- Tony Hsieh founded online ad company LinkExchange - sold to Microsoft in 1998.
- Later confessed he sold LinkExchange because he was no longer happy working there. As the company grew, it settled into a familiar corporate structure with hierarchy which he disliked.
- He founded online shoe retailer Zappos in 1999 determined to create a different corporate culture.
- Getting a job at Zappos was difficult and unusual. Example Zappos interview questions: on a scale of 1-10 how weird are you? What's your favourite swear word? What's your theme tune when you enter a room?
- Zappos adopted a 'holacracy' structure - no hierarchy, no job titles, but 'circles' instead (e.g. the marketing circle). Employees self-organised into circles. The approach appealed to some employees and not others.
- In 2015, a third of the workforce left: "the happiest company in the world had lost almost a third of its workforce in a single year"
- Could it be that people prefer some hierarchy in the workplace? In 'flat' organisations, the lack of formal rules can mask a vicious informal power structure, with no checks and balances in place.
There is much more in the programme/podcast including Hsieh's tragic death in 2020 at the age of 46. A recommended listen.