost anything. There are companies that have tried this, and failed miserably, mostly because they appear to lack the technical expertise that something like BankSimple is bringing to the table.

The banking system, right now, is a disaster. The things I'm describing are all possible right now, but they're an enormous pain in the ass to use.

BankSimple: if you're not doing this, do it.

I've had exactly this idea! It's sort of like a credit card, except a "swipe" just gives the merchant an end-point to send bills to. You still have to authorize each bill, but your bank could automatically pay any bills that you haven't contested by their due date (or whatever policy you prefer).

I am TERRIBLE at paying bills on time, even though I always have the money to pay them. There's way too much diligence required.

I used to be terrible with these, until I sent up a lot of automatic payments. For the most part this is just logging into the various provider's websites and setting it up. The one I can't do this for is rent, so my bank has a bill-pay function that just sends our landlord a check for the rent every month. It has been very convenient and when he comes by and claims we didn't pay we can point out it was already mailed and he's the one who lost it (he is very disorganized).

Not all bills are periodic. For example, I've paid a lot of late parking ticket fees.

I have missed paying a few parking tickets myself. I guess I don't think of non-recurring payments as bills. That is probably just due to the way the term is used in popular culture.

Hear hear! If they did then in real time, I'd login that day - but their little day delay kills my memory - I almost wonder if it's on purpose...

Isn't that BPAY?

http://www.bpay.com.au/tabid/62/Default.aspx

It doesn't have the swipe features, but I think the rest is there.

Does that require changing the mailing address to BPAY?

(I'm a co-founder of BankSimple.)

So, what you're talking about to the best of my understanding is the kind of billing systems that are popular outside of America but pretty underused here. Our CEO and CFO are both from outside the US, and our CEO in particular really prefers to pay his bills that way.

It's definitely something we'll get to, but it's also not something that will be totally unique to us; like you said, it's possible today, just clunky. This technology is called "electronic bill presentment", if you're curious.

Thanks for your thoughts!

(Oh: an actual API is in the works, too.)

Here in Norway, anyone asking for a recurring payment will offer either invoice by e-mail or a more automated eFaktura (electronic invoice).

After the first payment to a party offering eFaktura, you'll get the option in your online bank service to start an eFaktura agreement with this company. Once you've done that, the invoices will be sent and paid for automatically (or when you choose).

This system was created by a company jointly owned by all the banks in Norway and is thus supported by all of them.

We have the same thing in Sweden, in addition to direct debit and being able to pay for things (while shopping online) instantly via your online banking instead of using your credit card. It all uses industry standards so that any bank or merchant can hook into it.

The banks here also back an online ID system which has the same legal status as a signature, meaning you can sign up for various banking/insurance etc things online. The same ID system is also used to file taxes online.

Whenever I read about banking in the U.S., it strikes me how incredibly outdated it is. Outside of the U.S. I don't think I've ever seen a paper cheque.

I more or less get this functionality using Canada Post's ePost integration with my bank's web site, though the implementation could be a lot smoother.

I don't get a paper tax bill from the City, I get a notification by email and when I log in and view the message there is a 'Pay bill' link right next to it. Would be nice if it defaulted to as late as possible.

I don't know what it takes to sign up as a provider, but relatively few of the companies I regularly pay bills to (and don't use a pre-authorized payment) offer this solution.

The problem would be getting all the people who want your money to use this specific new "API" thing. In a banking system where even wire transfers are considered fancy high tech, I wouldn't hold my breath.

A potential profit point would be providing the legacy compatibility, any necessary personnel, etc., for so cities and other slow movers can still use the old system to set up automatic withdrawals, but implementing a client-side control over each of these hooks into your accounts. BankSimple could charge $5/mo to allow you to use the personnel that will configure this manually while people hooked into the API will be able to register hooks for free.

This could be done now by any major bank, but it isn't done because banks want you to unexpectedly lose money in hopes that you will overdraft. There are many, many problems in banking like this; not much technical overhead to solve, but the banks don't want to solve it because it stands to affect their predatory profits.

Here's a situation where I would like to see congress pass a law requiring something like this (not that they specifically have to use BankSimple, but that they have to use something like it).

There are laws involving the mail that need to be updated. Mail is [should be] a dead technology.

Sounds like you need Direct Debits: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_debit

Manilla does a good job of this - saved my ADHD ass a few times!

US consumer banking is archaic and can't be fixed with just another bank. The whole process is broken and it requires an industry change.

I applaud BankSimple for what they are doing but in the big picture it doesn't solve the major problems.

My biggest gripes with the banks:

- Can't wire money to someone else without going into the bank and paying ridiculous fees (Last time I checked, $25 for domestic, $45 for international). INGDirect attempts to make this better but the receiver still needs to have an email address and go through a procedure to receive the money. It's also slow, average is 2-3 days.

- It's easier and cheaper for me to use checks. It costs me nothing to deposit it but I have to pay a fee to receive a wire transfer. Wires have a lot fever errors than checks and a wire of over $5k doesn't have to be put on hold because the bank has to verify a check. The banks punish you for using wires instead of checks.

- When you go online and use bill pay the bank will pay a 3rd party to print and mail a check!! How is this electronic payment. (This does not apply to large firms like the phone company which will receive the payment electronically but small business can't utilize this!)

- Why no IBAN? Swift requires intermediary banks which charge a fee on your international wire.

- No chips on debpit/credit cards. In Europe most banks issue cards with chips on them. This would eliminate the risk of getting skimmed if only the US would also start using chips instead of the magnetic stripe.

I just don't understand why the banks do this. Someone enlighten me.

(I'm a co-founder of BankSimple.)

A lot of the banks mark up their wire transfer fees. We won't. Domestic US transfers with us (ACH) will be free. International transfers (SWIFT) cost us ~$15, and we'll pass that on to our customers with no mark-up.

We're trying to make electronic payments easier than checks with some UI innovations that today's demo didn't fully address. We want people to move money electronically, not with paper checks.

Bill pay in the US is a mess. We're going to try to have a great bill presentment system to help address this.

A lot of the banking world in the US is baffling to us, too. that's why we're doing what we're doing. We won't be able to fix everything overnight, and there's lots that's out of our control at the moment. But over time, we'll chip away at the problems and try to make banking better.

Thanks for the reply, I hope you guys can fix some of these ridiculous processes.

A huge issue for US citizens living abroad is that most US banks require a US home address (might be a patriot act thing).

Since all US citizens are required to file and pay taxes even if they don't live or make money in the US (only country in the world that still does this) sending a check to the IRS is not that simple without a US bank account.

Will you require US residency or will a US passport suffice?

One reason BankSimple will win is (hopefully) because you will not pay too much attention to articles like this: http://www.americanbanker.com/issues/176_184/google-wallet-m...

Certainly, there are many ready for this world you speak of and we wish you great success!

A major bank issuing magnetic stripe only cards would be out of business in less than a month in Brazil.

Heck, not even the ATM machines are safe and get blown up quite regularly, even with the systems in place that stain the bills.

Perhaps the fix would be to import a few... "bad guys"?

> When you go online and use bill pay the bank will pay a 3rd party to print and mail a check!! How is this electronic payment.

Is this true? That boggles my mind.

It depends on the payee. Many payees do support electronic payment; banks will print a check for those that don't. Encouraging people to use bill pay for everything allows them to collect fees from the payee for those who collect electronically, and/or save their own processing costs. If they didn't support _all_ payees, however, people would be more reluctant to use the bill pay system. So it's a marketing decision, to support payees that aren't capable of receiving electronic payments yet.

The whole issue is that payees have to pay to receive electronic payment but can receive check payments for free. That makes no sense to me. It should be the other way around. Even if a small business wanted to receive payments electronically the fees are too high for small volumes.

It might make sense in some cases; it takes less labor to accept electronic payments than paper-check payments. If the fees cost less than paper-check processing labor, it makes sense to pay the fees. I agree that it might not make sense for smaller businesses though - but that's why there's the check fallback.

I have USAA, and yes, this is exactly what they do (for some payees; others are actually electronic). My bank statement treats it as a check, and they have scans of the checks written this way. It's a bit of a surprise, because I'm writing checks that are numbered 200 or so, and the bank's Bill Pay uses checks numbered 900000 and up.

I don't care (much), because the bill is still paid, right? (Granted, it takes longer when they mail the check than when they do the electronic thing.)

Yes it is. AFAIK Wells Fargo/Wachovia still does it.

Agreed. It's frustrating that I can pay money to larger companies online (phone, cable, internet, etc.) but I can't send money to another person. Clearly it's technically possible, but the banks don't want to enable this for normal people, so North American's are stuck mailing IOUs (cheques) around.

In the video, he paid money to another guy (also at BankSimple). Wonder how fast that goes through.

Some questions I never bothered to actually ask of my current banking system probably because I've known people that had accounts with them and have seen several branch locations but I'd like to ask of BankSimple.

BankSimple is a bank account yes or no? I mean a real certified banking system? Are they required to meet governmental guidelines of official banks?

What guarantee (if any) do I have that my money will be there in the morning? Is there some guarantee that if I go to login to bankSimple tomorrow morning and the domain doesn't resolve emails get bounced etc, would there be any recourse for me? [again, never bothered to ask that of my real bank but I suppose a brick and mortar institution instills more confidence]

Visa, MasterCard, Amex... Is the bankSimple card backed by any of these institutions? Can I walk into to some random QuickStop gas station and pay using your card like I could with my current bank card?

What kind of development and testing infrastructure do you guys utilize? Are you able to roll out updates to limited groups of real users so you can test changes on a small scale before rolling them out to every one? I'm more curious as to this aspect because I attribute to BankSimple more of a website or new software company [which I envision bugs and glitches that get worked out with feedback] rather than a traditional bank [which surprisingly even though I know is capable of making mistakes, I don't really worry about bugs]

Will BankSimple eventually if not at launch do other bank-y things like consumer loans, offer savings bonds, etc?

What about fraud protection? What if some one steals my card and buys a bunch of stuff with it? [Ok, I've asked my bank about this one at least]

They answer a few of these questions on their FAQ: https://banksimple.com/faq/

* They are not a bank. They are essentially a web frontend for wholesale banks. Thus they are regulated differently.

* You do have the benefit of FDIC insurance, but it's unclear what ability you have to access your funds directly from the wholesale bank, or whether you are limited to BankSimple.

That's correct. We're also using Visa for processing.

You can read more about our partners here: http://banksimple.com/blog/BankSimple/partners-funding/

How is BankSimple different from mint.com searching through my Bank of America account statements? Alerts? Goals? I can do all that in mint.

If they do get categorization significantly better, I'd jump - I have to change something like 1/4 of my transactions in Mint, and the partial data I see is rarely descriptive enough to help much (not sure why it's partial - legislation? decision? I hate it either way). I can't make categorization rules specific or broad enough, and always always need to double-check everything. I like it, but it's a PITA.

We're a substitute for your bank, i.e. you'd use a BankSimple debit card, use our website or mobile app for payments and deposits, speak with our customer service representatives and so on.

My question is what does that buy me? Switching from an established bank to a mint.com like interface + an unknown bank that holds my deposits. There's no killer app to sign up for your service. Killer apps that I could think off are, (Holding deposits in multiple currencies, Savings account like interest on my checking. Right now the funds I park in checking for immediate expenses don't accrue interests till I move it to savings, Free payment gateway integration, so I could transact with anyone having a credit card like paypal, Free money transfers to any third-party bank in any currency in any country(you could kill western union with this)). Saying that I could grep through my statement more efficiently and visualize the data doesn't cut it as a market disruption.

I think the killer app is that this is a bank that actually cares about their customer's experience (because they know it's one of their big competitive advantages), and is coming at it from the standpoint of techies who understand what should be possible. In itself, that's not a checkbox on a feature list that you can line up against the other banks, but it should show itself in myriad ways as they rederive what a bank is from first principles. They're obviously not done. If they keep pushing, that's exciting.

Also, since they're likely to be run much more cost efficiently than most banks, they should be able to do a lot of things without the normal gotcha fees.

I get all that from First Republic now. Great web tools, no-fee access to any ATM, and fantastic phone support.

I'm not just looking for a bank that does the standard stuff somewhat better, or is nicer to me. There is a lot more that could be done. Wealth management related startups like Mint have scratched that surface, but with an end to end implementation of a bank and all the tools and data that brings, a lot more becomes possible.

Also, First Republic's site looks like something made with a table layout in the 90s and left alone since, so I doubt that they're doing anything innovative on the consumer facing side that requires any amount of tech expertise.

Admittedly my finances are pretty simple, but my bank is something I really don't want to think about much or spend a lot of time dealing with. Maybe if someday I have a lot of wealth to manage I'll feel differently. The most important thing is that I can always get somebody on the phone right away that is informed and helpful.

First Republic's web tools aren't going to win any design awards but they do the job and have never given me any trouble.

That's what I am wondering... I was under the impression that it was a new type of bank, not budget software. I'm a little concerned for my very similar named product BudgetSimple (http://www.BudgetSimple.com) which has been out for years both because of the similar name, and now seemingly similar space...

I don't get it. I don't get the point of it. Searching through a list of things? How is that making my banking simpler?

It seems to have turned into a credit card statement search & visualisation engine.

After watching the video, it reminds me of the iPad. Doesn't do anything you couldn't do before, but it does it faster and in a more attractive and pleasing way. These improvements are so great that it becomes a qualitatively different experience. This looks about as much nicer than Mint as Mint does than my bank website, and that counts for a lot to me. I'm eagerly awaiting a chance to try them out for myself.

Let's compare it to the iPod, for example. Before the iPod, I played music. After the iPod, I played music - but in a more convenient way.

After this app, I can search my statements in a convenient way. The problem is that right now I am not searching my statements at all. They seem to be solving a problem that I have not had so far.

I liken it more to a smartphone: before I had high-quality internet access in my pocket, I didn't care about it. It wasn't a problem I was looking to solve or a want I had.

Now that I can search Wikipedia or Google at a moment's whim, I find myself confused when I don't have it.

BankSimple may turn out like this: hardly anyone does this kind of searching and organizing of their bank statements because it simply hasn't been easy enough for anyone to care. Once it is, you might not want to go back.

You are missing the very important difference. Bank Simple can automatically track and categorize how you use your money and thus visualize it for you.

You didn't used to do this because it was not possible. The same thing with expense tracking. Believe me. It's a very powerful feature. I know I have created it for one bank already and seen how the customer satisfaction exploded.

Not everything is a better solution to something that existed before. Sometimes innovation is going to allow you to do things you could never really do before.

I almost totally agree: I think the secret to the iPad's success was it's simplicity rather than being more attractive and pleasing.

I am constantly frustrated when I try to find transactions more than 3 months old in both my bank accounts. The main reason I keep my Mint account is to be able to search my old transactions.

Why do you need to constantly search your old transactions?

That seems like a fair description to me, but that's exactly what my bank sucks at.

Yeah, that's why we showed what we did. While we also have the banking features you'd expect, e.g. payments and such, we were presenting in front of an industry crowd who are most likely already familiar with said core features but not search or visualization.

Very nice UI... any chance we'll see (i) a remote deposit mobile app without deposit limits and (ii) integration with Google Wallet?

I don't think a bank should ever have a mobile app instead of a nicely done web interface. Would you really want to use a bank that only works on iPhone?

There have been countless situations where I've had to make transactions in an internet cafe or using a friend's computer.

Sounds like you've never experienced the joys of depositing checks by taking pictures of them on your phone. I do this now with my current bank and it's awesome. (And I don't think anyone is suggesting that the website is replaced with an app, but rather that the app would supplement the website).

Sounds like you've never experienced the joys of free, instant wire transfers. Taking pictures of cheques? Are you going to telegraph them after?

Free wire transfers are great, but what does that do for you when you have a check in your hand? How about both?

Why would you have a cheque in your hand if you and everyone else have the option of using wires?

A) not everyone does yet B) with a check you don't have to get any information from who you're paying other than the name.

You know, the only times in my life I've even seen a check have been when dealing with some US company (which is rarely). I have to admit being greatly amused with the combination of really old and really new that you have in using mobile apps to handle checks.

A Brit here, who has recently established a (B2B) company in the US. The check thing really surprised me too. The USA still loves checks: we receive them for most of the work we do, and make a lot of our payments that way.

From a personal perspective, I rarely use checks, except (and this blew my mind) I can set up a regular payment through my bank's website to a recipient. If the recipient's bank is on a similar system, the transactions are made digitally. If not, then they automatically mail a check each month. Transparent to me, but seriously.

I'm sure I'm going to feel really dumb after getting the answer to this, but what prevents someone from sending a picture of the same check to deposit in multiple banks through their respective phone apps?

The biggest deterrent is probably the criminal check fraud charge you would face. Most banks also have additional counter-measures in place to detect this type of fraud too, but you are right, it is a concern: http://www.americanbanker.com/btn/22_3/-374033-1.html

Probably the same thing that prevents you from making up fake checks:

1) It will eventually get reconciled through the clearinghouse and the extra funds reverted.

2) The lawman will come for you.

If you don't mind me asking, what is your bank? Is their non-mobile website decent?

I use USAA which has a web interface, a mobile web interface, an iPhone app and an Android app.

It's fantastic to be able to deposit checks by taking a picture of both sides instead of driving someplace, or throwing something in the mail.

Assuming you aren't just spamming on behalf of USAA, or even if you are: can any USAA customer deposit checks by taking a picture of both sides? I thought that was only if you had some sort of connection to the US military, no?

Yes, you can deposit checks by taking pictures. (I'm not the throwaway account above, but I do have a USAA account through my father-in-law, who's retired Navy. And yes, you need a US military connection to get an account there.)

Personally, I deposit checks via my scanner, but that's just because I don't have a smartphone. But I don't vastly care, because I deposit a check about... once every three months?

(The flip side of USAA is that they have no branches, if you ever need to talk to a human in person. Phone support, yes, in spades; branches, no.)

I have no military connection, but I have a USAA account. My understanding is that the check-deposit-via-photo feature is only available to customers with US military connections, but I'm looking for confirmation of that. (The USAA website is vague about the details.)

I use Alliant Credit Union, and they allow deposit of scanned checks online. I have used my phone to take the pictures before, and they were accepted.

If you're going to spam the thread with USAA recommendations you could at least avoid using a throwaway account and do it openly so that we can see your motivations.

We're currently working on remote capture, more details are forthcoming.

Did you see the part about how goals work and safe-to-spend? That was pretty slick.

(I'm a co-founder of BankSimple.)

Our easily-searchable transaction list is just one feature. That feature alone wouldn't make it work switching. What we're doing is holistic: it's about taking every part of the banking experience, from technology to customer service, and making it better.

What we demoed today was just the beginning. And some of what we're doing doesn't really demo well; it's intangible.

"No wireless. Less space than a nomad. Lame."

I agree. All banks will work like this within 10 years.

FWIW, Banks in for example the UK, already do.

It constantly surprises just how far behind the US is in several areas.

No they don't. I'm in the UK and I know of no bank that offers these services. Did you actually watch the video?

Which bank allows you to:

* Hide money from your main balance for bills and savings

* Create automatic savings accounts on-the-fly for individual items

* plot where each of your transactions occurred on a map

etc

I'm with Lloyds who have one of the best online banking experiences and it's in the stone age compared to this.

That would be a cool feature, throwaway savings accounts where you can say: put 2€ in this account every day until it has enough balance to buy an iPad

Even better: ...and then buy it

You don't get it. You probably track your budget to the cent in Excel. This service is not for you.

I agree. Current banks and banking systems work well for people who are good with money. This type of system that helps you put money aside for bills and makes saving up for something really simple is fantastic for people who aren't good with money.

It's Money Management for Mere Mortals™…

For tracking money in Excel or whatever, a read-only API would also be nice

I agree, we're working on it (I'm also committed to writing an R wrapper in my free time).

I haven't followed news about BankSimple, and the firs few minutes of the demo I watched didn't help me understand what it is. Is BankSimple an actual bank (with ATM card, routing numbers, etc.)? Or is it a PayPal competitor? Or is it just a front end that interacts with Banks? Going to BankSimple.com, it seems like it's trying to be an actual bank. But the demo on the website made it seem more like a Mint competitor. So, BankSimple is just another bank but with a potentially super-awesome website? So far, I'm not convinced.

Yes, it is an actual bank. With an ATM card (and no fees). You are right the demo on the website didn't hint to that too much, but perusing through the site it becomes a bit clearer.

I also emailed support a while back wondering if it acts as a layer on top of my existing bank, or whether its a replacement: their answer was "its a complete replacement".

From the customer perspective, they're a bank with an improved website and mobile app. They're actually just a front end to their partnering banks (but you don't need to know that as a customer). Essentially they're a bank with the improved interface you might expect from Mint (minus the aggregation).

BankSimple itself does not have a bank charter and is providing its services through bank partners.

http://banksimple.com/blog/BankSimple/partners-funding/

It's like a bank & mint rolled in to one delicious package.

Seems like Wesabe hooked up to the bank network.

Search and categorized transactions are cool, but does the categorization require manual tagging? I'm pressed for time in my day, and I am not going to spend more than 5 minutes to look at my bank statements, unless I'm specifically sitting down to budget. My biggest concern with a service like this is the time it's asking from you. So many services designed to "make my life simpler" actually require spending more time than just not using the service at all. For that reason, your mobile app needs to be killer.

In addition to identifying (i.e. cleaning), we're automatically categorizing transactions.

I came to say the same thing - Wesabe had a similar concept of "safe to spend" and for me it made it a great app. I was disappointed to see them go under. Bank Simple doesn't appear to bring a whole lot new to the table.

> Bank Simple doesn't appear to bring a whole lot new to the table.

BankSimple, unlike Mint/Wesabe, is an actual bank* (*ok not techincally for regulatory reasons, but you will store money with them). You will keep/deposit your money there, and be able to spend it via BankSimple-branded debit cards. Its a whole additional level of integration over Mint/Wesabe, which are just web frontends to existing bank accounts

And this is actually very important to realize before you will begin to understand the completely different paradigm this allow for. It's a very big thing that it's not "just" a frontend. It means access to completely different kinds of data.

I think you are wrong - From their own FAQ: So, what’s the deal...are you a bank? No, but we replace your current banking relationship. That is, BankSimple provides a modern online banking experience, top-notch customer service, and beautiful mobile apps. Our partner banks hold our customers’ funds in FDIC-insured products and ensure regulatory compliance. BankSimple’s partner banks aren’t large banks, and have been chosen for the safety of their balance sheets and technological capabilities.

https://banksimple.com/faq/#whatthedealis

If they're a bank, it's definitely possible to use machine learning to categorize the vast majority of your transactions.

It's a beautifully clean design. I like the simplicity of it.

What I worry about is the security behind the scenes and the sharing of sensitive information between BankSimple and the banks.

And trademarking "Safe-To-Spend"? Come on... It's a math equation that shows how much running profit you have. You don't need to trademark such a thing unless you intend to use it in advertising or throughout the website, yet I only see it used in one place. Next thing you know it'll be patented.

Maybe I missed it in the video, but what I would like to see from any of these types of websites is a consolidated view of multiple accounts and banks. So if I have chequing and savings accounts at 3 different banks, I would like a dashboard of my entire spending and saving. It's easy to lose sight of this when you look at individual bank statements.

> And trademarking "Safe-To-Spend"? Come on... It's a math equation that shows how much running profit you have. You don't need to trademark such a thing unless you intend to use it in advertising or throughout the website, yet I only see it used in one place. Next thing you know it'll be patented.

That's rather extreme. For one thing, they're not advertising and they haven't launched their website yet. It's also not a math equation: it's a name which is what trademarks are for.

What's extreme? I expressed an opinion about a selling tactic used on a website.

I realize that one trademarks a name, which is why later in the sentence I used the word "patent" for the process (of the math equation).

Everything in that video was an advertisement. That was the point of it, and good on them for doing so. The simplicity of the design, words used, and the trademarks and imagery of the product. The whole point of the video in the link is to drum up hype and future business.

What I disagreed with was their use of Safe-To-Spend without further explanation on why it was being trademarked. Otherwise it's just a waste of money. They could have called the result anything and leave the silly trademarks for later, unless they specifically had something to sell the consumer on with that name.

Safe-to-spend isn't about the math, it's about the psychology. When you see $100 as your "balance", you're much more likely to spend a little more than when you only see $60. What's unique about it is that they show it in place of your actual balance, which really hasn't been done by another bank before.

Also a trademark will protect the name, not the underlying technology. Other banks can still use this technique. They just need a different name for it.

In this economy and with global debt crises, they'd do better to show the user how much money was saved.

I've never seen a bank or financial institution advertise spending money in such a blatant way. Instead, banks typically nudge their customers into purchasing products or services for their benefits, but they never mention the word "spend" because it denotes exhausting one's supply.

We're not doing the consolidation/aggregation thing. Mint does, of course. But we can't do a lot of what we want to do with the sort of low-fidelity, read-only data access that a service like Mint has.

We're subject to the same security requirements that the rest of the financial industry is. We try to go above and beyond them. Nobody's security will ever be perfect, but we push our bank partners to be as secure as possible. We take security very, very seriously.

trademark != patent

mint.com does a pretty good job of tracking your overall spending and saving for multiple accounts.

Trademarks are super cheap. Why not? It is a unique label they wouldn't want copied.

I love it. It works just like my brain does.

Sadly (for me) it also works just like my iPhone App "Payday" does (without the live bank ability) that was released last year and then sank without a trace (albeit partly due to a silly bug).

Being able to earmark money for bills in advance and set yourself saving goals is really cool (and was also the core feature of Payday).

If anyone would like to try these features before the release of Bank Simple you can find it here:

http://toccame.com/

and here

http://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/payday/id351013628

Just beware of a small bug that makes the calculations go off if you choose the last day of the month as Payday. (Yeah. I know. Sadly the talented programmer I worked with has had to move onto other projects. Maybe one day we can fix it. sigh)

Safe-to-spend balance is great but will it be enforced? I currently calculate my safe to spend balance but nothing stops me from over spending. I don't have the willpower. It would be great if the bank simple card will only let me spend my safe-to-spend balance. So if my safe-to-spend balance is $20 and I go to an ATM and try to withdraw $50, it will decline.

That's exactly what we're doing. If you tell us about your savings goals, you can then "lock" the goals that you really don't want to dip into if you're overspending. We'll prevent transactions from going through, in that case. We keep you honest :)

Your presentation mentioned that goals may be allocated to CD ladders and the like - if so, what happens if you 'dip into' this? Wouldn't you be hit with an unexpected CD early withdrawal fee then?

This sounds like an interesting concept but could be quite dangerous in emergencies or other situations.

But if you don't have the money, you don't have the money. I guess you could still carry an "emergency" credit card; maybe one with a high interest rate to deter you from using it unless its really an emergency.

Safe-to-spend is about your current obligations, and other stuff that would reduce your "really available" balance; there's more money physically in the account, in a true emergency you'll rob from tomorrow to pay today's emergency room visit.

Of course, now you need a way to pay for tomorrow, but there's still options: skip a bill or two this month, borrow money (from friends, credit card, payday loan, sell your internal organs), work overtime, or whatever.

I am excited by the 'how much can I spend' feature and NLP search. And this is the first bank that I would consider moving to. However, my current bank, rather a credit union is absolutely phenomenal in terms of online banking. I have had quite a few different banks accounts in my young life and am very impressed by the level of innovation from a relatively small institution.

My credit union is UW Credit Union. They have recently launched an updated version of their site as well as previously included Mint like features. It is great. I feel as though that as soon as UW Credit Union gets wind of BS, if they haven't already, will incorporate some of what BS is doing.

Banking is definitely an industry ready to be disrupted.

So I'm getting more interested in banking and accounting, largely because a friend and I are starting a business for the first time. When I saw "Accounting for Computer Scientists" on HN (http://martin.kleppmann.com/2011/03/07/accounting-for-comput...) it was a revelation to me, because I didn't realize that accounting could be so cleanly modeled as a graph structure.

Ever since then I've been itching to create some git-like software for accounting, where you have a repository of accounts and transactions. I feel like there is so much unexplored territory here in terms of analysis and visualization. For example, I want a way of saying "this insurance bill is for six months of coverage" and then seeing my bi-weekly breakdown of expenses include two weeks worth of that insurance bill. I want to be able to tag expenses as non-discretionary (taxes), periodic (mortgage), or discretionary (latte) as an easy way of understanding my overall cash flow. I want to be able to amortize my vacations over the whole year. etc.

I want to be able to view what my hypothetical cash flow would be if I cut out certain periodic expenses or added others.

A lot of this is probably more complicated than what most people would want to do -- that's why I think the important part is having a standard repository model that's easily programmable.

You might find this interesting: https://github.com/jwiegley/ledger

This is something that people would want. But I have a question about business model choice here, because I'm curious why they chose to become a front-end to various banks in this way.

Why choose to be a middle-man here (with all of the pain/cost of providing customer service, etc.) when they could be an enterprise software vendor or a SaaS provider? Banks don't actually make that much off of depositors, right? I'm not saying they made a bad choice; I wanted to see if anyone could rationalize it for me.

Surely banks (especially smaller regional banks and credit unions) would pay good prices to have this software power their banking websites so that they could care for their customers in a more sophisticated way. Right now my credit union, in the Bay Area, has a functional but very ugly e-banking and bill-pay platform which has clearly been purchased from a third party vendor and customized (checkfree, I think (http://www.checkfreecorp.com/cda/corp/L5.jsp?layoutId=51501&...).

I guess I don't understand where significant revenues will come from in a model like this.

The user experience, from the website, mobile to device to phone calls, will be a big part of people signing up. There are a lot of people out there who are unhappy with their banks. If they get enough users to sign up with them, the actual banks on the back end (which will probably be a collection of smaller, unknown, entitities), wield less and less power, cause in theory BS would be able to switch over from one bank to another and the user wouldn't know, or care. This may allow them to force certain banks to provide revenue sharing.

I'm pretty sure that it would be quite difficult to build a nice common system that can integrate with the backends of many banks.

One of the reasons I ditched Mint was because it was 2-3 days laggy due to having to scrape and process the data from my bank. I have yet to find anything that beats simply recording all my expenditures in a spiral notebook and reconciling it with my bank's online account once a day. That, plus "When I get paid, I pay my bills first". How simpler could it be? (Frost Bank in Texas, here)

BankSimple is a bank, so there's no delay (beyond however long it takes your actual bank to get the data).

Nice looking site! Why did you not use any green in the UI? For example the direct deposit of $100 is black and doesn't stand out too much, whereas if it was a nice green I immediately can make a correlation. For the users emotion's, seeing a sea of green transactions could evoke more happiness compared to black. A green background on the "Safe-To-Spend" section seems more intuitive than a red one, perhaps it can turn red as it gets close to a 'danger zone' of spending (Calculated based on their spending habits/frequency).

Lastly, everyone keeps mentioning that categorization is very important, yet categorization isn't that noticeable. I did not notice it until you demoed it. I might have found it on my own fairly easily if I wasn't being demo'd though, so its somewhat unfair to say. Rather than having users create very common categories (food, rent, transportation) make those default and more visible whether it be adding inset icons, or changing position/color of that section.

Great job! :)

I had thought that BankSimple was slimming down the traditional banking model and passing the savings (in the form of interest) to customers. I still love that they're tackling Goliaths but they need to be a little clearer on their vision and value proposition.

slimming down the traditional banking model and passing the savings (in the form of interest) to customers

That's ING Direct's business model. It was hard to beat until the recession started and interest rates crashed, but even now it's pretty great.

Very interesting. I like the concept of having only one account. The goals tab looks very useful.

The video states that the "safe to spend" feature calculates recurring bills and such. Is there a way to view and manage these?

IMO

Banks should be good at doing one thing. Holding my liquid assets. However, history has proven to us that even that is a challenge for banks. Where banks thrive in size, most banks lack in vision. I believe that banks are not software companies, at least not in spirit. Some banks are better at utilizing technology and others are not.

My challenge to BankSimple: prove me wrong.

We have to remember what a bank traditionally is, break that down, and build it from the ground up without the walls that immobilizes it today.

Love the design! While I think there is quite a ways to go, I will most certainly give BankSimple a shot when it is publicly released.

Upon seeing the video though, specifically when he was searching through for the bar that he went to, I started wondering how long it'll take before we can actually see precisely what we paid for at said location rather than having to dig through receipts.

I have no idea when that time will come, but when it does, I'll welcome it with open arms.

I imagine this is a US only Bank?

The guy in the video sounds Australian, but for some odd reason he says 'math' instead of 'maths'. So you're probably right... boo. Looking forward to the day when people don't stay in one place and startups begin catering to us itinerants.

Unfortunately, banking is a heavily regulated industry and the laws vary (in real and significant ways) from one country to the next. Big, multinational banks do it by opening different banks in each country, each operating according to the idiosyncratic laws of that country but all owned by a parent company that moves capital around as needed. Building a single thing for handling money that works across national boundaries without breaking laws is incredibly difficult.

Not some odd reason - he's an ex-pat in the finance industry. It's like how I had modified my pronunciation of 'cache' (although I refuse to change how I say 'data').

BankSimple are based in Portland, Oregon (so yes, US).

It's also interesting to note that in the U.S., companies are thought of as a standalone entity, and referred to in the singular, rather as a group of people.

So, it'd be "BankSimple is based in...", instead of "BankSimple are based in...".

When I first started reading things from the UK, I initially thought the writers simply used poor grammar :)

I found that jarring too. If I brought that seppo bullshit home the cheese n kisses'd be dark as a dingo's kidneys.

I'm quite happy with my bank's customer service, interest rates and fees. And I use Mint.com to get a view of all accounts including retirement, investments, etc.

So, from my view, BankSimple just does not provide enough value. Hopefully for BankSimple's sake, others are not satisfied like I am.

Now that I'm getting a better feel of what BankSimple is about, I don't think it's that revolutionary an idea. I'm not even sure I will use it. Most of what they showed, and more can be accomplished using Mint. And, Mint offers more choice by being an aggregator.

And Mint lets you pick a bank like USAA, that has great service as a core competency, rather than trusting a web company like BankSimple that is good at sleek-looking tech.

Then again, BankSimple's only purpose is great service. They delegate the actual money to a partner bank. So... Yeah. It doesn't really get much better than that in terms of motivation.

Am I wrong in thinking that BankSimple outsourced phone/email support to their partner banks?

Because as far as I can tell, BankSimple has no interest in service at all. They're just a shiny tech company.

As far as I know, yes, you are, in fact, completely wrong. The only thing partner banks handle is the actual money. You never talk to them. https://banksimple.com/faq/#whatthedealis

Shouldn't the Safe To Spend have changed when you scheduled 20 buck a payment to adam?

One thing I love is that I can have checks mailed to Bank Simple, and they'd automatically deposit the monies in my account.

I get quite a few checks, but not enough that I'd want to get a check scanning machine for.

I'm on the beta list, and hope for an invite.

Most banks support this I thought - just mail a deposit slip and a check (signed, with a "FOR DEPOSIT ONLY" endorsement) to the right address. I've done it before with ETrade Bank and ING Direct at least, and I imagine brick-and-mortar banks would do this processing if you mailed the check to a nearby branch.

You'll be able to post us checks for deposit.

Looks awesome. I would love to see a clone of BankSimple in India. The bureaucracy will be a pain but if you can successfully navigate it and create a simple no-frills online only bank, it will be a great success.

Wake me up when they have the deposit-from-phone working on Android phones.

USAA meets your needs today.

Unless you're not related to a ex-military person. Then it meets none of your needs, since you can't use it.

I'm not a USAA member, but that's a complete myth. See this link for the facts: https://www.usaa.com/inet/pages/why_choose_usaa_eligibility_...

"USAA's investment products, most checking and savings products, credit cards, life insurance, and shopping and discounts are available to other individuals. USAA auto and property insurance is not available due to membership eligibility requirements."

Touché sir. I had looked at their insurance in the past and very unfortunately extrapolated to the entire organization. My mistake and thank you very much for correcting that misconceived notion!

I'm a USAA account holder and it is very true: you cannot take advantage of iPhone deposits unless you are military or family. Same goes for most of their insurance products.

Neat. Now gear up for some honest feedback on your blurb :)

>A First Look at BankSimple

FB: Ok, though "Sneak Peek" is easier to relate to than "First Look".

>Joshua Reich, Wed September 21, 2011

FB: Ok.

>We’ve been very cautious on our blog and website about >talking about what we’ve been building.

FB: Redundant. Why are you telling me you've been "cautious"?

>Instead, we’ve focused on our vision.

FB: What vision? Mention it. Mention the key value proposition.

> Today that is changing: Below is a first public sneak peek of BankSimple. We think it’s far more powerful to show than tell.

FB: Check capitalization. Focus on what the user is getting is getting, rather than what you feel("we think it's far..")

>And now we are ready to show. We’ve been testing the product for a few months now, and it has been awesome. >The product isn’t finished. It will never be finished. We’re constantly improving. But we’ve now reached the >point where we’ve learned as much as possible from testing internally and in a few weeks we’ll be shipping > >cards to our first real customers.

FB: Mostly redundant. Only thing that's relevant is "We’ve successfully tested the product for a few months now, and are looking forward to ship it to our first customers over the next few weeks. (Click here to request a beta invite.)"

>This is only the beginning, but it is a tremendous step forward for our company.

FB: This line might be good for boosting the morale at a company internal meeting, but it means nothing to the customer. Also it seems to reinforce the idea that you're not ready yet to grab my attention.

>We will be sharing more important updates with you soon,

FB: Maybe be a little more specific than "soon"? "over the next couple of weeks"?

> but in the meantime,

FB: OK

>we hope that you enjoy this first look at our product –

FB: Redundant. What's there to enjoy?

>we’d love to hear your feedback.

FB: This looks like a call to action, with no visible action button. What should the user do to provide feedback? Maybe turn the "feedback" word at the end of the sentence to a hyperlink that points to a feedback page? Or better yet, use something lightweight like http://webengage.com/ (disclaimer: it's made by a friend of mine).

I was surprised to see that they put so much emphasis on the searching in the demo. The real value is in the "Goals" interface - which is well designed.

BankSimple is as someone else pointed out, just a simpler, sleeker interface to banking.

Brett King's Movenbank tries to reinvent banking.

sure, there's some cool stuff in here. but is it really enough to make anyone but a geek go through the hassle of adding yet another banking service? probably not, imo.

You don't add yet another banking service, you switch from your existing bank to BankSimple. The fact that they're not really a bank but partner with existing institutions is a behind-the-scenes thing that you never come into contact with as a BankSimple customer.

I totally disagree. This is a product for real people not geeks. It's the iPad of banking.

Some people are great at managing their money. Most people are not. A bank that designs its systems to suit an average human rather than to suit the bank itself will be a revolution. This is great design finally being applied to something notoriously difficult for most people.

The big hurdle will be in getting this out of the realm of the geeks and into the general public. If they can do that it will be huge and then every bank will copy them.

I look forward to all banks being simple.

The value proposition doesn't appeal to me... Slick GUI, and I'm sure you guys work your asses off, but there's no compelling reason for me to switch to another bank.. that's a huge cost.. I am get off my ass to another bank, tell them to close my account, write a huge check to BankSimple, change my direct deposit, buy new checks, etc... Do you guys replace the checkbook? If so, I'll sign up. That's my main problem with the entire banking process. I hate writing checks and signing checks. When I write a check to the IRS and somehow get a single number wrong, I have to rewrite the whole thing. It seems strangely ancient that we still have this process in place today.

I guess it depends on how you use your bank. I never use my bank for anything but netbanking. In Europe checks are more or less obsolete. I haven't had a check book since I lived in the US back in the late nineties and early zeroes.

The early adopters and innovators will switch based on whether they believe what BankSimple believes in. However, I agree that in order for the tipping point to occur I need to have a compelling reason to do all the leg work of switching. Unless, BankSimple comes up with a way to do that for us.

My two words of advice to BankSimple (well, two acronyms):

API and CLI

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