For whom do the Covid “fact checkers” work?
brownstone.org
brownstone.org
Even if they do work for a cigarette company or a research institution, they also have their own biases separate from the organization that they work for.
Their title is only a minor consideration.
Meanwhile a single search pulls a possible source for the 80% figure:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-br...
But talking about that source is inconvenient to the author because it provides ample support over a range of real world and laboratory studies (with both types demonstrating the 80% figure)
But even without looking deeply into this - what motive would the CDC have for making everyone run around in little fabric masks versus the very well known disinformation efforts.
At this stage of the pandemic: the science is abundantly clear - masks work.
You do realize that half of the supposedly covid free clientel declined a pcr test? They just said they felt fine.
I would not have gotten a passing grade in high scool if I had turned that paper in as proof of masking.
Since 2020 any crap, no matter how idiotic, as long as it supports masking, is passed off as science.
Some days reddit clearly leaks into HN.
Weirdly enough nobody seems to doubt HEPA filters work. Maybe because they are more convenient and don't demand that you wear a piece of cloth in your face?
Continues without providing data.
It's buffoonish, but easy to spot.
Just to spare others the click.
Vaccine prevents covid (e.g. death and major injury). Somehow vaccinated people are scared of unvaccinated or vaccinated-but-unmasked people. Huh?
Then, all schools in US are open to kids who cannot even be vaccinated (this is since a few months back).
If you point that out, people will counter back with covid doesn't impact kids. Well, okay?
We try too hard to use unvaccinated as a scapegoat of the bad crisis management.
Do you remember how Fauci undermined all masks in the beginning? I do.
Fauci still try to pin it on unvaccinated when schools are still open..
I can't speak for everyone, but even with a vaccine I can still transmit covid to my young children. I'll breathe easier once they are vaccinated too.
> Then, all schools in US are open to kids who cannot even be vaccinated
There are other factors besides COVID. Quarantine was not good for our kids, and we made the decision to send them back too school when we saw how much they were suffering due to lack of socialization.
Additionally, working with kids at home was next to impossible. We are taking a calculated risk sending them back because the bills, unfortunately, do not pay themselves. It was not an easy decision.
I suppose dead kids is cheaper than working with kids at home.
That is an absurd decision.
Your decision is absurd because that was exactly why you chose to set your strawman like that.
If you take a step back and force yourself to take a honest and reasonable look at what the OP really said, you'll quickly understand that all caring parents, even when considering that the average children's risk of serious illness is relatively low, do have a high risk aversion regarding their well-being. Therefore, they breathe easier if their kids' immune system is well trained and prepared to handle an infection, which is precisely what you get when you're vaccinated.
There you go. As I mentioned, when pointing out about school reopening, now covid isn't a huge deal.
But unvaccinated 20-29 years old is like the biggest deal ever.
> But unvaccinated 20-29 years old is like the biggest deal ever
Don't know exactly what you're referring to since all the unvaxxed people I know are old, but it's irresponsible not to get it.
What if vaccination won't help to reduce your anxiety?
> If you point that out, people will counter back with covid doesn't impact kids. Well, okay?
Who is “people”?
Are you using a consistent source?
If your point is that people have different understandings of appropriate COVID responses, then I guess I agree, but I don’t think that that’s the point that you’re trying to make.
More to the point, I can’t see how any government response could combat the fact that in 2021 everyone is an expert and disinformation is rife. This is a pre-existing condition.
Because if covid is a huge deal, we wouldn't trade dead kids with educating kids. Being alive would almost always come first
COVID-19 is not the big deal it was a few months ago because back then vaccine rollout barely started. Right now, those who still haven't got the jab either can't take it yet or are outright refusing to take it.
Meanwhile, children can't be vaccinated but enjoy a low risk of developing serious illness.
Given the scenario, it was necessary to evaluate the risk of deciding whether to impose a lockdown onto the school population, which would be largely incoherent and disproportionate to the risk, or returning to school while enforcing basic and low-effort health and safety measures, such as wearing masks and respect social distancing. Most of the world, if not all, chose to resume the school year with students returning to school.
Studies have shown that people fare poorly with judging non-immediate risk. Look how many people deal with type II diabetes.
I’m fully vaxxed plus a booster and I don’t really want to be around unmasked unvaxxed people if I can help it. Like the vaccine isn’t magic, the effectiveness drops over time and more exposures compounds the risk. There’s zero gain to be around a high risk group, especially when it’s so easy to avoid right now. And I still wear a mask and encourage others to as well (not that it matters because there are still mandates) because I don’t want to accidentally be an asymptotic carrier to someone, especially someone unvaccinated — I have friends and family with weak immune systems and kids. Wearing a mask costs me nothing, especially now that it’s cold and keeps my face warm, and might do some good.
I also think it is monumentally stupid that schools around here opened. Sure yeah, pack kids in poorly ventilated rooms for 8 hours a day, nothing bad will happen there.
Didn't they have this exact problem before covid with 1000 other diseases?
At this point, it seems weak immune people are weaponized.
Why must a timeline be put on it? The people asking "how long do we need to do this" kind of remind me of the kids in the back seat on a long trip asking every 10 minutes "are we there yet?"
It's a global pandemic the likes the which no living generation has witnessed before. No one can tell you the future. Anyone putting a timeline on it is giving you their best guess, not a guarantee.
I understand that is mentally and emotionally tough to deal with for a lot of people, but that's the sober reality of our current situation.
We have vaccines (miraculously) but only a partially vaccinated planet. We have promising therapeutics on the horizon (see last week's news about Pfizer's new drug), but we are many months or years away from them being available as ubiquitously as we need them to be.
> Didn't they have this exact problem before covid with 1000 other diseases?
That were as 1) widespread, 2) severe and 3) as contagious as COVID-19? I can't think of any.
wearing a goddamn mask in public is what really got to us
Because it has completely disrupted our society, and widespread vaccinations have reduced the <1% chance of non-elderly people dying to much lower than that. Many kids have lost more than a year of education. Suicide and depression rates are skyrocketing among people of all age groups. "15 days to flatten the curve" has morphed into, "we must wear masks and stay locked down forever even if it only saves 1 life". Many of us reject this safetyism. Life is inherently risky. The vast majority of non-elderly people face far more of a risk of injury and death from their daily commute than they do dying of covid. Everyone is free to make their own personal risk assessment and wear a mask and/or hide in their homes forever. The rest of us are going to accept covid as another one of the many risks we all face in life and move on and start living again.
The problem with the "personal risk assessment" argument is that you wear masks to protect other people, not yourself. This is a decision that must be made collectively for or against.
Tell that to the tens of millions of children - including pre-schoolers - who are forced to wear masks all day, every day, which greatly inhibits their learning and social development. Further, the fact is that places with "mask" (gauze masks and face covers - not actual N95 masks) mandates have not shown to have lower covid transmission rates than places without such mandates. That's the reality of the situation no matter what the so-called experts say.
COVID continues to overwhelm healthcare system ICU capacity. It continues to result in an unsustainable level of death and disability among the massive portion of the population that remains unvaccinated.
Where I live, and in other jurisdictions, public health authorities are telling citizens, “Hey, try to avoid getting into a car accident or having a heart attack because our ICU capacity is extremely limited”
So long as these systems are not operating normally, society cannot function as it usually would. And we certainly can’t pretend covid is over because we have lost patience and exacerbate those problems further.
Lastly, your assertion that suicides have increased due to COVID is false. [0][1]
Why are you telling people that?
[0] https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n834 [1] https://sunnybrook.ca/media/item.asp?c=1&i=2306&f=covid-19-s...
>Why are you telling people that?
Take it up with the CDC.
>In August, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention released the results of a nationwide survey conducted during the last week in June: More than 40 percent of those who responded reported symptoms of anxiety or depression or increased substance use, in addition to other struggles. And more than 10 percent said that they had seriously considered suicide in the past 30 days, compared with just over 4 percent who said the same thing in 2018 — and who were referring to suicidal ideation over the previous 12 months.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/21/magazine/will-the-pandemi...
This willingness to spread falsehoods in order to bolster a political view really needs to end.
Nevermind the irony of claiming that it's essential that everyone must stop "living in fear" immediately... which is then substantiated using inaccurate, fear-mongering claims of increased suicides and children experiencing learning and social development delays due to masks.
The fact you didn't link to the CDC data tells me that you lack familiarity with the way the CDC works, and that's important because suicide data is complicated.
The data we have so far doesn't support the points you've made.
They’re planning on benefiting from herd immunity at some point once the virus has been beaten back but while it’s still spreading like crazy they’re stuck. It’s the fact that Covid is so contagious that makes it such a PITA.
So to answer the question of how long, how ever long it takes for there to stop being so many new cases. It’s not forever.
You need to get your story straight. Things are quite simple as easy to understand once you take an honest look at the issue. For instance:
* The current generation of COVID-19 vaccines trains the immune system to have a fighting chance against COVID-19 and are effective at practically eliminating the risk of serious illness, but they do not prevent infection or spread.
* Some people cannot take the vaccine, such as the case of pregnant women until recently. Others do continue to be at risk even after taking the vaccine such as those plagued with comorbidities. See Colin Powell.
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/10/18/colin-powell-suffered-from-a...
* The risk of spawning a new strain that is not handled by the vaccine is proportional to the number of infections, thus contributing to it's spread endangers us all. See how the Delta variant was spawned in India.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/rising-covid-19-breakthrough-ca...
This is widely known by anyone who honestly cares about the subject and did a cursory search on the topic. In my case, the local vaccination drive distributed a leaflet explaining everything. Is any of this info new to you?
So, what is with the contradictory actions?
Taken from:
https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/covid-19/questions-answers/que....
"Most children do not develop symptoms when infected with the virus, or they develop a very mild form of the disease. However, research has shown that children can become infected, and can spread the virus to other children and adults while they are infectious."
It does prevent infection and spread. 10% of the time there's a breakthrough case. That is still effective often enough to bring us to herd immunity despite the high infectiousness of Delta.
Everything else is accurate.