Hacker News Reader

Comment by hohloma | Hacker News Reader

I changed my mind a bit on this issue. of course I still think its better with as little surveillance as possible, but I don't think what you are describing is actually "terror". If you are really an innocent person, there will be nothing in your history. I mean can you give me some examples of things this stati-state will find about you? Your porn history? or random wiki page about explosives? If there is a stasi-like state and they really want to get you, they don't need your history from 2021, its enough to just beat a concession from you about anything. Just see what the current stasi-like states are doing. Otherwise "Enemy of the state" is a pretty good movie.

View on HN

I want to agree with you... the problem arises because you're applying your values to those items... e.g. "yeah they're embarrassing/bad, but not really that bad"...

However, it becomes scary when the people with access are much less level-headed. There are people who think gay people or watching porn should require treatment. There have been power changes where people with drastically different views have an agenda to push, and your innocuous "not really that bad" is all of a sudden an imprisonable offense because you "think differently" and you might encourage others.

Innocent of what, though?

This sounds like the nothing to hide, nothing to fear argument.

The history allows such a state to construct a narrative where everybody else thinks you're guilty, based on your messages and porn history and so on. Cherry-picking, quoting out of context, etc. This allows the state to legitimise their actions, where torture would fail to do so.

Make everyone fear each other.

> If you are really an innocent person, there will be nothing in your history.

It's only not about things that are incriminating. Suppose you were a witness to something nobody was supposed to know about and now you're to be disposed of.

If they have your message history, they have your full contact list, your relationships with them, who you trust the most, where you like to hang out, who owes you money or favors you could call in. You're completely isolated. For sure you can't use any kind of ATM or credit card or find work anywhere they'd expect you to provide a social security number.

How far can you get if you can't buy gas or travel tickets? What do you do for food?

> I mean can you give me some examples of things this stati-state will find about you?

I think it’s a bit unfair to ask someone to throw away their (assuming American) 5th Amendment rights to make a point.

To paint with a broad and nonspecific brush, the UK government has regular surveys asking about drug use[0] which show that in the year ending March 2020, 7.4% of young adults used a class A drug. Possession of that class carries a maximum penalty of 7 years and an unlimited fine, supply and production up to life and unlimited fine.

Even for more mundane things like road traffic laws, if they were fully enforced then the only people with licenses would be those who didn’t drive.

(And are your memes fully licensed from the original copyright holder?)

[0] https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeand...

Let's see, drone research, bomb research, gunmaking and ammunition possibilities, research on fires, explosions and incendiary devices, quick suicide methods, drugs, legality and punishment for a lot of shit, etc.

Yep, I'm fucked :D

Reply on news.ycombinator.com