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Comment by echelon | Hacker News Reader

This is why apps suck.

Steve Jobs got us into this mess by trying to monopolize the iPhone processor (and only allowed the web to bootstrap his platform). Complete control can be strong armed by dictators, and our spineless capitalists will bend to their will.

The W3C needs to develop a standard for non-DOM, immediate mode painted, fully WASM apps that can access all of a device's hardware. Storage, cameras, network, GPS, multithreading, gyros, all of it. Native apps over web.

We need a web-based drive by app that we can run sandboxed and install without the Apple/Google duopoly, and the US, EU, and Asia need to mandate support.

Edit: downvoters, seriously, we need to talk. You're walking the evil line.

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W3C have zero power. Apple and Google have power.

Also I don't think that DOM presents any problem to security. It makes no sense to cut DOM or JS engine from your sandbox. You can use Canvas/WebGL/WebGPU to access GPU and draw anything in browser window. You can use WASM to have good speed. Tech is already there, you don't need W3C for it and DOM or JS is not really in the way. Storage, Cameras, GPS, Mulththreading, Gyros are available for web apps. Everything is already there.

Web apps miss notifications on Apple platform, home screen installation via API on Apple platform, better integration with OS on Apple platform (not sure about Android), but probably you want your password manager to be native app anyway.

I agree with the spirit of your post; however, I don't understand why it needs to be drive-by, browser-delivered-and-run apps. It almost seems like you're proposing a cross-platform sandbox and app store, which I'm all for! but I'd like it to stay as far away from modern web browsers as possible.

Totally agree. Web apps are actually more efficient in the long run because there are so many apps people use infrequently and yet use storage and receive updates.

What's even the point in making native apps work over the web? Just use native apps, period. You can install native applications on most operating systems already (iOS notably lacking support for persistent "sideloading").

If you want, I'm sure you can cross-compile WASM into some kind of native application or even just leverage a WebView component to make your "app" an HTML page with just a <canvas>.

All of this is already possible today, and yet this problem still persists. Open access to your own hardware is important, but it doesn't solve political problems like these. Web applications can quickly be blocked by censors as China and Russia have shown. The technology arms race doesn't solve the political root cause of the problem.

Native apps aren't a cross platform standard, when the truth is that they should be. They do the same things on all platforms.

They're also tightly controlled and taxed, which they shouldn't be.

I could go along with the idea of it, but the idea of the US mandating what I'd have to include in a browser is a bridge too far for me. If the US, EU, and Asia (like, all of Asia, en bloc?) want features, they can develop 'em themselves.

If you want something that can't be strong armed by governments, the web sucks too. There's virtually nothing in it to resist censorship.

I'm sure this voting app could've been a website, and I'm sure it was or could have been blocked in Russia.

Wouldn't that move the power from the app store owners to the browser owner? These are the same companies just a bit different market shares.

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