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Comment by tombert | Hacker News Reader

I never read the books, I only saw the Ender's Game movie that came out like 8 years ago. I remember thinking that the premise itself had promise, but that the movie was this rushed, hard-to-follow piece of crap that was borderline unwatchable.

For years people have told me that the books in the series are way better than the movie but I still haven't gotten around to reading it. Maybe I should.

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My advice is to not worry yourself with "books" when considering Ender's Game. The first book is a complete product, and it wraps up everything it needs to.

The sequels are good too, but they're also unnecessary if you aren't curious to experience more of the world. The ending of Ender's Game is roughly like the slideshow epilogue of a movie saying things like "Johnny went on to medical school and got married". The sequels and side-stories go into things like what happened while Johnny was at medical school, how he met his future wife, or what their retirement looked like, but the epilogue itself doesn't leave you hanging on anything.

For sure, nobody needs to worry about reading any of the books other than the original. The story begins, happens, and ends, all in one not-very-long novel.

After that novel is a whole series of novels that follow Ender into distant futures and places, as he literally runs from his past to keep it from defining him. The first one, Speaker for the Dead, is very recommendable for follow-up reading. The others I would only recommend if you've already decided that you want to read more of the series.

However, there is also a different set of sequels, and the first of them is the first book I would recommend to anyone who wanted to read more: Ender's Shadow. (Like Ender's Game, it won both a Hugo award and a Nebula award.) It takes place during the same time as Ender's Game, but from the perspective of one of the secondary characters. This second series of sequels generally takes place on Earth in the time shortly after Ender's Game, and follows Ender's siblings and the other Battle School characters. Like the first series of sequels, I won't go out of my way to recommend these to people who haven't already decided they're interested in reading them.

AS I write this comment, I learn that Orson Scott Card has been writing prequels: a trilogy in 2012-2014 (Earth Unaware, Earth Afire, and Earth Awakens) describing the First Formic War (which took place ~50 years before, and is heavily referenced in, Ender's Game), and a not-yet-complete trilogy since 2016 (The Swarm, The Hive, and the not-yet-published The Queens), which appears to be about the actions that were taken after the First Formic War to produce Ender. The reviews on Goodreads are promising; I might read some of these.

> For sure, nobody needs to worry about reading any of the books other than the original.

Hell, I've only read the novella, and don't really see how it'd be improved by being extended into a full novel. Even a short one.

While I’m sure it sums up well as a novella, as pre-teen, the “big reveal” probably hit with more force by being in novel format. It reads like a typical “coming of age” adventure, and then…suddenly isn’t. Although I haven’t read it since then, I think there was a fair amount of character development, which also increases the impact of the reveal since you’ve been given time to care about the characters and relate to them. Also, as a kid who loved strategy games, the training program was just really fun to read.

While I don’t usually care about spoilers, even knowing that there is a big reveal feels a bit like a spoiler.

Ender's Shadow didn't even make the shortlists for the Hugo or Nebula awards.

I don’t know. I read Ender’s Shadow before Ender’s Game, and felt like Shadow was a much better book. It’s been a while, but as I recall it runs parallel to Ender’s Game and goes into much more depth regarding the difficulties and anguish Ender endures.

On the other hand: Ender's Shadow also introduces a rather ridiculous and unnecessary origin story for its central character ("Bean"), involving an evil genetic scientist. This plot line continues through the rest of the spinoff series.

It's been a long time, so I can't remember which I liked more, but I definitely don't remember Ender's Shadow being a complete package in the way Ender's Game was. It leaves open a bunch of questions about the events in Ender's Game, doesn't have the same satisfying epilogue, and introduces a bunch of things that feel unresolved (the genetic engineering, and more focus on the global conflict stuff). If the GP commenter liked Ender's Game, they could go on to read the sequels and Shadow series, but if they didn't like Ender's Shadow, they'd have a bunch of unresolved questions.

The first book is fantastic, in that it makes a very good portrayal of extremely intelligent children, and how their lack of wisdom and experience allows them to be manipulated.

The movie completely missed this point.

The movie was sorely disappointing, which was itself disappointing because Ender's Game isn't at all unfilmable (except that the main characters are all children in a really messed-up environment).

It really is similar to Neon Genesis Evangellion in many respects. If NGE had existed first as a novel, it's hard to think that the TV adaptation would be anywhere near as good as what was actually made.

I highly recommend the book, with almost no reservations. It's not very long, and a very stimulating read.

If you enjoy that one, and want to read more, then I'd recommend reading either one or both of the immediate sequels (Ender's Shadow and Speaker for the Dead). Iff you read either of those, and enjoyed it, and want to read more, then (and only then) should you concern yourself with the trails of sequels.

I think the pacing of Enders game isn't right for Hollywood. The middle of the book, where he's in battle school figuring out politics and strategy is the best part. And what kid doesn't want to be in the battle room? They basically rushed through all the good stuff in order to make room for a longer ending.

It would probably be better as a miniseries.

Dissenting voice here. I did not like the book. It's dark and unpleasant and contra other people here I don't think it speaks to any particularly interesting truths about how supposedly smart kids can be misled.

edited to add: I arrived at this opinion when I first read the book sometime in the early 90's, which I think is decades before the author's bigotry became public.

I read the author's Homecoming series in the 90's. That doesn't outright show his bigotry but my lord, it hints heavily towards it.

I read the first three and have mixed feelings about them. They're creative and well executed. The stories are definitely captivating. But particularly in the later books the author's religious views come out and start coloring things in a way that personally I find a turn off.

I feel the same way about the Honor Harrington series, which is basically a riff on redoing Horatio Hornblower in space. The books are quite engaging if you like the gimmick, but the author is a conservative monarchist (in the UK sense) and it comes through pretty strong in most of the books. In the later ones he balances it out a bit though, so I'd guess he's grappling with some view changes of his own.

Yes, you should. At least the first book. Even if you don't adhere to the philosophy/politics in the book, it's really quite an entertaining story and it's indeed far, far better than the movie.

I've only seen the movie and didn't think that much of it, since the bulk of it is a kinda cringey children's sports league movie. I don't understand why so much time was spent (in the movie anyway) on weightless lasertag before they're rushed through military command training or whatever and tasked to save humanity.

Note if you do choose to pick it up: The author of Ender's Game is highly homophobic, to the point of helping funding the anti-gay-marriage side during the gay marriage rights battle in 2008.

On the other hand, it's an excellent book, and I recommend reading it.

I'm not telling you what to do, but personally I make it a point to get books like that used, if not borrowed.

Yeah, I replied that in sister thread. Part of why I haven’t read it is because I think Orson Scott Card is a douche.

I mean, he's a direct decendant of Brigham Young. Not exactly surprising.

> he's a direct decendant of Brigham Young.

So you believe in 'bad blood' then? Genetic evil? Or just in the sins of the fathers following their children?

Cool. What other scientific beliefs do you have?

Not defending him one way or the other, but even Obama was against gay marriage in 2008 [1].

[1] https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2012/may/11/barack-oba...

It's worth reading several of the books, if only for Jane.

I still wish I could play the fantasy game, decades after I read the original book last.

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