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Comment by enos_feedler | Hacker News Reader

The same reason why Apple will probably make a TV even though they have AirPlay. They are different solutions to different problems. AirPlay and CarPlay are all about the iPhone and connecting it to a diverse ecosystem in another product category (TVs, Cars). It increases the value of the phone. Making a TV and making a car are stand alone products that answer the question: can we make a version of this product that is differentiated enough to be meaningful in the market? From a technology standpoint, this means clever integration of hardware, software and services. And beyond that, there are other things too (privacy, etc)

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Apple isn't great at building low-value-add products. They shy away from these. TVs are a prime example where they can't add value beyond an AppleTV set top box.

- The set top box works with any TV and it's one SKU. The number of sizes/screen quality/prices that people would require from a TV is so not apple's MO. As much as apple loves integration, they'd prefer a one-SKU device more.

- Airplay is value, but they haven't really added to it lately. The existing AppleTV already does it, and so do 3rd party tvs.

- TVs are very low margin, and they don't own screen manufacturing so they're likely not able to take outsized profits from the market.

Regarding the Car - Its an open question if they're still doing it, but maybe like the TV, they shouldn't wont...

- They want to control the software and GUI and that's done now. Unless they want to control the car itself (eg. doors, alarms, etc. or self-driving) they don't need deeper integration.

- Cars are very complex, even for apple standards - and not complex in the way apple is familiar with. They have no experience building or differentiating in this industry (like screens wrt to TVs but 1000x less experience).

- CarPlay added tremendous value, and most cars have it now. Deeper integration of the phone as the brains makes sense. But does anything else?

I do not see any reason why Apple would invest in making a TV when all of these TVs exist that already support Airplay 2.

https://www.apple.com/ios/home/accessories/#section-tv

And they sell Apple TV devices, which when plugged into a TV with HDMI CEC controls (all of them nowadays), renders TVs indistinguishable from one another except for picture quality and maybe how quickly they turn on and off.

I guess it is possible for them to integrate the Apple TV device directly into a TV, but I do not see the profit motive on the part of Apple nor the convenience motive on the part of the TV user as it is pretty easy to stick an Apple TV onto the back of a TV.

Most TVs have garbage menu interfaces, I'd love for apple to provide a dumb screen + appletv

You never have to interact with a TV’s interface already.

HDMI CEC allows you to take a new TV, plug an apple TV in, and just use the Apple TV remote. The TV will automatically turn off and on switched to the Apple TV input, hence a dumb screen + Apple TV.

What happens when you have a ps5, xbox and/or switch attached to the same tv? is it seamless? Does it just switch on whatever remote you are using? what about first time setup?

I do not use those devices so I do not know for sure. But HDMI CEC is supposed to automatically move you to whatever device you start using. So if you press the PlayStation controller, the TV should switch to the PlayStation input since it received a signal from the PlayStation, and so on.

At least it works like that with Apple TV, I do not to see why Sony and Nintendo and Microsoft would not implement the same thing Apple did.

And there is no first time setup. Of course, to change the TV picture’s settings themselves you would have to use the TV.

It works like you would expect from 50 different manufacturers implementing a standard.

Kind of works most of the time. I mainly use my Nvidia Shield for most things, but if I touched the playstation controller the inputs would compete for a bit and flip back and forth.

Just try it out, most of your stuff likely has it (if they're not 15 years old). They're called a lot of different things in menus between brands though, so google it for yours.

Like I said, Airplay is a feature of an iPhone, not a TV product. The Apple TV set top box is a stop gap for a real tv. They need a placeholder platform to have the developer side of the platform seeded.

I disagree that the Apple TV is a stop gap. It works with any TV, and you stick some adhesive strips on it and stick it to the back of a TV, and the only difference is you need one more plug outlet for it.

Sony/LG/Samsung have plenty of low-mid-high quality TVs for whoever wants them. There is nothing extra Apple can provide there.

Thats exactly the problem. There is nothing extra Apple can provide. What if they want to use faceid for auth? They can't. If the TV is to be a platform like everything else, they can only push forward new APIs with new hardware. You are viewing the market is static.

That is a good point. I am only thinking of it in terms of how people use TVs today. If Apple does manage to convince people to to use it another way, then I agree there is some opportunity to have their own screen panel.

People have been talking about the Apple TV for many, many years. This actually sounds like a stronger case for Apple not making a car.

> can we make a version of this product that is differentiated enough to be meaningful in the market?

FWIW, I think the answer is 'No', unlike e.g. AR glasses or smartphones pre-2007.

Heck, Apple TV and the homepod each are struggling relative to competitors and apple really hasn't delivered anything innovative in those spaces. Aside from truly wireless headphones, I can't think of any successful apple product that isn't primarily a computer.

We'll see. Just because people talk about products and they haven't come to light yet doesn't mean they won't. In fact, its probably more likely that people are just a bit wrong on the timing and not wrong altogether. If there has been talk of cars and tvs for so long, chances are they will make their way out the door at some point. Same went for the phone, ipad, etc.

> If there has been talk of cars and tvs for so long, chances are they will make their way out the door at some point.

I've never heard any rumors after maybe 2010 of an apple TV product that isn't a set top box.

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