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_Understated_

Not to hijack the thread: why is my post being flagged? I'm asking a genuine question!

I was linking to UK Government data here [0] and asking about the numbers.

They're not adding up. I want to know if my interpretation is correct

[0] - https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsde...

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If you want to seriously discuss you should put which data points your comparing so others can also compare. When I look at that sheet and look at the rates comparing unvaccinated vs fully faccinated the death rate is lower for every age group when vaccinated.

* Comparing week ending 24th September 2021

They're comparing different/dates/vaccination rates, classic Simpson's paradox. No adjusted data shows otherwise.

You gave an inflammatory conclusion "we're all being lied to!" without showing how you reached that conclusion.

Perhaps I flew off the handle. Partly due to being flagged with no reply!

The other relevant factor is that if you lead with "Ok, I'm going to get flamed, downvoted or whatever for this", people will downvote/flag the post almost regardless of what it says, because (a) it's against the site guidelines, (b) it's a tedious internet trope, and (c) it's reliably a marker of bad comments. Best to edit that kind of thing out in the future.

Find a new talking point, this one is trivial to debunk[0]

[0] https://www.ntu.ac.uk/about-us/news/news-articles/2021/11/in...

Look all the way over at "Second dose", the age-standardized mortality rate is 1.1 per 100,000 vs 5.4 per 100,000 for the unvaccinated. 5x protection against death.

Table 1, in the linked XLS file for data through 24 September. You can see that it was originally closer to 0.1 (50x protection against death) but it's gone up to 1.1 over the last few months, I'm guessing as immunity has started to wear off.

Something else to consider is that while a person may die while having COVID-19, it does not mean that is all that they died from. People in general may have several health problems, which is especially likely for an 80+ year old person. Some healthcare activities have also been postponed since the outbreak, by the patients and also the hospitals, which may have led to less healthy people.

This is indeed what Table 8 shows. The vaccinated skew elderly, and while slight more vaccinated died, they were at a much lesser risk of dying for COVID. According to that data, over 32 times less likely for their age.

To put these numbers in perspective, global death rate from car accidents is 18.2/100k/yr. 12.4 in the US.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic...

Yeah, and this is per week data, not per year too. So one year of being unvaccinated is equivalent to 17 years of car crash risk.

I think you should see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVRfBhy5vGI

I don’t know myself, but this happens frequently. Any body can flag your posts.

Untrue, I believe you need a certain amount of karma to be able to flag.

But it's something like 20 or 25, so really trivial to hit for any genuine user. (Although it's possible there is some weighting going on, so maybe new accounts get less flagging power or something like that)

Nope, I have 213 karma and the only thing I can do is upvote comments.

Can you flag submissions?

Yes, I can.

interesting. maybe I'm misremembering and comment flagging comes with downvotes, which I guess would make some sense.

They don’t like this devolving into politics, which they really need to get over because the historical fact (when this is all said and done) is that Covid was heavily politicized by both sides in a variety of countries.

I think it's more about unsubstantiated conclusions, hysterically presented.

If the original post had outlined the data points that led them to the (IMO erroneous) impression they reached, then the point could have been rebutted.

Probably I took a look at the data linked and I have absolutely not idea how he came to that conclusion.

Like if you pick a age and week and then compare the age group+week specific death rate of fully vaccinated to the death rate of the same age group+week for unvaccinated people and it at least nearly always (I haven't check all data points) very clear that the death rate for unvaccinated people is worse.

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