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Comment by secretsatan | Hacker News Reader

Speaking as a UK immigrant to Switzerland, even though it is not in the EU, Brexit is just a massive pain. Switzerland has a somewhat strained relationship with the EU, but does have lots of bilateral agreements, like free movement in the Schengen zone, now I'm not even sure if I need a passport to cross the border to France for a day trip.

Not to mention job prospects, it used to be Swiss, then EU then the rest of the world for consideration for a job, so I've dropped down a category, which is just an extra incentive for any company to not even consider UK citizens for a job.

I have a swiss residence permit, so I'm better off than most, and I will be going for citizenship in the next year or so.

One of the stranger conversations you can have with uk expats is those that supported brexit and are now perplexed that they suffer consequences.

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> One of the stranger conversations you can have with uk expats is those that supported brexit and are now perplexed that they suffer consequences.

As someone wrote pithily "This may not have been the Brexit that you voted for, but it was the one that I voted against."

> now I'm not even sure if I need a passport to cross the border to France for a day trip.

You don't, in theory. However, within a certain zone from the border border agents have the right to ask you for identification. If you can't provide any they will take you along to determine your identity.

So while it's usually not a requirement to pass a border within the Schengen zone I highly recommend that you have proper identification on you.

Same goes for flying, at least before Covid. It was really rare that I even had to provide id within intra Schengen flights and if I was asked it was usually by the airline at the gate. The normal process was checking in automatically and then just badge yourself through the various checkpoints up and including the plane (depending on airport). Still, I would not recommend not to have a valid id or a passport when you fly. No matter if it's strictly required or not.

> One of the stranger conversations you can have with uk expats is those that supported brexit and are now perplexed that they suffer consequences.

I had some of these conversations in Portugal in the lead-up to the Brexit vote. "Turkeys voting for Christmas," was a phrase that came to mind.

Also speaking as a UK immigrant to Switzerland, Brexit hasn't changed anything and hasn't been a pain at all. If anything it's brought the UK closer to Switzerland because it's now got a friend who's also outside the UK and is big in financial services, so there have been lots of quick deals and collaborations signed between the two countries. But beyond that it makes no difference to my life.

Now it seems maybe you mis-understand the rules, which may be why you're claiming it's had a big impact on you when it should not. There are two things to recall:

1. The rights to a work permit only changed from January of this year. Everyone resident before that retains their prior rights. As you say you're soon going to apply for citizenship you presumably already have a work permit, so it's irrelevant - the grandfathering arrangement would apply for you.

2. Schengen rules say you must have ID with you at all times, even for internal travel. It's not well enforced so often people don't realize this, but you have always needed national ID like a passport not only to cross borders, but in theory, to go anywhere at all, even locally. Obviously the latter is ignored all the time but that's what the rules say. Also, the UK has never been a part of Schengen, and the UK leaving doesn't affect Schengen rules or Switzerland's application of them, so there's genuinely no change here.

> Schengen rules say you must have ID with you at all times, even for internal travel. It's not well enforced [...]

This is true. My story:

Summer I returned from holiday in Ticino with family by car. The shortest way is by Italy. This way I avoided many hairpin bends. My son tends to get sick from them.

By the way, Italy explicitly allows transit without a Covid certificate if you travel by car and don't stay longer than 36 hours. Our route meant that we were in Italy for 60 minutes.

However I lost my Swiss ID card.

I decided to go anyway counting on Italian customs not being staffed and it worked. Back at the Swiss border our Simplon car-train got controlled but when I had our four cards (three ID cards and my driving license) ready and visible through the window we got waved through without a fuss.

> I'm not even sure if I need a passport to cross the border to France for a day trip.

You should always bring EU-approved ID when crossing EU borders (even internal). There can be checks for a number of reasons.

For example, many moons ago high in the Alps, at the border between France and Italy, I witnessed two people on a French motorbike being turned back by the Italian customs for not having ID.

Worst case scenario for you would be to not be let back in.

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