Ask HN: How do you manage or avoid meltdowns? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: How do you manage or avoid meltdowns?

62 pointssolididiot91 comments

Being a SW Eng I spent hours on a chair. In home-office. COVID lockdowns made this worse. Added extra stress due to bad future outlook and a lack of direction in my career plus dozens of other blockers that navigating gets more difficult as I grow older.

Anyway. The point of the matter is that I crack and meltdown quite often. And that makes my problems multiply because I then have to deal with apologies etc.

How do you deal with meltdowns? How do you calm yourself down? I'm not talking about being a Buddha (I'm as far away from that as I could be unfortunately). I'm talking about doing the bare minimum so that I don't cause myself and the people around me extra problems.

For the most part I have managed to keep this away from my (shitty) job so it has not affected my (dead in the water) career. But it is taking a toll on my family relations and I hate me for that.

No phychotherapy please. I won't go near their arrogance.

Any practical tips that work on you are highly appreciated.

For context I'm 45 yrs old, male, relatively new dad in a backwater EU country.

TIA

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Given the impact of these symptoms on your life, you have a problem that's likely beyond the ability of the well-intentioned people on the internet to fully help.

Refusing to seek psychotherapy for this situation is like refusing to fix a hole in your tailpipe because you don't trust mechanics. Eventually, it'll rust through and fall off, and you won't have a choice but to fix it... for more money and time.

That is to say, your option is to seek professional help now, while this is a solvable problem, or to wait until things get worse and you don't have a choice. Have you considered what will happen if and when your "meltdowns" escalate to the point where you can't apologize your way out of them? Or, worse, where you are not able to pull yourself out?

You should consider seeking a psychiatrist or physician with experience prescribing psychiatric medication, but be ready for them to refuse to help you unless you commit to talk therapy of some kind also. Be aware that there are dozens of therapeutic modalities that are all different - your previous experience with therapy is unlikely to cover them all. You might have to go through multiple professional people before you find one that will fit what you need.

This is one of the more useful bits of advice here in my opinion.

Things like exercise, sleep, eating well etc. could go some way to coping better with the underlying issue, but by themselves are unlikely to address what’s actually going on.

The situation described suggests that feelings are not being managed very well. There could be lots of reasons why, but given the severity any quick fixes from random people on the internet are unlikely to result in sustained improvement.

fwiw +1 good advice.

You need to trust without any reservations that therapy or counseling is going to help.

You might not gel well with a specific therapist, and there is a choice to get a different therapist or therapy until one works for you.

Also, this takes time

> relatively new dad

This is probably a core reason for your problem. I would bet that you find it difficult to adapt to the new normal. You now have less time to yourself and many more constraints to deal with. That's just super stressful. Here's my advice as a not-so-new father:

1. It's OK to be stressed. Don't stress out over your stress level (Meta Stress).

2. Things will get better.

3. Take some you-time. Do whatever helps you. Cardio is an excellent idea, like jogging through brisk winter air. But make sure to communicate and coordinate this time with your SO.

4. Get your priorities straight. Once I made the conscious decision that kids are more important than work, I could let go of work projects easily when a child became sick and needed care. Communicate this openly with coworkers and bosses.

5. Plan for vacations and other breaks auch that you have one every two months. For instance, maybe the kid(s) likes a weekend with the grandparents? Or the family goes to the zoo every once in a while? This will help to reset your stress level.

Yes. Being a new parent — exacerbated by this current normal — is incredibly difficult. My wife and I have spent the past year focusing much of our energy on ourselves (after the kids, work, etc)

That dedicated time we have where we do what we need just for us has turned our year around; I run 5km a day, she goes to the gym to lift weights 3x a week. It took adjustment in our schedules and the time in the day is tight, but it’s oh so worth it.

We have many other priorities, like renovating the garage or reorganizing the living room, but we’ve decided that’s lower on the priority — with two young kids 2021 was not just about survival, but for us as a family to thrive.

Wishing OP the best!

> No phychotherapy please. I won't go near their arrogance.

No professional psychotherapist can afford to be arrogant, you might have gotten unlucky with your experience so far. They are equipped to answer exactly such questions. Psychodynamic approaches, for example, are something you might want to look into.

Yup, arrogance is a symptom of incompetency. People are loudest about the things they are unsure about. We see it all the time in our line of work - beginners are the most arrogant. But it applies to doctors, lawyers, and psychotherapists too.

Yes, you will encounter arrogance in all those professions. Just as often a professional will be called "arrogant" for telling us what we don't want to hear.

My dad's cardiologist is one of the best doctors I've ever encountered. His online ratings are all over the place and MOST of the low ranking patients were calling him "arrogant" and "terrible bedside manner".

There are a lot of great diagnosticians who are lousy human beings. If I need an x-ray I'll see that guy. If I'm going under a scalpel I'd rather have a kid who gives a shit and still values life.

The kid's probably more arrogant than the old man, too. But he's got to earn it.

Some of the best surgeons, the ones with the best patient outcomes, are high functioning sociopaths.

But that is orthogonal to my point, a lot of doctors, lawyers, etc. are not any more arrogant than the average person; they just get labelled that way because people don't like being told they are wrong or getting bad news.

I'm not sure those people are wrong to think they're dealing with arrogance. There are lots of ways of delivering bad news. And - unlike in medicine - for every lawyer who delivers bad news, there's another one delivering good news. Coming from a family of lawyers, and growing up knowing dozens of them, I think I've yet to meet one who wasn't extremely arrogant, whatever kind of news they were delivering. And let's not even mention how they order sushi.

And let's not forget, it also applies to patients as well.

  > No psychotherapy please.  I won't go near their arrogance.

I felt this way a while back. I realize, now, that it was my arrogance that was the problem with that situation -- coupled with a small number of bad experiences with psychologists[0]. Finding one that works for you is difficult, and it took me quite some time, but the value of having a professional "disinterested third-party" decode the workings of your mind is impossible to replicate alone.

Consider that the thing responsible for diagnosing your problems is the exact thing with the problem. Your brain has a way of lying to you, making things seem smaller/less impactful than they are. Talking to a professional about it can reveal things to you which you can't see with the blinders that your brain puts up. It doesn't have to mean "turning your brain off and blindly listening to everything you're told" -- it means listening for something this third-party is telling you that you may not agree with, but perhaps -- they're seeing something you're not and you should evaluate whether or not they might be on to something.

If you are unwilling to see a psychotherapist, find a friend that you trust deeply enough with this problem and ask them, directly, "What do you think I'm doing wrong, here?" or "What do I need to start doing differently?"

[0] Maybe it's just where I live but it seems every psychologist in the field got there because they had years of psychotherapy of their own. It's almost similar to how many who work in drug rehabilitation are former drug addicts, themselves. I'm not sure that it's bad, always, but I found myself speaking with people that seemed a lot less put together than myself.

Before I found a great car mechanic, I took my car to a couple of unethical and incompetent shops that would do things like spray-paint an old part and charge the customer for a replacement. I didn't trust auto mechanics for years.

I suppose psychotherapy is a skill that can be done well or done poorly. If done poorly it could cause great damage to people personally. Same could be said for any discipline that deals with intimate relationships.

Completely agree!

And I had to pipe in to say I've had similar problems with mechanics -- though not as brazen as spray painting old parts, but frequent cases of being over-charged for things that weren't fixed, not honoring warranties for things that weren't fixed, and generally having a car that ... wasn't fixed.

Like my psychotherapist, I found an amazing car mechanic. He's made a mistake or two over the years, but every single time it happened, he resolved it beyond my satisfaction. Honestly, kind of worried about how old the guy is getting who owns the shop and hoping he leaves it to someone with the same high ethical standards.

Most of my bad experiences with therapists were simply people that couldn't relate to my circumstances in a manner that they could provide advice/actions that I could use rather than people doing actual harm, but I could see that as a possibility if I had stayed for too long.

Having been here a lot of times.. Fuck the client or the boss, it's important to me that I put my best work forward. Even if it makes no difference to me financially. Even if their stupid company will go down in flames. Even if I don't want to wake up tomorrow and look at their piece of shit online store / dumbass genZ insta-sales emails / customer can't click button on iphone / server collapsed because Amazon EC2 West-1 .........

It's called fucking professionalism. So stop listening to the whining cohort and realize it's just doing a goddamn job.

Okay, that's my pitch to people who grew up in a military family.

On the other hand, consider yourself the bright spot in the day for everyone who has no fucking clue what's going on.

And it's 2022. I just raised my hourly rate from $200 to $250. Do the same. And find some good ways to spend that good energy you still have, racing in the street or playing in a band or throwing paint at a wall.

One day I realized.. ahem. Sorry. Today I woke up and reminded myself . Ahem. Every fucking day I work on a customer's code I need to remember it's a job, I'm doing it for the fucking money. Not to be a saint. Wake up. Set four hours. Make money. Write good code. Done? Great. Now I hope you know by now what you're going to do with the rest of your day. What is it?

It's soooo easy to slip into the hole where we feel like we finished the work and the day is done. Let's get a pizza and watch netflix. That, my friend, is a death spiral.

Just treat the work like work. [edit here:] Everyone I've ever worked for had no capacity to do what I do, but those motherfuckers went above and beyond to make me feel like my moral obligation and main mission in life was to solve their problems while they partied and slept.

Your main problem sounds like you don't know how to enjoy the other 16 hours of your day.

I'd like to stress this:

  > On the other hand, consider yourself the bright spot in
  > the day for everyone who has no fucking clue what's going on.

You've put into words the way I live. No matter how upset or angry I am, no matter how much traffic or rain was on my drive, no matter how much code was lost, I try to be the thing that people in my life look forward to. Always make other people feel better after talking to you.

I kind of developed that after hearing "people never remember what you say or do, people remember how you made them feel". Even the cop who pulls me over gets a smile and a "good morning".

I think that if just half of people did this, we would live in such a nicer world. This is the definition of civilization that I like best.

Never thought that would be a pull quote, but now that you mention it, you can put it on my tombstone. Isn't that the best part of the day?

I love doing end-user customer service. I'm incredibly thankful for being shielded from it 99% of the time, and I'd run off into the woods if I wasn't. But I love when I get to talk to them and just walk them through something. It's like any interaction that gives me some thought. I have MAGA neighbors. I have antifa neighbors. (I live in Portland, so). You get to a point where everyone has the same problems, and the only way you can solve them is by being civil with one another. That is civilization.

[edit] Just to reply to the spirit of what you said... there's something very reassuring about just being civil and decent. Pleasant, clear, logical, respectful or doubtful of authority; making yourself a person with other people. This is the ultimate power we all have that can't be taken away by any state or any authority. Civilizing the savages has taken on other connotations, but you can't beat civility. Politesse.

After looking you up, I wonder how much of this particular attitude is related to being Jewish. I sometimes feel like I'm refracting my family's misfortune in the Holocaust by making myself either unavoidably useful and friendly, or else unassailably logical. Maybe I tip too well.

Possibly.

I live amongst people who would slaughter me before knowing me, and in the vast majority of cases I make friends of them. I'm careful of course, but I feel that it is a risk that is important to take. Perhaps the desire to spread peace is a cultural trait that we don't even realize. In fact our everyday greeting is literally "peace".

heh. I've lived in Spain too. j/k. sort of. But actually I did live in Spain, and some of my best friends were Shia, Sunni and Druze, and our discussions over drinks would terrify the hell out of the Spanish or English seated nearby. And then we'd go get a shawarma. This is an attitude of making yourself relatable and human towards making friends and knowing people intimately - it's as a form of self defense, or just realism - that I seem preprogrammed to do. It's a nice part of my day, too. My grandfather never owned a gun. He had talked and romanced his way out of too many deadly situations. He believed being human to others was the only way to survive.

This whole internet of naifs is going towards a place where they're willing to slaughter before knowing each other, so it's helpful to have real world experience how to make friends.

Heh... Aleikum salaam!

If you see what I mean.

Biologically, a big thing is exercise. Get plenty of it, because it helps regulate mood (a lot). Longish walks or runs also help you take a time-out, which is important from time to time. Sunlight might also play a factor depending on how susceptible you are.

Also, being a new parent is inherently stressful. It helps to be aware of that to give some perspective.

Career-wise, think about what kinds of things related to your line of work you actually enjoy doing, don't enjoy doing, and utterly hate doing. There are different kinds of companies and work cultures that increase or decrease these things. Right now is a good time for remote workers, so you have more choice than you did a year ago. Figure out what areas of work will maximise what you like and minimise what you hate, then think carefully about what kinds of interview questions you can ask a potential employer to see what you can realistically expect if you worked there. It's perfectly fine to say "Sorry, we won't be a good match" and move on. Just like in relationships, there are all kinds.

Meltdowns are a common feature of the lives of Autistic people.

There are vast resources available from books to many good youtube videos.

Getting a formal assessment is fairly expensive but screening tests are free.

https://novopsych.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/Autism-S...

https://novopsych.com.au/assessments/diagnosis/autism-spectr...

https://www.aspietests.org/userdetails.php?target=raads/inde...

Mostly it is about managing your levels of stress and knowing your limits. And lots of good strategies rather than therapy. One thing I realized is I need a lot more sleep than I had been getting. And I need to ration social 'work' (that's how it feels - hard work).

Autistic people are very prone to trauma - basically they are hyperspensitive to many stiumuli and emotions - so there may be residual trauma to deal with. But there are multiple ways to do that.

You're too old to be having melt-downs and it's a bad example to set for your relatively new child. I think there are a couple clues in the description you've added above though. Sitting in a chair for hours is necessary as a software developer but that shouldn't mean sitting in one position. If you can't stand for part of your workday, at least change the position you're sitting in. The terms "shitty job" and "dead-in-the-water career" are a more pressing matter - your attitude is going to be pretty well correlated to your feelings about your job. If you can't simply change jobs, try to find a way to "make it new". One of my tricks is to "see it with new eyes" which can be practiced by driving through your town and imagining it's your first time there (I've seen things doing this that I'd simply never noticed before.) Another thing you can do is find ways to do your job that result in you learning new skills. Finally, when you're not working you should get away from your desk. Doing housework can be cathartic and getting some exercise will definitely help.

>You're too old to be having melt-downs and it's a bad example to set for your relatively new child.

Sorry, but this just comes off as so ableist.

I teach/coach parents and one of the main aspects of improving quality of parenting for the child is improving the quality of self care for parents.

Adults tend to sacrifice self care at the drop of a hat.

Here are a few ideas which my clients find useful:

- who you are, and what you are capable of, changes, and is influenced by many things, on both short and long timescales.

- you on 2 hours of sleep and no food is different from a well-rested well-fed “you”

- it is beneficial to look at yourself less as “good” or “bad” and more as “well-resourced”, or “under-resourced”

- divide your resources into a few different aspects which you can clearly identify/sense. You can visualize them like the health, energy, mana, ammunition etc. bars in a video game.

- I recommend rest/nourishment, belonging/connection, solitude/stillness/reflection, contribution/competency, play/fun, self expression. Yours may vary A bit but these are some of the most common basic human needs.

- when these get depleted, your cognitive resources diminish. Your stress increases. Your organism has a breaking point and a meltdown is a signal of your reaching it.

- a meltdown in a child is the result of the brain getting flooded with stress hormones and restoring itself to balance. (Cortisol gets excreted in tears for example). Similar to you - it’s a rebalancing process. But, it has impact on others and it’s better to not reach a point of losing control.

Resource-wise, you will need to fight to resource yourself - against your old habits, the time crunch etc. Prioritizing your self-care is now vitally important.

I was lucky enough to recognize similar behavior in myself a long time ago, and I 'fixed'[1] it by getting a lot more organized, and by looking for potential problems ahead of time so I can route around them. I'm a huge fan of things like "pre-mortem" meetings to work out where blockers might occur as early as possible and mitigate the issues before they're blockers.

It takes a lot of effort. There's no magic fix like sleeping more or going for a run. They make me feel a bit better, but the problem is still there.

[1] My partner is a therapist (not an arrogant one though), and she says what I do is 'catastrophizing behavior', where I look for things to worry about. She's entirely right. My issue is 100% not fixed but it's not a problem any more. If anything it actually makes me a much better developer.

> No phychotherapy please. I won't go near their arrogance.

Well, psychotherapy is what worked for me. What exactly types of arrogance did you encounter with therapists? Were they certified?

You can try many of things that a therapist would suggest: cognitive behavioural therapy (CBT), acceptance and commitment therapy (ACT), dialectical behavioural therapy (DBT) or just general mindfulness. Basically work on detecting when you are about to blow up and handle it.

As other posters have suggested; exercise and meditation.

> I'm talking about doing the bare minimum so that I don't cause myself and the people around me extra problems.

Bare minimum may not help here. You might have some underlying impairment of executive function like ADHD or a spectrum disorder.

I was in a similar spot up until a few weeks ago honestly and came to a realization.

It's a good time to let the stresses of life impact the job more than your family relations. Money is relatively easy to get right now, but real human connections are almost impossible. I've personally decided to put in a lot more effort at home because I have found my efforts are rewarded there, with your dead in the water job I'll bet it's the same for you.

That is a matter of attitude, but for practical tips. Is the kid out of your bedroom yet? Sleeping through the night? That's the next thing on your list if not. Then spend some money on your bedding, make the bedroom a inviting place that you are excited to spend time in. I put a huge TV on the wall, everybody says you shouldn't do that but the best part of my day is laying in bed with my wife and joking about stupid YouTube videos. I put a vase on the night stand and pick up flowers when I'm grocery shopping. Put in the effort. You need some time together to be grown ups without the stresses of a child, make a space for it and time for it. Spending time with your partner is the most important thing you do all day. Can you get a babysitter? If you can, take her (making a assumption there, but I imagine this works if you are married to a dude as well) out even if you don't feel like it.

Also consider how you are splitting the child care, are you doing your part? Having a resentful and stressed out partner isn't going to make you more relaxed. You need to take care of each other, and draw upon each others strength. Being a good dad is often getting the short end of the stick, let what doesn't matter slide when it comes to people who love you.

> How do you deal with meltdowns?

Were any of the meltdowns justified?

CBT - not everything is awful.

> I'm talking about doing the bare minimum so that I don't cause myself and the people around me extra problems.

Good to do something about it but why settle for the bare minimum to fix your life?

> For the most part I have managed to keep this away from my (shitty) job so it has not affected my (dead in the water) career.

You have a job and a career - great!

You can always get another job (and career) if you want

> But it is taking a toll on my family relations and I hate me for that.

You protect your (shitty) job and (dead in the water) career because they can fire you, but you don’t protect your family ?

> No phychotherapy please. I won't go near their arrogance.

I recommend therapy - otherwise if you want to go self-help take a look at https://www.amazon.com/Guide-Rational-Living-Albert-Ellis/dp...

Here's what works for me :

- An SSRI treatment, because generalized anxiety doesn't usually go away on its own.

- Heavy schedule compartimentalization.

- At least a moderate level of daily physical activity.

- 9 hours of sleep.

- Minimize caffeine & alcohol intake.

I've dealt with this myself and with my peers over the years. I see a lot of similar statements and will tag on to npwr's since it is close to what I do.

This is mostly in order:

1. No drugs. Booze and pot need to be sidelined while dealing with this. Minimization or stopping caffeine if possible. Don't quite smoking right now.

2. Exercise. Do what you like that can get you into the zone. Try and do it without external inputs like podcasts etc. Let the exercise take over your brain. 3 days a week is minimum. There is a good chance you will want to do more.

3. Sleep. Full sleep for whatever it is for you. I can't sleep 9 hours but 8 is good. This is a personal variable, but you should feel good when you wake up.

4. Talk to a friend. Hangout or call a friend that is low maintenance. You may or may not talk about what's challenging you. Having someone to go back and forth with is a great to get you back to who you are and will give you some perspective directly or indirectly.

5. See someone professionally that can help. There is a lot of science based approaches out there that aren't too far out or just sitting on a couch spending money. Find a councillor that you can say "I want to stop or reduce my meltdowns" and give them a few sessions to do so. It shouldn't be forever. The sessions should be basic and practical. Understanding how your adrenal gland pumps you up just before you have a meltdown is really helpful. How to get out of your head and back to reality - you aren't under mortal danger like your mind is telling you and your body is now in full flight or fight mode. How to you recognize this before it happens and make sure that when it does you have a process to get through it without melting down. It works pretty well within a few sessions.

I've had a lot of good feedback from my colleagues. 1-3 does it for a lot of people. The fact that we are talking in some ways takes it to 4. 5 is a hard step to take as there is a lot of stigma around it, but if you are melting down at work or with your family it is worth it. Work meltdowns suggest that this has gotten out of control.

I suggest to anyone that has been through this with some success to reach out to anyone that they see having similar issues. This has been a real positive as a manager having my own experience to share.

>- An SSRI treatment, because generalized anxiety doesn't usually go away on its own.

I want to add to this a very honest observation:

For many people this is the best path. I see a lot of people often saying they are unnecessary, that natural is best or that they create more problems. But I've realized, for me at least, they are totally necessary. I went off them for about 8 years, thinking natural really is best. All I have to show for it is a lot of white hair from excessive stress. I recently decided to try them again and man for the first time in years I just feel normal. No longer is anxiety the dominating emotion in my head. It's certainly still there-- but I can operate like those around me. I don't get over stressed as easily, and conversations come naturally to me. YMMV but it's worth a shot for some

Walk, walk, walk. Whenever something goes to your head, just go out for a 30 minutes stroll and let your body/mind relax. It will not solve any of your problems, but improve your attitude for sure, which is a step in the right direction.

It amazing what a 20 minute walk can do. I feel energized and relaxed the rest of the day. It's an amazing return on what's actually a very small time investment.

I know 98% of people aren't willing to try this-- but add in a cold shower afterwards and I become impervious to stress. And I'm usually a high anxiety person(have been my whole life). It's really a drastic, and honestly impressive, difference that it makes. This would almost definitely solve OP's problem, as it would for many people, the only problem is it's unpleasant enough that most are afraid to even try

Not sure why you want to avoid psychotherapy. Maybe look into Gestalt therapy. Find a therapist that will help you to solve your problems, and not one that is arrogant.

Paying 15% of net income for weekly therapy sessions only to hear lameness like "you are perfect, everyone is", "there is nothing wrong with you", "you are very brave" and to discuss the news is not what I would consider responsible use for money.

Like OP, there is something wrong with my daily life and I am the only person responsible of making it better. Phrases like "everything will be all right, anyway" and "you deserve more" are not driving me towards finding and applying the necessary changes to get my life back, quite the opposite.

Not sure whether you've ever done therapy, but I have and I've had an excellent experience with it. I don't think many therapists do therapy by spouting some superficial platitudes at the client.

120 sessions. I did not develop enough agency to react to the fact we did not have a plan or a goal during the last 100.

I'm sorry you had a bad experience. But sounds like maybe your therapist wasn't that great.

What, weekly for 2.5 years?

Exactly

Based on my own experiences and of those close to me, I'd say going to a therapist which works can indeed be very, very helpful. The problem is finding a therapist that works for you.

I had one which changed job, and the replacement just did not work. I have a good friend who's finally found one, after trying five others over the span of several years. I've got some other friends who never found one that worked for them and thus never got anything out of it.

Of course, one which works for me might not work for you, it's highly individual and might even be case-specific.

>Paying 15% of net income for weekly therapy sessions only to hear lameness like "you are perfect, everyone is", "there is nothing wrong with you", "you are very brave" and to discuss the news is not what I would consider responsible use for money.

Uh, that's not therapy - sounds like you've been to some "cheap" expensive therapy mate...

"you are perfect, everyone is" - this is a lie;

"there is nothing wrong with you" - another lie;

"you are very brave" - this could be a lie, most likely is;

Welcome to mid-life. It’s not that the younger are smarter: It’s that the older don’t have a disposable amount of time! More responsibilities both in and out of work.

Compounding that is a new child, being stuck at home perpetually, and so of course you’re at your wits-end.

So with good advice already dispensed, I’ll just ask questions.

Is there any way for you to keep work and home separate? Can you work outside? A temp office, a friend’s home, etc.?

Anywhere that’s not home and wouldn’t get you in trouble (no ex girlfriends!).

Second, is your job stable? Are you allowed to take leave? Are you really unhappy about your job or is it “everything”?

In the more quiet moments, does your partner understand the position you’re in and want to help?

What can you and your partner do to make home a slice of heaven/bliss? How can you make home-life a positive-reinforcement experience, and make all the negative experiences be part of “not-at-home”? Or a mutual, shared struggle (crying baby isn’t exactly a joy).

Would personal time help you to get some insights?

>Any practical tips that work on you are highly appreciated.

a) Lifting heavy weights, either at home or gym.

b) Reading

c) Any hobby that you find fulfilling, if you have time. If you don't just enjoy every second you have with your baby.

Yes. I am not the fittest person, but I lift weights and read books. Both have definitely helped keep me sane over the past 2 years. I don't have a family and don't intend to though, so I have a lot more free time and less general stress levels.

I'm going to (re)start sailing. Last time it made things worse though - some of the least professional people I've seen in my life make a living as sailing instructors. I hope I'll find a more organised situation in the new club.

The real question is the triggers for the meltdowns. Specifically, if there's a big sensory component here, that's the place to start, well before the psychotherapy, SSRIs or talk. If what's getting you to explode is some kind of sensory overload, no amount of talk will solve that.

We each have an optimal bandwidth of sensory stimulus in which we function. For some, it's pretty broad. For others, it's very narrow and complex. But the large majority, those who come across as perfectly normal and well-functioning, never even pause to think about this - and most people's bandwidth isn't that broad.

So the first thing I'd do is read about your sensory system and think hard about what throws you off in terms of sensory input. There are sure to be questionnaires online on this. It may be that what will help you far more than drugs or sitting still is installing a swing in your backyard.

For me: stay away from alcohol, caffeine and other psychoactives. These tend to ruin my ability to handle stress. Especially caffeine tends to make me emotionally volatile.

OP probably smokes cigarettes like a chimney. Sadly quitting them would make him rage even more.

I don’t know you so take this for what it’s worth:

One thing that has worked quite well for me is meditation. I use the Headspace app, and I like it.

Meditation is not a silver bullet, but for me it has been a net positive. It has definitely helped me to be a calmer person.

Seeing a therapist can also help sometimes. But it can be hard to find the right type of help. Is there any trustworthy medical center in your region? If you have the means to get help from them then you might want to try that. As 'Ensorceled pointed out, there could be an underlying psychiatric condition that affects you. But that is very hard to tell without further details and without the right competence, that’s why seeking care can be helpful. But the specifics of those possibilities will probably vary a lot depending on where you live.

Exercise, nutrition, sleep, seriously. There are no better solutions.

I lift weights (either at gym or home) and do cardio (depends on the weather). I also keep junk food to a minimal, mostly have protein (chicken, meat, etc) and vegetables. Finally I make sure that I get enough sleep, this means that I have a cut off time at night (~10-11pm) no matter what. To make this easier, I usually have a book that I read before sleeping which helps me avoid screen time.

Of course there are many other things that will help such as relationships and spirituality however in my experience, those are secondary and unless you have your health and nutrition under control, they won't contribute much.

Look into the book "Complex Ptsd: From Surviving to Thriving" by Pete Walker. I reckon you have a background that wasn't kind to you. I would also add limit media consumption (tv, radio, newspapers, social media, etc). Gotta find the root of why you react the way you do. When a negative thought enters your mind, stop it immediately and ask yourself where it is coming from? Is it your thought or from someone else, perhaps someone or something negative in the past? Good luck, fren.

Being healthy helps, but assuming you are tired/stressed, there's still ways to stay in control.

1) You have to recognize that you're nearing red zone, i.e. notice the physical effects of the adrenaline rush. If you can't consciously notice it happening and intervene, then you're just a meat puppet to your emotional system. You may notice that it causes you to breathe rapidly, for example. Don't worry about step 2 until you've got this part down.

2) Once you can notice it, you have to do the mental gymnastics in the moment to convince yourself that you're not going to do anybody any favors by indulging your emotion. If you've resolved ahead of time that you want to get on top of it, that's a good start; in the moment you need to remember that resolution and stick to it.

3) Be aware that you're possibly not going to be able to calm down instantly (though a physical trick that helps is to take two or three deep breaths through the nose). In a situation like this, you'll have chemicals running through your blood that keep wanting to short circuit your rational thinking. Either try to change the subject, propose to "agree to disagree" for now until you can think about it some more in your own time, or if possible try to end the conversation politely. It'll be very hard to continue to keep talking calmly about the subject that triggered you if you've got a strong emotional response (although with practice it is doable.) You can also discuss ahead of time with your spouse/partner, tell him/her that you're working on this, and that sometimes you'd like their permission to put conversations on hold until you're in a better frame of mind - just don't abuse their willingness, and make sure not to use it as an excuse for avoiding difficult topics.

Focus on your breath, place your hands on your knees in order not to react/do anything stupid. Dont get rigid, move your body slightly with smoothness in order not to get rigid. Dont get rigid focus on your breath again and again. Just focus on that, its not now your going to fix the world, fix yourself first. And smile.

Now, when it passes, ask yourself the following question: when was the last time you were stabbed?

You're too negative, it transpires in everything you say, your lack of openess and even your username. I dont say that because I care but because negativity attracts negative things. You are going toward a disaster if you keep being negative like that.

Plus you're trying to control your environment too much. You need acceptance, gratitude, etc

Youre judging yourself, others, everything. You are feeling bad because you are feeling bad. All those habits will lead you to a disaster.

Whats clearly happening here is that being negative is becoming your personality. Thoughts lead to actions which lead to habits which lead to personality. The negative spiraling starts with your thoughts.

I can only offer "becoming Zen". People constantly praise me for being Zen about things that upset everyone else; it apparently grants me much "leadership points" among my peers and direct reports.

It's mostly because at some level I just don't care enough to INVEST the energy required to get upset let alone meltdown. I pick carefully what I CHOOSE to invest emotional in and it's a very short list.

Related to this: what are you willing to "walk away from", and if you aren't, why not?

I have also experienced most of the "stress/crisis events" a man can, and survived them well enough or often enough to not be phased by them anymore.

https://paindoctor.com/top-10-stressful-life-events-holmes-r...

Some tips from somebody in a very similar situation (including the dead water)

- Cardio: Going out for a walk, running, walking the little one, preferably while sleeping so it adds no stress to the walking; You have to get the adrenalin out of your system and cardio is the most efficient way to do this

- medical check-up: especially the hormone stuff

- self-monitoring: Leave situations before you meltdown. Do not answer immediately when you see a meltdown coming or feel that you are already there, if nothing else works, just leave the room.

- Talk this through with your family, be transparent on your wish to "get better" again; show commitment. To me it is the biggest motivation that I want to be at least a mediocre parent, not the kind hated by their ex and children.

- Some kind of mentoring/personal trainer/psychology helps, because it adds that sweet third-person perspective. You are asking complete strangers for help already, so think about what kind of assistance you are willing to accept. A friend of mine is in a self-help group, I am quite content with psychoanalysis though it is baby steps and that does not go well with my impatience :-) Not sure if your rejection of psycho* is not already part of the problem, nobody I met in the mental health sector was arrogant, but your milage may vary.

- Think about your job and whether it is worth risking your family. Apply at some other company (but remember that there is no company where all is good) that you can identify with more or just for a change of scenery. Become a carpenter. Do not allow yourself to sulk in some 'I am the victim' mindset even if you are a victim, it will not get you anywhere. - read this: https://www.chicagotribune.com/columns/chi-schmich-sunscreen...

Disclaimer: I am still melting down several several times of the week, and there are times when I cannot imagine to go for another minute. But I do.

A few things:

- Go to the doctor and check for Diabetes, Thyroid and blood pressure. Especially diabetes can cause those meltdowns.

- Sport obviously

- Time for me. You need to have free time outside of whatever you are doing now. Go for a walk or a cafe and have some downtime.

- Supplements. For me personally I'm seeing good results with taking Ashwagandha

- Finally and this is the most important one: you need to be able to predict when the meltdown will happen. Meaning, with time you need to be able to see it coming and do something before it happens. Don't let things pile up to the point of a meldown, address them as they happen.

Basically, stop caring. That's my only option.

I don't melt down, but I say things I shouldn't. No yelling, no profanity, just my position. For example, I am currently struggling not to speak up on the asymmetrical nature of the merit structure at my company. It's still better to keep your mouth shut because in the end it's safer to be part of a group than to be your authentic self.

So now I must accept that there are injustices in the world, some of which directly affect me, for which the "best" thing to do is for me to stay silent.

Having a bad future outlook is the biggest one I'd say, if you feel confident you can land any fun job you want in the future then you can chose a job you actually like. Can be hard to do in the middle of being stressed out though. Linkedin and actually politely responding to the people there helps, I like self employed consultancies but it's not everyones cup or tea nor the least stressful option but at least I know if I'm not happy in a role I'll just fly away and do something else.

> No phychotherapy please. I won't go near their arrogance.

Username checks out.

There are many classes of introverts. One of the variations of introverts is a group that protects others from themselves. Think Scrooge. Keep your distance until you know how to manage.

It's a matter of perspective and perspective is practiced.

You are focused on positive outcomes, but those aren't under your control. Your focus should be on actions that you would expect to have positive consequences. If you've done those, you're personally off the hook as far as the outcome is concerned.

Since you are only holding yourself accountable to the actions and not the outcome, you might then have the energy to fix it later when the outcomes aren't positive.

This hits close to home. I've had a few really intense meltdowns including twice where I ended up in the hospital for trying to kill myself. Apart from my meltdowns I'm a pretty chill guy.

When a meltdown hits, the first thing I do is breathe. I've survived the last ones, I'll survive this one. I acknowledge that I'm having a meltdown and that I need to deal with it before anything else.

Then, the hard part is trying to seperate yourself from your emotions. A meltdown isn't quite you. It's your body telling yourself something is wrong and that you need to do something about it. So take a breather (you're not going to get anything else done anyway) and let your bodily functions happen. If you need to cry, go ahead, if you can get some fresh air that often pretty good.

To finish calming down I try to bring some humor and lightheartedness to my emotions, althought its not easy to do.

On the medium term what helped me the most was getting a healthier life style. I tried meditating a bit but it asked a lot of effort to take the time to do it so regularly. On the other hand, exercise helped me a lot.

On the long term, even if you seem to be against it, the best solution seems to be therapy. I understand that you may be against it, however finding a good therapist can really help.

If you all the answers here haven't convinced you to go the psychotherapy way, I'd suggest finding the next best thing. Talk about your issues to some friends or people you trust. This is not easy either. It requires being really open and transparent about extremely complex issues that you keep bottled up even to yourself.

What helped me most was not judging myself for being emotional. Which is absolutely easier said then done. However small issues could spiral out of control because I didn't handle them well, and then I'd hate myself more for not handling them well, and then I'd hate myself for being so negative about myself and being just a liability to myself and the people around me which was just a vicious circle which ended up in huge meltdowns.

For context, a bunch of this advice I got from another answer on HN and really worked wonders. Not everything is better but I'm in a much better place than several years ago. As I said, mental issues need a lot of time to solve, and accepting that is one of the hard things to do.

Why on earth would you melt down? Been a dev for over 20 years and sure some days are a bit hard, but meltdown? Best guess, you own the code, you own the product, and people keep breaking it.

I work for a great company, and we have a prime directive.

~"We believe that our coworkers have done the best they could, given the knowledge they had at the time and the situation."

So suggestion: Give your team more credit. Quit working where you work.

Go for a 5-10 minute walk every time you have to pee.

Watch some youtube videos to learn something.

if doing something causes problems, don’t repeat it.

Don’t fight reality, get better at predicting it.

> if doing something causes problems, don’t repeat it. I've quit most of it but e.g. I cannot quit driving.

Maybe you can! Take an uber every now and then instead of driving yourself. Let somebody else deal with the traffic.

Psychotherapy helps you increase your window of tolerance. Having meltdowns due to stress is normal.. but it doesn’t have to be a regular thing.

It’s too late for the OP but for the rest - consider if you can handle stress of your own at its peak and having kids before having them.

Be part of a healthy team who work together, who communicate well, and do sports together. During lockdown, more likely you go sport solo (figure something out; I like running and yoga) but stay in touch with teammates. Walk every day, learn to meditate (mindfulness). You can do that during anything, including a walk or sports.

New dad is really hard. For me It was really difficult to adapt. It really gets better when your kid starts to communicate. 1 to 2yo is really hard. From 3 to 4yo, I’m now less stressed than before being a dad. But that’s because a 4yo boy is really damn cool to live with and pretty autonomous for a lot of basic things.

I cannot speak for you, but what works for me:

- Daily cardio / lifting, alternating between them (first thing I do in the morning)

- Minimise caffeine intake

- Reminding myself that nobody is going to die even if I completely mess up everything

- Regular sleep schedule (new dad, so I imagine this is not going to be applicable)

Good luck!

a lot of good advice on here, but to consume any of it you need to Conquer your ego first. Accept you are not in control and learn to go with the flow, lower expectations and desires, learn equanimity, read the gita

honestly people on here are not spending enough time telling you that if your job is shitty and your career feels dead that you will be angry, depressed, anxious. not that having a job and a career is everything, but speaking from the experience of having done that once or twice before, 8+ hours of terrible job will get to you and start to fray anyone's patience and sap their life force. for the love of yourself and your own family, go find something to do all day that you don't hate.

I turn the mic off and scream several times a day when the stupidity gets too strong.

Sometimes I punch my desk - I would not advise this unless you have a sturdy one, but it is very cathartic.

I have a coworker who does exactly that. I know it because he is really bad at setting the mute mode on zoom.

Sorry but I got a proper laugh from this comment

Exercise, play computer games, minimise Linux usage.

> relatively new dad

For your child's sake, then, if not your own: please rethink your stance on therapy.

If you refuse to seek therapy, I would recommend reading about Mindfulness and practicing it.

This is normal. You are becoming a senior developer. Congratulations on making it this far.

:) Thanks for the laugh. Seriously.

> No phychotherapy please. I won't go near their arrogance.

Dude. You need therapy. Period.

To be blunt: what kind of grown man has "meltdowns"? Like...wtf lol

Your comment about the "arrogance" of psychotherapy is telling. If you think it's ineffective, then fine (though CBT is on-point for your use-case). But that's not what quite you're saying.

step 1: stop making it worse, stop the down spiral step 2: I have no idea

Get on antidepressants.

I've been in the same boat. It's really, really tough, and even though it doesn't seem like it's even possible, it does get better.

Many things have already been said here, one I haven't seen is (basic!) Mindfulness - no psychotherapists or other psychos involved. Just self-paced, listen to a 5-min mp3 once or twice a day. This one: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mindfulness-practical-guide-finding... comes with a good free app (book is OK, but written by a professional, so not airy-fairy).

Unlike my vegan childless friends, I don't have the time to go on retreats or walk barefoot on moist grass, but I do have 5 mins to breathe in peace, in work breaks for instance. I'm not sold on Mindfulness as a cure for everything from obesity to cancer, but it sure helped me gain a new perspective on life.

The basic premise is, our minds have an autopilot of thought tape. These thoughts tend to gravitate to negative, angry, protective thoughts and emotions. It's not that hard to break that loop though. This "stream of consciousness" is not objective, but rather a very biased resampling of our experiences. With minimal training, you can recognise it and refocus it.

For example, I used to often fume about work annoyances on my way home from work, thinking about e-mails I received, or what I'd respond next time, etc. With some Mindfulness under my belt, I can just switch it off. Look out the window of the bus and genuinely enjoy not changing nappies right now. Or when that infuriating guy from sales sends you another e-mail, and your brain serves you the many angry memories of past interactions, recognise that, separate the memories from the e-mail that really just needs an "ok, I'll look into it" response, and you can get on with your life.

It doesn't make the world an easier place for you, but it helps you focus on the good bits that are already there. As a new parent, you probably don't have the time (or sufficient sleep) to pick up a new hobby, but 5 mins most days is feasible. And, chances are, you might discover there are nice moments in the day, when your mind isn't flooding you with memories of the bad stuff.

That, and also: when we had 1 child, my wife and I tried to look after them together, always. We now figured having some "you time", as others say, is invaluable. 2 hrs of looking after a child on your own, plus 2 hrs of time to yourself, is a huge difference. Just sit and chill and watch Netflix if that's your thing. Or do the weight lifting / running / skydiving in that time. Did wonders for me.

Thorazine for acute symptoms and Lithium long term.

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