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Comment by miohtama | Hacker News Reader

Why would you have a fake certificate as getting your first dose, and in most cases, second dose is already possible around the world?

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Many see the censorship as a reason to pause. Some people were injured by the first dose but not in a way that satisfies the bar for a medical exemption. They need to function and don't want to risk more complications.

Other's have prior immunity and don't think the vaccine risk is worth it.

Some research and read articles like this: https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/circ.144.suppl_1.107... - "Mrna COVID Vaccines Dramatically Increase Endothelial Inflammatory Markers and ACS Risk as Measured by the PULS Cardiac Test: a Warning" They watch video of healthy soccer players collapsing dead on the pitch. They conclude they are young without comorbidities and it makes them apprehensive.

FWIW if you feel like you're about to drop dead you probably should be worried about already having a comorbidity that will be dangerous if you get Covid. The latter is way more likely than randomly dropping dead.

I'm young, fit and had a heart attack during exercise this year. No real known reason other than the acute problem at the time. I later got vaccinated and then had Covid with no problems.

It's the increased frequency of these players dropping dead. Also, why was all cause mortality higher in the vaccinated cohort in the Pfizer trial? And given this, why was the control group eliminated a third of the way through this study?

> It's the increased frequency of these players dropping dead.

But still far less likely to happen than you having a comorbidity for Covid.

Any proof of this claim?

Yeah it’s trivial, the comorbidities are well known for Covid as well as their incidence per capita. So is the chance of having a heart attack whilst being a footballer or if we want to get more general having a heart attack below the age of 40.

There are far more people with diabetes per capita alone unless you think there is a rash of undiagnosed heart attacks.

For my singular experience I’m a point of interest to every medical professional I meet going through the process of recovery because normal heart attack patients are either old or if they’re my age or younger generally have a genetic condition. That’s how unusual it is.

First dose is not sufficient for access to restricted activities, and the second dose requires a waiting period of 2-3 weeks AFAIK. Then there's the likely possibility of requiring a third dose (https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eu-covid-passes-set-to-ex...), making coordination even more difficult.

Adding to that some people believe (uh oh) that you're also taking on higher risks of life threatening adverse reactions for each subsequent dose.

There is already a requirement of the third dose as in a few countries the certificate of the second dose expires after 9 months.

Antivaxxers want to be able to enter places where a QR code is required, but don't want to get vaccinated.

Or they’ve already had it and want the same freedoms as those vaccinated? ONS study on infection/reinfection during the delta period over the summer charts 5 to 8 show previous infection is as good as or in some cases better than the vaccines.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthan...

Sure - but if they really want to go their local bar, you can either expose your computer to dark web to buy a certificate, or just go and get a free shot…

Whilst your comment is factual, I think it doesn’t make sense in the context. The barrier to purchasing a certificate off the dark web is high and require a fair amount of financial and personal conviction / exposure…

You can also bribe a doctor/nurse to "vaccinate" you, no barrier here.

Again, this comment doesn’t make sense in the context either… I responded to the difficulty of conducting a transaction on the dark web - you respond with comparing the dark web to a persona bribe?! I don’t understand why people seem to throw logical debate out the window when it comes to covid… I get that for some people it’s a personal affront, but in my opinion that’s no excuse to just throw logical processing out the window.

My answer explained is: you were right the dark web is a high barrier, because there exist simple ways to overcome the certificate mandate - like bribery.

Why do you say "free shot", while side-effects (short and long term) can't be ruled out on an individual basis.

Neither can be death, hospitalization, or long covid...

According to our government 1/5000 gets a serious myocarditis infection. With two shots thats 1/2500.

Antibodies should be recognized, especially as some people cannot get the vaccine.

I’m not sure I buy this. Who can not get the vaccine but is also trying to access areas that require vaccination? The overlap seems small/non-existent. Do you have examples of cases where this might apply?

Any of the legal medical exemptions.

Is there an official list somewhere? I’ve looked and been unable to find one that contained permanent medical conditions that would prevent all of the available COVID vaccines.

The vaccine is contraindicated for people with my cancer. I have taken it as I was I was in a high risk trial but I’m certainly still alive enough to travel places.

I’m glad you were able to get the vaccine, and I hope you beat cancer. Cancer has taken many loved ones from me.

Those that were infected and recovered from it do have the same freedoms as the vaccinated here in Germany by the way (for half a year after recovery, at least). They can acquire vaccination status with just a single jab during that half year.

Germany makes it deliberately hard (in many cases impossible) to prove that.

People count as recovered if they no longer show any symptoms and have proof of a positive PCR test for Covid that is older than 28 days but not older than six months. This does not sound unreasonable, imo.

"Recovered person" is defined here if you want to look it up: SchAusnahmV §2.4, §2.5 [0].

[0] https://www.bmjv.de/SharedDocs/Gesetzgebungsverfahren/Dokume...

The positive test has to be made in Germany and in most counties of Germany you need a doctor that confirms by signature that you went into quarantine, also in Germany.

According to §2.5 from the legal text [0](it was a draft that I linked to earlier. This is the real thing now), an attestation, in textual or digital form, of a previous SARS-Cov2 infection confirmed via a PCR test or similar test (not antibody-tests!) in German, French, English, Italian or Spanish language is accepted as proof of recovery. It does not include restrictions on where the test was taken.

[0] https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/schausnahmv/BJNR612800021...

Sir, I like facts and you do facts correctly.

That is federal law which is usually overruled by state law as stated in paragraph 7.

I couldn't find anything pointing to stricter requirements for the "recovered" status anywhere. Do you have an example? If that's too sensitive I would be fine if you name the federal state in which stricter rules are said to be applied? I can look up everything else by myself.

On the one hand, certainly to gain access to areas where non-vaccers actually have no access. But I think that a big motivation is also to feel superior to the authorities, that want to give you the feeling of an unalterable proof of vaccination through cryptography. If a citizen who is critical of the state actions now has the opportunity to deceive them, self-satisfaction will develop.

So they’re teenagers

Basically yes, that's been my impression so far. "No one fucking tells _me_ what to do!". That, or deluded.

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