Checking Covid logic – if 1. vaccinated spread it same as unvaccinated | Hacker News Reader

Checking Covid logic – if 1. vaccinated spread it same as unvaccinated

beckershospitalreview.com

4 pointsnomendos4 comments

Please correct the following logic; as per my reading of the COVID19 related research papers and findings, so far clearly we know the following facts: 1. Current Vaccines protect people short near term and then you lose immunity gradually month by month (our vaccines are not "canceling") 2. Vaccine does not protect people from getting infected by Delta 3. When fully vaccinated person is infected by Delta they spread it identically or nearly the same at the same level as non vaccinated person as highlighted in a recent Oxford study https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/pharmacy/pfizer-recipi...

If we add on the above new finding that getting infected by any COVID19 variant either btw 1st and 2nd dose or after by the variant results in "ideal environment that is guaranteed to produce new more resistant variants within ~6m-12m! In conclusion COVID19 (with new guaranteed new variants) will "never stop" by relying only on vaccines"! (google Geert Vanden Bossche & Bret Weinstein where Greet explains it at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNyAovuUxro )

Then logical conclusion is: vaccine value is purely personal choice for temporary protection (vs proven and known potential risks). Therefore anyone that decides not to take it has the right as his personal only choice. It is their personal calculation of the risk for themselves.

Therefore decision of one group not to vaccinate shall by no means affect or threaten in any way the vaccinated group. So unvaccinated do not threaten vaccinated! (in any different way than vaccinated threaten the vaccinated - per above)

Then why do governments seem recently be pushing to get everyone vaccinated by ANY MEANS (DISCRIMINATING with practices such as; threats of loosing job or forcing you out, media shaming, big tech bullying, restricting unvaccinated ones from flying or using many essential things - comparable to Geto's and discrimination against Jews in Nazi Germany)? WHY?

So far, Delta is the only variant I know of where it can be easily transmitted by people who are vaccinated. They may not suffer as much from the disease itself compared to those who are not vaccinated, but that can still pass it on.

Unfortunately, children still aren’t cleared for vaccination yet. And even if they were, anti-vax parents would prevent them from being vaccinated anyway.

So, there’s a huge population of people out there who are at grave risk of catching the virus and getting seriously ill, if not even dying. And among other things, that ties up a huge amount of medical system resources as we valiantly try to save as many of those lives as we can. And that has knock-on effects for other people who might need an ICU bed for some other reason.

If you just want to take all unvaccinated people and lock them up on an island without any medical care, so as to save the healthcare system for the rest of us who are vaccinated, that would be one solution to the problem. But I don’t think it would be a very publicly acceptable solution.

The other choice is to get EVERYONE vaccinated, whatever it takes. So they’re not as sick if they do catch the disease, and we can continue to race to try to come up with a proper full sterilizing vaccine.

But the healthcare system is being crushed by all the people who are not vaccinated and getting sick, and humanity is not well served by a healthcare system that has been completely destroyed by people who are not vaccinated. Humanity is responsible for protecting itself against those kinds of circumstances if it wants to continue to survive.

It’s not the direct effects. It’s the side effects and the knock-on effects.

If we establish: 1. non-vaccinated group does not affect the vaccinated group, which can be deducted from studies including most recent Oxford study highlighting that vaccinated group gets infected with Delta variant equally as non-vaccinated group and it spreads the virus the same (as Oxford study confirmed same concentration of the virus in the nose). 2. vaccines do offer temporary immunity which offers only individual protection, so per above no effect it should be personal choice. This does come with risks (increasingly documented and arguably some decide to take vaccine some don't, where one research tells that PhD's are group with the lowest vaccination rate - that should tell something,..).

Then there is no justification for forcing/discriminating/pressuring anyone.

Additionally, masks unless K95 or better, are closer to a "theater" than what little if any virus they can stop. (google cloth or fashion masks or even how to properly fit K95 otherwise it does not work)

In the meantime, we all should hope that science finds full solution that will stop the virus, as up until now all current vaccines are not the "canceling" type and until then COVID19 will go on (guaranteed as explained by Geert Vanden Bossche).

So, I warmly suggest all to "punch-up", calm down, get rational and appreciate each other, stop acting one group against other then all can start to focus on the pushing companies and scientific circles to open and constructive path, which is Canceling Vaccine or effective therapeutics. Anything else is punching-down (in any form of shape such as group think, which should not be our level of humanity - we can do much better)! Therefore, there is no reason for us humans to start getting down the evolution (toward animals and lower level belief/group think), just simply respect each-other. Hope we do not start down the path of one group discriminating against other group (remember history).

The article cites this U. of Oxford preprint:

https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2021-08-19-vaccines-still-effectiv...

It says: 'our data shows the potential for vaccinated individuals to still pass COVID-19 onto others, and the importance of testing and self-isolation to reduce transmission risk.'

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