Comment by qwertox | Hacker News Reader

Comment by qwertox | Hacker News Reader

Parent Full thread

I have a custom app which monitors my device 24/7 in the background with a persistent WebSocket connection to my server to receive push notifications. While yes, as a user you need to grant some permissions to the app, it works without a problem.

If by notifications you are referring to Firebase Cloud Messaging, which replaced Google Cloud Messaging and is now integrated in Google Play Services, I do agree with you.

It is my opinion that Google should be forced to decouple all these Google Play Services which are not related to the "Online App-Store" which Google Play is, and ideally be forced to open source it, so that trustworthy alternatives can be used to replace it.

I mean all the components which track you, which basically is what Google Play Services is: it is a system service created to monitor every possible activity you have with your phone (location, physical activity, health) as well as the efficient, persistent data connection to transfer these bits of information to Google (and to your device as FCM), while Google grants you access to use these services in a restricted manner.

For me Amazon's Android devices are basically useless since they don't have Google Play Services installed, and you have to work around it to get it installed, which basically is illegal to do.

> While yes, as a user you need to grant some permissions to the app, it works without a problem.

Without the problem for YOU, because, presumably, you have a non-shitty phone. It is a much more severe issue on the likes of Samsung / Xiaomi / Huawei. See https://dontkillmyapp.com

So the issue is not Android (AOSP) provided by google, but OEMs ?

The issue is the locked-in requirement to rely on the sole source of push notifications built into the system. Running your own persistent app is an ugly workaround that doesn't work more often than does.

Also, such apps are unloaded from time to time even on stock non-modified Androids.

AOSP is not Android. What Google distributes to OEMs and its direct customers is not AOSP. It is AOSP and the different Play Services including the Play Store and the Google applications with contracts mandating that they have to be provided to customers.

If you think people talk about AOSP when they talk about Android, you are always going to miss the point of these conversations.

From the link posted above parent: https://dontkillmyapp.com

> Unfortunately, vendors (e.g. Xiaomi, Huawei, OnePlus or even Samsung…) did not seem to catch that ball and they all have their own battery savers, usually very poorly written, saving battery only superficially, with side effects.

Heck, I was following the discussion regarding the notification system and how you couldn’t really do without and thought the link was actually relevant to the discussion without checking.

My apologies to NGRhodes, the link does indeed refer to an issue with OEM and not what Google supplies. I don’t really see what it has to do with the topic we were discussing however.

AOSP is horribly crippled by Google, as they move more and more features towards play services. Location, push notifications, etc.

> Without the problem for YOU, because, presumably, you have a non-shitty phone. It is a much more severe issue on the likes of Samsung / Xiaomi / Huawei. See https://dontkillmyapp.com

And if you force Google to stop verifying proper behaviour in CTS, do you expect those manufacturers to allow you to run background services at will?

They already kill off anything that's not whitelisted to keep those battery numbers up. The every new major OEM release we developers find bunch of new ways the try and kill background apps.

I can back that up. Oneplus is infuriating in that they include a way for you to whitelist apps and then kill them anyway. I essentially have to plug my phone in if I want to run, say, a torrent client for more than two minutes.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com