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Comment by mtberatwork | Hacker News Reader

Eh, "[insert stable, mature MVC framework] is dying/dead/etc" articles are a dime a dozen on the Web. I suppose it could be considered a badge of honor for a framework to have some internet punter declare the framework as "dead". But, just to nitpick...

> Bad Official Admin GUI UX

For anyone reading, Django's admin tool is designed for situations in which you need to stand up a quick admin or build some internal admin functionality. For more complex cases, you build your own admin to fit your user needs (including the UI/UX). From Django's own documentation:

> The admin’s recommended use is limited to an organization’s internal management tool. It’s not intended for building your entire front end around. [1]

Also, regarding documentation, in my opinion I have yet to see any project have better documentation than Django.

[1] https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/3.2/ref/contrib/admin/

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"Eh, "[insert stable, mature MVC framework] is dying/dead/etc" articles are a dime a dozen on the Web. I suppose it could be considered a badge of honor for a framework to have some internet punter declare the framework as "dead"."

Well said, people confuse hype, growth with death. If something is not hyped or people some folks are switching to something else then it is prematurely declared "as dead" which is a fallacy of thinking.

> It is now official. Netcraft has confirmed: BSD is dying One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered BSD community when IDC confirmed that *BSD market share has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all servers

> Bad Official Admin GUI UX

As bad as it is, it enabled our team of all backend devs to stand up a functioning infrastructure management tool that was mission critical to the business's success in the early stages, for relatively low effort.

I guess it just depends on what you're using the tool for.

Yes, and it's responsive. I am so happy as a solo founder. I can get my admin with almost no effort at all

I love Django & run it in prod. I had a really tough time figuring out how to customize the Django admin interface.

You need to do a lot of overrides on things [1] and changing up the model / form behaviors etc. gets a bit clunky, but at least is manageable [2].

I will say that 99% of my work is using django+drf for REST API purposes, so I wasn't previously familiar with django templating / forms, etc. - maybe that is where the bulk of the learning curve was.

1 - https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/3.2/howto/overriding-templ...

2 - https://stackoverflow.com/questions/7860612/django-admin-mak...

There are entire companies whose business model is to give you an admin panel. You get that for free with Django.

Every time someone declares Wordpress dead 10 more sites launch using it.

It's like that old saw from Strousstroup: "There are two kinds of programming languages. The ones people complain about and the ones nobody uses".

> Every time someone declares Wordpress dead 10 more sites launch using it.

I'm sure you're off by several orders of magnitude.

> in my opinion I have yet to see any project have better documentation than Django

I'm partial to Symfony. Good "getting started", per component documentation and links to cookbook-style articles for things people tend to want to do.

Symfony is a great project, I just feel like, in comparing it to Django, there are so few people who would choose PHP over Python that it's not really a fair fight.

I think that depends where in the world you are.

I've used Symfony for years, and Django for 2 years full-time, and I have to say that I find the Symfony documentation is much easier to learn from.

I use a lot of Laravel but symfony is awesome and its documentation is one of the best I have seen.

Django fan here, but honest question: is there a Flask admin at least as good as Django admin?

I'd say flask-admin is decent, but I don't think its as good as Django Admin.

https://flask-admin.readthedocs.io/en/latest/

Likely not. The Django admin is very much tied to its ORM. That's what makes it so easy to get working.

Nothing you wrote invalidate the point he makes about admin UX. Internal pages may not need to be fancy, but realizing that expectations change over time and that it may be a good idea to polish the UX a little isn't something that should be ignored by saying that only internal people will use it.

If the claim had been about ugliness, then you may have had a point, but it was not, it was about UX.

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