Someone was downvoted to hell for a comment, but it did make me think; can I refuse, as a kid in the US, to do the pledge? I cannot imagine having something like that where I was born; I think everyone + parents would've knocked it out of existence pretty much immediately, but can you, in the US, refuse to do it?
Yes. The child may face penalties and disciplinary action, but if the school does that, the parents can sue and will win. It's happened many times now. It's a church/state and compelled speech issue. The ACLU loves picking up these kinds of cases because it's such a softball. IANAL
At least when I was a kid and the whole "pledge" thing started happening, yeah you could skip it and no one did anything. However, I attended highschool in a very liberal town and the principal only ever played the anthem instead of the pledge anyway.
you can, but a lot of teachers and other adults in charge of watching and disciplining children are not aware that you can. So for a kid to successfully refuse, they or their parents need to be well-informed of their rights and willing to threaten the school with legal action
I never did. Altho I was a Muslim kid growing up post 9/11 so I think that played into it
How do you make a scale of comparison between the two?
One has at leadt theoretical space for the transfer of knowledge. The other is pure propaganda.
Interesting take, I don't want to assume which you mean, but it seems like the pledge is pure propaganda, that said I find it more troubling when knowledge is intermixed with propaganda. At least pure propaganda is not trying to convince you it is anything else, like a space to transfer knowledge :)
One includes the Dear Leader's name, one does not.