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They vaccinated a ton of people with Astra and then let them mix second doses and I know people who got Pfizer 1st dose and Moderna 2nd dose and just a complete shit show. I'm surprised they arn't injecting people with soup of the day at this point or some hybrid of all 3 (Astra/Pfizer/Moderna). What's funny is they find this worth bragging about while under the worlds longest lock downs and still not completely open. The whole thing is a disaster from start to finish but they have this huge inferiorty complex where they compare themselves to the USA in every way and then pat themselves on the back convincing themselves they're better in some way. Just cringe.....

Disclaimer: Canadian

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1) The number of Ox/AZ vaxes come far behind Pfizer, Moderna [0]

2) Mixing Ox/Az w/ mRNA vaccinations has been shown to be better than 2x Ox/Ax [1]

3) Pfizer, Moderna, AZ/Covishield, and J&J are the only approved vaccines. Certainly no "soup of the day" [2]

I hardly think any of this is "cringe".

[0] https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/services/diseases/201...

[1] https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/mixing-vaccines-pfizer-astraz...

[2] https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/services/diseases/cor...

Wow, that is certainly interesting!, gosh I wish we had more time to do deeper studies.

We easily could have done deeper studies. This is a highly parallelisable problem. The issue is all the regulatory red tape and extremely overburdening costs associated with clinical trials.

After the initial safety trials showing that these vaccines have no significant adverse effects, we should have just gotten a dozen YOLO engineers and statisticians to run any permutation of dosage, duration, and vaccine candidate; much like how software companies run thousands of A/B tests at scale.

It's a frigging pandemic with millions of deaths, there's no time to waste jacking off bureaucrats.

Really, there's no good reason that clinical trials should cost $$$$-$$$$$ per participant. Here's how much it should cost:

~$20: targeted ads enrolling one participant

~$20: doses of the vaccine for one participant

~$30: distribution and logistics

~$100: human staffing and follow up

~$5: experiment analysis

Instead, everything gets ballooned up by 10x or 50x because of arcane legislation. In the middle of a global pandemic.

Every time I read these blanket unsubstantiated claims about the evils of regulation, I’m reminded of Chesterton’s Fence:

> There exists in such a case a certain institution or law; let us say, for the sake of simplicity, a fence or gate erected across a road. The more modern type of reformer goes gaily up to it and says, “I don’t see the use of this; let us clear it away.” To which the more intelligent type of reformer will do well to answer: “If you don’t see the use of it, I certainly won’t let you clear it away. Go away and think. Then, when you can come back and tell me that you do see the use of it, I may allow you to destroy it.”

> we should have just gotten a dozen YOLO engineers and statisticians to run any permutation of dosage, duration, and vaccine candidate; much like how software companies run thousands of A/B tests at scale.

I, for one, would try to run clinical trials the total opposite from software companies.

"Fail fast, fail often" nor "Iterate fast, release often" really work for healthcare.

While J&J was authorized in Canada, I don’t believe any were ever administered.

We give/gave it to the homeless because, "good luck making sure they come back again for #2".

Source: google it

Source for that? Because the official Canadian government page on vaccine coverage clearly says the Janssen vaccine has yet to be administered in Canada and the only Canadians who got it got it outside the country.

https://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/vaccination-cover...

I just got my second dose on Friday. It was exactly 8 weeks from my first dose that I got the text message notification for my second. There were 2 lines at that clinic -- one for Pfizer and one for Moderna.

In Canada, Astrazeneca was available to anyone who wanted it if you wanted to skip the line for mRNA and be vaccinated immediately. Originally this was before the (likely overblown) health concerns with Astrazeneca.

As a Canadian, I found the roll out to be quite organized. The original promise was that all Canadians would have access to a vaccine by September and it looks like we will meet that goal handedly. I wouldn't call it a disaster at all. But then I don't live in Ontario.

In British Columbia I thought everyone did pretty well at navigating the different challenges. We had reasonable leadership and communication and I skied all winter. Would have sucked to be in Ontario.

The mix of vaccine shots doesn’t bother me.

Indeed comparing and following the USA is a problem.

> Would have sucked to be in Ontario.

It did!

Ontario did a terrible job at pretty much everything. I volunteered with a some other devs to build https://vaccine-ontario.ca because otherwise there was no single dashboard to find a vaccination clinic that had available appointments.

The Ontario covid experience has been Whose Line is it Anyway: everything is made up and and the points don't matter.

The rules changed all the time and with no explanation or justification. Government ministries didn't speak to one another or the regions. Multiple times the education minister said schools were opening while the premier said they were staying closed (or vice versa).

Vaccinations were delegated almost entirely to the regions and it was complete chaos, especially since the pharmacies were left to do all their own booking. I registered with the region and over 30 pharmacies to get my first dose. Then I got offers of first dose for more than a month after that I had to keep cancelling. 2nd dose was much more straight forward, but that was just luck since I know plenty of people who had to search and scramble.

The re-opening stages have minimal differences between them and don't offer any incentive to get vaccinated since there are no exceptions or enhancements for those fully vaccinated.

Government failed us pretty hard.

Astrazeneca was offered in pharmacies, and that part of the rollout was a total mess, I would certainly agree. It was also only a small fraction of the total doses offered, however, and was primarily aimed at individuals who wanted to get a shot earlier than was possible through the provincially administered system (which offered Pfizer, and once Moderna’s logistical issues were sorted out, Moderna)

My experiences with the provincial registration system in Ontario, were the complete opposite of yours. They were very good. Once my demographic became eligible, it was a single form to book an appointment. The actual vaccine clinics were quite efficient, and the followup (if you opted-in) was quick and easy.

The hardest part was waiting. Vaccines supply was the issue, but given Canada’s bargaining position (essentially none?) I’m shocked we got them as quickly as we did.

Same sentiments. Stuff coming out when you follow the patents is quite brutal. And this quote from Peter Daszak in 2015, and reported in the National Academies Press on February 12, 2016, in which he declared: ‘We need to increase public understanding of the need for medical counter-measures such as a pan-coronavirus vaccine. A key driver is the media, and the economics will follow the hype. We need to use that hype to our advantage, to get to the real issues. Investors will respond if they see profit at the end of the process.’

https://kamprint.com/realities/tag/daszak/

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