Comment by cantrevealname | Hacker News Reader

Comment by cantrevealname | Hacker News Reader

> Scientists in California gave 9 men aged 51 to 65 a growth hormone and two diabetes medications for a year. The drugs seemed to rejuvenate the men’s thymus glands and immune function. They also shaved 2.5 years off the men’s biological age

The study itself says:

During the first week of the trial, rhGH alone (0.015 mg/kg) was administered to obtain an initial insulin response, and during the second week, rhGH was combined with 50 mg DHEA to evaluate insulin suppression by DHEA alone. During the third week, the same doses of rhGH and DHEA were combined with 500 mg metformin. Beginning at the fourth week, all doses were individualized based on each volunteer's particular responses.[1]

So the meds in question are:

- recombinant human growth hormone (rhGH) [2]

- dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) [3]

- metformin [4]

If you wanted to have this treatment for yourself, how could you proceed? I assume that it would be just about impossible to convince your family doctor to prescribe this drug regimen for you? If you were to do-it-yourself, what would be the best way? It seems that metformin is widely available but I don't know about the availability and cost of rhGH and DHEA.

[1] https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/acel.13028

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growth_hormone_therapy#Recombi...

[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dehydroepiandrosterone

[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metformin

First and foremost I would suggest doing research. A recent study showed that in healthy individuals Metformin had no impact on all-cause mortality and there are potential side effects.

Of course, doing research is hard. Because it isn't really research in the sense of running a legitimate study, it's research in the sense of studying the work of others as an outsider.

Personally, I like Dr Brad Stanfield. https://www.youtube.com/c/DrBradStanfield

He's not afraid to reverse positions, he's articulate, he calls out when research is or is not compelling and explains why.

Again, personally, I expect the number one thing you can do to improve your healthspan is probably focus on what you can stop putting in your body vs what things you can add. If you're 40+ though, might be worth looking at other options.

Berberine is commonly promoted as a vitamin alternative to Metformin. Even if Berberine also has no impact on all-cause mortality (idk), I can anecdotally share that 500mg 30minutes before lunch considerably lessens my post lunch fatigue.

As for human growth hormone, this Huberman Labs podcast advises against taking it but also offers many natural ways you can boost it[0].

[0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7qbJeRxWGw

In this concrete study (TRIIM and TRIIM-Extended), metformin isn't used for any putative anti-aging effects.

It is used to counteract the effects of HGH on insulin levels. HGH increases insulin levels, which is known to be deleterious to the organism, and metformin serves to reduce them back.

For a more thorough dive into this topic, Dr Brad Stanfield on Youtube. I haven't found anyone better in breaking down the latest scientific studies on Longevity.

https://www.youtube.com/c/DrBradStanfield

There is evidence that Metformin doesn't extend the life of healthy people but does extend the life of Type II diabetics.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iByaqfmWfHQ

I would also caution HGH for men since it can enlarge the prostate gland.

David Sinclair had mentioned in a podcast that we use to be cold and hungry and now we're warm and fat all the time. Need to be cold and hungry more often.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwD5YYkbYmN2iFHON9FyDXg

Peter Attia has said that the number one thing he believes will extend healthspan/lifespan (if you did nothing else) is exercise. He wish he could prescribe as a medication.

https://www.youtube.com/c/PeterAttiaMD

So, exercise, fasting, and being cold?

Michael Lustgarten Ph.D is another good source for biohacking and longevity matters. he takes a diifferent approach though since he's trying to reverse his epigenetic age specifically through diet.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCT1UMLpZ_CrQ_8I431K0b-g

[2] https://twitter.com/mike_lustgarten

The most interesting thing I have heard from Sinclair is the studies on mice that eating once a day was what extended lifespan the most. Everything else was not that important diet wise.

It sounds like to me the method is eat once a day and get in the best physical condition possible from working out. Beyond that, I am just not going to stress about it. Surely, not going to take any reverse risk with HGH or experimental drugs.

But when being cold and hungry was the norm, life expectancy was much lower. Human life expectancy in the developed world is higher than at any time in human history.

And back then also a lot of other factors were less than ideal. (Including lack of medication and medical science altogether.) The idea behind cold and hungry is not being that cold for that long and that hungry. Definitely not starving to death.

What Sinclair hypothesizes that the reason behind the phenomena they see is that these adverse conditions trigger mechanisms in our body that are beneficial in the long term. And the very reason might be to try to make up for what causes the the lower life expectancy. Not knowing much about the topic and the mechanism, my other thought was that it tries to slow your ageing so that you can be fertile for longer in a bid to be able to reproduce when the rough times are over.

So the idea is to kick in the protective mechanisms but still cause no real damage. Similarly to how you're better off eating less than what the average person does in any obese society. Even though their life expectancy is still higher than what it was 500 years ago.

Let's be careful not to conflate life expectancy and life span. The former being dominated[1] by improvements in reducing infant mortality and mothers dying during child birth, while the latter has remained largely consistent[2],[3].

‘… life expectancy in the mid-Victorian period was not markedly different from what it is today. Once infant mortality is stripped out, life expectancy at 5 years was 75 for men and 73 for women.’[1]

[1]-https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2625386/

[2]-https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20181002-how-long-did-anc...

[3]-https://www.sapiens.org/biology/human-lifespan-history/

Edit - sources ordered incorrectly.

AgelessRX will prescribe metformin [1], DHEA is legally OTC in the US, and any kind of HGH is probably readily available at your local gym (also a number of hormone doctors online will prescribe it easily)

[1] https://www.agelessrx.com/metformin

>I don't know about the availability and cost of rhGH and DHEA.

DHEA: available over-the-counter in the US

rhGH: go to your local gym and ask the biggest guy

Funny to see metformin popping up again, it's already a staple in the anti-aging movement.

There are peptides you can buy online that make you overproduce HGH, though it’s hard to say if the effects would be the same. You can also easily buy metformin from Indian pharmacies.

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