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Comment by chaz6 | Hacker News Reader

High up my list is repairability, which is why I am a big fan of the Framework laptop.

Number two in my list. Hard to open? Hard to reach some parts? memory/ssd soldered on the mainboard? Go away.

Number one is immediate global availability so I won't have to deal with the customs or pre-order. Sadly the the Framework fails both.

Excellent hardware compatibility (full Linux support) is "number zero". I can only possibly forgive the finerprint scanner for being unusable on Linux (because these are not really necessary and the reality is they mostly are so I accept this).

> Number two in my list. Hard to open? Hard to reach some parts? memory/ssd soldered on the mainboard? Go away. Number one is immediate global availability so I won't have to deal with the customs or pre-order. Sadly the the Framework fails both.

I fail to follow your logic. Do you mean that Framework has memory/ssd soldered on the mainboard?

No, it's awesome in this aspect. I want one. But it's both US-only (AFAIK, I may be wrong) and pre-order. So I would have to both deal with the customs (extra time, money and papers overhead) and wait long.

It's US only currently, but they are looking at a global rollout (I'm patiently waiting in the UK).

I'll take a look at it when they do, thanks.

It's available in Canada too

Good point the current Thinkpad T14 and P14s and super difficult to open without breaking the plastic tabs

What's the solution if you break them? I broke some (if we are speaking about the same thing - I mean those little things that click and keep the bottom cover in place after you remove the screws) on one HP ProBook, now the trackpad-push clicking works unreliably. I thought of buying a whole new bottom cover on eBay but the serial number and the Windows sticker is on it so replacing it would probably void the warranty and other legal things perhaps.

The plastic tabs are ridiculous. Why do they use them when there are screws? To save an extra screw and a fraction of a penny off the price?

Screws have to be sourced. Stored. Present at repair site, etc.

That I can understand.

But the thing about broken tabs is that only some form of double-sided adhesive or drilling a hole and socket for a screw to replace the tab actually works sufficiently well.

So yeah, not a fan.

I'd totally invest my share in them (HP in my case) building a storage facility for extra screws (and the screws themselves can be manufactured anywhere - no real need to order from China and manage a complex and fragile supply chain). I bloody mean this when I buy a PRObook and an ELITEbook.

Drilling a place for socket for a screw in a laptop means drilling the mainboard - hardly a good idea :-]

At first, you broke some, but with some practice, you are better at this... Took me 5 or 6 to master this art ! But to get this kind of practice, you have to manage the laptops of a small company, that is only fun for the first day, after that, not that much.

Particularly with anything that wears. Batteries, fans, keyboard, flash storage. and maybe ports, need to be easy to replace.

Having no fan at all is a nice option.

Being able to upgrade the memory or storage also dramatically extends the useable life of a laptop.

i've seen all the hype but i have to ask: what is replaceable on these that you can't replace on a thinkpad t/pxx? (or p1)

Here are the parts they're selling. (A lot of them are "coming soon", though.) https://frame.work/marketplace

I'm not familiar with current ThinkPads.

i dunno. honestly it looks like a regular intel laptop made to look like an old macbook with bays for inverted usb-c dongles.

the whole "it's modular! here's your screwdriver! you can service your laptop by yourself and replace the ram! don't forget your coveralls, you're a hardware technician now!" thing seems a bit.. theatrical? but who knows, i've never owned a laptop with fixed storage and ram so maybe i'm not in the target demographic. also, who knows, maybe their inverted dongle thing will become a standard?

i've always just used thinkpads. they do a pretty good job of picking the right ports in the right quantities and have almost (excluding the ultra-ultralights) always allowed for replacement of ram, disk and sometimes have had a modular bay for cd-rom/dvd/additional disk/etc. quality seems to have dropped a little recently, but overall, still decent.

> honestly it looks like a regular intel laptop

That'd be true for laptops from 3-4 years ago. That's also what I thought about framework until I saw the recent crap Lenovo etc. are pushing in consumer segment. They have basically tablet motherboards. Everything else is soldered. No ram slots, no sata, no connectivity, only a single M.2. If you're lucky it'll have 1 ram slot. This'll only get worse and spread to all segments.

But that is only true for the consumer product line, isn't it? I have a Thinkpad T series and you can replace virtually everything and you can buy replacement parts super cheap on eBay because Thinkpads are so common.

I think it’s targeting the consumer market?

The usual replaceable parts are there in the Thinkpad P1 (SSD, RAM) but replacing the speakers, touch pad, screen or webcam is a much more involved process. I also haven't dared look at the keyboard replacement process. I also don't think you stand any chance of replacing the USB ports without a soldering iron once they start showing signs of wear and tear.

I think Thinkpads are actually quite fine for user serviceability, although I do find it was much easier to open my old HP Probook than it was to open my Lenovo P1 gen 3. Lenovo had me dig for a whole bunch of screws and tabs to pull off the bottom panel where HP let me access all the important parts with just one screw and a slide-off panel.

I ordered a Framework that should ship out sometime this month, pretty excited!

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